Copy/Mod/Trans Permissions, Oh My!

[EllieAnne Silverfall]

I recently opened a store on MP and a market stall in-world to sell the mesh furniture & decor that I have been making. I've been reading and reading the debates regarding copy/mod/transfer and am seeking some sound advice. 

I started selling my items as copy only, thinking there was no need for mod because they were mesh and I wasn't intending to include UV maps and the like. I am making mesh not to be used as building blocks (I may consider that in the future), but to be sold AS-IS. I figure copy let people not worry about losing an item and they could put out as many as they like. I figured trans makes them resell-able and I don't really want that (for collectibles, is fine). Mod I have a hard time with. I get the artist integrity part, but I also get the customers like to mod things part. I want my customers to resize my items as they see fit, but I do scale them to the standard SL scale to start.If I was selling C/M/T then I would just leave them blank and let the consumer do what they want (at a higher rate, of course). As a consumer, when I want to do my own thing, I buy the C/M/T blanks on purpose. I don't buy another object that is already textured with the intent of changing it. I buy it because I like it as is. But, I am not every customer.

As a creator, I don't want to be a sell-out, but I do want my little business to help pay for my SL - I have a full time job, so I don't need it as income. I make the mesh because I enjoy the creative process. If it became a chore, I'd stop. 

Additionally, I am a little confused regarding if trans is required for gifting items, because a friend brought to my attention that my items would work nicely as gifts. 

so, any advice that is constructive would be greatly helpful and I thank you in advance. 

Edited June 28, 2017 by EllieAnne Silverfall
clarity

[ChinRey]

I really would recommend copy/modify for furniture so people can resize the items and maybe also to allow them to change/adjust any animations, sit positions and such.

Copyable, yes, for exactly the reason you gave.

And of course, not transferable, agaibn for exactly the reasons you gave. An item does not have to be transferable to be bought as gifts on the Marketplace or through a vendor system.

[Chic Aeon]

I agree with ChinRey and I sell furniture :D.

Long ago and far away in an SL that is no more, most all of the furniture was no copy. That was the norm. Along the way things changed. I can only speak for myself as both a consumer and a creator. When an item is transfer and it gets lost then the customer will sometimes write and say "hey, I lost the serpentine couch in blue -- can your replace it please?". Now most sellers want to be nice and have good customer service, but how can you KNOW that they actually lost that item; they might just want a copy. So making things copy - no trans solves that problem. Send replacement at ease or use a redelivery terminal. 

As a BUYER I will almost never (sometimes a cute gacha item at the yardsales) buy an item that is no mod. I might want to resize. I might want to TINT (often).  A poll of customers on these forums felt that mod was VERY VERY important. So you will for sure lose customers on no mod items.

You can solve the "pieces" issue simply by uploading the mesh as a single object. Sometimes I do that -- sometimes not. I try not to get paranoid about what folks will do with my items. 

Personally I see no reason to make both copy items and trans items. If someone wants to give an item as a gift they can use the Marketplace OR the "gift" option in your vendor system. I am in the huge minority (oxymoron there) that does not use vendors. I also do not have a RL cell phone (OMG - REALLY?  Really). 

Best of success with your endeavors!

 

 

[tabletopfreak Toocool]

I am having issues with some creatores who won't sell me mod stuff , no mod?? no sale.. we both lose 

[Qa Boa]

Mod or no-mod is relative and depends on the context the way I see it: A vehicle, furniture, buildings, etc.: Absolutely must be mod or no sale.  Some things I'll go for that are no mod, but I have to *really* want it. Most clothing is okay, but I still prefer mod so I can add to it, customize it, recolor it, etc.

BUT here is an abofeckingly definite no sale: No demo? No sale, no way, no how, go jump in the lake. Either provide a demo or a place in the world where I can see it to inspect it. If it's something usable (example: vehicle) I must be able to drive it or otherwise use it. As for no-copy items? I never buy those. Ever.

Obviously, I speak for myself, though I do suspect I also speak for the majority of others who have been in SL for more than two or three years. Just been burned way too many times.

[Pamela Galli]

I have an issue with creators who don’t make pink clothes, because I only like pink. I will not buy anything not pink. No way. Just forget it. No sale!

 

And when I accidentally buy not pink clothes on MP, I leave a one star review because it is not pink.

Edited December 16, 2017 by Pamela Galli

[EllieAnne Silverfall]

1 hour ago, Qa Boa said:

Mod or no-mod is relative and depends on the context the way I see it: A vehicle, furniture, buildings, etc.: Absolutely must be mod or no sale.  Some things I'll go for that are no mod, but I have to *really* want it. Most clothing is okay, but I still prefer mod so I can add to it, customize it, recolor it, etc.

BUT here is an abofeckingly definite no sale: No demo? No sale, no way, no how, go jump in the lake. Either provide a demo or a place in the world where I can see it to inspect it. If it's something usable (example: vehicle) I must be able to drive it or otherwise use it. As for no-copy items? I never buy those. Ever.

Obviously, I speak for myself, though I do suspect I also speak for the majority of others who have been in SL for more than two or three years. Just been burned way too many times.

I agree demos are important. I'll demo hair, clothes, skin, heads etc. before buying. Furniture - I'd prefer to see it in-world before I buy it - to try it, if it is scripted or has poses, or to see how it actually looks. I've decided to make all of my items Copy/mod, but I don't supply UV maps and such at this time. If I was going to go for full perms, then I would. If someone wants to re-texture it, by all means... but it'll lack the AO. Want another look that I didn't provide? it's easy - contact me and I'll work with you. I've done that once already. I customized one of my pieces for a customer and she was thrilled with the result. I wasn't even going to charge her for it, but she insisted on paying me any way. I think the most I'd charge, if ANYTHING on a texture mod would be whatever it cost for me to upload the textures. But, rather, I see doing it free as a customer service, since the item was already purchased with the original texture. 

