Basic Shaders.. No. Now what?

[Lexii Lungu]

Okay.. so now that many people have to disable basic shaders.. now what do we do?

 

Multiple viewers have to have them off or I get that stupid pink texture screw up on various items.. so now what? shadows and such used to work just fine.. my video and graphics and processor are all rather up there. I can run Second Life on Ultra and keep it there, otherwise, and still have background processes if I need to have them running.. so what now?

Is there a second option for Shaders that I have not been told about or found out about? I would love to have the beauty of Second Life and it's creations, again, without excess error textures.

[Whirly Fizzle]

I guess you are talking about this problem: VWR-29357 - Scene is mostly pink with viewer update- 3.3.4 (262321) July 26, 2012 - ATI cards

This should only happen if you have AMD graphics & your graphics drivers are very very out of date.
I'd hope you should be able to update the graphics driver to a version that doesn't have this problem, even if your system is really old.

In the top menu bar of the viewer, go to Help -> About Second Life ( About ViewerName if using a TPV), click the "Copy to clipboard" button & paste all your system information here.

[cykarushb]

7 hours ago, Whirly Fizzle said:

I guess you are talking about this problem: VWR-29357 - Scene is mostly pink with viewer update- 3.3.4 (262321) July 26, 2012 - ATI cards

This should only happen if you have AMD graphics & your graphics drivers are very very out of date.
I'd hope you should be able to update the graphics driver to a version that doesn't have this problem, even if your system is really old.

In the top menu bar of the viewer, go to Help -> About Second Life ( About ViewerName if using a TPV), click the "Copy to clipboard" button & paste all your system information here.

no, no, no, no, no ,no just no god no

stop doin that

every god damn post about a bug someone pulls a JIRA from half a decade ago about hardware issues that existed for like 2 days

This is a server issue, the server is not providing textures and you are seeing textureless objects, sometimes theyre pink, sometimes theyre gray.

This has nothing to do with hardware, it is not about an AMD graphics card. Nobody is using the HD 5470 that guy in the notes is using, its unbelievably below minimum spec for this game to even start.

OP's best bet is to clear their cache and let the server re-download all the textures it needs as you go through SL. And i swear to god if someone comes in here and says "clearing your cache is bad for SL" i will throw this PC into orbit and let it return back to earth through their roof.

[arton Rotaru]

3 hours ago, cykarushb said:

And i swear to god if someone comes in here and says "clearing your cache is bad for SL" i will throw this PC into orbit and let it return back to earth through their roof.

Can you make a video of it, when you throw your PC into orbit. I really would like to watch that.

Alright then, here we go...."clearing your cache is bad for SL". Not that I believe in that, but I'd really like to see you throwing that PC. Although, I doubt it will hit my roof.

For the issue you are describing, Whirly will have a JIRA at hand as well I bet. Probably even one she did report herself, so that LL can fix it ASAP.

@Whirly Fizzle.
please keep posting even decade old JIRAs.

[Whirly Fizzle]

On 02/03/2018 at 11:34 PM, cykarushb said:

no, no, no, no, no ,no just no god no

stop doin that

every god damn post about a bug someone pulls a JIRA from half a decade ago about hardware issues that existed for like 2 days

This is a server issue, the server is not providing textures and you are seeing textureless objects, sometimes theyre pink, sometimes theyre gray.

This has nothing to do with hardware, it is not about an AMD graphics card. Nobody is using the HD 5470 that guy in the notes is using, its unbelievably below minimum spec for this game to even start.

OP's best bet is to clear their cache and let the server re-download all the textures it needs as you go through SL. And i swear to god if someone comes in here and says "clearing your cache is bad for SL" i will throw this PC into orbit and let it return back to earth through their roof.

Sorry, but your information is totally incorrect.
@Lexii Lungu - please can you post your system information as requested above so I can check your driver version & look for the correct driver update for your system.

Thanks 

[Pamela Galli]

On 3/2/2018 at 5:34 PM, cykarushb said:

no, no, no, no, no ,no just no god no

stop doin that

every god damn post about a bug someone pulls a JIRA from half a decade ago about hardware issues that existed for like 2 days

This is a server issue, the server is not providing textures and you are seeing textureless objects, sometimes theyre pink, sometimes theyre gray.

This has nothing to do with hardware, it is not about an AMD graphics card. Nobody is using the HD 5470 that guy in the notes is using, its unbelievably below minimum spec for this game to even start.

OP's best bet is to clear their cache and let the server re-download all the textures it needs as you go through SL. And i swear to god if someone comes in here and says "clearing your cache is bad for SL" i will throw this PC into orbit and let it return back to earth through their roof.

 You don’t know who you’re talking to. 

[Love Zhaoying]

[cykarushb]

3 hours ago, Whirly Fizzle said:

Sorry, but your information is totally incorrect.
@Lexii Lungu - please can you post your system information as requested above so I can check your driver version & look for the correct driver update for your system.

