Linden Homes Preview

[Solar Legion]

Adding to earlier ...

I'm back at the preview right now to examine a few houses and house boats I'd not looked at last night and I have to say: There's at least one or two House Boat styles I like and really only one House style I like in the preview. The latter of those has a nice second floor balcony I could use!

Erm, so yes ... Don't mind the Kitsune wandering around! I don't bite, promise!

[Claireschen Hesten]

Went to have a nosey round the new homes and boats. Really loved the hose boat with the upstairs room but i thought some of the other boats with so much ceiling height the potential for an upstairs room was missed. Of the homes i thought the most usable was the bungalow with the one main and two separate rooms if anyone wanted a bathroom space. the worst home was the bungalow with the two spaces off the entrance. It was really good to see the mail boxes outside will be used to pick and change which home or boat you'd like, the thing i liked least about my time short time with a premium home was that the home you got was randomly assigned and if you didn't get one you liked you'd have to abandon your home up to five times a day till you got the home you wanted

[Chic Aeon]

8 hours ago, Fionalein said:

They do? In that case the fact their walls still triagle out at a distance is even worse...

While I do agree that the land impact (it is the download cost that is the highest) is higher than I would expect,  I went back to check and found that I could cam out well over a sim distance with no breaking up even AT LOD 0.  Not sure why you see triangles at any reasonable distance.

Since that holding power was undoubtedly part of the criteria and since the land impact doesn't count against the 351 land impact, I don't see a problem. Yes, others could have likely had the same results with less land impact, but since the textures are very simply I doubt that the mesh is contributing too much to the lag equation.  Possibly because the house was in a rezzer, I couldn't really see all the info about the build, so can't say more than that.

Edited March 18, 2019 by Chic Aeon

[Fionalein]

12 hours ago, Chic Aeon said:

While I do agree that the land impact (it is the download cost that is the highest) is higher than I would expect,  I went back to check and found that I could cam out well over a sim distance with no breaking up even AT LOD 0.  Not sure why you see triangles at any reasonable distance.

I have LOD factor 1.5 and draw distance 32m, I guess your draw distance is higher... for me some windows and upper boat halfes poofed while zooming out... (and don't suspect much of SL's population to have much higher settings)

Edited March 19, 2019 by Fionalein

[Blush Bravin]

22 minutes ago, Fionalein said:

I have LOD factor 1.5 and draw distance 32m, I guess your draw distance is higher... for me some windows and upper boat halfes poofed while zooming out... (and don't suspect much of SL'S population to have much higher settings)

Of course it's going to disappear after you zoom out past 32m. That's how you have your viewer set up. You've told it you don't want to see anything that's further than 32 meters. That's not a problem with LOD. I understand that the windows and doors might poof before the walls but that's what I would expect since they are much higher detailed than a flat wall. I consider that smart building.

Here in this photo you can see that I have cammed out at 200m and the building holds well with a LOD factor of 2, which is the recommended. Check my settings. You can tell I'm at 200m away from the build as all the things in back of the house have poofed, and yet, the building has held shape very well.

to follow up .. here at LOD factor 1

and at 0 .. only at zero from this huge distance do the windows even begin to distort

Honestly, these houses are amazingly built. Great job!

Edited March 18, 2019 by Blush Bravin

[Chic Aeon]

45 minutes ago, Fionalein said:

I have LOD factor 1.5 and draw distance 32m, I guess your draw distance is higher... for me some windows and upper boat halfes poofed while zooming out... (and don't suspect much of SL'S population to have much higher settings)

As mentioned I tested down to LOD0  -- I was at 264 meters and that was enough for me   (usually at LOD2 at 120). 

I didn't have any issues with either houses or boats.  Strange their is a difference.   

[Love Zhaoying]

So..by being “good” mesh builds, higher detail and lower impact than old prim builds?

[Theresa Tennyson]

1 hour ago, Fionalein said:

I have LOD factor 1.5 and draw distance 32m, I guess your draw distance is higher... for me some windows and upper boat halfes poofed while zooming out... (and don't suspect much of SL'S population to have much higher settings)

With a draw distance that low the origins of the windows and upper boat halves probably just left the area that the viewer was showing. When they "poofed" like that they did NOT "triangle out."

[Blush Bravin]

43 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

So..by being “good” mesh builds, higher detail and lower impact than old prim builds?

My old Linden home at 76 prims on a 512

Yes, I added a planter and a tree to the exterior of my home. Looks nice doesn't it?