I have a retail business (cars) in RL and we always go above and beyond for our customers, which has won us awards for customer service. word-of-mouth goes a long way. Not sure how far it goes in SL... but my SL store is more of a hobby anyway. 

[Zii Minotaur]

On 17/12/2017 at 4:14 AM, Pamela Galli said:

I have an issue with creators who don’t make pink clothes, because I only like pink. I will not buy anything not pink. No way. Just forget it. No sale!

 

And when I accidentally buy not pink clothes on MP, I leave a one star review because it is not pink.

But if the clothes had modify permissions, you'd be able to tint them pink!

[EllieAnne Silverfall]

@Zii Minotaur you might need a lesson in sarcasm. 

[bigmoe Whitfield]

if it's no copy, No sale, if it's no Mod, No sale.  IF you do not provide a demo, No sale. if you go "COME TO OUR STORE TO GET THE DEMO" no sale.  I'm not going all over kingdom come to go find a demo, one stop shopping. 

[EllieAnne Silverfall]

@bigmoe Whitfield are you talking clothes/hair/skin? I sell home goods - do you expect me to offer a demo of those other than in-world?

Edited December 18, 2017 by EllieAnne Silverfall

[Sassy Romano]

3 hours ago, EllieAnne Silverfall said:

@bigmoe Whitfield are you talking clothes/hair/skin? I sell home goods - do you expect me to offer a demo of those other than in-world?

No reason why not, same principles apply - additional rotating demo prim etc. Although you'd need to make the demo no mod, don't forget that part!

[bigmoe Whitfield]

7 hours ago, EllieAnne Silverfall said:

@bigmoe Whitfield are you talking clothes/hair/skin? I sell home goods - do you expect me to offer a demo of those other than in-world?

Home goods need demoed in my house before, I buy them.  I'm not visiting your store where I have to only view them there because "I only have them in a rezzer system" which is fail,  now placing them on the marketplace, where I do all of my shopping and setting the demo correctly, I do not need copy perms on a demo...  mod maybe, depending if I need to jam a cabinet where it dont shine.   but demos are very important to me to have, I do not buy at all if their is no demo on your marketplace page.   btw if your items come no copy and no mod, it's a no sale for the items that are not demos.   it's simple. 11 years here.  I refuse to lose no copy items.  and no mod is just very one sided on the creators part. 

[EllieAnne Silverfall]

@bigmoe Whitfield First, all of my items are copy/mod. Second, it's one thing to need a demo to make sure that clothes will fit your shape (mesh) or if you will like how a head/body looks before buying, or checking that a skin is how it looks in the picture and how it looks with your shape. But those are things that are hard to get a sense of without a demo. Furniture, on the other hand, can be demoed very nicely in-world and you don't need a demo in your own home to see if it "fits". Maybe I don't shop enough, but I don't know of a single SL home goods store (or jewelry, for that matter) that provides demos you can buy to try. If you prefer shopping only on MP, more power to you. I like shopping MP because it's easy to search. But, If I'm worried about how a piece of furniture looks or operates, I have no issue TPing to the store from MP to do so. It's not like I have to waste gas to get there. But, alas, to each their own - and you can't please everyone (I'm not going to kill myself trying).

[bigmoe Whitfield]

1 hour ago, EllieAnne Silverfall said:

@bigmoe Whitfield First, all of my items are copy/mod. Second, it's one thing to need a demo to make sure that clothes will fit your shape (mesh) or if you will like how a head/body looks before buying, or checking that a skin is how it looks in the picture and how it looks with your shape. But those are things that are hard to get a sense of without a demo. Furniture, on the other hand, can be demoed very nicely in-world and you don't need a demo in your own home to see if it "fits". Maybe I don't shop enough, but I don't know of a single SL home goods store (or jewelry, for that matter) that provides demos you can buy to try. If you prefer shopping only on MP, more power to you. I like shopping MP because it's easy to search. But, If I'm worried about how a piece of furniture looks or operates, I have no issue TPing to the store from MP to do so. It's not like I have to waste gas to get there. But, alas, to each their own - and you can't please everyone (I'm not going to kill myself trying).

everything I buy I make sure has a demo on the marketplace. if you do NOT offer demos on mesh clothing, you can seriously kiss half your sales goodbye, I'm not buying on a whim, and I'm not going to travel to get it. 

[EllieAnne Silverfall]

19 minutes ago, bigmoe Whitfield said:

everything I buy I make sure has a demo on the marketplace. if you do NOT offer demos on mesh clothing, you can seriously kiss half your sales goodbye, I'm not buying on a whim, and I'm not going to travel to get it. 

I'm not talking about mesh clothing (I think I already said that mesh clothing, skins, and bodies/heads should need a demo product). I'm talking about furniture and decorative items.

In regard to mesh clothing: personally, as long as the mesh clothing includes a fit for Maitreya, I'm not to worried about a demo unless it is relatively expensive. But, that's me; I don't have time to try a demo for every piece of clothing I buy, but I'm lucky enough that if I waste a little L on something I hate, I just shrug it off and stop buying from that designer. Most of the time I'm only disappointed in stuff I didn't pay much for, so no big deal to me. 

Building/selling mesh furniture/decor items in SL for me is a hobby. I have a business in RL that is stress enough. If my SL business becomes too much work, I'll pack it in. So, I'll do what I have time for, and that does not include MP demo items for home furnishings, especially when I have demos in-world. If I've lost your sale and the sales of others like you, I'm sad for it, but I'll live. 

Edited December 19, 2017 by EllieAnne Silverfall
typos