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Kara Trapdoor

Mainland Beauty

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Why can't /doesn't LL dedicate some mainland for those seeking residence on mainland and incorporate a few easy rules for such areas, similar to rental landlords, specifically no low lying skyboxes or sandbox type things below 500m?  

I recently took advantage of the premium benefit and purchased my first mainland area.  I spent quite a bit of time finding a space not surrounded by a lot of low lying airspace things cluttering the sky or other things that were not overly appealing to me, when I just wanted to purchase a space to live.  The coast seems to be sold and resold for high prices and is a little more residential, as people tend to want to live there vs putting up a shop, renting column skyboxes, or using it as a sandbox. What is the reason LL doesn't have areas where no sky builds can be below 500m, and maybe a few other easy rules? I think it would greatly improve their land sales. Also, why is some of the mainland SO hilly to the extent that it cant all fully be terraformed flat?  There must be logical reasons for these things, but so far I haven't figured them out. I think they want more people to purchase mainland and enjoy that, and right now some other landlords are making a ton of money with markup on some nice land spaces. LL could be making money off this.  Granted there may be a little monitoring or checking on people who don't cooperate, but maybe they could designate home owner association presidents to check up on complaints or something like that.. or at least try a relatively little area with a few extra rules.  LL DOES still get land fees from people who own larger parcels than their premium covers.  They have rules about land rating, why not a few extra easy rules in certain areas. Maybe they could have dedicated mainland sections like residential, business, company, rentals, sandbox, etc.  I really don't know what might work best, but I saw people clammoring for quality land spots, other scalping others for the prim locations, and MUCH junk, err, things in the air but still very low lying tings, obstructing views of many others w/out a care. I even saw some block in others on the coast so their tiny water can't open to the open water any more, stacked column rentals from ground way up into the sky, etc. It's quite interesting but I do think more mainland could be sold by LL if there were dedicated areas for those just wanting a nice residential area.  People might landscape beautiful areas.  Right now the only option for a beautiful area is derendering a lot of air objects. 

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The problem is: those rules never were there. LL could have added them when they added new mainland like Horizons... but adding them for those that already established their ugliness is kinda hard. Mainladn has it's own market rules... those ugly spots will most certaily driva away all neighbours (especially the great "shoebox panorama" designs) and drive down the land price around them, aggregating more stacked rentals and that other stuff no one wants to see... The nice looking areas however are highly sought after but you have to pay a higher price... no one pay 10 times the price to a comparable parcel to set up those stacked rental skyboxes... it just does not pay out. What could happen is that somone buys your neighbouring coastline and puts out boatslip rentals... :D... but those most often fit the theme.

 

Edited by Fionalein

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5 minutes ago, Alyona Su said:

They already have: it's called HORIZONS. Exactly what you are describing, OP.

oh they did for Horizons? smart move

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But I aint keeping it....I can get double the prims for $3.70 more!

 

 

Edited by SodaGnome
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3 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

What is the reason LL doesn't have

3 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

Also, why is some of the mainland

3 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

There must be logical reasons for these things,

Don't count on it... Madlands is MAD for a reason...

3 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

ton of money with markup on some nice land spaces. LL could be making money off this.

They do...  Every property tycoon wannabe who pays MAD prices at auctions of abandoned land, then racks up MAD prices for resale, pays TIER on their Madlands dirt while they wait, usually in vain for somebody MAD enough to take the land off their hands, until finally they realise they will never sell it and that TIER has eaten all hope of profit, and abandon it, so it can be auctioned off at MAD prices to some other property tycoon wannabe.

3 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

maybe they could designate home owner association presidents

Translation: Allow self appointed Neighbourhood Snitch Nazis to bully their neighbours, Let's not and say we did, bloody awful idea.

3 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

Maybe they could have dedicated mainland sections like residential

Horizons... Prices even more MAD than most Madlands, with rules most Madlanders can't abide, you see people who payed MAD prices for Horizons renting the stuff out for LESS than the tier cost, just to minimise the losses from being suckered into that MAD scheme.



 

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1 minute ago, Klytyna said:

 Every property tycoon wannabe who pays MAD prices at auctions of abandoned land, then racks up MAD prices for resale,



 

I was told we cannot resale land we win on auction. Do you mean rent it out? Or we can be the auctioneer and re-sell it after we win it in an auction?

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1 hour ago, SodaGnome said:

I was told we cannot resale land we win on auction. Do you mean rent it out? Or we can be the auctioneer and re-sell it after we win it in an auction?

You can resell it.  It is mainland and you paid for it and thus you own it.  You can sell it for however much money you can get.

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7 hours ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

Why can't ..................to much to quote.................... objects. 

i live on the mainland, totally enclosed by neighbours with styles and "building skills" that are not my liking.

I don't see the need of more rules.

