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Careful there Maddie, next thing you know you'll have the immature brigade after you, claiming your thoughts don't matter ...

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1 hour ago, Serenityfirefly McMahon said:

You clearly are not a survivor or never gone through it.. so yeah judge yourself first and go do it.. growing up.

Would you take the word of a "survivor" then?  Check my profile and limits if you want.  "I will not be raped by a man" is chief among them.  Let's skip the fact that it cannot happen in SL anyway and that there was no CTRL-SHIFT-H for me.  It is my limit.  If you want to role play being forced, please have fun. If I want to enjoy being captured, tied up and "raped" by a Miss, please don't call me names. I am a victim of multiple and prolonged rape in RL and I am saying that SL role play rape is just people having fun and nothing more plus I do enjoy role playing being forced by a beautiful and confident woman.

This comes up from time to time and it draws me out but what offends and angers me is anyone who assumes the worst thing that can happen in SL is in any way close to the hell I lived through as a child. It is like saying you know what war is like because you played Call of Duty. I have lived through it and I can tell you that what happens in SL is not rape no matter what anyone involved or witnessing might want to claim.  Rape in SL is as impossible as being shot by the video game you are playing.

That is my perspective in any case.

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3 hours ago, Serenityfirefly McMahon said:

You clearly are not a survivor or never gone through it.. 

I am a survivor, but I can guarantee you, based on all of my many years of conversations with other survivors, that not everyone views any related activity the same way.  In SL, even if people are pretending to be forced, they are still pretending.  Nobody in SL can actually be forced to do anything - unlike RL. 


IMO, and I am truly trying to be sympathetic and helpful here, if you are traumatically triggered by the online depiction of something that we all know is fake simulation, then maybe you should stay away from SL for a while and concentrate on more healing and recovery in RL. 

In my early years here here in SL, I actually got really pissed off at the people that would dare to compare any of the pretend rape in SL to what I and many others truly experienced in RL.  How dare anyone think that an online depiction of an event can compare in any way to the real thing?  I've since gotten past all of that, realizing that those people are just in a different place along the 'healing timeline'.  I now simply avoid what I don't wish to see and I leave others to do their SL as they wish, as long as it isn't against the TOS.

 

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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Fyi its not just men who assault. It can happen to men aswell. You do you, don't attack others for how they are feeling. Rape is evil. Anybodies got a right to have what ever emotions they feel. I don't understand how people can be going out their way to justify something "I" see as something inhumanly, disgustingly evil. Thats my opinion. If you don't agree rather then telling me or anybody on same wave length as me to move on when its completely on topic. You move on? 

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32 minutes ago, SteffiiSugabum said:

Fyi its not just men who assault. It can happen to men aswell. You do you, don't attack others for how they are feeling. Rape is evil. Anybodies got a right to have what ever emotions they feel. I don't understand how people can be going out their way to justify something "I" see as something inhumanly, disgustingly evil. Thats my opinion. If you don't agree rather then telling me or anybody on same wave length as me to move on when its completely on topic. You move on? 

I'm not sure if you missed the context of this thread, but it started with the OP insisting that something she didn't like should be banned. You're entitled to your own opinion, of course; but you are not entitled to ban something just because you don't like it. That's what you're supporting. Instead, the people that don't like the activity in question (which includes me) need to "move on" and just ignore the sims that cater to that.

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Well course we're not entitled to ban something we're not Linden Lab staff lol. Butt, I do aswell as many actually, think these abuse simulators should be re-considered. As it is promoting something that is extremely dangerous in RL. It's also providing a negative experience for people who have been through the abuse triggering them. Even just in search for example. You can be looking for somewhere totally unrelated but they pop up in a huge listing of not just Adult Sims, but Moderate aswell. Same with MP I've even seen "date rape" pills being sold... It's something I strongly urge to be re-looked at.

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3 minutes ago, SteffiiSugabum said:

Well course we're not entitled to ban something we're not Linden Lab staff lol. Butt, I do aswell as many actually, think these abuse simulators should be re-considered. As it is promoting something that is extremely dangerous in RL. It's also providing a negative experience for people who have been through the abuse triggering them. Even just in search for example. You can be looking for somewhere totally unrelated but they pop up in a huge listing of not just Adult Sims, but Moderate aswell. Same with MP I've even seen "date rape" pills being sold... It's something I strongly urge to be re-looked at.

The one suggestions that I can make here is that if you ever see anything inworld or on the MP that advertising anything related to rape and it is not in the Adult MP category or Adult section inworld, then most definitely report / AR it.

