TMP Legacy mesh body

[Sammy Huntsman]

Just now, BrooklynnC said:

I never implied that their body was better than other bodies out there. I was merely saying that if a creator, regardless of reputation, has a product that is better than what I'm currently using, then I won't hesitate for a second to ditch my old product for a new and improved one. I could have worded that better.

And gurl you can reality check me all you want. I take great pleasure in that.

That's respectable.

I just think your complaints around their prices are bold considering you're selling a 'reading a book' animation on MP for a whopping $L300.

How does 300L, compare to 5000L exactly? At least the pose is actually worth it, it's completed. 

[So Whimsy]

2 minutes ago, BrooklynnC said:

I never implied that their body was better than other bodies out there. I was merely saying that if a creator, regardless of reputation, has a product that is better than what I'm currently using, then I won't hesitate for a second to ditch my old product for a new and improved one. I could have worded that better.

And gurl you can reality check me all you want. I take great pleasure in that.

That's respectable.

I just think your complaints around their prices are bold considering you're selling a 'reading a book' animation on MP for a whopping $L300.

The more known full permission animation stores sell animations for more than that. I am actually cheaper than my competition. So I am not sure why you are trying to go down this route but you are failing really hard.

On another note, here's one for you. I'll give you that 300L if you can quote anywhere where I said the product is overpriced. Have at it!

[So Whimsy]

3 minutes ago, halebore Aeon said:

How does 300L, compare to 5000L exactly? At least the pose is actually worth it, it's completed. 

It's a full animation indeed, and I offer customer service that at times means a walkthrough through avsitter which is an entirely different product I did not create or have any affiliation with. Considering the reviews, the many projects I've done inworld....people know I don't walk away leaving things unfinished and that my animation quality holds up. I could go on with the things that set me apart from TMP but I'll leave it at that, I spent too much time already on that sockpuppet.

[BrooklynnC]

7 minutes ago, Skell Dagger said:

Unless TMP are actively posting their sales figures somewhere, all I have to say is this: I work for Catwa, and even I have no idea what her sales figures are when she releases a new head. There are no updates on either of the TMP-related Facebook pages (The Shops FB page hasn't been updated since June 2017, and the TMP News FB page has only clothing ads on it, going way back).

Where did you get those very exact sales figures from, Brooklynn? I'm genuinely curious.

 

I tried to dodge that question but since many asked - I realized I shouldn't have mentioned anything about sales and I don't expect anyone to see it as a fact.

3 minutes ago, halebore Aeon said:

How does 300L, compare to 5000L exactly? At least the pose is actually worth it, it's completed. 

Is this a serious question?

1 minute ago, Syn Anatine said:

The more known full permission animation stores sell animations for more than that. I am actually cheaper than my competition. So I am not sure why you are trying to go down this route but you are failing really hard.

On another note, here's one for you. I'll give you that 300L if you can quote anywhere where I said the product is overpriced. Have at it!

I mean you've got to be illiterate if you don't understand why I called you out for that. I know very well you never said it's overpriced but the way you said it indirectly implied so. Again, very bold for someone who sells single animations for L$300. Talking about 'people don't have that kind of money'. Give me a break.

[So Whimsy]

Just now, BrooklynnC said:

I mean you've got to be illiterate if you don't understand why I called you out for that. I know very well you never said it's overpriced but the way you said it indirectly implied so. Again, very bold for someone who sells single animations for L$300. Talking about 'people don't have that kind of money'. Give me a break.

I am not illiterate, I just don't understand your crazy reasoning.

Nowhere did I imply it was overpriced. The only time I said a price was when I said that 1L was too much for that body, which to a normal human being is a covert way of saying "Do not buy this body." and was not in direct relation to the 5000L. That was other people who kept bringing it up, so get your sh- straight.

[MoiraKathleen]

30 minutes ago, BrooklynnC said:

I just think your complaints around their prices are bold considering you're selling a 'reading a book' animation on MP for a whopping $L300.

?

