Connect the Continents

[Klytyna]

13 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

Quite the contrary, this is exactly how the most popular "exclusive" private estates are configured: Four large or sixteen smaller islands spread out evenly across the sim with wide waterways between to allow some rudimentary boating activities but even more as buffer zones to improve the privacy of the islands. Bridges won't be a problem since connecting the islands is the last thing the residents would want.

Quite the contrary...

Read his proposal for the Strip-Mall Continent of Animatsland again...

"...lots of water AND lots of roads..."

16 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

Make it 24 1024 m2 parcels with double prims

So, since the regions are supposed to serve as connectors between continents, there needs to be a main waterway running along the line of the connection, wide enough to be navigable by multiple vessels, even allowing for the need to tack back and forth, you are also guaranteeing all the plots have "waterfront" so, your 24 plots would be 4 rows of 6 plots each.

Each row of plots would face the water strips down the middle of the sim and down the parallel edges, each pair of rows would be separated from the neighbours by a road, each strip would be broken into 2 groups of 3 to allow for connecting cross streets between the 2 main roads that run parallel to the main waterway, there would be at least 3 bridges across the main waterway for the 3 cross streets, if the 3 plot subgroups are also separated from each other by additional cross canals, then even more bridges.

Remember, Animats thinks with his motorcycle, he's not proposing some private rentals estate sim like the United Sailing sims, where people rent upper class 4k, 8k, and 1/4 sim islands, all very separate from each other, he's proposing a sort of strip-mall style urban marina for lower middle class housing estates, where every plot has 32 m of waterfront at the back and a car port opening onto 32 m of suburban main road at the front. so you can either get in your speedboat and use the canal, or climb on your motorbike and use the road to drive the entire length of the strip-mall.

His proposal is NOTHING like those expensive and stylish private islands in the United Sailing Sims area, East of Hollywood Airport.
 

[IceCold Skytower]

Well about everyone teleporting around. In my RP places and among my friends i encourage actual traveling to places, SL has great engaging vehicles now that are fun to use, and most people have powerful enough hardware and internet to handle simcrossings without issues... MOST ... I still find occasional people on potatoes... anyway i digress. What i'm saying is, i encourage my circles to actually travel instead of teleport everywhere, because alot of people indeed do want to just teleport, i say things like the journey is more fun than the destination, and i usually end up right, it turns out into a nice adventure usually. I end up convincing people that traveling is more fun. Though occasionally there are some negative nancies who are reluctant even after the adventure, or they get the short end of the stick on a potato.

[IceCold Skytower]

3 minutes ago, Klytyna said:

Quite the contrary...

Read his proposal for the Strip-Mall Continent of Animatsland again...

"...lots of water AND lots of roads..."

So, since the regions are supposed to serve as connectors between continents, there needs to be a main waterway running along the line of the connection, wide enough to be navigable by multiple vessels, even allowing for the need to tack back and forth, you are also guaranteeing all the plots have "waterfront" so, your 24 plots would be 4 rows of 6 plots each.

Each row of plots would face the water strips down the middle of the sim and down the parallel edges, each pair of rows would be separated from the neighbours by a road, each strip would be broken into 2 groups of 3 to allow for connecting cross streets between the 2 main roads that run parallel to the main waterway, there would be at least 3 bridges across the main waterway for the 3 cross streets, if the 3 plot subgroups are also separated from each other by additional cross canals, then even more bridges.

Remember, Animats thinks with his motorcycle, he's not proposing some private rentals estate sim like the United Sailing sims, where people rent upper class 4k, 8k, and 1/4 sim islands, all very separate from each other, he's proposing a sort of strip-mall style urban marina for lower middle class housing estates, where every plot has 32 m of waterfront at the back and a car port opening onto 32 m of suburban main road at the front. so you can either get in your speedboat and use the canal, or climb on your motorbike and use the road to drive the entire length of the strip-mall.

His proposal is NOTHING like those expensive and stylish private islands in the United Sailing Sims area, East of Hollywood Airport.
 

