I Have Cut My Time in SL In Half

[Coby Foden]

3 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

It's not the drivers. It's their softmare. I'm not the only one experiencing this. The forums represents 5 percent of the user population in readership, and 2 percent of the user population in posters. Look at this thread, and count how many people say they are experiencing the same thing. The end.

Well, I don't experience any of the problems what you have. Neither do my friends. And there surely are huge number of people who don't experience the same problems what you have. Can you explain it, why not?

If lots of people would have those problems surely it would be widely known thing and Linden Lab would be investigating what's going on. But obviously the problem what you have is not widely spread thing.

The only solution for you is that you make a bug report. Send LL information about your computer, viewer, net connection, and ask: "What did you change that my computer cannot run SL well anymore? It used to run ok earlier." Nobody else can help you but LL.

[Tari Landar]

56 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

What has changed?

Thanks for reiterating my point, you need to figure out *precisely* what has changed. I know for a fact your windows today, is not the same as your windows even a month ago (again I *like windows, it's not a knock on them, whatsoever). Could that contribute? Yes, it can, denying that it can won't change that. Note, I didn't say it IS the cause, anywhere, just simply that it could be.

It is as likely that something on *your machine changed, as it is likely a change LL has made. The fact that you cannot even for a moment consider the possibility, pretty much answers the question "why can't anyone help you fix this".  You're not willing to do any legwork on your own, and that's going to be detrimental to figuring out the problem. 

No one has yet said that their recommendations will actually sort out your problem, or that they are the root of your problem. You, however, are dead set on a specific root of the problem, so much that your prolonging your problem for sake of...I don't know what, but it comes across as a desire to be right in all things. 

I get your frustration with the issue, and when LL has been responsible for issues(and there have been many, many, many cases of such, I am no apologist, I'm rather critical, really) I have been just as frustrated with them. But, first, I like ensuring they ARE the cause, without a doubt..because going off half roostered won't help me any. I learned that a long time ago when I was having some major issues, just barely got them fixed, and then sl went all wonky dory for over a month (that would be that whole spread in early 2009, lol). Anger didn't even begin to cover it, much less frustration. I also, as I'm sure much of sl does, lol, that you have some serious issues with LL in general (and I get why) and how you feel they treat you. So, I can see that too clouding this whole thing. But I really do think you need to look at most of the suggestions here,t hey're worth considering even if in the back of your mind you continue to say "nope, not it" the entire time. 

[Roxy Couturier]

I run a direct ethernet connection to my modem. I sometimes get slowdowns too Prok. The thing I've noticed when I do get a slowdown, it's 99.9% of the time due to one or more of three things happening.

1 Another windows update, These things are quite large and will take priority over your connection. Sometimes programs will run flaky after it's done until I've gone through the process of shutting down and finishing the update.

2 I run Steam in the background and sometimes there will be updates there as well. Those, of course, I can turn off and on whenever I wish if it's inconvenient.

3 Time of day. With the proliferation of smart phones, smart TVs, tablets and a plethora of other devices, the strain on cable connections is heavier than ever. I'll sometimes get slowdowns during 'primetime' in my area. Roughly from when schools let out until 11pm or so. On a direct ethernet connection.

With all those things, I'll get slowdowns on all my own devices. Such as my Netflix or Prime cutting in and out and games that run over the net will rubberband and stutter.

Of course your cable company is going to pass the buck, but unless you're on a dedicated T1 line, where you are the only person on that cable, your connection can and will degrade when these other strains on your pipeline are in play.

[Prokofy Neva]

On 11/17/2018 at 7:46 PM, Coby Foden said:

Those cannot repair your computer if there is some problem in it. Like in the hardware, they don't last good for ever. They cannot repair errors in the programs, not in the operating system, not in the drivers.

There is nothing wrong with my computer. It runs fine. It runs all kinds of other programs/apps. It's SL's software that isn't working well. The end.

I don't need to be turned into an Amnesty case (BTW, I've lost all respect for that organizations since the days of Gita-Gate). 