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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1 hour ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

In my early years here here in SL, I actually got really pissed off at the people that would dare to compare any of the pretend rape in SL to what I and many others truly experienced in RL.  How dare anyone think that an online depiction of an event can compare in any way to the real thing?  I've since gotten past all of that, realizing that those people are just in a different place along the 'healing timeline'.  I now simply avoid what I don't wish to see and I leave others to do their SL as they wish, as long as it isn't against the TOS.

As a survivor, this. So much this. If you haven't reached this point yet, you still have some "healing" to do.

Do I wish LL would ban such things? Of course I do. It's abhorrent to those of us who have been through it in RL. Do I think LL will ever ban it? No, not until laws in the US and the state of California have been passed that would make roleplaying such things illegal. I don't see that ever happening. It's another of those things in life that we just have to accept so that we can deal with it and live our lives the best way we can.

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The rape fantasy is to real rape what watching The Evil Dead is to witnessing real-life murder.

With that said, and I appreciate this is hypocritical given some scenes that I've had in SL and RL, I am glad that there are people who are appalled by it. I really wouldn't want society to become desensitised to it. And I would of course be extremely sensitive about it when speaking to a survivor.

Obviously I've seen those groups and RLV settings whereby a woman could be plucked from anywhere on the grid to be "kidnapped" and so on. I do understand the psychology behind it. I'd never do it myself, though, because I know what sort of sick misogynistic f*cks would be on the other side. Not people like my Dom, who understand the fantasy from my perspective, who are connected throughout and will most definitely stop if I give the word and who engage in power exchange.

I'm truly sickened by vore, Dolcett and so on, to the point where even typing this is putting me off my dinner. I would really, really love for all those horrible places to be banned but they're not going to be. As long as they aren't prompting anyone to be killed and eaten in real life, I guess I'll have to make uneasy peace with the fact that they exist and are frequented only by people who, for whatever godforsaken reason, want to act that out. I'd rather they went to therapy (or a permanent underground cell) but that's not my decision. 


 

Edited by Amina Sopwith

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What I can't understand though is if mp tos says no objects etc to depict anything unconsentual etc. Why is there so many places for this obviously creating for this. Why there so many stores that catch me off graud with rape simulation objects etc. I think it needs to be revised. 

As for being about healing why is the blame coming onto people effected by this due to trauma? Did we ask for our experience? Obviously not. I personally aren't gonna "heal" because I have c-ptsd. 

I dont see why anybody should have expectations for anyone to be accepting of this. We're talking about a matter that distroys, and traumatised people for life in rl. 

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6 minutes ago, SteffiiSugabum said:

We're talking about a matter that distroys, and traumatised people for life in rl. 

IMO -- 'traumatize' yes, but 'destroy'?  Only if you let it.

How we react to anything is our choice even if it is an unconscious one.   We have to learn how to NOT let other things continue to bring the trauma back.  That is not to say that depictions of rape are not horrid, but only that we can't let it continue to make the trauma replay over and over in our heads.

 

Someone once claimed that SOME of the people acting these things out on the internet helps to keep them from acting on their fantasies in RL.  I don't know if that is true or not -- it may be true for some people.  For others, I do think that it normalizes the actions and might even make some people want it in reality.  I don't condone that stuff in SL, but I'm pretty sure that it will not go away and not be banned from SL.  At least not as long as movies and other games can legally depict the same thing in the US.

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Just now, LittleMe Jewell said:

Someone once claimed that SOME of the people acting these things out on the internet helps to keep them from acting on their fantasies in RL.  I don't know if that is true or not -- it may be true for some people.  For others, I do think that it normalizes the actions and might even make some people want it in reality.  I don't condone that stuff in SL, but I'm pretty sure that it will not go away and not be banned from SL.  At least not as long as movies and other games can legally depict the same thing in the US.

I wonder the same thing. My BDSM experience started in SL, and later went on to RL. I know the same is true for many other people. I also know that, far from satisfying people without doing it in reality, SL role play often makes people dissatisfied with their RL.
 

SL can skew our perception of what people are really like. If you spend a lot of time in a virtual world surrounded by people who are acting out things that would be abhorrent in real life, it can lead you to think that more people are into it and accepting of it than is reality. Normalising it, as you say. It can also lead you to think that these people do want it to happen in reality, even if they're spending hours a day doing it in SL and, therefore, not doing it in reality. 

One reason I left SL last time was because I was a bit concerned that my perception of humanity in general was becoming distorted. Dark fantasies may exist, they may not be uncommon, but that doesn't mean it does us good to be confronted with them all the time. Especially if we're in an environment where we're being told that ALL people (women) feel like this and want this. They don't.