Thanks 

Please tell me how this is somehow related to a graphics card from 2012 or really any other old AMD/ATI card that OP clearly does not have when they specifically stated having a decent cpu/gpu and being able to hold ultra settings.

 

[Solar Legion]

2 hours ago, cykarushb said:

Please tell me how this is somehow related to a graphics card from 2012 or really any other old AMD/ATI card that OP clearly does not have when they specifically stated having a decent cpu/gpu and being able to hold ultra settings.

 

There are these things called "drivers" that can be out of date or have old issues resurface despite being a more recent version. 

The problem being described occurs when the shaders are in use, which is client side, not server side.

Edited March 4, 2018 by Solar Legion

[Callum Meriman]

5 hours ago, cykarushb said:

Please tell me how this is somehow related to a graphics card from 2012 or really any other old AMD/ATI card that OP clearly does not have when they specifically stated having a decent cpu/gpu and being able to hold ultra settings.

Whirly is very widely respected for a reason.

I see nothing wrong in her suggesting a possible cause and *importantly* asking for further information from the OP to support or disprove it, especially as the advice - update your drivers - is good advice no matter what the error.

[Paul Hexem]

On ‎3‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 6:34 PM, cykarushb said:

no, no, no, no, no ,no just no god no

stop doin that

every god damn post about a bug someone pulls a JIRA from half a decade ago about hardware issues that existed for like 2 days

This is a server issue, the server is not providing textures and you are seeing textureless objects, sometimes theyre pink, sometimes theyre gray.

This has nothing to do with hardware, it is not about an AMD graphics card. Nobody is using the HD 5470 that guy in the notes is using, its unbelievably below minimum spec for this game to even start.

OP's best bet is to clear their cache and let the server re-download all the textures it needs as you go through SL. And i swear to god if someone comes in here and says "clearing your cache is bad for SL" i will throw this PC into orbit and let it return back to earth through their roof.

Ah, yes. The old "It's not my toaster, it's the servers! It's just a coincidence that it's not happening to nVidia users!"

Gotta see them system specs, people.

Edited March 5, 2018 by Gadget Portal

[cykarushb]

9 minutes ago, Gadget Portal said:

Ah, yes. The old "It's not my toaster, it's the servers! It's just a coincidence that it's not happening to nVidia users!"

Gotta see them system specs, people.

Quote

my video and graphics and processor are all rather up there. I can run Second Life on Ultra and keep it there

hmmm, sounds like a 5000 series radeon card to me, no doubt about it

Also the whole "its ATI/AMD hardware causing problems" hasnt been an issue in over a decade. The reason that was a problem for SL users in the early 2000's had to do with the fact that ATI used to make all the dedicated graphics chipsets for consumer laptops, nvidia mobile FX Go stuff was on higher end laptops. For example my Thinkpad T42 from 2004 had an ATI Radeon Mobility 7500 chip in it with a whopping 32mb of vram that struggled with games more advanced than Halo CE.

So all these people didnt have bad hardware, they had just weak consumer hardware. And then it got blamed on ATI being bad because the people who didnt have problems had desktop Nvidia cards. The same issue is in that JIRA from 2012 where someone had a weak mobile GPU that compared poorly to Nvidias options.

Ive seen posts on these forums about people saying AMD cards flat out will not work with SL. Which has just never been the case. And its because the userbase here is generally older and technologically stagnated in the early 2000's when this stuff was still relevant. Right now AMD and Nvidia are pretty much on par with performance tier options, price and driver stability. And honestly thats been the case since the 7000 series cards.

 

21 hours ago, Pamela Galli said:

 You don’t know who you’re talking to. 

Quote

Whirly is very widely respected for a reason.

I dont care how many posts a person has or how well theyre known, the information is plain and simple wrong. Giving someone wrong advice is worse than giving them no advice.

Also unrelated but on the topic of toaster PC's, nobody should be running hardware so old it cant run SL, my computer is from 2006 hardware wise and runs this game pretty well, if someone has performance issues its beyond time to upgrade. My Quadro FX 4600's are in a single gpu configuration on par with HD 520/620 integrated graphics. Nobody should be running less in 2018.

 

[Love Zhaoying]

Imagine a world where programs like SL would run just fine on the same PC in 2005 and 2018. It would mean either: a) the program’s graphics and order features were static/unchanging; b) the program was written for the “least common denominator” of hardware; c) the program had proper controls for backwards compatibility on older hardware (with some feature loss). 

[Whirly Fizzle]

15 minutes ago, cykarushb said:

Giving someone wrong advice is worse than giving them no advice.

At least we agree on something 

OP really needs to post her system information or we are not going to move forward here.

[Whirly Fizzle]

Just to explain a little about what causes the hot pink texture issue.
I'm not a dev so I can only explain in basic terms what's going wrong.

