Phorumities Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said: No. That wasn't what the thread's op said. Go back and read it again. You might find the difference to be a little subtle, but it's very different I'll always put the reasons why I as a seller chose not to sell copyable items. That goes without saying, and no change there I was looking at "group social activity" furniture the other day. There were no copy items selling for $5000 L. If it was copy I might have paid that price but no copy no way. I did find a very suitable product for about $3000 L copy so I bought one. Who is the smarter creator? The one that gets sales by selling copy items, or the one that thinks each sale should be for one no copy item and thus sells less? Edited October 4, 2018 by Phorumities spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 41 minutes ago, Phorumities said: Who is the smarter creator? The one that gets sales by selling copy items, or the one that thinks each sale should be for one no copy item and thus sells less? Phil is smarter, because reasons! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Phorumities said: thats the problem with the western world today too many people think there is no such thing as right and wrong. As societies change through the centuries what is right or wrong changes -- there is no ABSOLUTE right and wrong for all of eternity (I think this is basically what Love is saying). For example, the libertarian alt-right philosophy you champion on the forum (that 'every man is for himself' and 'might makes right' and 'why should power be taken from anyone') might have made sense during hunter-gatherer periods when small bands were roaming around trying to survive. But as society moved into the agricultural period rules changed, and then changed again as industrial society took precedence. In industrial society there is a strong tendency to funnel more money to the top, as the factory owners who are in control need workers to achieve their goals and so can set the rules to favor themselves. This was when more rules and complexities in the determination of 'right and wrong' were needed so that workers had rights too. Capitalism only works with some regulations put in place, and a value system that includes all people (not just those at the top). This is why you see such a focus on social justice now -- it's finally being recognized that certain groups have been disadvantaged through the ages and had severe injustice levied against them via society & the courts. There is finally a strong effort to correct this injustice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qie Niangao Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 One thing that may have changed is the greater availability of quality, low-LI free and low-cost copiable furniture. Between monthly group gifts and Fifty Linden Fridays, one can furnish quite a palace on a pittance, especially once one knows how to use open-source AVsitter's AVpos-shifter script utility to easily migrate poses among items. I think the only viable business model for no-copy now is gacha, which is less about the items on offer than it is about the gambler's fallacy. Such change in objective reality, however, doesn't necessarily affect arguments made on forum threads. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Deakins Posted October 4, 2018 Author Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said: Phil is smarter, because reasons! Reasons = very large profits Phorum...s didn't include the other type - the one who thinks it should be for one copy only but sells a massive amount of stuff. You bit at the wrong bait Edited October 4, 2018 by Phil Deakins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said: The silliest thing I kept reading in that thread was, “a lot of people think everything should be free”. I’ve never met anyone with that opinion. Well I agree there's not a whole lot of people with that opinion, but personally I've met quite a few. I've had people ask me to do a project that takes a month of full-time work to complete (like 200 hours or so) and think 2 dollars in compensation is just fine. Others have said "it's just pixels, and so I'll never pay anything for it". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said: Reasons = very large profits I thought you’re no longer in business? By the way, your statement above is VERY Ferengi. Edited October 4, 2018 by Love Zhaoying 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 1 minute ago, Luna Bliss said: Well I agree there's not a whole lot of people with that opinion, but personally I've met quite a few. I've had people ask me to do a project that takes a month of full-time work to complete (like 200 hours or so) and think 2 dollars in compensation is just fine. Others have said "it's just pixels, and so I'll never pay anything for it". I paid a RL friend US $800 several years ago to make non-SL art of my Neko..got nothin’. Resent same photos not long ago as reference, at his request. By contrast, I paid someone (my choice) L$10k to make my wing tattoos in SL. Need a higher res version, dunno if I’ll ever get the courage to select an artist for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Deakins Posted October 4, 2018 Author Share Posted October 4, 2018 3 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said: I thought you’re no longer in business? By the way, your statement above is VERY Ferengi. That correct. The huge profits were from when I was in business. You can call me Quark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said: That correct. The huge profits were from when I was in business. You can call me Quark. Darn, you quoted before I attached his picture meme! I was too slow. I do hope you treat women better than Ferengi do. Quark evolves, as I recall. Edited October 4, 2018 by Love Zhaoying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 9 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said: Need a higher res version, dunno if I’ll ever get the courage to select an artist for that. Be sure and see previous work, pay in thirds, and even get references if you can. There's been more than a few creators who get the full payment up front and run off with the money without completing the project. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Deakins Posted October 4, 2018 Author Share Posted October 4, 2018 19 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said: Quark evolves, as I recall. He did. He evolved into a judge in Boston Legal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 3 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said: He did. He evolved into a judge in Boston Legal Silly. I mean, because he was forced to interact with non-Ferengi so much, he softened a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Deakins Posted October 4, 2018 Author Share Posted October 4, 2018 oooh lol. But I liked Boston Legal They stopped making it way too soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phorumities Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Luna Bliss said: As societies change through the centuries what is right or wrong changes -- there is no ABSOLUTE right and wrong for all of eternity (I think this is basically what Love is saying). For example, the libertarian alt-right philosophy you champion on the forum (that 'every man is for himself' and 'might makes right' and 'why should power be taken from anyone') might have made sense during hunter-gatherer periods when small bands were roaming around trying to survive. But as society moved into the agricultural period rules changed, and then changed again as industrial society took precedence. In industrial society there is a strong tendency to funnel more money to the top, as the factory owners who are in control need workers to achieve their goals and so can set the rules to favor themselves. This was when more rules and complexities in the determination of 'right and wrong' were needed so that workers had rights too. Capitalism only works with some regulations put in place, and a value system that includes all people (not just those at the top). This is why you see such a focus on social justice now -- it's finally being recognized that certain groups have been disadvantaged through the ages and had severe injustice levied against them via society & the courts. There is finally a strong effort to correct this injustice. I really wish you would stop telling me what I think, it's very tiresome. Libertarian philosophy has nothing to do with might makes right. It's simply a belief that the government rules best that rules least and that each individual in society should be free to follow their own path as long as he doesn't harm anyone else while doing it. You are too obsessed with "groups" and "group rights". You have lost sight of the individual in your mad rush to make it all about "groups". Promoting group rights only promotes group jealousies and group animosities. Your social justice is ultimately promoting class envy, class hatred and in the end class warfare. This rhetoric of divide and conquer has been used the the democrats for a long long time now. It's the only song they know, and its ultimate end will be the destruction of the America free INDIVIDUALS have worked so long and so hard to create. Edited October 4, 2018 by Phorumities spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blush Bravin Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 /me wonders how long it will be before Jagix Linden has to lock this thread too. Seems that's what happened the last time this subject was brought up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 2 minutes ago, Blush Bravin said: /me wonders how long it will be before Jagix Linden has to lock this thread too. Seems that's what happened the last time this subject was brought up. This one seems more civil, with less name-calling and arguing. It’s shorter, too. Give it time! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Phorumities said: really wish you would stop telling me what I think, it's very tiresome. Libertarian philosophy.. Isn’t that exactly what you are doing by lecturing us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blush Bravin Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 Isn't there some kind of taboo about resurrecting a closed thread topic? I mean he can say he's not doing that and that he's quoting from the old forums, but it's still the same topic as the one that got closed. Isn't it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Phorumities said: I really wish you would stop telling me what I think, it's very tiresome. Libertarian philosophy has nothing to do with might makes right. It's simply a belief that the government rules best that rules least and that each individual in society should be free to follow their own path as long as he doesn't harm anyone else while doing it. You are too obsessed with "groups" and "group rights". You have lost sight of the individual in your mad rush to make it all about "groups". Promoting group