Re: "Like you said..it works fine for most others. So look at the variables that are different between your machine and all the others it's working fine for. "

 

There's actually another thing to do, consistent with the Socratic Method. Look at all the people *in this thread* who have the SAME experience as I have. See what they have in common. Oh, I know, the Lindens' softmare.

[Coby Foden]

 

9 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

There is nothing wrong with my computer.

[Love Zhaoying]

10 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

There is nothing wrong with my computer. It runs fine. It runs all kinds of other programs/apps. It's SL's software that isn't working well. The end.

I don't need to be turned into an Amnesty case (BTW, I've lost all respect for that organizations since the days of Gita-Gate). 

Re: "Like you said..it works fine for most others. So look at the variables that are different between your machine and all the others it's working fine for. "

 

There's actually another thing to do, consistent with the Socratic Method. Look at all the people *in this thread* who have the SAME experience as I have. See what they have in common. Oh, I know, the Lindens' softmare.

So, you don’t want to take advice, you don’t want help. Your point is just to vent?

Got it!

[Luna Bliss]

Can you afford to have someone come to your home and check out your computer? Sometimes a minor tweak could help it play well with SL again, or you might need a new part that would enable this.

BTW, a Windows update just fried my laptop...made it totally unusable...I can't even access my Desktop. Researching Windows updates it looks like many have this problem. I'll be turning off those updates for the future.  Not that this is your problem, but if you have not disabled updates it might be good to do so. I'm sure someone can post the procedure for disabling them.

[LittleMe Jewell]

41 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

  but if you have not disabled updates it might be good to do so. I'm sure someone can post the procedure for disabling them.

It is not a good idea for the average home user to disable Windows updates unless they really know what they are doing.  For Windows 10, it is an extremely complicated process.

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

45 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

  but if you have not disabled updates it might be good to do so. I'm sure someone can post the procedure for disabling them.

It is not a good idea for the average home user to disable Windows updates unless they really know what they are doing.  For Windows 10, it is an extremely complicated process.

Really?  I thought it was just 3 fairly simply steps, but  I was researching on some forum and got that idea from a poster.

I'll ask the repair person coming later today. I know you can decline the updates till a later date, but it seemed at one point I couldn't decline anymore.

[Luna Bliss]

I'll be getting a new video card for my desktop, and am anxious to see if this will fix the problem where sculpts rez slowly or need a click to fully rez.  As Cody & Callum mentioned, sculpts don't pop into shape as quickly as they used to. I just assumed the problem was my PC getting older, but this may not be the case -- it might be that certain video cards don't play as well with SL anymore.

Eventually I encountered a couple of sculpts that totally won't rez out, and remain distorted even if I click on them.

[LittleMe Jewell]

38 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Really?  I thought it was just 3 fairly simply steps, but  I was researching on some forum and got that idea from a poster.

I'll ask the repair person coming later today. I know you can decline the updates till a later date, but it seemed at one point I couldn't decline anymore.

They made things much more complicated in Windows 10.  It seems that Microsoft is out to fully control the Windows on your computer.

I still have not managed to fully stop the updating -- no matter what I do, it eventually re-enables itself.  I have however, at least managed to completely stop auto-updates to my video drivers and stop the auto-reboot.  That at least gives me a bit more control.

[Luna Bliss]

12 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

They made things much more complicated in Windows 10.  It seems that Microsoft is out to fully control the Windows on your computer.

I still have not managed to fully stop the updating -- no matter what I do, it eventually re-enables itself.  I have however, at least managed to completely stop auto-updates to my video drivers and stop the auto-reboot.  That at least gives me a bit more control.

Thanks, I will see if the repair person can do that..

[Prokofy Neva]

6 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

 

Seeing "Error 21" in relationships to Second Life isn't "something wrong with my computer".

My computer works find and everything else works fine on it.

I've seen Error 21 in the past, *when SL was playing far better than it is now*.

*I don't see Error 21 now as it happens*.

Error 21 has various easy fixes you can find in Google, I've done them, it has no effect on how SL plays.

No one has established this is the reason for SL not playing well, which is not only my problem.