The hot pink colour was added deliberately by LL to textures that produce a shader error - "SH-2700 Fix for random black textures due to texture index out of bounds. Also change shader to show bright pink on index out of bounds and add assertions to help prevent this sort of bug in the future."
Code: http://hg.phoenixviewer.com/phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/rev/063d1be7fec5

Affected textures would never load & LL had to choose a colour to display them as. Hot pink is pretty in your face & makes it obvious what the problem is caused by, rather then choosing invalid grey or black, which could be caused by other things like a poor connection in the case of grey textures.
Hot pink textures generally means the user has to update their graphics driver.

This has also affected Nvidia cards in the past on some old Nvidia beta drivers & it still would happen with Nvidia if the user had an affected card & old beta driver.

Unfortunately some really old laptops that have locked OEM AMD drivers cannot update to a driver version that fixes the problem.
There is another workaround apart from updating drivers or disabling Basic Shaders & that is to set the debug setting RenderMaxTextureIndex  to zero BUT this will cause extreme performance loss.

RenderMaxTextureIndex controls how many textures can be combined into a single batch, so setting it to 0 will effectively give you 50% more draw calls. On systems where draw call overhead is the bottleneck, this can result in a huge performance penalty.
With some older hardware &/or older driver versions, that texture batching isn't supported or is broken

 

20 hours ago, cykarushb said:

Please tell me how this is somehow related to a graphics card from 2012 or really any other old AMD/ATI card that OP clearly does not have when they specifically stated having a decent cpu/gpu and being able to hold ultra settings.

The OP hasn't given system information yet, so we don't know what card they have.
"my video and graphics and processor are all rather up there" doesn't mean anything. I'm not saying the OP has a toaster, but I've seen many Residents say they have a gaming system & when you get their system information, they are, to be blunt, running SL on a toaster.

Of course the OP will have no problems running on Ultra - even with Basic Shaders enabled, their system isn't actually loading shaders so they will have minimal render lag.

Anyway, we need the OP's system information to really know what is going on here.

 

[arton Rotaru]

On 3.3.2018 at 12:34 AM, cykarushb said:

OP's best bet is to clear their cache and let the server re-download all the textures it needs as you go through SL.

 

1 hour ago, cykarushb said:

the information is plain and simple wrong. Giving someone wrong advice is worse than giving them no advice.

Btw. how far did that PC flew? Did it made it into orbit yet? It certainly didn't hit my roof as of yet.

[Whirly Fizzle]

Clear cache to make it fly further

[Love Zhaoying]

2 minutes ago, Whirly Fizzle said:

Clear cache to make it fly further

 

[Bitsy Buccaneer]

This seems like a reasonable place to bring this up - what causes the multi-coloured white-pink-blue speckled textures?

I had problems with them forever ago, then it disappeared until SL got borky recently. I think it's ok again. It was just a couple of textures (in stores which tend to be slow to rez anyway) and not enough of a problem to bother looking into a solution. Graphics card is a GTX 950 M.

[Phil Deakins]

2 minutes ago, Bitsy Buccaneer said:

This seems like a reasonable place to bring this up - what causes the multi-coloured white-pink-blue speckled textures?

Too many whiskeys?

Edited March 5, 2018 by Phil Deakins

[Bitsy Buccaneer]

Alas only in my dreams, Phil.

[Love Zhaoying]

52 minutes ago, Bitsy Buccaneer said:

This seems like a reasonable place to bring this up - what causes the multi-coloured white-pink-blue speckled textures?

I had problems with them forever ago, then it disappeared until SL got borky recently. I think it's ok again. It was just a couple of textures (in stores which tend to be slow to rez anyway) and not enough of a problem to bother looking into a solution. Graphics card is a GTX 950 M.

Did you have the problem less if you reduced draw distance or maximum graphics memory?

[Love Zhaoying]

52 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said:

Too many whiskeys?

Some people may be confused by the concept of “too many” of alcohol.

 

[Whirly Fizzle]

47 minutes ago, Bitsy Buccaneer said:

This seems like a reasonable place to bring this up - what causes the multi-coloured white-pink-blue speckled textures?

I had problems with them forever ago, then it disappeared until SL got borky recently. I think it's ok again. It was just a couple of textures (in stores which tend to be slow to rez anyway) and not enough of a problem to bother looking into a solution. Graphics card is a GTX 950 M.

Speckled rainbow barf textures are usually what a corrupted texture looks like when decode failed.
It can be caused by various things - disk fault on the drive that stores texture cache, not enough free space on the drive that stores texture cache, sharing a cache folder between a 32 & 64bit viewer, sharing a cache folder with 2 different viewers, but most usually these days it's caused by pipelining blowing up.

Certain antivirus software (most notably Webroot) isn't compatible with Http Pipelining & any texture fetched over pipelining will be corrupted.
On viewers that have the Alex Ivy code, Pipelining blows up pretty often, even when not using a culprit antivirus software.

Once a texture is corrupted in cache, you'll continue to see that texture as rainbow barf until you remove it from cache, or it gets removed by the viewer during normal cache clean up.

 

[Lindal Kidd]

1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Some people may be confused by the concept of “too many” of alcohol.

 

I don't know where you got all your emojis, but they are so YOU, and always used so appropriately.