Clothes are not fitting once worn a second time

[Milla Alexandre]

I've been inworld for years, became  paralyzed and now I'm back.  The problem is when I buy new clothes some  don't fit at all while others fit the first time I wear them and then wen I try again fragments are missing.  Has anyone had this problem.

 

p.s. there is no resizing  option for the clothes.

 

Milla Alexandre

[Alwin Alcott]

11 minutes ago, Milla Alexandre said:

I've been inworld for years, became  paralyzed and now I'm back.  The problem is when I buy new clothes some  don't fit at all while others fit the first time I wear them and then wen I try again fragments are missing.  Has anyone had this problem.

 

p.s. there is no resizing  option for the clothes.

 

Milla Alexandre

sounds to me you confuse mesh clothes and layer clothes...

for mesh clothes you need alpha's to hide bodyparts.

[LittleMe Jewell]

For the ones that do not fit the first time you wear them -- they are likely 'mesh' and you need an alpha and also the appropriate size.

For the ones that fit once and then not again - are you sure you're not either chaning your shape or trying to wear a different size than you wore the first time?

[Nalates Urriah]

Things have changed over the years. So, depending on how long you have been gone, doing things the old way will create problems like you see.

There are now different types of avatars in SL. There are two sorts of new starter avatars, one type we have has what we call mesh bodies. The older type we call Classic. There are newer avatars in the Library and signup pages that use the classic and mesh bodies. You won't notice which is which by just looking at the avatar. You'll have to examine the list of what is being worn.

The classic avatar skeleton and skin are the base avatar for both mesh and classic. The classic is likely the type of avatar you are familiar with. They were the first avatars in Second Life.

When using a new mesh body the skin of the classic avatar is hidden behind it. As the classic body will poke-through the mesh body when animated the classic body is hidden using alpha layers.

Classic or System clothes were all we had for years. System clothes are like decals that are painted on the Classic avatar body. In 2013 the Lindens added the ability to create rigged mesh clothing that fits over the classic body. Prior to that, we used Sculpties to make clothes that fit over the avatar body.

Very quickly people began to make better bodies. Now it is very common for the entire Classic avatar to be hidden under rigged mesh head, hands, body, and feet. Mesh clothes are rigged to fit on top of the mesh bodies. There are technical reasons that the clothes fitting over mesh bodies do not always fit well. So, mesh bodies are made with HUD's so that we can make parts of the body invisible, so the body doesn't poke through the clothes.

You can catch up on what has been going on with bodies and clothes by reading the various blogs covering SL. Mesh Body Addicts is a good one to start with. On a more technical level try my blog (see signature) or Inara's Living in a Modem World. Start with articles in 2013.

Welcome back.

[Milla Alexandre]

Thank you, that was very helpful.  I do have a new avatar, shape and skin and the clothes I am referring to fit me the first time, and then when I wear them again ,they don't.

How do I find this alpha /mesh in the clothing?  My avatar is pretty standard, thin body, boobs aren't too big.  I will check for a resizing hud on my shape.

Thank you again.

Milla

 

 

[Milla Alexandre]

22 hours ago, Lillith Hapmouche said:

What do you mean with "new avatar"? An avatar you bought anywhere? Or a premade one from LL's selection? Though it does sound like you might be wearing the old school classic shape without anything meshbody-related...
That's a huge difference, so some clarity will help enormously.

Perhaps you can provide some screenshots for a better understanding of your problem.

Anyway, a shape does not have any resizing HUDs or rather: not any HUDs at all. The very basic body shape can be edited via rightclicking yourself and choosing Edit Shape... or from your "worn" inventory ... or from the outfits menu. That's more or less the skeleton, because it defines your basic form, if you do wear mesh bodies on top of it.
If you don't wear a meshbody, you need to wear an alpha layer, usually included in your clothing purchase. Those layers will blend out parts of the classic shape.

A bought mesh body will usually come with a control HUD, giving you the option to alpha out certain parts, aka making parts transparent. Those bodies can be worn with pretty much all clothing marked as suitable for that body, usually pictured by icons on the vendor image.

