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Kytteh Wytchwood

Need Feedback - Photo Service

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Hello. I feel awkward posting this. I am very new to Photoshop. I have the CC 2018 version. I learn through tutorials. I'd like to do pics for people and charge for it but I don't know how much to charge. Nowadays photo editors have to be amazing to get anyone to pay for their services. My skills are not amazing like them. I am pretty much a newb to taking the best pic. I also own the LumiPro gadget.I prefer to do greenscreen pics as I run on a cheap laptop with a spotty connection due to connecting wireless to the modem in the house.So I'll leave some links here for you to see what I have attempted so far. Just click the pic to get sent to my flickr to see the views / faves.

This is a promo card I created for a shape I made and sell.

Promo Card Dollarbiex2! Bento Shape

These next two are portraits of a previous shape I sold but wanted to practice with Photoshop tutorials

Kitty Graffiti

 

Kitty sketch

 

This next one is a promo for a club I work at. 

It's NSFW so I will leave it as just a link.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/sbddollsgirlsshapes/40932866264/in/album-72157695098012264/

These last 3 are snapshots when I was first learning how to use the LumiPro

Hut

 

NSFW due to shirt

https://www.flickr.com/photos/sbddollsgirlsshapes/24926637558/in/album-72157692062976905/

Catching Rays

 

I have many more but selecting the most popular. I look forward to your feedback.

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the shape promo card i wouldn't shop too much because that can be off putting for some (not saying it is in yours just saying some people like seeing what something look exactly like it would inworld) . I think yours is fine, just a bit high on the exposure or saturation side, but the background is nice. I wouldn't use hair that covers the body shape, but only if your not selling it as just a face shape.

Cant really help with the photo shop side of things for you, I haven't the faintest on how to use it. I can help keep your thread bumped though. :)

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12 hours ago, germ0742 said:

the shape promo card i wouldn't shop too much because that can be off putting for some (not saying it is in yours just saying some people like seeing what something look exactly like it would inworld) . I think yours is fine, just a bit high on the exposure or saturation side, but the background is nice. I wouldn't use hair that covers the body shape, but only if your not selling it as just a face shape.

Cant really help with the photo shop side of things for you, I haven't the faintest on how to use it. I can help keep your thread bumped though. :)

Hi. I wasn't asking for advice on how I make my promo cards for my shape shop. I am just explaining what the pictures are of. I did state I would like feedback on what price I could charge based on the little experience I have. I showed examples of my work. As far as my ads go, my ads get cut out from a greenscreen background in-world. I use the LumiPro gadget in-world to give it light. Then after I remove the green from the hair and body, I paste it onto a free stock image for the background. Promo cards are a different thing. You can edit it more than you would with an ad. The ad is on the marketplace listing. The promo card is for people to see what it could look like if you were to buy the shape, follow the stylecard, and photo ediit a pic of your avatar using my shape/ stylecard look. I have done a lot of research on the marketplace, and most customers do prefer a heavily edited picture. Which is why I provide two, one not heavily edited for the listing and one in my Flickr stream to showcase the beauty of digital art.

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I don't know how much time you are spending on these images, but if it is a lot then I am sorry to say that there are free Photoshop actions that can produce these types of effects within a few seconds. So I don't know that there would be many people who would be willing to pay much for this type of work when there are SLers on Flickr doing custom work that involves not only decent photography but a lot of detailed digital painting. But even with all the over-painting, people still want the picture they are paying for to look like their avatar. I would say you would have a better chance of getting customers if you skip all the flashy effects and just take a decent picture, using the lighting from the LumiPro to its best advantage.

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18 minutes ago, Stephanie Misfit said:

I don't know how much time you are spending on these images, but if it is a lot then I am sorry to say that there are free Photoshop actions that can produce these types of effects within a few seconds. So I don't know that there would be many people who would be willing to pay much for this type of work when there are SLers on Flickr doing custom work that involves not only decent photography but a lot of detailed digital painting. But even with all the over-painting, people still want the picture they are paying for to look like their avatar. I would say you would have a better chance of getting customers if you skip all the flashy effects and just take a decent picture, using the lighting from the LumiPro to its best advantage.