I'd say do it like how trains do... have occasional double "rails" where opposing "trains" can wait for each... in terms of SL sims, just have multiple regions around where there is an island, to allow adequate bypass. other words, Maintain a 256m wide unobstructed passage everywhere. Do use openspace for passage, and homestead for islands. That should do it. and since the actual bare bones bridge would be a tiny bit less that 100 sims, you can round it up to 100 and use the extra for these passages and islands.

[Fionalein]

but animats has a good idea there.. the linden homes should be connected to mainland in some way - but let's be honest, I do not see all linden home users moving... some will stay in their little dugouts for ages and I doubt the Lab will forcemove them.

Edited June 16, 2018 by Fionalein

[Klytyna]

2 minutes ago, IceCold Skytower said:

most people have powerful enough hardware and internet to handle simcrossings without issues... MOST ... I still find occasional people on potatoes..

Sim crossings and teleports do not differ that much in terms of hardware requirements, blaming "laggy crossings" on people using "a potato" is technically, a pile of BS.

4 minutes ago, IceCold Skytower said:

because alot of people indeed do want to just teleport, i say things like the journey is more fun than the destination,

For you... For a lot of people, the "fun" is at their destination, not staggering along through a semi abandoned wilderness of empty urban prim ruins.

And before you say anything, YES, I used to sail and fly in SL, regularly, I'm aware of how SMALL the percentage of regular sailors and flyers is compared to those people who prefer to TP between shops and clubs and homes, and social hangouts.

8 minutes ago, IceCold Skytower said:

Though occasionally there are some negative nancies who are reluctant even after the adventure,

Comments like that are why many people would rather TP than listen to vehicle using roleplayers, who arrogantly assume that what THEY enjoy is what EVERYONE should enjoy.

It's no different from that ePeener vs ePeener Gore-Bore Unevolved guy who claims everyone should be bullied into giving up "boring" activities like shopping , socialising and roleplay, and forced to learn to enjoy ePeener noob-gank spawn camping...

 

[Klytyna]

13 minutes ago, Fionalein said:

but animats has a good idea there.. the linden homes should be connected to mainland in some way - but let's be honest, I do not see all linden home users moving... some will stay in their little dugouts for ages and I doubt the Lab will forcemove them.

Sims can be relocated on the grid...

Explore the Madlands, find abandoned Madlands sim, delete abandoned Madlands sim, relocate occupied Entitlement Club ghetto sim to plug the hole, repeat as often as required, 

TA-DA! Entitlement Club homes connected to the Madlands...
 

[Fionalein]

7 minutes ago, Klytyna said:

For you... For a lot of people, the "fun" is at their destination, not staggering along through a semi abandoned wilderness of empty urban prim ruins.

BUUUUTTTT Kyltyna...  don't you know they miss out on all those fullbright digital archeology artifacts they can encounter along their journey 

Edited June 16, 2018 by Fionalein

[ChinRey]

2 hours ago, Klytyna said:

Quite the contrary...

Read his proposal for the Strip-Mall Continent of Animatsland again...

"...lots of water AND lots of roads..."

Yes, I think we should leave the roads out.

 

2 hours ago, Klytyna said:

Remember, Animats thinks with his motorcycle, he's not proposing some private rentals estate sim like the United Sailing sims, where people rent upper class 4k, 8k, and 1/4 sim islands, all very separate from each other,

Oh yes, his idea needs a bit of adjustments but that doesn't mean the basic concept is bad.

I'm having second thoughts about the Linden-Homes-along-the-route concept though. A journey along a 20 m wide ruler straight channel across 90 identical sims with pancake flat land criss crossed by ruler straight roads may not be everybody's cup of tea.

[Fionalein]

1 minute ago, ChinRey said:

Yes, I think we should leave the roads out.

Exactely, build train viaducts instead! 

[ChinRey]

3 minutes ago, Fionalein said:

Exactely, build train viaducts instead! 