[Coby Foden]

23 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

My computer works find and everything else works fine on it.

"Everything else works fine" is irrelevant. You cannot run SL properly. Lots of people can. So there is something in your computer which prevents it running SL properly.
Find out what it is and the problem is fixed. Sitting back and waiting that LL will fix your personal computer problem is probably not going to happen.

Anyway, If you're extremely lucky, there is a slight change that some future viewer update might magically work well on your computer too.
Just sit tight and keep waiting, doing nothing on your end. Good Luck! 👍

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Coby Foden said:

Sitting back and waiting that LL will fix your personal computer problem is probably not going to happen.

Maybe she needs someone to file a Jira.

[Tari Landar]

44 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Seeing "Error 21" in relationships to Second Life isn't "something wrong with my computer".

My computer works find and everything else works fine on it.

I've seen Error 21 in the past, *when SL was playing far better than it is now*.

*I don't see Error 21 now as it happens*.

Error 21 has various easy fixes you can find in Google, I've done them, it has no effect on how SL plays.

No one has established this is the reason for SL not playing well, which is not only my problem.

The only thing your post proves, is that you have network issues that only *sometimes* cause problems for your sl. Just because you don't see that error elsewhere, doesn't mean your network isn't having problems. Not every application or program is designed to GIVE you error messages (most, in fact, are not). That error message is a direct correlation with your actual internet connection-it means your connection went haywire and can therefore not load something, though it's rarely specific as to WHAT it cannot connect to. It still is a problem that *begins with your network connection, and then spirals out, with the potential to cause other issues. It very much IS your connection causing that error, btw, and even a super quick google search would've told you that. You have no idea if it actually affect other areas of your system, or if they manage working around it, because you are focused on what you KNOW is not working right (ie, you don't go looking for other things that might be working poorly too)...like most other people would be. That's pretty standard when something goes wonky, we look at what's gone wonky first and foremost, and connect the two, rather than looking deeper.  The fact that you say you have "done them"-doesn't really answer WHAT you've done, nor does it address the base issue, that is, the reason you have gotten the error..ie...your connection(because YES, the two are linked, and denying it won't help). Also, YES, operating system changes CAN also cause network issues, up to and including this particular NETWORK error. 

You also haven't established what is *actually wrong yourself, so it would do you well to listen, pay attention to, and try, all of the suggestions already made.  That's more for everyone else that may be having similar issues. 

[Tari Landar]

By the by....when I ride Amtrak, which I do at least 4-6 times a year, for 8+ hours each way, I get the exact same issues as you (including the same error). The only difference between my experience and your experience, is that I KNOW it's the network, because I am using Amtrak's wifi and it's not reliable for many things, including sl, because it's friggen wifi lol.  I also know, should I decide to access SL from somewhere other than my home, on any device, utilizing wifi, that I am on the low end of that network totem pole, that is, below anyone on a wired connection, and I have the potential to experience multiple issues related to a poor network connection. That is the nature of a wireless connection, try as we might to be superior beings in all things, we have yet to perfect wifi to the point that it is as equal to a wired connection as far as reliability and solid connections are concerned. Does that mean I will ALWAYS experience issues on wifi? Nope. In fact, I can actually go months, years even, using wifi, and never really notice any issues.  That doesn't mean they don't exist, it just means *I* don't notice them, because *I* have no need to look for them when things are functioning just peachy. 

 

I don't think you really understand the differences between wifi and a wired connection and why one is more preferred over the other, or why one is more likely to experience issues. Perhaps you feel you don't need to actually understand them..and that's fine. But, in doing so, you're going to continue to run into problems, because you're not addressing the base issue. It may not be today, tomorrow, or even months/years from now, but at some point, your poor connection is going to make something go really wonky, and then you're going to be pissed. I can only imagine the anger filled posts we'll see when your network errors render sl completely un-playable..because it's going to happen, eventually. I'm certain it will be all LL"s fault then too, because, they're simply out to get you with some personal vendetta. 

