Can I be banned from my own land?

[Tourmaline Falken]

Hi all

I've just bought a parcel of land and rent out for the first time, so a total newbie to being a "landlord" lol.  My question is - could a nasty renter ban me from my own land by putting out a security orb or in some other way?  What can I do to prevent this (eg what should be checked/unchecked in "About Land" when renting out).  I already have a group for the land and the house I'm putting down has its own security system. Any tips generally?  

TIA 

[Callum Meriman]

52 minutes ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

Hi all

I've just bought a parcel of land and rent out for the first time, so a total newbie to being a "landlord" lol.  My question is - could a nasty renter ban me from my own land by putting out a security orb or in some other way?  What can I do to prevent this (eg what should be checked/unchecked in "About Land" when renting out).  I already have a group for the land and the house I'm putting down has its own security system. Any tips generally?  

TIA 

On mainland, a nasty tenant can put an orb in or ban lines up if you allow deed. But you can also cam in and return it, then ban them (Use firestorms area search to trivially find it). On private estates ban lines and orbs don't work on estate managers. [[Generally though, so what if they orb you, you ethically shouldn't be visiting the rented land in my opinion. At the end of the lease you can return all their remaining stuff from outside the parcel (carefully) and then undo the ban line and walk in.]]

A word of advice, never give the tenant owner status in the group, make a second level under owner with a lot of the options turned off (like sell land)

A second word of advice, make an alt and give that alt owner level like you. You should always have 2 avatars who own the land in your name.

 

Edited March 26, 2018 by Callum Meriman

[Love Zhaoying]

Just now, Callum Meriman said:

never give the tenant owner status in the group, make a second level under owner with a lot of the options turned off (like sell land)

Saw the post about this recently.

[Callum Meriman]

5 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Saw the post about this recently.

Mmm, my partner made this mistake in one of our land groups, when I noticed it the person was honest enough to lower themselves from Owner to Officer. I love my tenants  they are all pawesome.

[Tourmaline Falken]

Thanks everyone - a lot of helpful advice here

35 minutes ago, Callum Meriman said:

On mainland, a nasty tenant can put an orb in or ban lines up if you allow deed. But you can also cam in and return it, then ban them (Use firestorms area search to trivially find it). On private estates ban lines and orbs don't work on estate managers. [[Generally though, so what if they orb you, you ethically shouldn't be visiting the rented land in my opinion. At the end of the lease you can return all their remaining stuff from outside the parcel (carefully) and then undo the ban line and walk in.]]

A word of advice, never give the tenant owner status in the group, make a second level under owner with a lot of the options turned off (like sell land)

A second word of advice, make an alt and give that alt owner level like you. You should always have 2 avatars who own the land in your name.

 

Yeah I wouldn't be visiting the plot while they are renting, just thinking someone could ban me and stop paying, then what would I do.  You answered that - thanks.  Shall I just not allow deed?  They'd only need that for a TV otherwise, I think.  Anything I'm missing?

Yup I was going to make tiered levels in the group for renters.  What options should be on and which ones off?

Yes I've got an alt with owner level, so that should be covered.

[Callum Meriman]

13 minutes ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

Shall I just not allow deed?  They'd only need that for a TV otherwise, I think.  Anything I'm missing?

I let them as I like to let my tenants put in their own TV and Radio - but it means they can orb too, no biggie in my opinion as it's easy to find and return.

Other people don't allow it - and that can be an extra support load. So, it's down to what you find easier and some of that comes to the market your serve too. For the cheaper places it can be easier to turn deeding off and install your own radio/tv/orb.

13 minutes ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

What options should be on and which ones off?

I'd turn *OFF*

• Toggle 'Open Enrollment'
• Create new roles
• Delete roles
• Assign Members to Any Role <-- critical this is off
• Assign and Remove Abilities in Roles <-- important this is off
• Change Charter, Insignia and Show in Search
• Deed Land/Buy land for group <-- important this is off
• Abandon Land <-- Critical this is off
• Set land for sale <-- Critical this is off
• Subdivide and Join <-- important this is off
• Toggle 'Show in Search'
• Toggle Edit Terrain
• Always allow Edit terrain
• Allow Event Hosting
• Landscaping using Linden Plants 
• Set Group owned for Sale
• Pay Group Liabilities / Recieve dividends

 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2018 by Callum Meriman

[Bebe Bunny]

There is an option on the banlist of the land where you can add yourself as "Always allowed" on the "Access" tab. If you're renting with rental boxes and not the full land, you can also provide the security orb yourself with your tenants as sub admins.