How about something like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Cape_Tunnel

[Fionalein]

3 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

How about something like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Cape_Tunnel

Yay that would be awesome and a whole new mole job creation program in itself 

[Qie Niangao]

Looking at the map, there's a whole lotta void-surrounded islands scattered all across the waters separating the continents. I doubt there's a clear path between them that wouldn't intersect with any of those private islands -- most of which are probably isolated on purpose. As discussed, moving a region causes all kinds of problems, so doing anything like that would require extensive coordination with the island owners.

Seems like a lot of work.

I'm wondering if it wouldn't be easier to fudge the whole problem with a technical tweak to allow a sim to have one "portal" edge that is adjacent another sim with global coordinates far from those of the sim itself.

Say the objective is to cross east from the Atoll to Sartori; a region could be added to the east coast of the Atoll continent with no northern nor southern neighbors (to keep the geometry relatively simple) with the region's own east border adjacent a similar region protruding from the west coast of Satori, so that travel across the border between those two regions effectively hops across the whole span of global coordinates separating them. For all other purposes they are adjacent, avatars on one being child agents on the other, etc.

Now, I have some scripts that would be mightily confused by this discontinuity in global coordinates, but who cares? If it bridges the gap for intercontinental travel, I think it would be worth it.

[ChinRey]

2 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

Looking at the map, there's a whole lotta void-surrounded islands scattered all across the waters separating the continents. I doubt there's a clear path between them that wouldn't intersect with any of those private islands -- most of which are probably isolated on purpose.

That used to be a problem but not anymore. The first time I sketched up a possible route for the Northeast Passage, was more than four years ago. It was possible even then to make a route that stayed away from all existing sims. The route was rather awkward with many bends though and each band adds one extra region to the sims. Today most of them are gone - just look at Christi's map earlier in the thread. Some of the regions that are still in the way are Linden Lab owned and. It may be possible to make an even straighter route if they were moved out of the way or included in the passage. And if the Estate Service sims were moved a bit eastwards, they could contribute at least five sims...

Come to think of it, it's amazing how much more noticeable sim death is on that part of the map than anywhere else. It's almost as if somebody has deliberately kept new sims away from the area.

[Fionalein]

9 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

Come to think of it, it's amazing how much more noticeable sim death is on that part of the map than anywhere else. It's almost as if somebody has deliberately kept new sims away from the area.

Sounds like the lab has a long term plan they are not gonna tell us until they slap it into our faces 

Edited June 16, 2018 by Fionalein

[ChinRey]

3 hours ago, Fionalein said:

Sounds like the lab has a long term plan they are not gonna tell us until they slap it into our faces 

Yes. Or at least that Linden Lab or somebody at Linden Lab thought about it and decided to see if it was possible to open up for the option. That doesn't necessarily mean there are any concrete plans though.

I can't imagine anybody who plans ahead at all would even consider adding isolated sims in the gap between Sansara and Satori. There is nothing to gain from doing so and it closes one very obvious option for the future. Planning ahead was completely alien to the early CEOs but Ebbe Altberg does it and Rod Humble did it too.  The concept has slowly but surely become a part of the Lab's modus operandi.

Edited June 17, 2018 by ChinRey

[Brad Roddenham]

I wholeheartedly support this project, I spend much of my time exploring, and the biggest frustration is finding your way to another area blocked.  Connecting the continents and opening new paths to explore would do nothing but encourage people to join and participate in everything SL has to offer.

[Geneer Gynoid]

I would support inhabited sims as well as completely open sims, BUT... I think for funding, and for interest, and for enjoyment, scattered rent-able islands throughout would be great not only for people that live there, but of-course, navigation, and some funding...

BUT

one thing we definitely don't want is sims that are so over crowded they do not allow for bi directional traffic, space for larger craft, or even space for easy navigation. FOUR islands per sims should be PLENTY to generate revenue, provide a nice landscape, and also allow for plenty of space for bi-directional navigation. Scatter them up, maybe 3 in one sim, 4 in another, 2 in another, 1, etc.... I am always thinking ideally, of-course....