 

 

[Prokofy Neva]

11 hours ago, Tari Landar said:

The only thing your post proves, is that you have network issues that only *sometimes* cause problems for your sl. Just because you don't see that error elsewhere, doesn't mean your network isn't having problems. Not every application or program is designed to GIVE you error messages (most, in fact, are not). That error message is a direct correlation with your actual internet connection-it means your connection went haywire and can therefore not load something, though it's rarely specific as to WHAT it cannot connect to. It still is a problem that *begins with your network connection, and then spirals out, with the potential to cause other issues. It very much IS your connection causing that error, btw, and even a super quick google search would've told you that. You have no idea if it actually affect other areas of your system, or if they manage working around it, because you are focused on what you KNOW is not working right (ie, you don't go looking for other things that might be working poorly too)...like most other people would be. That's pretty standard when something goes wonky, we look at what's gone wonky first and foremost, and connect the two, rather than looking deeper.  The fact that you say you have "done them"-doesn't really answer WHAT you've done, nor does it address the base issue, that is, the reason you have gotten the error..ie...your connection(because YES, the two are linked, and denying it won't help). Also, YES, operating system changes CAN also cause network issues, up to and including this particular NETWORK error. 

You also haven't established what is *actually wrong yourself, so it would do you well to listen, pay attention to, and try, all of the suggestions already made.  That's more for everyone else that may be having similar issues. 

Let's say you go to the store and buy six bottles of yogurt protein drink from six different companies with all more or less the same expiration date.

The next day, you pour some of each bottle into a separate cup and taste it. And you discover that one of the yogurt drinks has turned and is sour.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be my refrigerator" (computer). But it can't be, because the five other drinks are ok.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be the store" (your browser). But it can't be, because only one of the six drinks from this store went bad.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be the expiration date" (your connection). But that can't be, because another bottle has an even earlier expiration date and it tastes fine.

Do you say, "Just because another bottle has an earlier expiration date doesn't mean that there isn't something wrong with your refrigerator. You have no idea if that earlier expiration date for that brand in fact means that the store is to blame. Because yes, the store is to blame if it doesn't check the expiration date for that particular brand."

No, you realize that the brand doesn't have very good pasteurization or storage or transport. You stop buying that brand. 

But not if you are some Lindens and fanboyz. Then you say, "Your refrigerator is to blame." If you are finally persuaded that isn't the case, you say, "The store is to blame" or maybe "it must be the store's failure to watch that particular brand's expiration date which is different than others." 

Edited November 21, 2018 by Prokofy Neva

[ellestones]

16 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'll be getting a new video card for my desktop, and am anxious to see if this will fix the problem where sculpts rez slowly or need a click to fully rez.  As Cody & Callum mentioned, sculpts don't pop into shape as quickly as they used to. I just assumed the problem was my PC getting older, but this may not be the case -- it might be that certain video cards don't play as well with SL anymore.

Eventually I encountered a couple of sculpts that totally won't rez out, and remain distorted even if I click on them.

a few releases ago now (can't remember the exact release number but was this year sometime) LL changed how sculpts rezzed

the way it used to work was:

1) rez a sculpt placeholder (a sphere)

2) rerender the sphere when the sculpt shape texture is available

3) render the face texture on the sphere or the sculpt shape whichever it is at the time

the result was often lots and lots of face textured spheres in the view waiting for the sculpt shape texture to resolve itself

LL removed step 1)

result is now that when the sculpt shape texture never arrives or is not able to be resolved then is never shown

i personal prefer that LL removed step 1). I rather not see anything than see spherical blobs all over the screen, which continue to show forever when the sculpt shape texture never arrives/resolves 

 

[Prokofy Neva]

12 hours ago, Tari Landar said:

By the by....when I ride Amtrak, which I do at least 4-6 times a year, for 8+ hours each way, I get the exact same issues as you (including the same error). The only difference between my experience and your experience, is that I KNOW it's the network, because I am using Amtrak's wifi and it's not reliable for many things, including sl, because it's friggen wifi lol.  I also know, should I decide to access SL from somewhere other than my home, on any device, utilizing wifi, that I am on the low end of that network totem pole, that is, below anyone on a wired connection, and I have the potential to experience multiple issues related to a poor network connection. That is the nature of a wireless connection, try as we might to be superior beings in all things, we have yet to perfect wifi to the point that it is as equal to a wired connection as far as reliability and solid connections are concerned. Does that mean I will ALWAYS experience issues on wifi? Nope. In fact, I can actually go months, years even, using wifi, and never really notice any issues.  That doesn't mean they don't exist, it just means *I* don't notice them, because *I* have no need to look for them when things are functioning just peachy. 