The price of a full-perm animation (regardless of how it compares with its own market competition) has nothing to do with the price of one mesh body compared to prices of other comparable mesh bodies on the market.  

[Janet Voxel]

36 minutes ago, BrooklynnC said:

I never implied that their body was better than other bodies out there. I was merely saying that if a creator, regardless of reputation, has a product that is better than what I'm currently using, then I won't hesitate for a second to ditch my old product for a new and improved one. I could have worded that better.

And gurl you can reality check me all you want. I take great pleasure in that.

Ok.

So, in the spirit of being competitive, what's competitive about the TMP body? I mean in the sense of it being another body on the market, I guess you could call that competition.  But the way I see it, competition is something comprable.

The price is not competitive

Features not competitive (what does it do that justifies a 5000L price tag? Does it support Omega?)

Support not competitive (who's making clothes for it? Does it even have a Developer's kit?)

See, if it were competitive, it might possibly have an introductory price of 2000L, less than other bodies. Something like that is competitive. Competitive here seems to be a strawman, one that no one seems to be buying. So when people are saying "It's competition" what's competitive about it?

 

[MrsSeren]

4 minutes ago, janetosilio said:

Ok.

So, in the spirit of being competitive, what's competitive about the TMP body? I mean in the sense of it being another body on the market, I guess you could call that competition.  But the way I see it, competition is something comprable.

The price is not competitive

Features not competitive (what does it do that justifies a 5000L price tag? Does it support Omega?)

Support not competitive (who's making clothes for it? Does it even have a Developer's kit?)

See, if it were competitive, it might possibly have an introductory price of 2000L, less than other bodies. Something like that is competitive. Competitive here seems to be a strawman, one that no one seems to be buying. So when people are saying "It's competition" what's competitive about it?

 

Can they promise to keep their servers active too, that my other question!

[Theresa Tennyson]

2 hours ago, Syn Anatine said:

It's the same diversity as the 234234 different mesh heads available now. Why would people embrace the diversity there but not for the mesh bodies?

With heads:

1) Humans are naturally programmed to recognize faces and pay attention to small differences, and the Bento facial bones aren't adjustable enough to create an extremely wide range of appearances.

2) The accessories that may be used with a mesh head are generally not rigged and there's greater chance of interoperability from one head to another.

This means that there are more advantages than disadvantages to having a large number of heads on the market.

With bodies:

1) Most bodies in Second Life, including this new body, are designed to represent a young, commercially attractive body and basically don't have extreme differences in their shape that can't be overcome by using sliders.

2) The accessories used with bodies generally are rigged and the makers need to rig to the proprietary weights used by that body maker so there's less interoperability.

This means that a large number of body choices won't be supportable long-term.

[BrooklynnC]

37 minutes ago, Syn Anatine said:

The only time I said a price was when I said that 1L was too much for that body

So 1 linden is too much for the body but 5000 linden isn't? How are you not implying the body is overpriced here?

Have a seat. I'm not here to fight. If you read my replies to this thread from the beginning you'll understand where I'm coming from.

6 minutes ago, janetosilio said:

Ok.

So, in the spirit of being competitive, what's competitive about the TMP body? I mean in the sense of it being another body on the market, I guess you could call that competition.  But the way I see it, competition is something comprable.

The price is not competitive

Features not competitive (what does it do that justifies a 5000L price tag? Does it support Omega?)

Support not competitive (who's making clothes for it? Does it even have a Developer's kit?)

See, if it were competitive, it might possibly have an introductory price of 2000L, less than other bodies. Something like that is competitive. Competitive here seems to be a strawman, one that no one seems to be buying. So when people are saying "It's competition" what's competitive about it?

 

God, shower me in accusations of being affiliated with TMP for this one, but:

I believe many things make this body competitive. I feel like the look of this body alone should make all body creators out there feel uneasy. The body offers a unique look, it works great for both skinny and thick women, the body has realistic curves that doesn't act up when you're using an animation (like Syn Anatine's L$300 read-a-book animation) and whether you like TMP or not you can't deny the fact that they've always had some of the best skins.

