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1 hour ago, Luna Bliss said:

 

Why do you feel the need to tell them what you think about their genitalia? Looking at the first post from the OP it does not seem they requested that..

I know what they think about their genitalia.

If they loved it, they wouldn't be transgendered.

duh

 

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3 minutes ago, Phorumities said:

I know what they think about their genitalia.

If they loved it, they wouldn't be transgendered.

duh

You can be trans while being comfortable with your genitals. It's not just about that.

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1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I think you missed or dismissed the discussion of non-binary..

once again, there are only TWO genders. Male and female. 

You obviously missed all the posts explaining that simple fact.

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1 minute ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

You can be trans while being comfortable with your genitals. It's not just about that.

I'm sure its not, I was trying to simplify things for the person I was replying to.

It's possible to so muddle terms and definitions that in the end there is no basis for any discussion or agreement on anything.

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3 minutes ago, Phorumities said:

cisgender: your mind agrees with the physical sex your your body is.

Transgender (shortened to trans for all the cool with-it kids): your mind disagrees with the physical sex your body is.

I completely agree with this*, especially the bit about how cool we are ?

4 minutes ago, Phorumities said:

gender: the physical sex you are

sex: gender, ie male or female. 

However, this bit conflates gender with physical sex. Gender is your identity, physical sex is just physical sex. They're two different things (the reason 'gender' has been conflated with 'sex' in the past is because historically English speakers were simply bashful about using the word 'sex'. We're all a bit more grown up now).

 

8 minutes ago, Phorumities said:

That's all there is, the rest is just mental masturbation.

This is just dismissive of peoples' lived realities. Nonbinary identities, which come under the trans umbrella, are perfectly valid, and allow people to express who they actually are rather than having to conform to an ill-fitting box.

 

*knowing a few agender folk, I'm happy to acknowledge this as a third descriptor alongside cis and trans, but it's best to allow agender individuals to define what it means to them.

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Just now, Phorumities said:

once again, there are only TWO genders. Male and female. 

You obviously missed all the posts explaining that simple fact.

Yes I did, I only saw your post in the "Unread Content" tab and wanted to do a drive-by. I don't have interest in getting deep into this (especially with what I'm now reading), it's just an FYI.

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1 minute ago, LexxiXhan said:

I completely agree with this*, especially the bit about how cool we are ?

However, this bit conflates gender with physical sex. Gender is your identity, physical sex is just physical sex. They're two different things (the reason 'gender' has been conflated with 'sex' in the past is because historically English speakers were simply bashful about using the word 'sex'. We're all a bit more grown up now).

 

This is just dismissive of peoples' lived realities. Nonbinary identities, which come under the trans umbrella, are perfectly valid, and allow people to express who they actually are rather than having to conform to an ill-fitting box.

 

*knowing a few agender folk, I'm happy to acknowledge this as a third descriptor alongside cis and trans, but it's best to allow agender individuals to define what it means to them.

No one is putting anyone in boxes. Everyone is free to describe their gender in any way that makes them happy.

So if a woman, with a 100% complete woman's body, wishes to declare she's not a woman, she's actually 100% male, good for her, but if i wanna date a man, i want a man with man bits.

As I said, everyone can self identify, but in the end, the definitions and results are meaningless.

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Phorumities said:

So if a woman, with a 100% complete woman's body, wishes to declare she's not a woman, she's actually 100% male, good for her, but if i wanna date a man, i want a man with man bits.

Which is fine. You have a preference for cis gender men. Trans men and trans women are perfectly aware that some people have a preference for cis folk.

18 minutes ago, Phorumities said:

As I said, everyone can self identify, but in the end, the definitions and results are meaningless.

Well, they're not meaningless. Not to the people who live those identities and have an understanding of themselves in relation to the world and people around them. Maybe you mean they just don't mean very much to you?

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53 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Yes I did, I only saw your post in the "Unread Content" tab and wanted to do a drive-by. I don't have interest in getting deep into this (especially with what I'm now reading), it's just an FYI.

Don't bother engaging with them, love. They're just here for a reaction.

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1 hour ago, OfDragonFire said:

I feel like I answered this over and over again throughout the thread but not all trans people are the same and not all of us fit or want to fit into society's ideas of what it means to be male or female. I am proud of who I am, of my gender; why would I want to hide it? Or erase that part of my identity to make other people feel better? 

I didn't say anything about that... I was talking about your physical body or in SLs case your pixel one. I asked... Why would you want to have an actual representation of your physical body if you are trans? Wouldn't you just let the body you identify as shine through in SL? You keep saying you are male, yet you have a female av in SL (with male bits i assume). If as you say, you are male, why bother with the female av? Why not just get a male one?

You have said you were born with a female body, i think.. Ah, yes, its in your profile. "No, I wasn't 'born' a girl, I was assigned female at birth." Quick question about that, if you were born with a female body, and you had a female mind, would you still say you were "assigned female at birth" or would you say you were female? Cuz to me anyway, that sounds a lot like you had a female body but the doctors should really have known you were a male mind in a female body and done something about it as soon as you popped out. 