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11 hours ago, Fionalein said:

Depending on where you live RP Rape can be a RL criminal act.... just saying 9_9

Because of where I live, I cannot legally enter skilled gaming areas. Does that mean those who can, shouldn't

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 I may be done with Second LIfe because of this. I'm definitely done reading these responses because I'm sick of being accused of going looking for it, or participating in it or surely being into it.  Or telling everyone else what to think. No, I'm looking for ways to make Second Life a better place for young people and women. If you have a problem with this, you are part of the problem. I'm turning off notifications for this post because some people are dumb and I'm sad.

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2 hours ago, Talligurl said:

Because of where I live, I cannot legally enter skilled gaming areas. Does that mean those who can, shouldn't

Off topic, also how can you even compare the two... (not a literal question by the way just a reconsideration request).

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3 minutes ago, Bliss Rembrandt said:

 I may be done with Second LIfe because of this. I'm definitely done reading these responses because I'm sick of being accused of going looking for it, or participating in it or surely being into it.  Or telling everyone else what to think. No, I'm looking for ways to make Second Life a better place for young people and women. If you have a problem with this, you are part of the problem. I'm turning off notifications for this post because some people are dumb and I'm sad.

But... you are telling everyone else what to think? O.o

I've said it many times before, but I'll say it again - I find these places detestful too. You wanna know how I deal with those places? I just don't visit those sims. It really is that simple. And if those types of guys want to take that behaviour to other sims, I have and will continue to do everything I can to get them banned from those other sims, which have rules against that kind of thing.

But this conversation has been circular for a while, and I'm fairly certain you guys are trolling at this point, as there's no way an actual human could fail to understand such a simple concept so many times.

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And I'm not going to limit myself to G-rated entertainment. That's not going to be happening. 'This is not as simple as most people here would like it to be.

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50 minutes ago, Bliss Rembrandt said:

 I may be done with Second LIfe because of this. I'm definitely done reading these responses because I'm sick of being accused of going looking for it, or participating in it or surely being into it.  Or telling everyone else what to think. No, I'm looking for ways to make Second Life a better place for young people and women. If you have a problem with this, you are part of the problem. I'm turning off notifications for this post because some people are dumb and I'm sad.

I get your hurt totally it does make me sad to see it in SL not just for myself, but for others too. There is, really sadly, so many people this effects, more then we will ever know, negatively because of experience they've had, friends have had or family too. I'm in all of those situations... I don't agree with the concept some have of "get over it, avoid it" cause lol come on do they think we haven't tried avoiding it hence why we are complaining? Anyway. It's good you express how you feel, just as friendly advise though yeah make your point then don't let anybody who doesn't agree anger you. Cause yeah it will just get used against you, in these forums there is a high expectation for perfectionism to be had and its pretty unreasonably annoying. Maybe try contact Linden Lab directly aswell. See what they think, I think its getting out of control when it comes to these places and I think for the benefit of all, it'd be a good step forward from this for LL to revise the matter(s) for themselves.

Another thing you can do aswell, mute. There is that option here aswell. I do it when someone tries to make an argument. 

Edited by SteffiiSugabum
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25 minutes ago, SteffiiSugabum said:

I think its getting out of control when it comes to these places and I think for the benefit of all, it'd be a good step forward from this for LL to revise the matter(s) for themselves.

Oh hell no...

Look, I live in a country, where, back in the 90's, "concern over certain non consensual activities" resulted in a legal ruling, that effectively made consensual spanking games a prosecutable offence, defined as "actual bodily harm", it also resulted in well known body artists, piercers and tattooists being accused of ABH, and having the books of portfolio pictures of their work confiscated as "evidence" of said ABH.

It reached a stage where, if you for example, got a nipple pierced "because it looks cool" that was legal, but if you did it because "it feels good" you were guilty of "aiding and abetting Actual Bodily Harm" against your self, and could be sent down for about HALF the jail sentence your piecing studio owner would get for accepting your business.

One documented case from Yorkshire, involved 38 gay men being arrested at a birthday party for "Intent to commit unlawful sex" because they were wearing LEATHER TROUSERS!

Their lawyers got them released within a few hours... But the Police kept the leather trousers as "evidence".

Yeah, the "Rape Alley" sims are repellent crapholes, filled with knuckle dragging retards, but...

A tightening of the rules to eliminate them, will piss down the backs of so many others.

The principle is simple... LWA - Let Well Alone.

I don't visit Rape Alley sims, I don't visit GoreBore sims, I don't visit "Land of da Mastas wot R natraly dumbinant, weer rlv hos can't say no"...