Anyway, the prim count on the new Linden homes range from 155 to 219 for the houseboats and 197 to 249 for the houses. Now to consider that the land size has increased so if we double the old prims to balance the new size parcels .. 76 X 2 = 152. So the new homes are still heavier in land impact than the new, but when you consider the level of detail in the new homes I think you'd agree that they are made very well.  

Have you been to the Linden Homes preview yet? If not, you really must go!  

Edited March 18, 2019 by Blush Bravin

[Qie Niangao]

9 hours ago, Lucia Nightfire said:

The houses have pretty high land impact for such basic designs. The thing to me that is unacceptable is the number of scripts and the script timing each house is consuming. Script counts range between 21 - 45 and timing between 0.046ms - 0.092ms, this in a region that still has 14ms available timing and 99% script run rate.

I went back to look around and this is accurate -- and appalling. Or at least baffling. There seems to be (at least) one individual script in each link that is touch-interactive; now with "Click to: None" in the object editor* I don't see why this would be necessary in a finished product. (I can see it happening while sketching out a build, so builders who don't do scripts can just mix and match pre-scripted components.)

Besides script count, one wonders what the heck the scripts are doing to use that much script time. Could they all have active timers for some unknown reason? Or chattering link messages with each other? (Do they have scripted security, separate from parcel access lists? If so, could they be burning all that time doing llGetAgentList() over and over?)

__________
* but unfortunately not in llSetLinkPrimitiveParams*() apparently. It does seem that in llSetClickAction, -1 has the missing effect we'd want for CLICK_ACTION_DISABLED, although I've not seen it documented anywhere, and of course we really need it in llSLPP*.

[Adorarose Trueheart]

They look pretty nice I have seen them in world.

[Blush Bravin]

9 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

I went back to look around and this is accurate -- and appalling. Or at least baffling. There seems to be (at least) one individual script in each link that is touch-interactive; now with "Click to: None" in the object editor* I don't see why this would be necessary in a finished product. (I can see it happening while sketching out a build, so builders who don't do scripts can just mix and match pre-scripted components.)

Besides script count, one wonders what the heck the scripts are doing to use that much script time. Could they all have active timers for some unknown reason? Or chattering link messages with each other? (Do they have scripted security, separate from parcel access lists? If so, could they be burning all that time doing llGetAgentList() over and over?)

__________
* but unfortunately not in llSetLinkPrimitiveParams*() apparently. It does seem that in llSetClickAction, -1 has the missing effect we'd want for CLICK_ACTION_DISABLED, although I've not seen it documented anywhere, and of course we really need it in llSLPP*.

Could it be related to the fact that this is a temporary build for display purposes only? I am clueless when it comes to scripts so if that question seems stupid, it's probably because I pretty much am when it comes to scripting.  Please be kind in your response.  

[Qie Niangao]

1 minute ago, Blush Bravin said:

Could it be related to the fact that this is a temporary build for display purposes only?

Maybe. Two possibilities come to mind:

1. There may be special scripts (or special versions of scripts) that are quietly collecting data about all of us as we snoop around, perhaps to find areas of improvement.
2. Perhaps these are really just a step beyond those "sketching out a build" versions because there may be further improvements identified, on the theory that it's easier to optimize the scripting all at once rather than having to retrofit already optimized scripts. (I don't actually think that's true, but it may sound to a non-scripting manager as if it could be.)

[Fionalein]

33 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

On the theory that it's easier to optimize the scripting all at once rather than having to retrofit already optimized scripts.

Any scripter worth their contract fee would have told them no it isn't - but maybe they had to rush it for H&G Expo (I fear my estimate I made in that other thread on how many weeks "within weeks" could be just came true)

[MoiraKathleen]

10 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

Oh. I haven't been following this at all. I'd just assumed that these would be used to "finish" Gaeta I and link it with Gaeta V and Corsica

My main home parcel is on Gaeta I, so I would vote for this choice, if we had any say in the matter

I like setting up different houses - currently I have my main house on a mainland parcel, a townhouse I rent on a private estate and an existing Linden home.  I went out to the preview and I really liked the neighborhood look.  There were one or two of the house designs I liked, and I prefer the houses over the houseboats, partly because I really like having the yard space around the house.   I like that we'll be able to change the house style from the mailbox - that is a big improvement over the existing Linden homes where you need to change location in order to change house style.   

I've purchased homes before that have had around the same size or smaller rooms than those in the preview homes, so I am not expecting furnishing them to be an issue.  Even though (in the homes) the ceilings, doors and windows are tall, the bottom of the window sills are low enough that I don't feel like the house is oversized for my avatar size. 

[Shudo]

2 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

There may be special scripts (or special versions of scripts) that are quietly collecting data about all of us as we snoop around, perhaps to find areas of improvement.