Thank you for the feedback. I'll try experimenting with LumiPro further. As far as actions go, I don't know if they make them for the filter gallery. Plus if I use actions, then I am not learning the Photoshop software. I like to do it manually so I learn as I go. I know I can't do painting. I am not a digital artist. I just wanted some figures on an estimate price I could charge, based on the few examples I provided. No one seems t want to throw them out there for me. I didn't ask for critiques, I asked for what do you think I could charge.

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OK, since you prefer to dismiss all friendly advice, which surely were meant to help you improve your editing to a sale-worthy level, and you rather want a price tag... well, L$ 0.

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@Kytteh Wytchwood - I get what you are asking. So here is the best way to go about it.

First: build your portfolio - this helps build your skill. And "skill" in photography isn't about snapping the picture, it's about composing the picture - read up on the web on how to take great photographs in RL - employ those techniques. The fastest, easiest way to build your portfolio is to offer your services for free as in "gratis" or "complementary". It's hard to say no to something offered for free. Start with profile pictures and work your way up.

Shop other SL photographers via their portfolios; see what their styling is all about. You need to develop a style that is you and not them. This takes time.

Learn the viewer tricks - and the least used/most powerful is the ATL+0 Field-of-View (a.k.a. "zoom" function. It's not a zoom, but rather a narrowing of the FOV that *also* removes lens distortion. ALT-8 to go opposite to widen the FOV (and ALT-9 to reset)

Finally: Photoshop is WAY overrated, over-bloated, and overpriced (and I do graphic design in RL, so I am a Photoshop/Illustrator expert). Consider a true photographers tool like those from ON 1 (you should grab the 30-day demos) - because you don't "edit" photographs, you "post-process". Photoshop name is a misnomer, it's designed for illustrators, not photographers. Photographers latched onto it in the early days because there wasn't anything else, but now there is.
https://www.on1.com/store/category/desktop-apps/

Focus on these aspects first. LumiPro is great - but it will take practice to be able to work with it quickly, efficiently, and proficiently. So keep at it.

Edited by Alyona Su

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there are millions of really good SL photographers. And people, from my past experiences, don't like to pay much for a photo unless the photographer is really good and unique IMO you should gain alot of experience, develop a style, shoot people either free or minimal charge for now until you gain a bit of a following. And if you really want to get into it, look up WrenNoir Cerise (https://www.flickr.com/photos/wrennoir) she runs a multi week photography course that teaches you all the ins and outs of photography in SL, but photoshop is not the focus

IMO being a good photographer in SL is the same as RL - it isn't the equipment, post processing or any of that. it is understanding  composition, light, posing, etc... I seen some amazing sl photographers who use minimal if any post processing just by getting it right in world

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On 6/24/2018 at 6:30 AM, Lillith Hapmouche said:

OK, since you prefer to dismiss all friendly advice, which surely were meant to help you improve your editing to a sale-worthy level, and you rather want a price tag... well, L$ 0.

That's a sassy retort and quite immature. Not once did I ask for photo editing advice. I like how my pictures look. Yes I am still learning how to take screenshots with lighting and learning Photoshop. Like I said I just showed some examples and asked for an estimate price range. You can't get upset because people are giving me what I did not ask for. 

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On 6/24/2018 at 7:44 AM, Alyona Su said:

@Kytteh Wytchwood - I get what you are asking. So here is the best way to go about it.

First: build your portfolio - this helps build your skill. And "skill" in photography isn't about snapping the picture, it's about composing the picture - read up on the web on how to take great photographs in RL - employ those techniques. The fastest, easiest way to build your portfolio is to offer your services for free as in "gratis" or "complementary". It's hard to say no to something offered for free. Start with profile pictures and work your way up.

Shop other SL photographers via their portfolios; see what their styling is all about. You need to develop a style that is you and not them. This takes time.

Learn the viewer tricks - and the least used/most powerful is the ATL+0 Field-of-View (a.k.a. "zoom" function. It's not a zoom, but rather a narrowing of the FOV that *also* removes lens distortion. ALT-8 to go opposite to widen the FOV (and ALT-9 to reset)

Finally: Photoshop is WAY overrated, over-bloated, and overpriced (and I do graphic design in RL, so I am a Photoshop/Illustrator expert). Consider a true photographers tool like those from ON 1 (you should grab the 30-day demos) - because you don't "edit" photographs, you "post-process". Photoshop name is a misnomer, it's designed for illustrators, not photographers. Photographers latched onto it in the early days because there wasn't anything else, but now there is.
https://www.on1.com/store/category/desktop-apps/

Focus on these aspects first. LumiPro is great - but it will take practice to be able to work with it quickly, efficiently, and proficiently. So keep at it.