We have great tools... if you don't want to see it, lower your drawdistance

If it's to close?.... use derender   (use the select tool to derender whole parcels at one click)

tip: don't buy flat land, but as high as possible on a hill... you'll overlook most of the neighbours, if you can't flatten it enough, use a prim to level it out.

 

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6 hours ago, Fionalein said:

oh they did for Horizons? smart move

There are rules for Horizons but from what I've seen the few times I've visited, people don't always follow them and LL doesn't seem interested in enforcing them.

There are some areas where a single owner or a group of people have created a unified theme but not many and for obivious reasons there's not much chance you can buy land in those spots - you probably have to rent - and you have to be find one that fits whatever style you want. I run one of those myself (with a Northern English theme) and it's a constant struggle with little or no support from Linden Lab who - except for some lukewarm support of Bay City - show little or no interest in themed mainland areas.

 

22 minutes ago, Ethan Paslong said:

We have great tools... if you don't want to see it, lower your drawdistance

If it's to close?.... use derender   (use the select tool to derender whole parcels at one click)

Yes but to me at least it seems extremely pointless to live on ground on mainland if all you can see around you is empty land and you don't want visitors (or have to tell each and every one of them to derender and lwoer their draw distances too). If that's what you want, you're better off on a private estate or in a skybox high up in the air.

Edited by ChinRey

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9 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

There are rules for Horizons but from what I've seen the few times I've visited, people don't always follow them and LL doesn't seem interested in enforcing them.

That's kinda the problem with rules in SL, except the ones the Lab must enforce for legal reasons (gambling, sexual *****, etc.). And frankly, I wouldn't want my tier spent running a police force and court system, opportunity costs against developing new features.

One feature I'd like to see developed, though, is something like a "parcel level" derender, so the owner of the parcel could determine what external surroundings are visible to visitors, without those visitors needing to do anything. We suggested this way back during adfarms, but nowadays with such things as Experience-assisted portals and the upcoming scripted-Windlight EEP, it would be a significant advance to be able to define distinct parcel-specific environments on Mainland and Estates -- the LEA sims foremost, in fact.

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I doubt it is intentional, I really consider going premium and buiyng one or two horizons parcels.... but I cannot find those rules =^.^= So if they exist, how should someone who does not even know about them ever learn them when I who actively seek them already cannot find them?

Edited by Fionalein

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1 hour ago, Fionalein said:

I doubt it is intentional, I really consider going premium and buiyng one or two horizons parcels.... but I cannot find those rules =^.^= So if they exist, how should someone who does not even know about them ever learn them when I who actively seek them already cannot find them?

On all parcels and sims in "About Land" box there is one tab called Covenant. Almost every private sim uses this as their "legal" notice of any and all rules, especially rental sims. All mainland sims have a blank covenant (there is no covenant). Horizons and LL Homes do have covenants and there is where the 'legal-speak" rules are. And I use the term "legal" very loosely, there is no legal precedent, but rather it is meant to be: in all disputes, questions, etc., these are the final word on a subject.

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2 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

And frankly, I wouldn't want my tier spent running a police force and court system, opportunity costs against developing new features.

I don't think it's even possible anymore. "A neighbor is an enemy you haven't met yet" has become such a fundamental part of SL's culture it would be very difficult and expensive to change it now.

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The lack of rules leads to some hideous constructions. I find the parcel wraparounds some people use particular awful. 

However... Those lack of rules are part of what makes Second Life mainland fun. For relatively cheap you can own your own parcel and put what you like there. You might live next to a lovely garden... Or a strip joint. It's randomness, it's brutal ugly aesthetic actually quite enders the mainland to me. 

Part of the solution comes from living up to the standards we want, keeping sky boxes high and not leaving bare ground is a start. And land collectives, groups of likeminded folk in it for the long term could be started if there really was demand to go out and take over and remodel mainland regions. 

The fact it doesn't happen that often suggests that the demand might not be there for that solution sadly... 

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5 hours ago, Christhiana said:

I think a maximum height for privacy screens would be a great help.

There is a maximum height. It's 4128 meters (max build height plus half of the max prim height). If it's mainland there won't be rules. Rules need enforcers (who can't be residents) and LL certainly doesn't have enough people to waste time enforcing the in-world equivalent of homeowner association rules.

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2 hours ago, Parhelion Palou said:

There is a maximum height. It's 4128 meters (max build height plus half of the max prim height). If it's mainland there won't be rules. Rules need enforcers (who can't be residents) and LL certainly doesn't have enough people to waste time enforcing the in-world equivalent of homeowner association rules.

They could at least make it AR-able. Then LL would only have to respond when someone actually has an issue with a privacy screen.

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7 hours ago, Christhiana said:

They could at least make it AR-able. Then LL would only have to respond when someone actually has an issue with a privacy screen.