There is no "standard" for avatars, even though older mesh clothing tried to establish "standard sizes" from XS to (X)L. But those measurements left out a huge mass of bodyshapes which did not take part in the initial "let's find the standards" survey. Wearing clothing that adjusts to your meshbody does provide much more freedom to alter your appearence. 

 

[Milla Alexandre]

Just now, Milla Alexandre said:

 

Hi Lillith,

Thank you here is a photo of my avatar wearing a bathing suit that clearly does not cover her all the way.  When I got into second life again my avatar was all screwed up.

So I chose a new one, then proceeded to buy a shape and a skin which I am wearing in that photo.  I am very aware of how to change my shape, but I chose to buy one because it was easier.  I did not notice anything about sizes when I purchased my clothes.  I am having the same problem with other items I bought.  They wear perfectly the first time I put them on but the second time as the picture shows, partial clothes.  

 

Thanks Milla

 

[angeoco]

Can you post a much bigger photo please? It's impossible to see any details in that one. If possible, two photos showing the clothes fitting and not fitting.

[Lindal Kidd]

A couple of things about mesh clothing...they've already been mentioned, but I am not sure you caught them the first time around.

As Nalates says, mesh clothes are attachments (like your old flexi skirts), not clothing layers.  As such, they are not affected by by the body shape appearance sliders.  And what's more, they can't be re-sized using the normal SL object-editing tools, either.  So, mesh clothing typically comes in a pack with five or six different sizes, usually XS, S, M, L, and XL.  Wear the one that fits your particular shape best.

Even if the mesh clothing is a pretty good fit, bits of you will poke through, especially when you move...just like your legs used to pass through your flexi skirts.  So, mesh clothing comes with an "alpha mask".  This is a special clothing layer.  In your inventory, it has the symbol of a shirt with a grid pattern on it.  It makes the parts of your body that are under the clothes transparent, so they don't appear to poke through the clothes.

An important point about these alpha masks...very often you will need to wear more than one.  For example, you might need an alpha mask for your shoes, another for your pants, and yet another for your top.  Instead of putting on your alpha masks with the "Wear" command, be sure to right click them in your inventory and choose ADD, or "Add to Current Outfit."  This will let you add the alpha layer, while NOT removing any others you're wearing.

[Nalates Urriah]

I suspect the various answers are adding to your confusion. They are all correct, but incomplete. Leaving you to figure out how to put it all together. I’ll try to bring it together for you.

What we really need to, for certain, understand is a screen-cap of your Appearance-Wearing. This image is from the LL SL Viewer. I’ll use it for explaining.

At the top, you’ll see I am wearing Slink Physique Alpha. Slink is a brand of mesh body parts. Physique is a model of mesh body. The alpha means it is used to hide the classic avatar body to work with the Slink body. The alphs is worn on the classic body. You’ll see I am wearing a body labeled: Slink Physique Mesh Body Original V3.01, near the bottom of the list.

So, you can wear either the classic or a mesh body.

System clothes, those the inventory shows as shirts, pants, socks, etc. all work ONLY with the classic body. All mesh clothes and body parts are shown as ATTACHMENTS. 

When you buy mesh clothes you’ll find they come in different types of mesh. As SL tech progressed we had different ways of making clothes. So, depending on when something was made, it behaves differently.

The two basic types are rigged and not-rigged mesh. Rigging is about placing information in the mesh object that tells each vertex in the mesh which bone in the avatar it is to follow. So, we tell a shirt that some parts follow the upper arm and others the forearm. At the elbows, we mix the percentage of influence the two bones have on each vertex so it looks like an arm being and not a soda straw.

Rigged-mesh cannot be positioned or sized using the viewer build tools. The unrigged mesh can be positioned and sized. Think, hat.

Rigged-mesh comes in 3 flavors. The older mesh comes in Standard Sizes. This is from the era when people changed their shape to fit the clothes. These are still in the marketplace and some people still make this type of mesh clothing.

Next was an intermediate step in mesh evolution, Liquid Mesh. These clothes we made by rigging the mesh to the avatar’s collision bones rather than the basic bones used for animation. This allowed some of the shape sliders in Appearance to affect the clothes. This type of clothing is rare.

Now, most new clothes and body parts are made using a technique we call Fitted Mesh. The Lab decided to provide a complete set of collision bones that were controlled by all the sliders. When Fitted mesh clothes are made the mesh is rigged, sort of attached, to the collision bones.