As for the price, I honestly can't come up with an argument as to what justifies the price. I don't believe they have any reason to play politics with their prices unlike Maitreya (who honestly updated her body free of charge to keep it relevant, and in turn cash in that way, because that's really what it was) and so they charge what they feel their work and time is worth.

And because the body is adjustable and allows you to wear anything you please, you shouldn't have to be concerned about creators take on it, I actually wouldn't count on creators support for this body, since this feature doesn't benefit them, it benefits the user.

In short, they could be charging the same price as Maitreya, but my guess is that they're trying to get as much as possible for this and chances are they won't sell anywhere near as many bodies as Maitreya has, and therefor they have no reason to try and cuddle with us consumers. 

We see it, we like it, we want it, we got it.

[Janet Voxel]

16 minutes ago, BrooklynnC said:

God, shower me in accusations of being affiliated with TMP for this one, but:

I believe many things make this body competitive. I feel like the look of this body alone should make all body creators out there feel uneasy. The body offers a unique look, it works great for both skinny and thick women, the body has realistic curves that doesn't act up when you're using an animation (like Syn Anatine's L$300 read-a-book animation) and whether you like TMP or not you can't deny the fact that they've always had some of the best skins.

As for the price, I honestly can't come up with an argument as to what justifies the price. I don't believe they have any reason to play politics with their prices unlike Maitreya (who honestly updated her body free of charge to keep it relevant, and in turn cash in that way, because that's really what it was) and so they charge what they feel their work and time is worth.

And because the body is adjustable and allows you to wear anything you please, you shouldn't have to be concerned about creators take on it, I actually wouldn't count on creators support for this body, since this feature doesn't benefit them, it benefits the user.

In short, they could be charging the same price as Maitreya, but my guess is that they're trying to get as much as possible for this and chances are they won't sell anywhere near as many bodies as Maitreya has, and therefor they have no reason to try and cuddle with us consumers. 

We see it, we like it, we want it, we got it.

I'll keep my opinion of your affliation to myself. But....you did give a honest opinion and I respect that.

Good Luck to you all!

[Stephanie Misfit]

1 hour ago, janetosilio said:

Features not competitive (what does it do that justifies a 5000L price tag? Does it support Omega?)

Oh that's a good question. No Omega, no purchase. 

[Sammy Huntsman]

Look right out the door, TMP has nothing to offer. To make it competitive in the least, it has to have a return of some sort. Just saying a body, has nice features,  doesn't make it competitive. Saying that it has tonnes of creator support, as well as supports Omega. That would be competitive. At the price range, it's at, the body won't do as well in sales. People will see it, and then see how much less the other bodies are and go for them. Again that takes competition off the market. Another thing, if moulded right. You can acquire any shape you want, with anybody. It just takes a lot of patience and making sure everything is proportionate. So again, that takes away from the competitive edge. And my final point, I think you brought up the skin, and how there are shadows in the right places. If you are a competent applier designer, you could do the same thing, and it would be the fraction of the cost for the consumer, then the actual body itself. I don't really see how it can compete in this market, it has nothing going for it. I actually demoed it and found the generic skin that came with it. Looks like many skins, from high retailers. I also looked at its shape and noticed everything was exactly the same. Minus the brand name, you are being sold a generic body. That is made to look like a model, in proportions.

 

[Sammy Huntsman]

I get your excitement, I truly do. I just don't see the competitiveness in the body. As I said before, there are already a bunch of established bodies, that have tonnes of support. The price on average for the already well-established bodies is on average 50% cheaper, give or take a few percent less or more.  So please answer the question, If Belleza, Maitreya, SLink and Signature. The four established and well-supported body companies.  Let me add, you can buy all three Belleza female bodies for a little over 4k I think. I could be wrong, and please tell me the exact price. My question is. If there are already 4 big and well-established body brands, whose prices are lower and have way more support. How does TMP top them in competition? The points you made, aren't solid. Support, sales and prices, are a better establisher of competition in the market.