 

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1 minute ago, Klytyna said:

Oh hell no...

Look, I live in a country, where, back in the 90's, "concern over certain non consensual activities" resulted in a legal ruling, that effectively made consensual spanking games a prosecutable offence, defined as "actual bodily harm", it also resulted in well known body artists, piercers and tattooists being accused of ABH, and having the books of portfolio pictures of their work confiscated as "evidence" of said ABH.

It reached a stage where, if you for example, got a nipple pierced "because it looks cool" that was legal, but if you did it because "it feels good" you were guilty of "aiding and abetting Actual Bodily Harm" against your self, and could be sent down for about HALF the jail sentence your piecing studio owner would get for accepting your business.

One documented case from Yorkshire, involved 38 gay men being arrested at a birthday party for "Intent to commit unlawful sex" because they were wearing LEATHER TROUSERS!

Their lawyers got them released within a few hours... But the Police kept the leather trousers as "evidence".

Yeah, the "Rape Alley" sims are repellent crapholes, filled with knuckle dragging retards, but...

A tightening of the rules to eliminate them, will piss down the backs of so many others.

The principle is simple... LWA - Let Well Alone.

I don't visit Rape Alley sims, I don't visit GoreBore sims, I don't visit "Land of da Mastas wot R natraly dumbinant, weer rlv hos can't say no"...



 

I understand your concern, but I don't agree really. You can't tell the outcome of something before its happened. There are plenty of things in the past where the law has gone wrong. Not gonna get into that here because its off topic. There is things going on today aswell that I don't agree with either. 

But yeah when its getting to the point of being able to be found so easily, when there are objects/devices/drugs being sold and advertised for rape simulation which is already against the MP TOS anyway... it does need revising in my view. 

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9 hours ago, Female Winslet said:

This kind of thing is classic metoo.

I read an interesting comment piece lately (by a feminist no less)... it suggested that replacing the casting couch of patriachy with the current "destroy the males" of feminism was just "same crap different leader".

 

IBTL!

Edited by Callum Meriman
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3 minutes ago, SteffiiSugabum said:

You can't tell the outcome of something before its happened

Yes, you can, prediction based on the logical consequences of a system is a well established activity, people do it all the time, predicting who will win an election based on surveys of voter stupidity, and marketing budgets/press coverage, for example.

There is also the form of prediction that is based on past attempts to do the same thing. Everytime anyone tries [solution A] the result is [problem B]. That's a well established activity too.

We KNOW where this sort of thing leads to.

We've seen it before, EVERY time clueless vanillas decide to crack down on "depictions of rape" for "the Greater Good", they invariable start by pissing on the Consensual Kink community.

Your digital fetish artwork depicting single figures in shiny clothing gets taken down because some Vanilla associates latex wear with BDSM, and assumes BDSM is all about kidnapping and rape...

So a digital art gallery website removes digital art, because some clueless vanilla middle manager at the credit card processing company that handles the VIP subscriber transactions, assumes latex dresses = rape, and their company has responded to some fugging stupid new law from clueless vanilla politicians pandering to the clueless vanilla voters demands for a new law to deal with something that is adequately covered by all the old laws, by announcing a new policy of refusing to do business with gallery sites that "promote rape"...

I actually had a long argument about this with one of the other artists on that site...

He claimed the new restrictions were a good thing, and justified this by ranting on about how looking at adult art "makes you go out and do those things" and how he had TWO teenage daughters, and didn't want them raped by somebody who's brain had been taken over by one of my pictures of a woman in a latex outfit. Because HE KNEW that there was a direct link between adult art and sex crimes...

The argument ended with him storming out of the artists chat room in a huff, when I pointed out that 90% of the images in his gallery depicted hetrosexual activity between male figures in their apparent 20's and 30's, with female figures who looked suspiciously "Just 15 Barely Illegal"...

...

It doesn't matter if YOU think otherwise, recorded history says you are wrong...

I've said my piece, you disagree, but then you would, you are one of those people who actually thinks you can legislate what happens inside peoples heads.


 



 

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Nice assumption of me being vanilla. Lol. I'm not actually. However I have limits. I personally believe everyone should have limits just for their own safety. We don't know "anything" we can make assumptions though, yes. 

I'm not faulting you by the way for having a concern. Concerns are valid, a natural part of being human. However, I have a concern about what is going on in SL in the present. 

If you can't take another point of view, that's fine. However, you're not gonna change my mind on this one. 

p.s I actually love latex lol... Especially gold/rosegold lol.

Edited by SteffiiSugabum
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