Mesh clothes can be worn with the classic and mesh bodies. If the classic body is used, you often wear an alpha layer to hide the classic body and avoid poke through. The same is true with mesh bodies, but they have HUD’s that control the alpha layers.

When you show us your worn list we can tell which you need to be using.

These are the basics. I hope, put together in a coherent way.

As to why your clothes fit and then don’t… The answer may depend on which viewer you are using.

Check your viewer stats (Ctrl-Shift-1) to see if you are losing packets.

Make sure you detach any attachment you edit and put them back on before logging off. This forces an update to be sent to the servers. If that is failing, when you put it back on, you won’t see your changes. The problem then becomes chasing the failure to update.

There are other possibilities. But, until we see your WEARING list there is no point boring you with those possibilities.

[Milla Alexandre]

Thank you, that is all very helpful.  I will try to post those images, however I will not be online long enough to do it today, hopefully tomorrow.

[Milla Alexandre]

Just bought this shirt and this is how it appears.  I cannot seem to take a snapshot of the "wearing" window but it shows that I have everything on that came with this shirt.

When I bought the shirt it did not offer sizes, I simply clicked on the board and paid.  The shirt should appear as open but covering my boobs.  I am wearing the "t-shirt" alpha layer and there were only 2 other boxes which I am also wearing.

Does this help you guys?

[Lindal Kidd]

What you call the "T shirt alpha layer" is what ought to be keeping the parts of your body covered by the shirt invisible.  To be sure you actually ARE wearing it, take off just the, um, "boxes", and see if part of your torso is in fact invisible.

The "boxes", by the way, are attachments.  The little box is the inventory symbol for any sort of OBJECT...as opposed to a skin, clothing layer, texture, etc.  In this case, the boxes represent mesh objects that are, or at least may be, parts of your outfit.  NOTE:  Most mesh clothing comes in several sizes, and/or in specific versions for popular mesh bodies like Maitreya, SLink, or Belleza.  Be sure you are only wearing the one that is intended for your body, and that is the optimum size.

If you are wearing a mesh body, the alpha mask layer that comes with the shirt won't affect it at all.  You'll need to use the body's HUD to adjust its alpha masking instead.  If the controls don't let you adjust for a good match with a particular piece of clothing, you may need to either wear something else, or take off the mesh body and go with your classic avatar body instead.

[angeoco]

Since you have a classic body, you need either (1) a standard size (S/M/L) with a matching alpha layer which would hide your boobs and anything else poking through, or (2) fitmesh for the classic body, which would adjust itself to your shape. However, lots of clothes are designed for certain mesh bodies (like Maitreya), which will generally not fit classic bodies properly, and that could be what you have. Can you tell us the full name of your shirt?

Edited August 25, 2017 by angeoco

[Alwin Alcott]

not sure angeoco means also the bodyshape or the sizes for the clothes:

next to the standard sizes for the clothes, also the fitting will be a lot better when also the bodyshape is somewhere close to the standard sizes.

The alpha layer can get a total different result when the body is smaller or larger as what size it's made on.

Free standard sizes for your shape are for free on the MP. ( copy your own shape, than adjust the copy, keep the original so you can always go back when you don't have the result you want.

Edited August 26, 2017 by Alwin Alcott

[Nalates Urriah]

The grab a screen-capture of the 'wearing' panel use the Windows Snipping tool...

Or in the viewer's snapshot/camera click the option to capture the HUD's and UI.

[Milla Alexandre]

I am sorry I couldn't make the picture bigger,  here is everything I  am wearing and the hud that I cannot get into.

[Milla Alexandre]

Just now I logged in, changed my "Kimberly'' shape to the second on the list (there's 3)and the shirt fit!  Now I don't know how to use this hud?  I'm supposed tp be able to change the colors of the shirt.  Any help?

[Nalates Urriah]

I am not sure why you are having so much trouble getting us readable image...

There are a number of free image sharing sites. Many of the SL people use Flickr, which I used for this image of the Snapshot panel. Right-click and open in new tab... takes one to Flickr and the full size image can be downloaded. Other free services are even easier. The red shows the setting that need to change to get an image the size of your full screen. 