Themes could be established through different legs of the channels... Tropics for some, something like a northern theme, Aleutian Islands Alaska, perhaps, simulating a colder string of islands. Why not..

Again, I could go either way with the completely open, or some islands, but it MUST remain very open and easily navigable or else this project is in vein.

[Qie Niangao]

8 hours ago, ChinRey said:

[...]  just look at Christi's map earlier in the thread. Some of the regions that are still in the way are Linden Lab owned and. It may be possible to make an even straighter route if they were moved out of the way or included in the passage. And if the Estate Service sims were moved a bit eastwards, they could contribute at least five sims...

I dunno. Admittedly, I'm a half-hearted sailor myself, so when I look at a stretch of 90-some sims to get between continents... that's a long time sailing in a more-or-less straight line, even if there are some (narrow) attractions along the way. The ANWR Strait is about as far as my patience extends, although I could see a continuous (non-portal) link between Sansara and Jeogeot, maybe, if it's by way of a new, next-gen Linden Homes continent in that big already-empty space north of Jeogeot. That space really does appear to have been made blank for a reason.

Also, now that the adult-content hysteria is years in the past and the grid has experience with Adult private sims adjacent non-Adult, I'd actually use a vehicle portal sim to get to Zindra, where some great, under-utilized sailing waters can be found. But without a portal, that would be days of uninterrupted sailing to span the 600-some region-widths separating the west coast of Zindra from the rest of Mainland.

Maybe ideally we could have user-defined vehicle portals, but that might violate the continuous map / world illusion a bit too much.

[animats]

23 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

I'm wondering if it wouldn't be easier to fudge the whole problem with a technical tweak to allow a sim to have one "portal" edge that is adjacent another sim with global coordinates far from those of the sim itself.

That would take a major overhaul in the viewer, which has multiple sims in view and (mostly) works in world coordinates.

[animats]

On 6/16/2018 at 5:44 AM, Fionalein said:

but animats has a good idea there.. the linden homes should be connected to mainland in some way - but let's be honest, I do not see all linden home users moving... some will stay in their little dugouts for ages and I doubt the Lab will forcemove them.

I meant new areas with larger 1024m^2 home parcels. Existing Linden homes are on the old 512m^2 parcels. Premium users could upgrade if they wanted; many won't bother.

[Aethelwine]

Whilst I still think moving one of the sets of continents closer and building a land bridge between them would be worth the effort and temporary disruption of broken profile links, another possibility that I would think possible would be to link remote sims together so they function in every way as if they are together whilst being apart. Atanua to Blush, or the ANWR could be linked up with just a couple of sims and the continents effectively joined together without moving the continents across.

Whilst I don't know anywhere else this has happened, it might well be a real possibility that has been overlooked.

I seem to recall a weird temporary glitch in the past where the sim I rented appeared to have a border with a different sim elsewhere on the grid, which suggests it might well be a possibility.

Edited June 19, 2018 by Aethelwine

[MeesterP]

On 6/13/2018 at 4:19 PM, Alwin Alcott said:

count the number of repliers here, and think agian if LL will take this as "top priority"   (20)

 

Alwin Alcott, we have the the impression that you are showing contempt for the people in this forum and their ideas.

On 6/13/2018 at 4:19 PM, Alwin Alcott said:

For sure not when you hear here nearly nobody really jumps in and yells "i buy you 50 sims to connect"

You are insulting contributors of this forum by calling them "nearly nobody".  Just because you don't like them personally inworld, you come here to insult. That's uncalled for, and at least, we use our main account's name, not an alt. 

If this idea of connecting continents is so irritating to you, why don't you leave this forum, instead of trolling?  We have not seen any constructive contribution from you so far.

The appropriate thing to do is to apologize and then change tone.

[Alwin Alcott]

19 minutes ago, MeesterP said:

 we

we?