 

I don't think you really understand the differences between wifi and a wired connection and why one is more preferred over the other, or why one is more likely to experience issues. Perhaps you feel you don't need to actually understand them..and that's fine. But, in doing so, you're going to continue to run into problems, because you're not addressing the base issue. It may not be today, tomorrow, or even months/years from now, but at some point, your poor connection is going to make something go really wonky, and then you're going to be pissed. I can only imagine the anger filled posts we'll see when your network errors render sl completely un-playable..because it's going to happen, eventually. I'm certain it will be all LL"s fault then too, because, they're simply out to get you with some personal vendetta. 

 

 

I don't ever get Error 21 on Amtrak. Must be something wrong with your laptop.

SL works on wi-fi. It has for years. But now it doesn't, and it's not just my issue. Read this thread LOL

BTW I've had wire connections and yeah, I know the difference, and sometimes over the years SL stops working right even on wired connections.

 

[Resi Pfeffer]

2 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Let's say you go to the store and buy six bottles of yogurt protein drink from six different companies with all more or less the same expiration date.

The next day, you pour some of each bottle into a separate cup and taste it. And you discover that one of the yogurt drinks has turned and is sour.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be my refrigerator" (computer). But it can't be, because the five other drinks are ok.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be the store" (your browser). But it can't be, because only one of the six drinks from this store went bad.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be the expiration date" (your connection). But that can't be, because another bottle has an even earlier expiration date and it tastes fine.

Do you say, "Just because another bottle has an earlier expiration date doesn't mean that there isn't something wrong with your refrigerator. You have no idea if that earlier expiration date for that brand in fact means that the store is to blame. Because yes, the store is to blame if it doesn't check the expiration date for that particular brand."

No, you realize that the brand doesn't have very good pasteurization or storage or transport. You stop buying that brand. 

But not if you are some Lindens and fanboyz. Then you say, "Your refrigerator is to blame." If you are finally persuaded that isn't the case, you say, "The store is to blame" or maybe "it must be the store's failure to watch that particular brand's expiration date which is different than others." 

The energy you waste on fighting other peoples thoughts (which are just meant to help you), would be in better use, if you would try to fix your problem.

[Tari Landar]

2 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

I don't ever get Error 21 on Amtrak. Must be something wrong with your laptop.

SL works on wi-fi. It has for years. But now it doesn't, and it's not just my issue. Read this thread LOL

BTW I've had wire connections and yeah, I know the difference, and sometimes over the years SL stops working right even on wired connections.

 

I don't believe you even ride Amtrak, let alone have ever used their wifi, lmao.  Rest assured, my laptop is just peachy keen jelly bean, and even if she wasn't, I wouldn't take advice from someone that knows even less about her than I do  Amtrak's wifi availability is limited, as a feature, not a bug. Many routes don't even have wifi, still (or yet, for those still scheduled to). So, yep, you can, and should, expect to experience network issues, assuming you're not simply throttled entirely, off and on.  Again, it's by design, and the only way they can really offer any sort of wifi service at all (some of those routes get packed!!). Still, that particular network error (and countless others) is *not* going to always (or even usually) be displayed when there is an issue in, well, a whole hell of a lot of programs and applications. 

I know you're not all that interested in finding the actual cause, but I am willing to bet others who have similar (no one said they have the exact same issues, btw) issues are more than willing to try whatever they can. Odds are pretty darn good, they're all going to find a solution before you will, all because they're willing to listen...even if they don't think the suggestions will work at all. 

