Full bento dances with facial animations - oh no!

[Coby Foden]

When visiting one of my favourite dancing place I noticed that the owner had replaced the dances on all dancing pads to full bento dances (the ones which animate not only the body but also the bento head). Oh no!

All bento heads already have their bento facial animations. People most likely want to use those.
Because all bento head brands are rigged very differently the heads need animations specifically made for them to look good. Using other brand's animations will often give weird unexpected results. In that venue I was watching the faces of the avatars. It was not a pleasant sight at all. All kinds of weird expressions on the faces. No good at all.

This is again one more disadvantage of the incompatibility between mesh heads. Full bento dances just don't work as expected. One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh, to kill this crazy mesh avatar trend were we are heading. The more mesh bodies and heads there are, the more complicated things will get.

[KanryDrago]

20 minutes ago, Coby Foden said:

When visiting one of my favourite dancing place I noticed that the owner had replaced the dances on all dancing pads to full bento dances (the ones which animate not only the body but also the bento head). Oh no!

All bento heads already have their bento facial animations. People most likely want to use those.
Because all bento head brands are rigged very differently the heads need animations specifically made for them to look good. Using other brand's animations will often give weird unexpected results. In that venue I was watching the faces of the avatars. It was not a pleasant sight at all. All kinds of weird expressions on the faces. No good at all.

This is again one more disadvantage of the incompatibility between mesh heads. Full bento dances just don't work as expected. One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh, to kill this crazy mesh avatar trend were we are heading. The more mesh bodies and heads there are, the more complicated things will get.

Reduction of choice so we all look pretty much the same, not for me thanks, also even if they made a system mesh avi they cant stop others making mesh bodies so you would only be adding another to the list to support , and frankly who uses club dance balls anyway ? Pretty much everyone I know has their own hud

[Ceka Cianci]

More reason to use a hud for dances that work for our own heads..

I think it's a neat idea and finding the right dances could be fun loaded in our huds..Tomorrow I'm going to be looking for some and trying them out..I didn't know they even existed until this thread..

Thank you

Edited July 19, 2018 by Ceka Cianci

[Fionalein]

Just boycott full bento dances... who needs those anyways?

[Annie Nova]

I have a few dances that animate the head so what I do is disable the animations in my head and the dances don't look half bad, but that's just me, each person has their own preferences. 

[Coby Foden]

1 hour ago, KanryDrago said:

Reduction of choice so we all look pretty much the same, not for me thanks, also even if they made a system mesh avi they cant stop others making mesh bodies so you would only be adding another to the list to support , and frankly who uses club dance balls anyway ? Pretty much everyone I know has their own hud

Before mesh we didn't look like clones of each other. We had very wide range of different looks. Maybe you didn't notice it?

If the system avatar was excellent then there would less need for mesh bodies and mesh heads.
And using excellent system avatar would make things much easier, especially so for new people.
Surely, designers could still make mesh bodies and mesh heads, but I'm pretty sure gradually there would be less and less real demand for them.

[KanryDrago]

2 minutes ago, Coby Foden said:

Before mesh we didn't look like clones of each other. We had very wide range of different looks. Maybe you didn't notice it?

If the system avatar was excellent then there would less need for mesh bodies and mesh heads.
And using excellent system avatar would make things much easier, especially so for new people.
Surely, designers could still make mesh bodies and mesh heads, but I'm pretty sure gradually there would be less and less real demand for them.

shrugs the only people who benefit from only one mesh body are creators. I like seeing the range of shapes, species etc. Why do you want to stifle choice? Besides you think the labs will make a body everyone prefersslightly less likely than Donald trump becoming a nun

Edited July 19, 2018 by KanryDrago

[Coby Foden]

8 minutes ago, Coby Foden said:

Before mesh we didn't look like clones of each other. We had very wide range of different looks. Maybe you didn't notice it?

If the system avatar was excellent then there would less need for mesh bodies and mesh heads.
And using excellent system avatar would make things much easier, especially so for new people.
Surely, designers could still make mesh bodies and mesh heads, but I'm pretty sure gradually there would be less and less real demand for them.

 

6 minutes ago, KanryDrago said:

shrugs the only people who benefit from only one mesh body are creators. I like seeing the range of shapes, species etc. Why do you want to stifle choice?

/me points up to my post... (Read carefully.)

[KanryDrago]

I read your posts, pre mesh the avi's were crap. I fully expect anything the labs produce to be sub par to those bodies created by users. They frankly arent very good at knowing what their users like. By all means advocate a labs created mesh body. I think though without banning other mesh body creators from making them it is going to be as popular as the cup full of vomit diet.

