Second Life - Avatar Complexity

[iceing Braveheart]

Published on May 18, 2016

 

 

Can you update the ultra preset to something useful and beneficial like 1,000,000 Complexity

[Solar Legion]

Set it yourself. 

[Ansariel Hiller]

1,000,000! Why o why does somebody want to wear stuff having that complexity - unless you are a sub and have the desire to wear some weird RLV stuff boosting the avatar complexity like that?

[iceing Braveheart]

when that update was released it broke my avatars and friends avatars and made using second life a pita to use for almost everyone with quality avatars as you always have to use unlimited or only use avatars that second life launched with decades ago, you would think the max preset would help or be useful but it sucks and is worthless trash, you always have to use unlimited because no research RND was done in design numbers were randomly picked out of a hat ultra is not ultra complexity is for better visuals the update was done after microtransactions i am willing to accept a complete refund for all microtransactions on account in favour of the update but they would never refund microtransactions

[Ansariel Hiller]

3 minutes ago, iceing Braveheart said:

when that update was released it broke my avatars and friends avatars and made using second life a pita to use for almost everyone with quality avatars as you always have to use unlimited or only use avatars that second life launched with decades ago, you would think the max preset would help or be useful but it sucks and is worthless trash, you always have to use unlimited because no research RND was done in design numbers were randomly picked out of a hat ultra is not ultra complexity is for better visuals the update was done after microtransactions i am willing to accept a complete refund for all microtransactions on account in favour of the update but they would never refund microtransactions

If avatars shoot past the 350K complexity limit, I wouldn't consider them as good quality.

[iceing Braveheart]

Second Life - Avatar Complexity limiter in a nutshell

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krRFlzwnw3U

[Solar Legion]

Kindly cease the BS. 

First you demand a VRAM adjustment that has no practical purpose and then you demand a setting be put in for complexity above one million, pretending it to be "useful and beneficial"...

Seriously, stop.

[iceing Braveheart]

7 hours ago, Ansariel Hiller said:

If avatars shoot past the 350K complexity limit, I wouldn't consider them as good quality.

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/stores/31077

some of these items are listing 84,505 complexity per item

maybe that is a bit because i cannot see it, half of the avatar items do not list complexity base items and huds etc

if I take off all jewelry and accessories complexity is 161,700 minus hair a bald avatar

hair was 308,447 complexity tough finding good quality hair that doesn't look like it was used as a custodians  mop

1 outfit 636,354 complexity

varies a little but most are roughly around that at the moment one million complexity gives room to grow whereas now it is unlimited or nothing

does 350 complexity support that?

if linden labs wants to return all purchases for the broken update i am fine with the update

every time I return to second life I guess complexity spikes higher and higher with the new items that are released by creators / modders second life's based on what modders make not what linden labs makes what product did anyone buy from linden labs besides the coins currency and land

if I have to go back to a basic default avatar because of updates I should be refunded all purchases from the beginning to the end

[Drake1 Nightfire]

Move the slider to unlimited? 

I just want to point out, if your hair is 308K ARC, you are buying the wrong hair. Flexi hair is bad hair. BAD HAIR!!! I walk around in full mesh at under 50K.. Hair, head, body, clothing. Its not that hard to do. 

[Qie Niangao]

I think flexi gets a bad rap; at least I've found a few strands of flexi grafted onto a mesh wig adds a lot for a trivial bit of complexity.

What's an absolute killer, though, is the ancient, pre-mesh practice of massing twisted, tapered tori; just a bit of that really spikes complexity -- possibly more in measure than in fact, although add some blended alpha and you can practically feel the GPU shuffling bits every time the head turns.

To the larger point, yeah, if the avatar has greater than 100K complexity, it's a sure sign of a careless shopper.

(But true confession: I still have a few ancient outfits that must score off the charts, just for the guilty pleasure of nostalgia. Even though they're kind of retro-cool, anything scoring that high would be too embarrassing to wear in public. Obviously.)

[ETA: while I'm ranting about wigs, I must carp on the practice of having a head of hair spontaneously swap alphas, as if wind blew the part to the other side or something. Maybe they're okay products to offer, but they really need to come with pre-purchase warnings that they're like three times as complex as necessary, and that they advertise their profligate stupidity at the first glimpse of Highlight Transparent.]

Edited November 18, 2018 by Qie Niangao

[ellestones]

2 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

I think flexi gets a bad rap; at least I've found a few strands of flexi grafted onto a mesh wig adds a lot for a trivial bit of complexity.

What's an absolute killer, though, is the ancient, pre-mesh practice of massing twisted, tapered tori; just a bit of that really spikes complexity -- possibly more in measure than in fact, although add some blended alpha and you can practically feel the GPU shuffling bits every time the head turns.

agree about the tori

not so much agree about the blended alpha. i have a tail. 16 flex cylinders and 2 textures for the cylinders. The effect on my FPS is about 0.1 if that

[iceing Braveheart]

On 11/18/2018 at 5:37 AM, Qie Niangao said:

To the larger point, yeah, if the avatar has greater than 100K complexity, it's a sure sign of a careless shopper.

How so? complexity was added after I had bought and purchased everything

this softwares like https://store.steampowered.com/earlyaccessfaq/

Edited November 19, 2018 by iceing Braveheart

[Solar Legion]

Steam has diddly bupkiss to do with Second Life.