But, I digress...you keep doing you

And everyone else...I do hope your issues are remedied swiftly, it's not much fun when things go wonky.  (pssst.....listen to the more seasoned geeks, nerds, IT geniuses, gurus in sl flubbery and other shenanigans, whatever they wish to be called here..they're smart, they know what they're talking about...I'm not one of them, I'm just weird)

Edited November 21, 2018 by Tari Landar

[Theresa Tennyson]

4 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Let's say you go to the store and buy six bottles of yogurt protein drink from six different companies with all more or less the same expiration date.

The next day, you pour some of each bottle into a separate cup and taste it. And you discover that one of the yogurt drinks has turned and is sour.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be my refrigerator" (computer). But it can't be, because the five other drinks are ok.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be the store" (your browser). But it can't be, because only one of the six drinks from this store went bad.

Do you say, "Oh, it must be the expiration date" (your connection). But that can't be, because another bottle has an even earlier expiration date and it tastes fine.

Do you say, "Just because another bottle has an earlier expiration date doesn't mean that there isn't something wrong with your refrigerator. You have no idea if that earlier expiration date for that brand in fact means that the store is to blame. Because yes, the store is to blame if it doesn't check the expiration date for that particular brand."

No, you realize that the brand doesn't have very good pasteurization or storage or transport. You stop buying that brand. 

But not if you are some Lindens and fanboyz. Then you say, "Your refrigerator is to blame." If you are finally persuaded that isn't the case, you say, "The store is to blame" or maybe "it must be the store's failure to watch that particular brand's expiration date which is different than others." 

That would be a fine analogy if we had any assurance that the other "products" that your "refrigerator" kept "cold" had similar characteristics to Second Life. They almost assuredly don't. Second Life requires a constant two-way connection that sends a tremendous amount of data both ways and can run almost nothing directly off your computer.

A more accurate analogy would be buying a can of tomato juice, a can of soda, a bottle of YooHoo and a carton of milk and then putting them in your (broken) refrigerator. In a few days, the milk and only the milk would be swollen and hissing. Does that mean that's the fault of the milk supplier? After all, YooHoo is sort of chocolate milk. Of course, it's been processed so heavily a cow wouldn't recognize it, but its brown and almost opaque, isn't it?

[ellestones]

40 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

That would be a fine analogy if we had any assurance that the other "products" that your "refrigerator" kept "cold" had similar characteristics to Second Life. They almost assuredly don't. Second Life requires a constant two-way connection that sends a tremendous amount of data both ways and can run almost nothing directly off your computer.

A more accurate analogy would be buying a can of tomato juice, a can of soda, a bottle of YooHoo and a carton of milk and then putting them in your (broken) refrigerator. In a few days, the milk and only the milk would be swollen and hissing. Does that mean that's the fault of the milk supplier?

am not sure this analogy is correct

on similar characteristics

software 1 = milk
software 2 = cheese
software 3 = cream
software 4 = butter

stick them all in the fridge. The butter goes off. The milk, cheese and cream are all good

butter vendor says: Our butter does have issues of which we are aware. But your fridge is most likely also contributing to the problem with our butter. Because while other people also experience these issues with our butter there is nothing wrong with their fridge. Perhaps you could get another fridge and see if that might change things for you

we say to butter vendor: but the milk, cheese and cream never went off in my fridge

butter vendor: Sorry, we don't provide milk, cheese or cream. You will have to speak to those vendors about any problems with their products

we say to butter vendor: But I don't have any problem with those products

butter vendor: That's great! Is there anything else I can help you with

we say to butter vendor: !!! There's a problem with your butter. When I stick it in my fridge it goes off. Unlike the milk, cheese and cream !!!

they say: *sigh* We have been over this already. Perhaps you could try turning the fridge off and on? It may help you feel better

and then we start think about unmentionable things the butter vendor can do with their butter

[Bitsy Buccaneer]

On 11/17/2018 at 9:22 AM, Prokofy Neva said:

No. It's everywhere. On all sims. Even in an empty Linden ocean. It's not about caching. Every time I return to the same sim I go every day, it's grey squares all over again and loading from scratch.

Quote

I clear cache.

How often do you clear the cache?