I think you are onto something Qie. I'd be surprised if the lab arn't tracking this. They would find some valuable metrics by how many people look and which houses they enter. At this point of SSP, to even rebalance in a few more houseboats before small town usa fills out everything.

 

[Chic Aeon]

4 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

So..by being “good” mesh builds, higher detail and lower impact than old prim builds?

Well I am sure that each builder would have their own definition but simplistically, yes.

You can make a window for example with plenty of detail that will also be viewable from "across the sim" at "lower LOD levels" (as in NOT 3 or  4) for 1 land impact. That same window made with prims (granted no worry about disappearing) would be (quick math in head visualizing)  maybe 7 prims (and less choices of sizing unless you made the prim window more complex.    That is why so many prim houses used alpha textures for paned windows. That has a completely different problem of course. Many of us remember that :D.  Glad it is gone. 

 

Edited March 18, 2019 by Chic Aeon

[LittleMe Jewell]

 

14 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

Oh. I haven't been following this at all. I'd just assumed that these would be used to "finish" Gaeta I and link it with Gaeta V and Corsica

Interesting thought - the entire SSP block would fit pretty well into that area.  We've all assumed that it would go between Sansara and Jeogeot because someone brought up how well it would fit in that area.

 

14 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

I still wish LL would have some lakes inland, but then the land would really be so nice that people leave other land. I assume a lot of inland houses will be empty and people like me try and try in hope to get a better spot.

The current build on the SSP regions do have some inland waterways.  Grant, not a lot, but there are also still areas not fully developed yet in the SSP block.

 

 

With and LoD setting of 2 and my normal draw distance of 112-160, I'm not having any issues with the houses disappearing too soon when I cam out or look around the area.  I also think that the houses and houseboats are large enough.  While some folks will get a Linden Home and live there forever, for the most part LL thinks of these as beginner homes, a way to give a new person a home right away without them having to figure out land stuff.  It will give many new people the "land ownership itch" and they'll move on to buying their own, possibly larger areas and thus giving LL more money in tier (or via multiple Premium accounts).

 

[Chic Aeon]

14 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

We've all assumed that it would go between Sansara and Jeogeot because someone brought up how well it would fit in that area.

I thought that was an OFFICIAL bit of news? Is that incorrect?   

[LittleMe Jewell]

15 minutes ago, Chic Aeon said:

I thought that was an OFFICIAL bit of news? Is that incorrect?   

The only 'official' that I knew of so far was Inaya's conversation with Patch saying it was going to bridge two continents.  In the SSP thread, somewhere around page 25-27 I think, is where there is some speculation about the Sansara and Jeogeot location, but I don't think we've heard from LL on the exact location.

[Blush Bravin]

1 hour ago, Chic Aeon said:

I thought that was an OFFICIAL bit of news? Is that incorrect?   

It wasn't official. It started here with this comment. 

 

 

[Blush Bravin]

Apparently I have too much time on my hands, or I've become obsessed with SSP, or both! But I had some fun with the map this evening. Since we're speculating .. I did some SSP floating on the map. 

Using those ghosted regions between Sansara and Jeogeot I was able to position SSP in between them. It almost looked like place savers it fit so snugly. If I were a betting person this is where I'd put my money. But for fun I tried two other locations.

I was able to place in both locations without any interference from private regions. Both of those spots were completely empty. I have to wonder if Patch and the Moles are chuckling at us for all our guessing. But it's exciting. I can't help myself.

[Chic Aeon]

54 minutes ago, Blush Bravin said:

It almost looked like place savers it fit so snugly.

That was my thinking too last night when I looked. A bunch of those sims didn't look like viable sims. 

[Shudo]

If it does go around there it might open up some more viable (and valuable) CPP positions.

The area around Blake is very much cartel locked right now, and the prices match that. I'd likely pay the US$500/year plus 10 needed regions to do it then.

Edited March 19, 2019 by Shudo

[Marianne Little]

10 hours ago, TeraChrista said:

They look pretty nice I have seen them in world.

Yes, it was the quality of the landscaping that impressed me. Look at that hedge in the top picture. And the garden wall in the lower image. And the tree trunks and other plants. Sure, I have a lot of garden stuff in my inventory. But it would count against my prim limit, and these do not. Very nice for newcomers who don't have a ton of landscaping stuff.

The gardens look big enough for a vegetable garden! Or an above ground backyard pool maybe?

Haha, listen to me, already wanting to use more than it's room for. Maybe that is what LL thinks, offering bigger homes, wasn't it some speculation about it? Different forms for premium, with different perks?