rights only promotes group jealousies and group animosities. Your social justice is ultimately promoting class envy, class hatred and in the end class warfare. This rhetoric of divide and conquer has been used the the democrats for a long long time now. It's the only song they know, and its ultimate end will be the destruction of the America free INDIVIDUALS have worked so long and so hard to create. Well I'm glad you're willing to talk more about your views. Often you just make some snarky comment about the "leftist sycophant" or when someone tries to discuss with you then you end up referencing a Karl Marx book or calling them a communist (more recently changed to calling them a socialist). Your Libertarian philosophy as you described above sounds good, in fact I think I even agree with it. But what about when another day you said it was wrong to take power from anyone, and wrong to expect wealthy people to be forced to pay more taxes? See the problem is that while it sounds good for us to "allow an individual to follow their own path as long as it doesn't harm anyone else while doing it", the reality is that those in power either don't see or care what their excesses are doing to those less fortunate -- some of them even think it's perfectly fine to have a stratified world where those who climb to the top oppress others. Hence, the laws and control that you seem to hate, finally taking into account the disadvantaged people, that must be a factor in a better society. I am not too obsessed with groups - I am concerned about the pain and suffering of indivduals that belong to various groups. All individuals fall into various groups, and in Social Work we learned about the specific problems these individuals in groups experience(d) so we can assist them easier. For example, people who are financial poor and people of color encounter problems that are SPECIFIC to the group they belong to -- however some groups overlap, and in this case we can see how people of color could be poor too. If in this latter group one of the members (poor and of color) was also female they would have an additional burden of descrimination as they are part of yet another third group with it's specific challenges. In other words, by identifying the groups individuals belong to we can more easily see the unique challenges each group faces. This ackowledgemnt of groups is not a way to, as you say, create class warfare, nor is it a way to divide and conquer. It is a way to identify and present their problems clearly -- if we can't see the problems they face we can't remedy the injustice. It is also a way for people who have been oppressed to come together and receive support for the problems they've encountered, gather strength, and attempt to do something about it with the power that a group of people vs only one individual can afford. There's a strong tendency for those who have been the default and the ruler (typcially the straight, white, male in the USA) NOT to be able to see the reality of those outside their OWN group. The problem is the "straight, white, male" who feels threatened and wants to keep society as it always was, and they don't like these other groups that have been historically disadvantaged to gain the status only they had in the past. They want to keep them down...keep their position as the 'default'....they want a stratified society where some have more power than others...and they enact laws that favor themselves. In other words, it is the people in power who do not acknowledge the rights of those with less power who create the class warfare. I don't deny that there are crazy people online who just want to fight, and are using the social injustice issues in society to feel morally superior...but they are in the minority and mostly exist on forums. I wish you could meet my Social Work friends in the field -- see some reality outside 4channel forums or wherever it is you are getting your ideas from. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 9 minutes ago, Blush Bravin said: /me wonders how long it will be before Jagix Linden has to lock this thread too. Wait! If I just keep posting here and doing household tasks (even found it appealing to remove raccoon droppings near my deck) I can avoid this next annoying Blender lesson! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 4 minutes ago, Blush Bravin said: Isn't there some kind of taboo about resurrecting a closed thread topic? I mean he can say he's not doing that and that he's quoting from the old forums, but it's still the same topic as the one that got closed. Isn't it? Sneaky! And I was tricked into reading the darned thing! Can I have my time back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blush Bravin Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 (edited) Oh I see what happened. ***** got the last word in that thread that was closed. I guess he wants his turn to get the last word. Edited October 4, 2018 by Blush Bravin I'll be good ... no more posts for me! :P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 Poor Phil, I really think he was just expressing a kind of platitude, something along the line of "the more things change, the more they remain the same". And now all this..lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love Zhaoying Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 I’m reminded of a lyric from “White Rabbit”: When Logic and Proportion have fallen sloppy dead.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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