20 minutes ago, MeesterP said:

You are insulting contributors of this forum by calling them "nearly nobody". 

show me the ones that provided you a bunch of sims for the plan

20 minutes ago, MeesterP said:

Just because you don't like them personally inworld,

i have nothing against sailors

21 minutes ago, MeesterP said:

we use our main account's name, not an alt. 

my account is a alt?....ehm no

22 minutes ago, MeesterP said:

If this idea of connecting continents is so irritating to you, why don't you leave this forum, instead of trolling?

just pointing to the many posts, but no contribution isn't trolling, but pointing to the weakness in your plan, that you totally demand only LL's input.

23 minutes ago, MeesterP said:

The appropriate thing to do is to apologize and then change tone.

you must live at a different planet...

[MeesterP]

On 6/16/2018 at 11:59 AM, animats said:

Yes. Once you get far from water and roads on the continents, you find abandoned land with nothing on it. What are you going to do with 1024 m^2 in the hills of Corsica? There's nothing to do there. Nothing happens around you.

Now look at all those tiny islands near the Blake Sea. People buy those and build on them, and watch the sailboats go by.

What could go between the continents is Linden Homes, the 1024 m^2 generation. Now that premium members get 1024 m^2, Linden Homes A, B, and C are obsolete. "Live the lifestyle of the rich and famous." That sells in SL. Get a 1024 m^2 house on the water with your premium membership. Go for about 30 homes per sim, with lots of water and roads, like some of the better estates. Put in a commercial area once in a while for retail and entertainment, and some water-only sims as filler.

Maybe that's the pitch to make to LL - now that premium users get more tier, LL needs to provide them with bigger and better homes.

 

-  Great idea, animats!    Placing a string of Linden Homes regions between continents may work. 

-  Moving existing Linden Homes regions to create a bridge may also work. Linden Homes regions should be easy to move because they are simple in structure, with relatively few objects in it, if compared to moving a full mainland continent. 

-  But if one really wanted to move a piece of mainland to create the bridge, I reiterate the idea of moving the Sharp Continent (http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Lewis/27/226/30), which is relatively small and already has an elongated, bridge-like shape.    

-  Gaeta V (http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Lastness/202/63/20) could be moved too, to create the bridge (for the same reason as the Sharp Continent) and would finally find a purpose to it's life.

-  Or,  if you were really really in the mood for moving continents, you could move the Blake Sea and USS sims to west of the Bingo Strait, in a symmetrical position to where they are now. If the Blake Sea and USS sims can beautifully sit on the east side of the Bingo Strait, why can't they beautifully sit on the west side?  They themselves could benefit in traffic from being the transit point in between the 2 main land masses (Satori/Nautilus on the east and Sansara/Heterocera on the west.  They could be attached to Binnacle-Orlop-Tonar sims, for example.                         #BlakeWestSideStory 

 

Edited June 19, 2018 by MeesterP

[Aethelwine]

I think it worth considering the Horizons development. 50 new sims with water and road connections, laid out in a themed way, 36 of which were residential, 14 Linden owned, water sims, hubs and the gaming area, all bought as soon as they hit the market. Whilst part of their success was the fact it is adult land on the adult continent, perhaps partly the link with the game area... but I think mostly it is the themed build with road and water access to the rest of the continent that makes it so attractive. The success of that development was (I think) before improvements to parcel size and tier on premium accounts. Whilst the adult nature of the development was a part of the attraction I think a much bigger part is the road and waterway access to the rest of the continent.

What I take from that is similar developments are viable and would work just as well. That redeveloping and improving the moderate and general mainland areas is financially viable. It must be possible to do something with the South of Sansara to improve it with roads routed through the wastelands of unwanted rushed half finished sims. Waterways extending water access around the continents and even developing out to link continents either by portals, by moving the continents together or in the case of Jeogeot with some Horizons type development. All these ideas would seem financially viable. Linden investment would pay for itself, land barons would snap up the residential parcels to sell on just as they did with Horizons

Edited June 19, 2018 by Aethelwine