You say in your profile you are a boy with a... cat... Why? If you identify as male, why not be male? This is the confusing crap  us LGBT supporters and even the non supported get confused about, especially when the reply is along the lines of, "I don't have to conform to societies standards." This may be true, but logic has some questions... 

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7 hours ago, AyelaNewLife said:

To be honest, this is probably the most calm and reasonable discussion on this topic I've ever had on the internet. It is so, so easy for this to turn nasty fast. And we're 9 pages in and it's stayed polite, if a little warm at times. So thanks for that.

Edit: Not just aimed at you, but everyone else commenting too

I jinxed it, soz

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15 minutes ago, Drake1 Nightfire said:

Why would you want to have an actual representation of your physical body if you are trans?

I can't answer on behalf of @OfDragonFire, obviously. But here're a few thoughts:

Some trans folk prefer to live in stealth. Some don't.

Nonbinary trans folk may not fit into the binary representations commonly available in SL.

Gender identity does not equate to preferred expression or presentation.

Some of us are queer as feck and enjoy the ways we and our partners like to mix things up ;)

Other people have issues. Some of those issues revolve around gender, sex and honesty. Some of us prefer not to deal with f**kw*ts.

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42 minutes ago, Drake1 Nightfire said:

If you identify as male, why not be male? This is the confusing crap  us LGBT supporters and even the non supported get confused about, especially when the reply is along the lines of, "I don't have to conform to societies standards." This may be true, but logic has some questions... 

Somehow I don't think OfDragonFire wants to attempt to explain it to you, given the unwelcoming vibe of this thread.

But maybe I can...perhaps he wants to be true to himself...to be in SL as he is in RL...and that true identity would be a person with a woman's body who feels he is a male, or partially so, or landing somewhere along some non-binary definition of that continuum.  Perhaps he wants to be accepted as that both in RL and SL.

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3 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Love Zhaoying, speaking directly to you again...in public...

Whut? As long as we stay on topic, no issues.

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46 minutes ago, Drake1 Nightfire said:

"assigned female at birth" 

“Assigned _____” is preferred terminology..for what the biological gender was assigned at birth. There’s a great cartoon “Assigned Male”, drawn by a Trans woman artist. It talks about the struggles and issues in a positive way.

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1 minute ago, Love Zhaoying said:
5 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Love Zhaoying, speaking directly to you again...in public...

Whut? As long as we stay on topic, no issues.

Ok, well then maybe you can explain it to me then....why do many Hindu seem to have such a problem with activism? Luna loves yoga  I sometimes wear a pink pussyhat and march, and all my Social Work friends have been activists...protecting abortion clinics by meditation is good for u guarding the doors to the clinics and such...marching in gay parades and women's 'take back the night' events....  Hindu Hindu Hindu Relgion

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13 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Ok, well then maybe you can explain it to me then....why do many Hindu seem to have such a problem with activism? Luna loves yoga  I sometimes wear a pink pussyhat and march, and all my Social Work friends have been activists...protecting abortion clinics by meditation is good for u guarding the doors to the clinics and such...marching in gay parades and women's 'take back the night' events....  Hindu Hindu Hindu Relgion

 

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Hey it was a serious question.  'Activism' has been either trashed or questioned in this thread. (yes there were some hidden words)

This seems bizarre to me, resting in this privilege that activism has given us while trashing it...

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10 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Hey it was a serious question.  'Activism' has been either trashed or questioned in this thread. (yes there were some hidden words)

This seems bizarre to me, resting in this privilege that activism has given us while trashing it...

Well, the upcoming Trans Day of Remembrance (TDOR) is coming up shortly, an opportunity for activism. There is a candle light vigil at City Hall, and of course we hold a special Sunday service. Speaking of activism, I saw a great Facebook post that gay marriage rights aren’t from recent laws, but thanks to original Stonewall riots protesters - the leads of which were Trans Black women!

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I have read all 11 pages of this thread and it has been interesting to read about both sides. I have PDD-Nos, an Autism spectrum disorder. Which means i interpret the world and myself differently from other people. This is seen as a DISORDER and as such the consensus is that it needs to be treated. In my case with medication and therapy. This in order for me to conform to every day life so i don't stick out like a sore thumb. If i would just stop my medication and therapy and say sod it, the world will just have to conform to my disorder and the effects of it and if they don't they are *insert any name of choice* it would become a rather "interesting" place.

So my question would be: Why should the world these days conform to a disorder instead of the person having the disorder conform to the world?

I would like to add that although i make light of my situation i can assure you that i have been through deep valleys because of it and talking about it lightheartedly  is just my way to cope with it. 

I still very much love my trans friends but that question keeps bugging me

Edited by Jules Catlyn
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4 minutes ago, Jules Catlyn said:

Why should the world these days conform to a disorder instead of the person having the disorder conform to the world?

I hope you don't mind my response: neurodiversity and gender diversity aren't 'disorders', but things that should be included.

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