[Tourmaline Falken]

4 hours ago, Sylvannas Zulaman said:

There is an option on the banlist of the land where you can add yourself as "Always allowed" on the "Access" tab. If you're renting with rental boxes and not the full land, you can also provide the security orb yourself with your tenants as sub admins.

I've tried to do this but cannot add myself.  I've added my alt but selecting myself doesn't add myself to the list.  Perhaps cos I am the land  owner anyway (therefore perhaps I would always be allowed by default?)

 

6 hours ago, Callum Meriman said:

I let them as I like to let my tenants put in their own TV and Radio - but it means they can orb too, no biggie in my opinion as it's easy to find and return.

Other people don't allow it - and that can be an extra support load. So, it's down to what you find easier and some of that comes to the market your serve too. For the cheaper places it can be easier to turn deeding off and install your own radio/tv/orb.

 

 

 

 

I've tried to deed the parcel to the group but get this message "[09:47] Second Life: Deeding parcel failed because the group does not have enough land credits."  It's only a titchy 512m parcel - what do land credits mean and how do I fix it?

Edited March 26, 2018 by Tourmaline Falken

[LittleMe Jewell]

3 hours ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

I've tried to deed the parcel to the group but get this message "[09:47] Second Life: Deeding parcel failed because the group does not have enough land credits."  It's only a titchy 512m parcel - what do land credits mean and how do I fix it?

The group needs enough Tier donated to it to cover the parcel size.  You should also have an option for something like "Owner makes contribution" when you deed the land.  That will automatically deed the tier from your personal usage directly to the group with the land so that there will be no double tier charge.

[Tourmaline Falken]

You've all been so helpful so far - may I ask some more questions while I continue to learn and set this up?

I've deeded the parcel to the group - I got the warning that if the land is sold then the sale amount is divided between group members, and thought well I will just un-deed it to group before I sell it (if & whenever I sell it).  However, now it's deeded to the group, I notice the deed buttons are greyed out.  How do I reverse the process and become the sole owner in the future if I want to sell the land?

 

Edited March 28, 2018 by Tourmaline Falken

[So Whimsy]

2 hours ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

You've all been so helpful so far - may I ask some more questions while I continue to learn and set this up?

I've deeded the parcel to the group - I got the warning that if the land is sold then the sale amount is divided between group members, and thought well I will just un-deed it to group before I sell it (if & whenever I sell it).  However, now it's deeded to the group, I notice the deed buttons are greyed out.  How do I reverse the process and become the sole owner in the future if I want to sell the land?

 

No need to undeed it before you sell it. In your group you can assign different roles and you can decide exactly which role would get any Linden from a potential land sale. Usually that is just the owner(s) unless otherwise specified.
Just make sure that before you sell (or of course before that) that no role but your owner role is liable to receive divident payouts. When you sell your group owned land then only you will receive the cash.

 

To get the parcel back in your name you will have to sell it to yourself for 1L using the normal sell land option as there's no way to revert it back once deeded.

[LittleMe Jewell]

3 hours ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

You've all been so helpful so far - may I ask some more questions while I continue to learn and set this up?

I've deeded the parcel to the group - I got the warning that if the land is sold then the sale amount is divided between group members, and thought well I will just un-deed it to group before I sell it (if & whenever I sell it).  However, now it's deeded to the group, I notice the deed buttons are greyed out.  How do I reverse the process and become the sole owner in the future if I want to sell the land?

 

As Syn said, just make sure only you, the owner, has the "Liabilities"  assignment.  This means that only the owner would pay for any 'search' feature and only the owner gets any money paid to the group.  

For actually selling the land, you can sell it when it is group owned.  The sales amount will go to the group and within a 24-hour period it will then be disbursed evenly to those in the group with 'Liabilities' assigned to them (hence why you make sure only you have that).  