That would require the lab to hire 2 short time employees for just 2 month worktime of pricacy screen removal alone after the moment they woud allow this. Believe me, a lot of us mainland drivers would report them... I ride around there for the view after all...

Edited by Fionalein

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We do pay LL land fees though for mainland for something right?. Why not try it.. reserve some mainland to sell to ppl who desire single family residency willing to keep skybuilds over 500 meters etc.  Worth a try and LL can earn some $ vs land sharks. 

My next question:    I THOUGHT maintenance land that says not for sale is not for sale.  I did purchase a small plot from someone else higher than the going LL rate and was enjoying a large empty maintenance land next to it for quite a while then suddenly a huge section of it was owned by a rental agency who stacked rentals on it and another piece of it sold to a store and another piece to an individual literally all within a couple days. I NEVER saw for sale marks on the land.  Can a person put in a ticket to buy maintenance land that says not for sale?   I NEVER saw it for sale but must all of a huge area been changed literally within a couple days? How /why would that happen?  I would have liked some of it or at least preferred it to remain open vs stacked laggy rentals and a store?   Now my new concern is i have another separate small plot that has maintenance land next to it.. will it suddenly be for sale or can I put in a ticket to buy some of the maintenance land next to it?  I thought maintenance land was for LL to maintain some land to reduce lag and keep a sim.. idk nicer? 

Can I request to buy some maintenance land ... before someone else gets it? How does maintenance land work? 

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11 minutes ago, Kara Trapdoor said:

Can I request to buy some maintenance land ... before someone else gets it? How does maintenance land work? 

The majority of land set to the "Maintenance" group is abandoned, and the Lab is very eager to get people paying tier on that rather than leaving it idle. So yeah, you absolutely can request to buy that land unless it's also "Protected", and those requests are getting fulfilled with fewer restrictions than in the past.

Some "Maintenance" group land, however, is Protected -- the Linden ocean Homesteads, waterways, and some other land is Protected, as is most Linden Department of Public Works land -- and that is generally not made available for sale (although reportedly there have been rare exceptions).

I'm not sure about the "Not for sale" thing. Most Protected land says that, but I'm not sure all land that says "Not for sale" is Protected. If it's not Protected, it's probably not intended to be permanently off the market.

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If you want a nice area of little houses, try the premium Linden Lab house continents, like Meadowbrook. They have strict rules.

    * Linden Home is for residential use only.
    * Business use of any kind is prohibited, including parcel rental, rental boxes, classified ads or other forms of advertising, and event listings.
    * Land cannot be terraformed, sold, deeded to group, joined, or divided.
    * Land cannot contain sky boxes, temp-rezzers, or individual prims beyond the allocated size of the Second Life Viewer build tools — 10x10x10m (no megaprims).
    * Linden Homes may not be removed, modified, exchanged, set or deeded to group, or transferred.
    * Linden Homes should be kept presentable and in-theme.
    * Linden Homes should not be used as sandboxes.
    * Linden Homes do not include traffic tracking.
    * Ownership is limited to one Linden Home per Premium Account.

    * Use local chat say, rather than shout.
    * Adhere to the Maturity Rating for the Linden Home region you're located in.
    * Respect your neighbors' privacy.
    * Review general Second Life etiquette suggestions and incorporate them into your Linden Home experience: http://bit.ly/sletiquette

 It's suburbia. There are huge areas of houses, with trees, flowers, parkland, and pathways. Few roads. Almost nothing else. Very peaceful. Boring. Just like RL suburbia.

 

Edited by animats
More rules.

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5 minutes ago, animats said:

If you want a nice area of little houses, try the premium Linden Lab house continents, like Meadowbrook.

    * Linden Home is for residential use only.
    * Business use of any kind is prohibited, including parcel rental, rental boxes, classified ads or other forms of advertising, and event listings.
    * Land cannot be terraformed, sold, deeded to group, joined, or divided.
    * Land cannot contain sky boxes, temp-rezzers, or individual prims beyond the allocated size of the Second Life Viewer build tools — 10x10x10m (no megaprims).
    * Linden Homes may not be removed, modified, exchanged, set or deeded to group, or transferred.
    * Linden Homes should be kept presentable and in-theme.
    * Linden Homes should not be used as sandboxes.
    * Linden Homes do not include traffic tracking.
    * Ownership is limited to one Linden Home per Premium Account.

    * Use local chat say, rather than shout.
    * Adhere to the Maturity Rating for the Linden Home region you're located in.
    * Respect your neighbors' privacy.
    * Review general Second Life etiquette suggestions and incorporate them into your Linden Home experience: http://bit.ly/sletiquette

 It's suburbia. There are huge areas of houses, with trees, flowers, parkland, and pathways. Few roads. Almost nothing else. Very peaceful.

 

You are limited to 512 sqm of land and thus 175 LI and the houses themselves are really pretty 'meh'.

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