 

My evidence Sansar for example, or insert Labs idiocy of your choice

[Alyona Su]

1 hour ago, KanryDrago said:

Reduction of choice so we all look pretty much the same, not for me thanks, also even if they made a system mesh avi they cant stop others making mesh bodies so you would only be adding another to the list to support , and frankly who uses club dance balls anyway ? Pretty much everyone I know has their own hud

You give the impression you haven't been around long or out very much. Long before mesh and except for the first few minutes after creating your account and logging in: face and body sliders allowed you to look very different from anyone else in SL.

As for the poseballs/dancepads (and dance poles) in music venues? Based on what I always see: most people don't have a clue there is such a thing as a personal dance HUD. LOL

@OP Really good point about that. *any* animation that does both body and face is epic-fail for exactly the reasons you state.

[KanryDrago]

1 minute ago, Alyona Su said:

You give the impression you haven't been around long or out very much. Long before mesh and except for the first few minutes after creating your account and logging in: face and body sliders allowed you to look very different from anyone else in SL.

As for the poseballs/dancepads (and dance poles) in music venues? Based on what I always see: most people don't have a clue there is such a thing as a personal dance HUD. LOL

@OP Really good point about that. *any* animation that does both body and face is epic-fail for exactly the reasons you state.

Sliders and stuff still work with mesh bodies, I can look and can tell usually however what body type the avi is because each of them has unique characteristics. When we just had classic bodies yes people looked different, however they look far different now than then. 

This is the issue I have with the op. She wants a single mesh body. If the labs do one I have no real objection my issue is however when it doesnt become the most popular I suspect she will be back here suggesting other mesh bodies be outlawed because it has not resulted in what she wants which in one mesh body to rule them all

[Alyona Su]

2 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh, to kill this crazy mesh avatar trend were we are heading. The more mesh bodies and heads there are, the more complicated things will get.

 

 

16 minutes ago, KanryDrago said:

This is the issue I have with the op. She wants a single mesh body. If the labs do one I have no real objection my issue is however when it doesnt become the most popular I suspect she will be back here suggesting other mesh bodies be outlawed because it has not resulted in what she wants which in one mesh body to rule them all

1

This is how people absolutely create drama: they take their own meaning of what someone else says rather than reading and failing to *comprehend* the meaning as written. You are twisting the meaning of what the OP wrote.

The OP never said "she wants a single mesh body" as you wrongly state that she says. Then you insert your unfounded, ridiculous prediction: "that she will be back here suggesting..."

Well, cowboy here's a pro-tip: passive-aggressiveness speaks volumes about you. Hahahaha. Your cute little quip in the "date night locations" thread wreaks of conceit as well. But, I digress.

You have my permission to plonk me in whatever quippy reply you can conjure up. I'll not waste my time in recursive discussion or debate on it as I have very clearly made my point.

~Blows a sharp kiss~

Edited July 19, 2018 by Alyona Su

[Coby Foden]

10 minutes ago, KanryDrago said:

This is the issue I have with the op. She wants a single mesh body.

Please go back and read again what I said.
I do not want single mesh body, not at all.

What I was saying was " One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh."
Do you know what is the difference between mesh body and system avatar's mesh?

[KanryDrago]

2 minutes ago, Alyona Su said:

 

This is how people absolutely create drama: they take their own meaning of what someone else says rather than reading and failing to *comprehend* the meaning as written. You are twisting the meaning of what the OP wrote.

The OP never said "she wants a single mesh body" as you wrongly state that she says. Then you insert your unfounded, ridiculous prediction: "that she will be back here suggesting..."

Well, cowboy here's a pro-tip: passive-aggressiveness speaks volumes about you. Hahahaha. You cute little quip in the "date night locations" thread wreaks of conceit as well. But, I digress. ~Blows a sharp kiss~

 

This is not Coby's first outing in these forums with this idea

the date night thing was meant as a joke hence the emoticon on the end

take your passive aggressive and look in a mirror maybe?

 

[KanryDrago]

2 minutes ago, Coby Foden said:

Please go back and read again what I said.
I do not want single mesh body, not at all.

What I was saying was " One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh."
Do you know what is the difference between mesh body and system avatar's mesh?

Are you denying you have posted before advocating that there should be a single mesh body everyone uses?

[MirandaBowers]

2 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

When visiting one of my favourite dancing place I noticed that the owner had replaced the dances on all dancing pads to full bento dances (the ones which animate not only the body but also the bento head). Oh no!

I didn't even know this was a thing! Guess that shows how little I hit the dance floor

2 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

 One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh

The Linden Lab mesh bodies definitely could use some work. I think if they upgraded them then maybe newer players wouldn't feel so pressured to run out to buy these third party mesh bodies/heads before they are ready to make informed purchases. 

