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Posted (edited)

Hey everyone, please read this and let me know... This is about private region owned in SL and I want your opinions :)
And possibly help if you feel I haven't done anything wrong or I haven't done that big of a violation to be treated like that.

I work as a manager in the power couple contest and as a way to get more people and spread the word, I am promoting this contest. Many of you might have got a message from me about it. I am fairly new to SL so I don't have much friends or contacts...
Similarly inworld , I look for groups that have their member list and have not mentioned I can't message them and send then ONE SINGLE message - a brief about the contest and if they are interested. 
Nothing after that if they don't reply. No follow up, no asking , no nagging. 
Like many of you must have seen. 
Yesterday I messaged some people from my rental and one happened to be the owner's alt. 
And without any warning, any intimation she banned me from the sim. I apologised to her since I thought maybe she was not okay with the idea, I explained to her that I was unaware of such a policy and even told her I have paid for 3 weeks rent with my hard earned money and please give me one last chance and consider.

She never replied , nor did the support there. And MY friends who got the same rental yesterday requested to her too and they were banned as well.
So I want to ask if what I did was such a huge thing that warrants a ban ? 
My idea of communication is word of mouth, we all have our dj and host friends who tp us or have conferences about their gigs. 
Do we ban them? I don't think so, or else how are people going to know about that club or about that dj or in my case .. about that contest.
Please leave your opinions as comments :) have a nice day

Edited by AngelStar42

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Posted (edited)

Private landowners can ban you for any reason, or no reason at all. Most people really hate spam.

Oh yeah, you might want to get rid of that business name from your post too, it's against the rules.

 

Edited by Stephanie Misfit
added info
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^ This. If they have region rights, they can ban you from that sim and any other sims that they are added as region managers with the click of a button. 

Most people have 0 patience for spam messages, so regardless as to if it’s in their profile or not, reconsider your unprovoked IMs.

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Most groups that are not part of whatever you are advertising consider this spam.  And it is a ban worthy offense in most groups.

 

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And I am not entitled for a refund? I paid for 3 weeks and it is my week 1 .. so the money for other 2 weeks is non refundable ?

 

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That's between you and the land owner.  Not something LL or anyone else is likely to get involved with.  Read any covenants next time and ask before you advertise.  What isn't in a profile about land may be in a covenant. 

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Since you claim to be new, I will delve into this a bit deeper.  If you got away with "spam" we'd have to allow it for everyone.  We are talking about thousands of these per day in every group if it was allowed.  Chat already gets clogged in some big groups if someone just says Hi.

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3 minutes ago, Sandy Schnook said:

Since you claim to be new, I will delve into this a bit deeper.  If you got away with "spam" we'd have to allow it for everyone.  We are talking about thousands of these per day in every group if it was allowed.  Chat already gets clogged in some big groups if someone just says Hi.

No, I didn't message in the group chat. I only messaged the person on the rental ..

And the message was I am the manager of this contest , are you interested in participating ? 

No continuous messages too 

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Here’s nothing “unfair” about it, since presumably everyone is treated the same. If only you were banned for spam, I guess you could say it was unfair.

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Okay on an individual level then.  Do you want to get hundreds or thousands of IMs like that everyday?  I know I don't and put people who do it on ignore.  It's not just about you.  It's about all the others plus you who want folks to come see their new club, shop, park, strip joint, sex beach, whatever...

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Not all landlords offer refunds. If you would like to have any chance of getting your money back, I would suggest that any correspondence you have with the landlord be very polite and apologetic and that you don't try to argue that what you were doing was OK (hint - it wasn't), because that is just going to annoy them and make them less likely to refund you.

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21 minutes ago, Stephanie Misfit said:

Not all landlords offer refunds. If you would like to have any chance of getting your money back, I would suggest that any correspondence you have with the landlord be very polite and apologetic and that you don't try to argue that what you were doing was OK (hint - it wasn't), because that is just going to annoy them and make them less likely to refund you.

And keep in mind that when people ban, they often mute as well.

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, AngelStar42 said:

I look for groups that have their member list...and send then ONE SINGLE message

I would mute/ban you too.

Unsolicited spam is not nice, so please don't do it, esepcially if you are harvesting your victims from other people's groups.

Edited by Callum Meriman
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You learned a very valuable lesson, only pay for one week at a time.

If i get a spam im I just close the chat, it's not like it ruined my day, same if there is spam in a group chat, close it and forget about it.

Other people are rather high strung, and any unwanted ims totally ruins their day.

Don't waste your time asking for a refund, consider it money spent on a lesson well learned.

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Whether you think it's unfair or not makes no difference.  A landowner doesn't need a reason to ban you.  It could just be a bad hair day, or the neighbor's dog peed on his flower bed and you got banned for ... nothing at all.  It also doesn't make any difference whether the landowner has put "rules" into the covenant.  The landlord can change rules on the spur of the moment and is under no obligation to warn you.  Or to offer you a refund.  

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3 minutes ago, Rolig Loon said:

Whether you think it's unfair or not makes no difference.  A landowner doesn't need a reason to ban you.  It could just be a bad hair day, or the neighbor's dog peed on his flower bed and you got banned for ... nothing at all.  It also doesn't make any difference whether the landowner has put "rules" into the covenant.  The landlord can change rules on the spur of the moment and is under no obligation to warn you.  Or to offer you a refund.  