Thank you for the informative advice. I used to use the alt keys but I dropped them. I have studied a few real life photographer techniques but not enough to employ it with SL. I wasn't sure if I actually needed a real world perspective to snap a screenshot of a game. I have seen people who have the hobby of taking screenshots and post-processing as you say, offering their services for free to build up their skills again when they had deserted said hobby for awhile. I do agree with creating a portfolio. My Flickr photostream is very messy, from SL screenshots, SL videos, and other game screenshots. I have thought about creating another Flickr account or perhaps utilizing another photo hosting website, so that it is clean and more appealing than dumping them into my current Flickr account. It seems this shall take up a lot of my time in one location instead of applying my interests in the different mediums I enjoy online. I do know and understand that with practice and due diligence, it creates the masterpiece that people would take more interest in and be willing to pay for, than if I did minimal editing and refused to learn further about this virtual reality craft.

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The best way to get current prices is to go around to the studios (via search) and see what other people are charging. Unfortunately as people have mentioned there are TONS of photographers in SL, so at best the price you can actually sell things for is really pretty low -- more so now than in the boom days of SL because the population now is more 'mature' in every sense of the word and may people know how to take photos.

I CAN tell you than when I had a studio, I took profile photos for 250 and didn't sell all that many. I also did a gig at a magazine and made more money there. So if it is money you are looking for that might be a better route. These days most of the folks taking photos for their studio are mostly "playing" at it, enjoying the fun of HAVING a studio and doing the work. Honestly I think we should ALL be playing and I try and do that as much as possible now that Blender and I are friendly.   

So the actual answer that people aren't answering is that it is unlikely you can sell photos -- even the best out there mostly do it for the enjoyment. 

Check the studios you find in search. That doesn't mean they are actually SELLING anything of course, but it will give you a ballpark figure. 

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Just organize your Flickr into albums - and one album can be your v=best stuff: THAT would be your portfolio. :)

Many self-proclaimed "Pro Photograp[her in SL" aren't. It about the vision and style (and not just running Instagram filters - but the actual creative-composing of the shot) - so yes: RL photography techniques very much play into SL "photography" - if you want to be good at it.

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On 6/24/2018 at 12:02 PM, Jackson Redstar said:

there are millions of really good SL photographers. And people, from my past experiences, don't like to pay much for a photo unless the photographer is really good and unique IMO you should gain alot of experience, develop a style, shoot people either free or minimal charge for now until you gain a bit of a following. And if you really want to get into it, look up WrenNoir Cerise (https://www.flickr.com/photos/wrennoir) she runs a multi week photography course that teaches you all the ins and outs of photography in SL, but photoshop is not the focus

IMO being a good photographer in SL is the same as RL - it isn't the equipment, post processing or any of that. it is understanding  composition, light, posing, etc... I seen some amazing sl photographers who use minimal if any post processing just by getting it right in world

Thank you for the information. I refuse to call it photography because it isn't. it is not capturing a moment in an ever changing environment. It is a screenshot of a game, with editing added to it from a photo editing software. I don't pay for courses so if she charges for it, I'm not interested. Thank you for the resources.Yes I do agree, a pose in a SL screenshot with the right lighting can actually convey real emotion. Although I have noticed that SL users will write a descriptive caption on Flickr, so that viewers will know the emotion. There are many pics I have viewed, that I don't know the emotion, until I read the caption. I do have lighting packs for Photoshop that I have not yet applied. I do enjoy Photoshop, it is a fun tool to play around with. I am learning how to use it for outside of SL, but then incorporating what I have learned and using a SL screenshot to edit with. Though now I am going away from SL and using photographs of my family to experiment with and produce artistic renditions of. 

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14 minutes ago, Chic Aeon said:

So the actual answer that people aren't answering is that it is unlikely you can sell photos 

 

Thank you for your raw and blunt answer. It does sting a bit but at least someone had the courage to step forward with their opinion. It won't stop me from learning Photoshop. 

