Uploader - physics file ignored

[Anna Nova]

I'm sorry but I am clearly having a bad day.  I built a segment for the cupola of my new build, and made a faces physics file for it.  Using the SL Viewer and the latest Firestorm release, I get the same effect (see I do listen!).  The object .dae is accepted and displays, but the physics .dae, while accepted without error message, is not used - and there is no obvious physics visible in the uploader window.  I tried carrying on, in the hope the phys was actually there, but just not visible, but the upload has no physics and remains a hull.

If I open the physics .dae in the uploader as the object (i.e. on it's own) it looks fine, and I can apply it to itself as physics, and that looks fine.

The object is made in blender and the physics is a simplified version - so planes, not Chic's Cubes.

I have done a cursory look through the secondlife viewer log, but it is all gobblede***** to me.

This hasn't happened to me before, so in desperation, I am asking for help again.

[Zoxin UwU]

Physics was a massive pain in the rear for me work out how it actually works. Have you matched the bounding boxes of both meshes up?

 

 

Edited July 20, 2017 by Zoxin
syntax

[Rolig Loon]

And applied both Scale and Rotation to the model and the physics shape?

[Chic Aeon]

2 hours ago, anna2358 said:

so planes, not Chic's Cubes.

Had to smile at that. While we all know that I am only "learning" about planes physics (baby steps, baby steps) here are a few things to look at just in case.

Object > Transform> Origin to Geometry on BOTH object and physics (I don't think that's it but it CAN cause a lot of odd issues sometimes).

Do NOT analyze the physics if you are using planes

In Planes physics it shouldn't make any difference which viewer (only "Chic's Cubes" physics needs the SL uploader and only sometimes like if you really needed a window type of opening.

What I am wondering about is why you can't SEE the physics model at all. That seems like the key to the puzzle.  Did you try flipping the faces? 

A screenshot of your object and physics file might help us see.

 

Did you CHANGE THE OBJECT TO PRIM IN THE FEATURES TAB?   :D.  We all forget to do that from time to time in the joy uploading and texturing. 

[Anna Nova]

OK, thanks for the replies so far.  I have two objects now that I want to apply the same physics to.

OK some photos.

First in Blender the Cupola physics, camera7, showing that the origin is set at the center, and the rotation, scale and location are applied.

Second, in Blender the Cupola version, same.  I didn't bother with a pic of the Blender for the Cupola without a port - it's identical to the Phys from camera7 although it has all the window detail.

Third, in Aditi (beta) the upload window for the version without the porthole, showing that the physics is accepted.  And next to it the texture final version.

Finally in Aditi, the upload window with the Porthole version, showing that the PHYS has not been applied - uploading works, but there is no prim to switch to.

Just for fun I pushed Analyse, but it doesn't do anything.

So, I tried my trusty BoxPhys ( a box....)  and it won't accept that either.  So it has to be something to do with the dae file of the object itself.

In desperation I tried using the 'high', but got the degenerate triangles.....  The last pic is the objective, but with physics.

Thanks for trying to help.

Edited July 20, 2017 by anna2358
problems with the pictures being reordered by the stupid BB software

[Chic Aeon]

Well I am sure Aquilla would know what's going on  LOL.  BUT that being said. 

I think you might have better luck uploading in more pieces (or as a linkset if that is your preference). The fact that a box won't work as the physics model -- even though you obviously don't want that -- well yes, uploader NOT happy. 

 

So I suggest splitting off the roof from the walls and see if you can get the walls to work (with or without the floor).  My hunch is that the uploader is not happy at all with your porthole LOL. Finicky little uploader. 

 

Personally I would break off the floor, walls, and roof into three separate pieces. That's just me, though but sometimes the more complex the build gets to be the harder it is to get the uploader happy.  

I am really not understanding your physics model though. It doesn't seem to conform to your building (section of wall with roof).  Is there another section for the base part of the build? I see something that looks like a doorway maybe on the right? If there is going to be GLASS in those "windows"? then there is NO reason to have the physics model.

Hopefully someone else will have a great idea, but Immagonnago with the breaking it up into more sections. 

And I am pretty sure -- if I have been understanding anything about planes physics -- that Aquila would say you have too many small planes in that are where the porthole goes though. Do you even need that to be navigable?    

While I don't think it makes any difference (I could be wrong on this) I always have Origin to Geometry because someone smart told me to do that four years ago. I suspect that as long as the origin of the physics matches the origin of the mesh it shouldn't be an issue.

This likely didn't help at all and sorry about that.  Someone else will hopefully see something I did not.

 

PS. And you do know that often you need to click on a build a second time to see the PRIM choice (pretty sure you know that but just putting it in here for others). It is a little pesky, that :D.

Go forth. Solve. Happily I am not having issues today and my bake is definitely done  now LOL. 

 

[arton Rotaru]

I would do pretty much all what Chic said. The phyiscs model does look way too complex to me too.

If you upload more than one object in a single DAE file, your physics DAE must have the same number of physics shape objects as well. A proper naming convention will make sure that the shapes will applied to their visual counterparts correctly.

I also don't understand "having the same phys mesh applied to two different objects". How is that supposed to work?

Edited July 20, 2017 by arton Rotaru

[Aquila Kytori]

 

Hi

 

2 hours ago, anna2358 said:

Third, in Aditi (beta) the upload window for the version without the porthole, showing that the physics is accepted.  And next to it the texture final version.

The screenshot below this quote is showing a physics mesh in the Preview window, 37 triangles.

 

2 hours ago, anna2358 said:

Finally in Aditi, the upload window with the Porthole version, showing that the PHYS has not been applied - uploading works, but there is no prim to switch to.