Well actually, a landlord that would ban you without any reason IS acting unfairly.

Its their right to be unfair, but it IS unfair.

So is keeping unused rent. If they were the slightest bit fair, they'd return the unused portion.

But they know the renter has no recourse, so they keep the money.

Is that fair? No its not, its Second Life.

That's why you never never never pay for more than one week at a time, you keep your losses to a minimum when you run into an unfair landlord

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The best you can do is file an AR / open a support ticket against your landlord. Getting banned from your rental is fraud. Maybe LL will be able to assist you.

As for spamming .. don't ever do it.

As for everyone else, lesson learn't and all that .. two wrongs don't make a right.

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I never said it was fair. I said that it doesn't make any difference whether you think it's unfair. A landiwner can be as unfair as he likes, as long as he doesn't violate the TOS. I agree that refusing to refund rent is mean and nasty. I would never do that to one of my tenants. 

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1 hour ago, AngelStar42 said:

Unfair ban from a region

Uh oh ... This looks familiar

 

1 hour ago, AngelStar42 said:

This is about private region

And there it is.

 

I know you feel that this is unfair but the golden rule of SL is those who pay the gold make the rules.  It is their property just as your house is yours. 

 

1 hour ago, AngelStar42 said:

So I want to ask if what I did was such a huge thing that warrants a ban ? 

Spaming groups? (and yes, just once is spam if it is advertising.)  Yes.  Most places have zero tolerance for outside promotions.  It is common to ban/mute/block all at once anytime someone is banned.  This inevitably leads to the blocked person logging in their alts to argue the ban. 

I don't mean to imply that all this is your fault.  However you are paying the price due to policies put in place because of all the many many people who have come before you.  Some were intentional griefers; some were hurt and spiteful and others, like yourself, simply did not know better.

So here's the things to learn:
1 - If it is not YOUR group or a group specifically created to exchange event info, don't promote your special projects.
2 - Who ever owns the land or group sets whatever rules they feel necessary as long as it does not violate the TOS (and being fair is not in the TOS -- just like real life)
3 - Linden Lab does not get involved with resident to resident disputes.

It's a cold razor we all live with and I truly sorry you were cut, but these conventions exists for a reason.  The only way people can protect themselves is to ban/mute and ignore.  I know it is not a fun way to learn SL culture but there it is.  The only thing you can do is move on.

 

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Posted (edited)

While the concept of fairness does not apply to the ban, IMO it may apply to the refusal to refund. It depends on whether she made clear her refund policy in advance. It is fair to trade money for agreed upon goods or services, unfair to renege on the agreement, unless the no refund stipulation was part of the original agreement. 

That doesn’t mean LL will intervene, tho.

Edited by Pamela Galli

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3 hours ago, AngelStar42 said:

 I am promoting this contest.

Many of you might have got a message from me about it.
Similarly inworld , I look for groups that have their member list and have not mentioned I can't message them and send then ONE SINGLE message -
Nothing after that if they don't reply. No follow up, no asking , no nagging. 

Like many of you must have seen. 

Yesterday I messaged some people from my rental and one happened to be the owner's alt. 
I explained to her that I was unaware of such a policy.


My idea of communication is word of mouth, we all have our dj and host friends who tp us or have conferences about their gigs. 
Do we ban them? I don't think so, or else how are people going to know about that club or about that dj or in my case .. about that contest.
 

you spammed groups, used others membershiplists, spammed individuals at your homesim, and just random?... you are lucky you'r still around and only kicked out of tht sim, it's a AR-able violation. You'll be on so many mute lists now that your advertisements won't reach a lot of people anymore.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Alwin Alcott said:

You'll be on so many mute lists now that your advertisements won't reach a lot of people anymore.

This ^^   My mute list contains only people who have spammed me with store/event/anything I didn't sign up for.  Did you actually read the group rules before spamming people?  Imagine a group with 1000 members  and even 1% of the group decided to contact everyone individually in one day.  That's 10 IM's I am going to log into alongside the legit IMs from friends or to do with businesses.  I would mute you too, ban you from my group too.  

4 hours ago, AngelStar42 said:

I look for groups that have their member list

Sorry you got kicked from your rental and lost money but a lesson learned.  Advertise in legitimate and fair ways in future. 

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4 hours ago, AngelStar42 said:

Many of you might have got a message from me about it. I am fairly new to SL so I don't have much friends or contacts...
Similarly inworld , I look for groups that have their member list and have not mentioned I can't message them and send then ONE SINGLE message - a brief about the contest and if they are interested. 
Nothing after that if they don't reply. No follow up, no asking , no nagging. 
Like many of you must have seen. 

The part I bolded... what words are you looking for in groups that have "mentioned" you "can't message them"?

Did somebody tell you that it's okay to send messages to members of groups that don't have those words? How did you get that impression?

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3 hours ago, CoffeeDujour said:

The best you can do is file an AR / open a support ticket against your landlord. Getting banned from your rental is fraud. Maybe LL will be able to assist you.

As for spamming .. don't ever do it.

As for everyone else, lesson learn't and all that .. two wrongs don't make a right.

Unless the land's covenant contains clear statements about it, it is theft. Unfortunately LL allows thieves to operate like that in SL.

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My friend banned me after i foud out thst he is an alt of dude who harrassed people.And then he started the same talk about me and disturbed random people with "you re alt of Sam".

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