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Just now, Kytteh Wytchwood said:

Thank you for your raw and blunt answer. It does sting a bit but at least someone had the courage to step forward with their opinion. It won't stop me from learning Photoshop. 

And it shouldn't. We ARE supposed to be having fun here!  My forum signature is there for a purpose :D

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2 minutes ago, Chic Aeon said:

And it shouldn't. We ARE supposed to be having fun here!  My forum signature is there for a purpose :D

I agree. I do enjoy the fun SL brings me, especially when taking screenshots. I haven't seen your signature so not sure if that was sarcasm or you have a fun spirited signature. 

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23 minutes ago, Alyona Su said:

Just organize your Flickr into albums - and one album can be your v=best stuff: THAT would be your portfolio. :)

 

I do, except for the screenshots that go straight from inworld to Flickr using the Flickr toolbar button. Those ones are just for fun and showing what I am doing currently, like SL moment screenshots. 

The reason I see it as messy, majority of the people view my account via the photostream. Instead of by albums.

Edited by Kytteh Wytchwood
more info

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50 minutes ago, Kytteh Wytchwood said:

I agree. I do enjoy the fun SL brings me, especially when taking screenshots. I haven't seen your signature so not sure if that was sarcasm or you have a fun spirited signature. 

Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love.. 

At the bottom of every post but maybe you have that turned off.  I don't do sarcasm.

 

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5 hours ago, Chic Aeon said:

Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love.. 

At the bottom of every post but maybe you have that turned off.  I don't do sarcasm.

 

Good to know. Nice way to express silent admiration. It's by default. I just recently came onto the new forums. I haven't messed with any settings. I didn't even know we had any settings to access.

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17 hours ago, Kytteh Wytchwood said:

Thank you for the information. I refuse to call it photography because it isn't. it is not capturing a moment in an ever changing environment. It is a screenshot of a game, with editing added to it from a photo editing software. I don't pay for courses so if she charges for it, I'm not interested. Thank you for the resources.Yes I do agree, a pose in a SL screenshot with the right lighting can actually convey real emotion. Although I have noticed that SL users will write a descriptive caption on Flickr, so that viewers will know the emotion. There are many pics I have viewed, that I don't know the emotion, until I read the caption. I do have lighting packs for Photoshop that I have not yet applied. I do enjoy Photoshop, it is a fun tool to play around with. I am learning how to use it for outside of SL, but then incorporating what I have learned and using a SL screenshot to edit with. Though now I am going away from SL and using photographs of my family to experiment with and produce artistic renditions of. 

well, it is photography, and perhaps if you want to improve start looking at it like that. We may not have a physical camera capturing an image to film or disc, but we are capturing a moment in time that needs to be composed properly and exposed properly. If shooting a subject we need to properly pose the subject and compose the shot. We can use either ambient light or add in artificial lites to fill the shot r properly expose it. Most Lessons you read about rl  photography or on youtube video applies here as well

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11 hours ago, Jackson Redstar said:

well, it is photography, and perhaps if you want to improve start looking at it like that. We may not have a physical camera capturing an image to film or disc, but we are capturing a moment in time that needs to be composed properly and exposed properly. If shooting a subject we need to properly pose the subject and compose the shot. We can use either ambient light or add in artificial lites to fill the shot r properly expose it. Most Lessons you read about rl  photography or on youtube video applies here as well

Absolutely, it most definitely is not a case of just taking a screenshot. When I had one of my avatars photographed for an ad by a professional SL photographer, it took a whole lot longer than I expected it would. Getting the composition and lighting right is really important, and then there is the creative (and fun) side too - most of the very best photographs on Flickr have clearly had a lot of thought put into them as far as creative design is concerned. You don't take an amazing SL photograph by just standing an avatar in front of a green screen, grabbing a screenshot and doing a little editing in Photoshop.

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Maybe you could find some people kind enough to support you and pay your upload cost. So I say 10 Lindens. 

If you really want to go into photography, I would advise you to forget about Photoshop and focus on some basic elements of a good image - composition, light, story/message/feeling/whatever. Just raw photos. Editing is the last step, which you did first. 

 

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