 

[karynmaria]

14 hours ago, SueWorthly said:

To be fair, they gave a free bento hands update a month ago or so, if you had the old "deluxe" body. However, it's likely it's no longer available now: you had to use their shop HUD for a redelivery to get the bento hands, but the old shop HUD no longer works, since it has been replaced by the experience keys.

Besides the bosom and the shape, TMP has fitmesh feet that you can resize, unlike almost everyone else. So if they started to sold the updated old body at a low and competitive price, maybe it would have been interesting to someone. But if you have the old deluxe body and you have to spend further 2500 for this update, it's more likely you will spend the same amount to definitively switch to Maitreya.

As for the new body, oddly called "Legacy", it has some refinement (yup, even "below"), but as it is, it's not even compatible with the old TMP body clothing. I don't know what the deformer would do, though. Also while the HUD has been improved, the text is quite small and almost unreadable on laptop screens and in some place it's even white on a silver background, which doesn't help. The styles part requires the Media on a prim now (which has pros and cons...)  it looks like it's still server side.

They surely worked quite a bit on all this, but they can't ignore the competition, especially when they don't have a great reputation already, and at those prices I'm not sure what sales they would expect.

 

I had the old deluxe body and got the free bento hands update even though I hardly ever wear this body anymore.  Which really is a shame because it is actually one of my favorite bodies due to the shape and like you mentioned, I can resize the feet.   I personally won't be spending anymore money on this body just due to the frustration, lack of support and no clue if they will disappear.

 

[Ruslana Koskinen]

I cannot find the demo of Legacy Mesh Body, through I do not plan to buy or upgrade my old.  TMP shop is really pissing me off by their design. It is just another version of the old hud, next, next, next on horrible white. I have to blacklist most of their shop structure for looking what are on there, after 5 times running through there system. 

--update--

I found the demo at the end. It only work in shop. -_-.  The new body cannot use back the old tmp clothes.  What is in their hell's mind?  Before I left the shop, I blacklisted all of it. I was so exhausted by their design. I have one of the worst shopping experience their, camera not working, their system script loading high latency...

Edited April 26, 2019 by Ruslana Koskinen
update

[rasterscan]

My 5 grand TMP is still in beta 3 years on. I wont be buying.

[Ruslana Koskinen]

4 minutes ago, rasterscan said:

My 5 grand TMP is still in beta 3 years on. I wont be buying.

And you need to buy all new clothes for it too. Old clothes are all to trash. BUT, WHERE TO BUY NEW CLOTHES?? I wont buy it too. The latest update from them is defective too.

[Skell Dagger]

13 minutes ago, Ruslana Koskinen said:

And you need to buy all new clothes for it too. Old clothes are all to trash.

This is notable, because of the claim that their amazing 'deformer' (that you can't test until you've forked out L$5,000) is supposed to allow people to wear any clothes with the new body.

So... does it allow you to wear any clothes (including old TMP ones) or... not?

[Moore Jun]

6 hours ago, halebore Aeon said:

I get your excitement, I truly do. I just don't see the competitiveness in the body. As I said before, there are already a bunch of established bodies, that have tonnes of support. The price on average for the already well-established bodies is on average 50% cheaper, give or take a few percent less or more.  So please answer the question, If Belleza, Maitreya, SLink and Signature. The four established and well-supported body companies.  Let me add, you can buy all three Belleza female bodies for a little over 4k I think. I could be wrong, and please tell me the exact price. My question is. If there are already 4 big and well-established body brands, whose prices are lower and have way more support. How does TMP top them in competition? The points you made, aren't solid. Support, sales and prices, are a better establisher of competition in the market.

 

Four Big Mesh bodies already has over 65% of the market share. Old TMP has only 0.6%. Now, new TMP has 0%. It even cannot fit with old TMP clothes. What is the point to have it? 

[Ruslana Koskinen]

9 minutes ago, Skell Dagger said:

This is notable, because of the claim that their amazing 'deformer' (that you can't test until you've forked out L$5,000) is supposed to allow people to wear any clothes with the new body.