If you want to actually take the land back to individual ownership at any time, you have to do it carefully to avoid extra tier charges.  First you remove enough Tier donation from the group to cover the exact size of the land -- groups are allowed to be negative in tier for short periods.  Then you set the land for sale, directly to you, for L$0 and you buy it.  Then you set it for sale to anyone for whatever amount you want.  Note that if you are using the full amount of the 10% bonus that the group gets, pulling out enough tier to sell it to yourself could result in the group not having enough even after you sell the plot to yourself.  This is why it is sometimes better to just leave the land in the group and sell it straight from there.

Edited March 28, 2018 by LittleMe Jewell

[Tourmaline Falken]

21 hours ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

As Syn said, just make sure only you, the owner, has the "Liabilities"  assignment.  This means that only the owner would pay for any 'search' feature and only the owner gets any money paid to the group.  

For actually selling the land, you can sell it when it is group owned.  The sales amount will go to the group and within a 24-hour period it will then be disbursed evenly to those in the group with 'Liabilities' assigned to them (hence why you make sure only you have that).  

Thanks again both.  To be clear, and as this is so important, the place to be unchecked in the group for general group members regarding Liabilities is under "Accounting: Pay group liabilities and receive group dividends"? Anywhere else?

[LittleMe Jewell]

1 hour ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

Thanks again both.  To be clear, and as this is so important, the place to be unchecked in the group for general group members regarding Liabilities is under "Accounting: Pay group liabilities and receive group dividends"? Anywhere else?

That is the only setting that involves the money.

[Tourmaline Falken]

Hello again - 

I've noticed on my transaction history a payment regarding my group which the land is deeded to. Is this because the land is deeded or something else?  Is it weekly or monthly?  I don't think I understand group liability or tier charges properly ...

https://gyazo.com/1265f6c322a6012d4ba4f22c5f81203c

Edited April 11, 2018 by Tourmaline Falken

[Cindy Evanier]

That looks like half payment of the group fee to show land in search.  Do you co-own the group with anyone else?  If so they pay the other 15L$.  It is a weekly charge of 30 L$  split between whichever group members are set to pay it  scroll down here to read about group liabilities,  If you don't want to pay it in future you need to untick "show in search" in your land settings

 

34 minutes ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

Hello again - 

I've noticed on my transaction history a payment regarding my group which the land is deeded to. Is this because the land is deeded or something else?  Is it weekly or monthly?  I don't think I understand group liability or tier charges properly ...

https://gyazo.com/1265f6c322a6012d4ba4f22c5f81203c

 

[Tourmaline Falken]

Ah yes, thank you - I have it set to show in search to advertise the rental, and yes I have an alt who is also an Owner of the group. I'll be taking it off show in search once it gets rented. Thanks for that!

[Tourmaline Falken]

Hello all - well my parcel rented for the first time today.  Somebody paid for a whole month, so I'm pleased. (Although having said how much she loved the place, she refunded the lease 30 mins later cos she found something better *sigh*)

Thing is I got no notification from the rental box and only found out cos I had a visitor detector at the parcel and went to check. I think it only notifies me in local chat if I'm online.   How do you all get notifications of payments for your rented parcels?  What's the easiest way for me to set that up apart from constantly going there or logging into my transaction history to check?

Edited April 22, 2018 by Tourmaline Falken

[Parhelion Palou]

On 4/22/2018 at 6:09 AM, Tourmaline Falken said:

Hello all - well my parcel rented for the first time today.  Somebody paid for a whole month, so I'm pleased. (Although having said how much she loved the place, she refunded the lease 30 mins later cos she found something better *sigh*)

Thing is I got no notification from the rental box and only found out cos I had a visitor detector at the parcel and went to check. I think it only notifies me in local chat if I'm online.   How do you all get notifications of payments for your rented parcels?  What's the easiest way for me to set that up apart from constantly going there or logging into my transaction history to check?

CasperLet can tell you when people rent, quit renting, etc. but I doubt you're using that for a single parcel. You'd have to check the documentation for your rental box to see if it has the capability. If it doesn't but the script is modifiable then notifications (IM and/or email) could be added.

[Tourmaline Falken]

9 hours ago, Parhelion Palou said:

CasperLet can tell you when people rent, quit renting, etc. but I doubt you're using that for a single parcel. You'd have to check the documentation for your rental box to see if it has the capability. If it doesn't but the script is modifiable then notifications (IM and/or email) could be added.