Larger images display a bit differently. But, are limited by the forum. But clicking on them allows you to get to Flickr's full size image display. The invisi... com whatever really sucks. I can't even hack the page and get the image...

 

I can't read your list. From the icons in it I can guess you are wearing a mesh body and clothes.

Not being able to read the list I can't tell if the shirt and body are compatible. From the image, they obviously aren't. Changing shape apparently helped the fit. So, the assumption is you had the wrong shape for that shirt. Changing shape and getting a fit brings up the question of whether the shirt is Fitted or Standard size mesh. A Fitted top that doesn't fit a body usually doesn't fit even when shape is changed. The shirt changes with the body to maintain its no-fit... Really annoying. However, the older Standard Size rigged mesh only fits if you do change shape. As you change the body the top doesn't change so, you can achieve a fit.

The HUD that came with the top I assume is the one shown in the image. Click Textures and see what it shows you. HUD's added in a No-Script region, often will not work until you move to a Script-OK region. Even then they may have to be detached and then worn again.

 

[LittleMe Jewell]

42 minutes ago, Nalates Urriah said:

I can't read your list. From the icons in it I can guess you are wearing a mesh body and clothes.

 

From the wrists, ankles and feet in the one image above that we can see, it is a system avatar.

[Milla Alexandre]

Thank you, you both have been very helpful.  I know all about flickr because I used to be on there will my SL pics.  I lost that account because I couldn't remember my old Yahoo log in that was tied to flickr.

Thanks for the tip about the HUD, I will try to find another area to go to that allows scripts.  I usually use a public sandbox when taking pictures to post here.  I will bounce around to see where I can use my HUD.

I am sure I will be back with more questions eventually so stay tuned, ha ha ha.

A lot has changed since my accident in 2010 ... which reminds me, I was verified as an adult and now I am not.  How do I get that done again?  This is the same account I have now.

 

 

[Nalates Urriah]

If you were verified in this account, you should still be OK. You may have to set your preference to see G, M, or A rated content. See Preferences->General. Near the top, "I want to access..."

There is no longer a verification process. They ask your age at sign up and you type it in... that is about it.

[Lillith Hapmouche]

What do you mean with "new avatar"? An avatar you bought anywhere? Or a premade one from LL's selection? Though it does sound like you might be wearing the old school classic shape without anything meshbody-related...
That's a huge difference, so some clarity will help enormously.

Perhaps you can provide some screenshots for a better understanding of your problem.

Anyway, a shape does not have any resizing HUDs or rather: not any HUDs at all. The very basic body shape can be edited via rightclicking yourself and choosing Edit Shape... or from your "worn" inventory ... or from the outfits menu. That's more or less the skeleton, because it defines your basic form, if you do wear mesh bodies on top of it.
If you don't wear a meshbody, you need to wear an alpha layer, usually included in your clothing purchase. Those layers will blend out parts of the classic shape.

A bought mesh body will usually come with a control HUD, giving you the option to alpha out certain parts, aka making parts transparent. Those bodies can be worn with pretty much all clothing marked as suitable for that body, usually pictured by icons on the vendor image.

There is no "standard" for avatars, even though older mesh clothing tried to establish "standard sizes" from XS to (X)L. But those measurements left out a huge mass of bodyshapes which did not take part in the initial "let's find the standards" survey. Wearing clothing that adjusts to your meshbody does provide much more freedom to alter your appearence. 

[Lillith Hapmouche]

 ... what angeoco said... a bigger pic and probably a "worn for the first time" and a "worn for the second time" shot would be immensely helpful.

At least it does seem as if there's no meshbody involved here.

[Lillith Hapmouche]

My first thought: you are wearing mesh clothes made to fit to a mesh body, but you are in the classic shape.
If it was made for a classic shape, chances are very high that you would have received a pack of several sizes, labeled from XS to L.

 

As for the screenshots...
if you take your screenshots using the Screenshot panel, in an area labeled "Capture", you should see a checkbox for "Interface". Check that one and things like your inventory should be included in your screenshot.

Or as an alternative: hit the PRINT key on your keyboard, fire up your Paint or Paint3D pre-installed application on your machine and inside the program, hit ctrl+v. Save that image as JPG and you can directly attach it to your post.