In your next screenshot the Physics preview window is not showing a physics mesh in the Preview window but still indicating 37 triangles :

 

But both images the Edit panels, Fetures tab are showing Physics Shape Type Prim ?

Any way what I wanted to ask was, How many mateirals do you have assigned to your visual mesh and how many assigned to your Physics mesh.

Having more than 8 can cause the Physics not to show in Physics preview window of the uploader  AND when uploaded you may find that you do not have the Prim option in the list of  Physics Shape Types.

Try removing all but one Material from the visual mesh and ALL materials from the Physics mesh and do a quick test upload like that. 

 

Edited July 20, 2017 by Aquila Kytori

[Anna Nova]

1 hour ago, arton Rotaru said:

I also don't understand "having the same phys mesh applied to two different objects". How is that supposed to work?

same way using the box always works.  If the item is basically a box with lots of surface detail, then the simplified phys is just a box.  In this case the only difference between the two items is the porthole, so the physics that I want is the same.  The two objects are the same size, oriented the same, with the same everything.   The whole thing is going to be way up in the air, so I don't need a collision plane for the porthole.

The lack of an error message is a clear bug.  IMO.

In both cases there is only ONE object in the .dae file, and there is ONE object in the physics version too.  So all the shape object stuff doesn't apply.

[Anna Nova]

Aquila, I think you are a genius, I add a glass material late in the day....  I'll try that tomorrow.

Sorry I left the edit window open in the second shot.  Not relevant.

Many thanks to everyone.

 

[Chic Aeon]

3 hours ago, Aquila Kytori said:

Having more than 8 can cause the Physics not to show in Physics preview window of the uploader  AND when uploaded you may find that you do not have the Prim option in the list of  Physics Shape Types.

You KNOW, I had that in my remarks above but edited it out (I think) as I had already said too much LOL.  And we have said that 8 materials thing so many times .....   So good for you -- if that is it :D.  

 

Edited July 20, 2017 by Chic Aeon

[arton Rotaru]

3 hours ago, anna2358 said:

same way using the box always works.  If the item is basically a box with lots of surface detail, then the simplified phys is just a box.  In this case the only difference between the two items is the porthole, so the physics that I want is the same.  The two objects are the same size, oriented the same, with the same everything.   The whole thing is going to be way up in the air, so I don't need a collision plane for the porthole.

The lack of an error message is a clear bug.  IMO.

In both cases there is only ONE object in the .dae file, and there is ONE object in the physics version too.  So all the shape object stuff doesn't apply.

Yeah well, your pictures weren't all that clear to me. The first Blender pic with the physics shape, the model doesn't look at all like the model in the importers preview.

Maybe I am missing something, but anyway, good luck getting it sorted.

[Chic Aeon]

1 hour ago, arton Rotaru said:

Yeah well, your pictures weren't all that clear to me. The first Blender pic with the physics shape, the model doesn't look at all like the model in the importers preview.

Maybe I am missing something, but anyway, good luck getting it sorted.

Yes, I was there too. Happily Aquila has ESP so hopefully all will be well.  

It's funny really -- and this is a general comment -- most of us have a set way of seeing things and our own "method" (let alone workflow) so it is difficult sometimes to get a grasp on what folks are actually doing or trying to do.  I couldn't wrap my head around the physics model shown and how it related to the model -- hence, I was pretty stuck. 

This isn't JUST a comment on Blender of course 

[Anna Nova]

In the end I changed the whole build.  It turns out impossible to do what I want by dividing the 8 segments vertically, because, as Aquila said, I needed to stay below 8 materials - and that was indeed my problem.  I reformed the full 8 segments, then cut into two horizontally - the Drum part with complex windows, and the Spire with the portholes - this then allowed me to reduce the number of materials in each part.

As it happens this just about halves the LI of the whole cupola and spire, allowing me to add some more details too.   This photo shows the old Cupola (32LI) and the new one with the extra finial (16LI), there are about half the number of triangles in the new physics too.

Sorry my photography isn't so good, especially the screenshots of Blender.

Thank you for all your help.

[Berksey]

Not that you're one of the fleeting ones who posts and runs in the first place, but thank you so very much for posting the resolution to your issues and providing details. It's extremely helpful to others.

Although I model and upload meshes myself, it's still mostly a mystery to me how it all works; the lowered land impact, for instance. I've never understood how making something in more than one piece can lower the land impact, but sometimes it does...

Just trying to make a single item with more than one face is a baby step too big for me at the moment, so good job getting all that sorted. ^-^

[Anna Nova]

1 hour ago, Berksey said:

...

Although I model and upload meshes myself, it's still mostly a mystery to me how it all works; the lowered land impact, for instance. I've never understood how making something in more than one piece can lower the land impact, but sometimes it does...

...

Thanks for the compliment, but it's not justified.  Anything Chic Aeon, arton Rotaru, Aquila Kytory, Chin Rey, and recently Beq Janus, posts is worth a deep study.  There are others, but they helped me recently.

I think it's worth remembering that the up-loader only gives a guide to the eventual LI.  Sometimes when you turn it to prim it is way off.  And the detail is important - which element: Physics, Download, or Server is the dominant, because when you link it's the sum of each - and then the biggest.

My motto: "Just because SL is made from logic, doesn't mean it's logical".  But then I'm made from meat....

[Berksey]

Look closely, it's justified.

You got it working and then ... you actually posted what worked.

That is what made me say it. The fact that you're not one of those people who comes in, asks for help, resolves an issue and then simply naffs off. You share back what you learn, so other people can get something from it.

Thank you for that.

Edited July 21, 2017 by Berksey