Thanks for that!  I got a friend of mine to add in the IM notification in the script for me, so hoping that sorts the problem next time.

[Tourmaline Falken]

Sooo my land and house has been set up for 6 weeks and apart from an abortive rent which lasted a few hours, no-one has rented it.  I'm thinking of reducing the rental price.

My question is:  How long would you leave a rental up before reducing the price to attract renters?  It's currently advertised on the MP and in several Facebook and in-world groups, as well as in my shops, and I have had at least two visitors to the land every week to look at it, but no takers as yet.   

[So Whimsy]

1 hour ago, Tourmaline Falken said:

Sooo my land and house has been set up for 6 weeks and apart from an abortive rent which lasted a few hours, no-one has rented it.  I'm thinking of reducing the rental price.

My question is:  How long would you leave a rental up before reducing the price to attract renters?  It's currently advertised on the MP and in several Facebook and in-world groups, as well as in my shops, and I have had at least two visitors to the land every week to look at it, but no takers as yet.   

I was bored so I took a look at your rental. You are basically trying to rent out a pre-furnished 512sqm parcel. Skybox no less. No ocean view, no Linden Road, nothing that makes it special.

512 sqm parcels on mainland rent out for 100-150 Linden per week (mayyyyybe up to 170L if they offer ocean view, sailing, roads etc). You are asking more than double the amount. It's no wonder nobody rents.

Edited May 10, 2018 by Syn Anatine

[Tourmaline Falken]

3 minutes ago, Syn Anatine said:

I was bored so I took a look at your rental. You are basically trying to rent out a pre-furnished 512sqm parcel. Skybox no less. No ocean view, no Linden Road, nothing that makes it special.

512 sqm parcels on mainland rent out for 100-150 Linden per week. You are asking more than double the amount. It's no wonder nobody rents.

Thanks for your reply -  I am a new landowner so still learning, hence my posting here for advice.  I was advised elsewhere to start high and reduce as necessary so I was aware that I was aiming high. It's all good quality stuff - 100% mesh house with animated 100% mesh furniture and use of a private Intan dance ball and other extras in the house, which you wouldn't get in some crap box in the sky.  I wasn't asking for an opinion on the price but how long I should leave it.  However, I appreciate your comments and will reduce the rental price.

[So Whimsy]

It doesn't matter whether your house and furniture are high quality. Most people want to buy their own house and furnish it with their own items. Even more so when it comes to adult items such as beds. Furnished rentals aren't that popular in SL.

Even if you offer to take off the house and furniture, it would leave them with a 512sqm skybox with about 175 prims. Not even private Estates would charge as much as you do for your mainland parcel.

Don't listen to others unless they're established land renters themselves. Start high and go lower only works if you have prime land situated in a great neighbourhood or attached to protected linden open space regions where renters can sail. I am not sure why you insist on listening to that person. You've been waiting a month to rent it, shouldn't that tell you enough that the person didn't give you the best advice?

Don't wait, lower your rental to actually compete on the land rental market.

[Tourmaline Falken]

15 hours ago, Syn Anatine said:

It doesn't matter whether your house and furniture are high quality. Most people want to buy their own house and furnish it with their own items. Even more so when it comes to adult items such as beds. Furnished rentals aren't that popular in SL.

Even if you offer to take off the house and furniture, it would leave them with a 512sqm skybox with about 175 prims. Not even private Estates would charge as much as you do for your mainland parcel.

Don't listen to others unless they're established land renters themselves. Start high and go lower only works if you have prime land situated in a great neighbourhood or attached to protected linden open space regions where renters can sail. I am not sure why you insist on listening to that person. You've been waiting a month to rent it, shouldn't that tell you enough that the person didn't give you the best advice?

Don't wait, lower your rental to actually compete on the land rental market.

Actually both the pieces advice I've had has been from two established land renters - about starting high and also about waiting and being patient.  I'm not insisting on anything.  I am new to this and appreciate your comments and will change the rental price and maybe other things if it doesn't rent soon.

So do you think if I made it unfurnished I could actually charge more for the rent?  How much?

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by Tourmaline Falken