But then again, you already knew that.

[Drake1 Nightfire]

11 hours ago, iceing Braveheart said:

How so? complexity was added after I had bought and purchased everything

this softwares like https://store.steampowered.com/earlyaccessfaq/

Complexity has always been there... 

[MoiraKathleen]

I don't think that I have ever come across someone whose complexity was over 600,000.   Once in awhile, I have been someplace where there are some large mesh dragons which come in around the 400 - 500,000 range, and I have chosen to render them fully while I've been there.  The majority of the time at the places I go to, most avatars are under 200,000 complexity. 

To the OP, there is no 'broken update' around complexity*.  The slider and the jelly dolls do not prevent you from wearing what ever you want to wear, no matter the complexity.  The trade off is that other people may choose to not see you other than as a jelly doll, but that is their choice, and different people will choose different max values on the slider based on their hardware needs and their experience needs.  

*There are discussions about whether the calculation works as well as it should in terms of calculating a truer cost of rendering, but that is a different conversation. 

[LittleMe Jewell]

4 hours ago, moirakathleen said:

I don't think that I have ever come across someone whose complexity was over 600,000.

While I don't ever go out in highly complex outfits in the hundreds of thousands, while cleaning out old inventory stuff I have come upon a few absolutely gorgeous old prim gown outfits that have come in from 1.0-2.5 million.  I take a picture and save it all, but that is a far as those outfits ever make it.

[iceing Braveheart]

5 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

While I don't ever go out in highly complex outfits in the hundreds of thousands, while cleaning out old inventory stuff I have come upon a few absolutely gorgeous old prim gown outfits that have come in from 1.0-2.5 million.  I take a picture and save it all, but that is a far as those outfits ever make it.

sounds like high complexity is a good thing 

 

[LittleMe Jewell]

26 minutes ago, ChibiDragon007 said:

Unlimited I don't think really is unlimited - just the absolute maximum your system can handle for SL. 

Unlimited would actually allow some griefer to provide more than your system can handle, resulting in a fried GPU.

[arabellajones]

I have very mixed feelings about this.

First my usual, all-mesh, hair body, clothes, and tail has a complexity/displayweight of under 10k

Second, I usually run my viewer with a limit of 100k, and very few people go above 150k

But the UI for complexity setting sucks big-time.The maximum value that can be set is somewhere just over 350k, above that the only uption is "Unlimited", and an extra couple of big steps could be worthwhile. If the last three steps were 350k, 700k, and 1100k, that would still shut the door against the ultra-complexity griefer tools, while allowing a handful of extreme avatars.

On what I see, Complexity is the only one controlled by a slider without a direct numeric input.

Incidentally, the size of the steps, masked by the slider, is bizarre. It's not measured to 2 or 3 significant figures. It's not jumping from 10,000 to 11,000 but from something such a 9768 to 10732. (Those aren't real numbers, but that's the style.).That's meaningless precision.

[Wulfie Reanimator]

16 minutes ago, arabellajones said:

dentally, the size of the steps, masked by the slider, is bizarre. It's not measured to 2 or 3 significant figures. It's not jumping from 10,000 to 11,000 but from something such a 9768 to 10732. (Those aren't real numbers, but that's the style.).That's meaningless precision.

Because the slider is a linear scale between 20k and 350k, the increments you are seeing are entirely based on wherever your mouse pointer happens to stop. Technically the smallest increment on the slider is based on the resolution of your UI and monitor (and therefore, the distance between individual pixels on the slider).

You can have numeric input though, literally every adjustable thing  in your viewer (even those you can't find normally) are listed under Debug Settings (Ctrl Alt Shift S).

Search for RenderAvatarMaxComplexity and set the value to anything you want.

[Ansariel Hiller]

18 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Because the slider is a linear scale between 20k and 350k

It's not. ARC slider is on a logarithmic scale.

[Wulfie Reanimator]

25 minutes ago, Ansariel Hiller said:

It's not. ARC slider is on a logarithmic scale.

I should've said continuous. The type of algorithm used isn't relevant.

[Candice LittleBoots]

3 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

.. the increments you are seeing are entirely based on wherever your mouse pointer happens to stop. Technically the smallest increment on the slider is based on the resolution of your UI and monitor (and therefore, the distance between individual pixels on the slider).

When clicking on a slider I use the left/right arrow keys if I want to get amongst the finest increments, rather than flailing about with the mouse pointer.

Works with all menu sliders in Firestorm, as far as I know.

[arabellajones]

On 12/23/2018 at 7:20 PM, Wulfie Reanimator said:

I should've said continuous. The type of algorithm used isn't relevant.

Oh yes it is.

And the debug trick is one for people who really know what they're doing. Why doesn't the slider allow direct numeric entry, like all the others do?

[Wulfie Reanimator]

1 hour ago, arabellajones said:

Oh yes it is.

And the debug trick is one for people who really know what they're doing. Why doesn't the slider allow direct numeric entry, like all the others do?

Reasons. However you can add new things into the quick preferences.

For some odd reason, I was able to use the "slider" type up to 500k max, but when I went back to take screenshots, it would limit me to only 100k max and I can't get it back to 500k. But in the last screenshot you can see that I was able to use the "text" type to set max complexity to 543210 and it's reflected by the "real" slider.

Edited January 3, 2019 by Wulfie Reanimator