So... does it allow you to wear any clothes (including old TMP ones) or... not?

I am a bit confused. I was wearing their old clothes in the shop. Also my tmp shape, the basic shape looked so different. The clothes was nowhere fit, body phy not fit either..

Is there any such magical  'deformer'? It seem we need to pay the price to get the body with their Legacy wand for a try.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Ruslana Koskinen
update

[BrooklynShahan]

http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/TheMeshProject/128/128/0

You can get the bento update to original TMP still here, and I think still get the super low price on one.

if you look at TheMeshProject Resident profile it explains more.

[Sammy Huntsman]

3 hours ago, Moore Jun said:

Four Big Mesh bodies already has over 65% of the market share. Old TMP has only 0.6%. Now, new TMP has 0%. It even cannot fit with old TMP clothes. What is the point to have it? 

I was actually pointing out, that it lacked competitiveness.

[Drake1 Nightfire]

17 hours ago, Vanity Fair said:

My major problem with TMP is their price point and their past marketing practices. They lost a lot of goodwill with designers and users over the years. For example, they only allowed auto hide on clothing they sold, not making it available to outside designers.

I really doubt the product will be a success at this price. TMP has come across as greedy in the past and they still do now. Most people don’t trust them with good reason. 

Even though I really like the look of the male body I won’t touch it at this price. Also, nowhere in their fancy new shopping experience does it say these bodies are Omega compatible. 

And if the style HUD relies on TMP servers to work properly (like their past bodies and clothing), then that’s another good reason to avoid them. If and when TMP shuts down their servers, you will not be able to change anything on your purchases like skin tones. 

I think the real major problem with TMP is that if they ever decide they are bored with SL and shut down their servers the bodies are now stuck as they are. No skin chnages, no alpha changes, no nothing. Bodies broken. 

16 hours ago, BrooklynnC said:

 

 

They sold 5,200 something bodies in their first 24 hours. I'm not sure what you're referring to when you say 'most of us'. I understand 5,200 residents aren't a majority but it's a great portion of the people who buy lindens on a regular basis.

I'm not much for conspiracy theories, but perhaps you forum people are a bunch of stingy broads who feel like your money is too good for a community you spend more time on than you do with your hubbies. And this is coming from someone who has an average 9-5, high expenses and a mediocre salary. God knows where you guys are in society. Certainly not in a place where you have the right to speak for other people?

It's an OK product. If you love this community and wanna support creators then you should at least consider it. I'm not here to try and convince anyone anything.

Chill. o/

You know info that hasnt been shared and claim you have no affiliation?!?! Riiiiiight.

Stingy broads... Well.. Isnt that a glowing reason to run out and buy this body.  All you have done is attack everyone here and personally attack Syn for no reason. Just an FYI, personal attacks are a no no on the forums. Good way to get yourself banned. 

TMP has ZERO support. If they ever leave SL their bodies will stop working. If they have a power outage, their bodies stop working. If they lose internet, their bodies stop working.. I spent 5K on the first deluxe body.. it sucks. Skins are mheh, can only wear TMP clothing as the body is slightly off the skeleton so ANY other mesh clothing wont even remotely fit, have to use a hud to buy anything from them and THEY STILL HAVE 135L of mine i cant get back from the hud. BAD MESH IS BAD. 

Its a crap product. What community? the TMP one? WHy would i love them? 

I still think the whole deformer thing is hinky at best. How does it work? They deform your body to fit other mesh clothing? But that clothing is fitted to a specific mesh, not the skeleton. What does the deformer do to the TMP body? how freaky do you look with the different deformers? "Pay 5K for something you cant test first and may not work." Oh hells no. 

[Sammy Huntsman]

7 minutes ago, Drake1 Nightfire said:

I think the real major problem with TMP is that if they ever decide they are bored with SL and shut down their servers the bodies are now stuck as they are. No skin chnages, no alpha changes, no nothing. Bodies broken.  

Basically, you would have a 5k paperweight. End of story.