[Coby Foden]

11 minutes ago, KanryDrago said:

Are you denying you have posted before advocating that there should be a single mesh body everyone uses?

I would be interested to see where I have said that. Please do show me.
What I have actually said is that it would be great if Linden Lab upgraded the system avatar's mesh.
Nowhere I have said that everybody must use it, or any other single imported mesh avatar.

Even if the system avatar was excellent, people could still wear imported mesh avatars if they wanted to.
But as I said earlier, there would be less demand for them.

And could Linden Lab implement excellent system avatar if they wanted to? Of course they could. Just hire an excellent designer to make excellent mesh for the system avatar. It's totally possible, what would prevent it?

[Coby Foden]

1 hour ago, Fionalein said:

Just boycott full bento dances... who needs those anyways?

Nobody needs those. As I said, in that dancing place they looked really weird and bad.
It seems too that not everybody has a dancing HUD. There are lots of places where there are venue provided single dances, couple dances and even dancing pads. And they are used too. So, it's very bad idea if the venue owners start filling those with full bento dances.

[Fionalein]

56 minutes ago, Coby Foden said:

It seems too that not everybody has a dancing HUD.

Really? Never saw the need of one...

[Maryanne Solo]

The secret is... its all in the fingers. You'll never be a K-Pop star otherwise 

*crowd roars! \0/\0/\0/\0/\0/\0/\0/

https://gyazo.com/02a289a7ffbebcd8c82e1e4c63984c7e

Edited July 19, 2018 by Maryanne Solo
More crowd, more cowbell.

[Klytyna]

9 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

One more reason for Linden Lab to upgrade the system avatar's mesh, to kill this crazy mesh avatar trend were we are heading.

No, it's one more reason to boycot idiots who make/use bento face animation dance poses desgned only for brand x heads, that's all.

It's not a justification for trying to eradicate mesh bodies and heads because some people are mesh hating fossils.

8 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

Before mesh we didn't look like clones of each other. We had very wide range of different looks. Maybe you didn't notice it

Today with mesh bodies, talentless and lazy people buy their shapes and end up as clones...

Be honest, how does that differ from the "Golden Age" of crappy system Avis, when talentless and lazy people bought the same popular shapes and looked like clones?

It doesn't. More fraudulent anti-mesh propaganda.

7 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

And could Linden Lab implement excellent system avatar if they wanted to? Of course they could. Just hire an excellent designer to make excellent mesh for the system avatar. It's totally possible, what would prevent it?

If you had EVER worn one of LL's "Official New Improved Default Avatars" from the era when they decided that the system avi was just too crap to continue with, and "hired a designer", you wouldn't ask such a foolish question, because you'd know the damn answer...

LL would prevent it, by hiring the wrong guy, and giving him the wrong design brief, just like they did LAST TIME!

 

[Resi Pfeffer]

12 hours ago, Coby Foden said:

In that venue I was watching the faces of the avatars. It was not a pleasant sight at all. All kinds of weird expressions on the faces. No good at all.

The general SL lag is sometimes so bad, what makes me even unable to notice, if people performing grimace dances or not...
And 200K+ jelly dolls have no face at all. 

Back to topic: Face expressions are a general problem. The variety of bento faces and the shapes behind is so huge. There is no sweet spot to hit for a designer, i think.
I even see the difference when i compare the same head with a slighty altered head shape... On the first head it looks friendly and natural, but on the other one just creepy.

Edited July 20, 2018 by Resi Pfeffer
typo

[Arduenn Schwartzman]

I see a business opportunity here. I'm going to open a new dance club with the best bento dances. I'll rent a sim for it and have it renamed 'The Uncanny Valley'.

Edited July 20, 2018 by Arduenn Schwartzman

[Janet Voxel]

I just use my own dances. I haven’t used a dance pad in ages, but that was because I was under the assumption that they’d be old dances where the transitions consisted of floating in the air with your head twisted 180 degrees around.

 

[Coby Foden]

9 hours ago, janetosilio said:

I just use my own dances. I haven’t used a dance pad in ages, but that was because I was under the assumption that they’d be old dances where the transitions consisted of floating in the air with your head twisted 180 degrees around.

In some places the dances in the dance pads are quite new. So are the single dances, and there are places with excellent new couple dances. Really nice ones. So there is not always need to use the dances in one's own dance HUD. Anyway, there are also places where the venue provided dances are very ancient ones and thus not good looking.

The problem with dance pads is indeed that most of the avatars are floating in the air. Only the very tallest avatars will have their feet on the floor, or close to it.