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How does your avatar look today ?

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2 minutes ago, kiramanell said:

Okay, now I'm dying of curiosity. :) How did all y'all get that mirror thingy working?! Mine never do that! 😛 Did I miss a memo or something?!

   There are a few different methods to do 'mirrored' shots. Unfortunately, there's no such thing as a 'working mirror' in Second Life - with the exception of SL water surfaces, that with some specific water WL settings turn into blank mirrors.

   So the first method is to use actual water as the mirror, by turning your entire scene and subject onto its side, and either rolling the camera (only works in certain viewers, like Black Dragon) to shoot at that angle, or by shooting it on the 'wrong' axis and then turning the picture right way up.

   The second method, which is my preferred one, is to pose in front of a mirror - but turn the mirror into a green screen (a full-bright, blank prim). You then shoot the picture from two opposing angles in relation to the camera position and mirror surface, and layer the two pictures and mask the green screen.

image.png.bfc5b5c22c5a3ebb1fc4055ae272b0d0.pngBlue: subject. Green: Mirror. Red: Camera 1 & 2. Note that the wall is transparent on the 'outside'.

   In this particular shot, though, I'm guessing that Angelina is using a mirror backdrop. Such backdrops are specifically designed to make it look as if you're viewing into a mirror from a first person view, this works for as long as there's only one view of the subject visible.

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2 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

And one thing I definitely don't need to double is double or triple my shopping!

I have an alt originally created for building and running a store that I recently decided to update.  She had very few clothes and an outdated static mesh head.  It's not just the 25 bucks for a head but also the hours spent trying to make a shape that is unique to her and I'm still not happy with it. 

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2 hours ago, Orwar said:

I think it's an interesting history around the acceptance of breasts.

It's a very interesting history, and one that I actually don't know enough about. Most of my understanding of the evolution of cultural attitudes towards breasts is derived indirectly from reading literature, rather than from sociological, historical, or anthropological studies. And then there's the question of how they were perceived in non-Western cultures.

And the whole thing is complicated by the fact that women, every bit as much as men, are susceptible to the influence of culturally-determined attitudes. And that would very much include me. For instance, I have no intellectual problem at all with a woman walking down the street without a top, just as men sometimes do now . . . but it would certainly startle me, and I know I'd be wrestling with the conflict between my ideological stance, and my socially-conditioned shock.

And even in SL, where the breasts aren't "real" . . .  I am uneasy about displaying too much boob even here, and frequently throw on a tee, camisole, or jacket when wearing a dress or top that seems particularly risqué. There are reasons for that beyond social conditioning (I don't like the way in which skimpy clothing is sometimes read by people), but there's no question it's also about that. And if I could do topless shots here, I likely wouldn't . . . at least, not very often. I have no topless shots on Flickr, for instance, where I could put them if I wanted.

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5 minutes ago, kiramanell said:

 

Ooo, that's pretty clever. :) Thx. And LOL @ 'smoke and mirrors.' 😍

In some shops and other locations, they use the same trick to make the floors look reflective/extremely shiny - the floor is semitransparent, with the whole shop replicated upside down/mirrored under the floor...

Take a look at this shop if you want to see an example of this: http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Penumbra Republic/133/132/501

Much work for quite a suttle effect...

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2 minutes ago, Angelina String said:

In some shops and other locations, they use the same trick to make the floors look reflective/extremely shiny - the floor is semitransparent, with the whole shop replicated upside down/mirrored under the floor...

Really?????? Not only is that a ridiculous amount of work (and would presumably contribute to lag), but it also wouldn't mirror the avatars walking across the floor. Seems like a lot of effort for a pretty flawed effect.

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Just now, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Really?????? Not only is that a ridiculous amount of work (and would presumably contribute to lag), but it also wouldn't mirror the avatars walking across the floor. Seems like a lot of effort for a pretty flawed effect.

   If it's a mesh set, you can just build it to duplicate itself below the floor surface in Blender. If it's prims, just select all the prims, create a copy and rotate it and position it.

   And yes, the effect is flawed - unless you, again, take two shots, one where you actually flip your avatar upside down below the floor, and layer the two shots.

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13 minutes ago, Rhonda Huntress said:

I have an alt originally created for building and running a store that I recently decided to update.  She had very few clothes and an outdated static mesh head.  It's not just the 25 bucks for a head but also the hours spent trying to make a shape that is unique to her and I'm still not happy with it.

Yes indeed. I've been updating Laskya (who actually already owned a fair amount in the way of mesh clothing, albeit early mesh) very gradually, and using relatively cheap mesh body parts. This may be why she's looking a bit resentful in my pic.

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2 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Really?????? Not only is that a ridiculous amount of work (and would presumably contribute to lag), but it also wouldn't mirror the avatars walking across the floor. Seems like a lot of effort for a pretty flawed effect.

Yes, really :D

Snapshot_2733.thumb.jpg.abbe5c453eba2e728e93b45f865ebf84.jpg

Look at this :D

 

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The trouble with Alts is that they demand in world time and Lindens...…….and they are never happy!!!!!  9_9

SL43.png

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3 minutes ago, Orwar said:

create a copy and rotate it and position it

Ah, but unless you have a perfectly symmetrical build, that wouldn't actually mirror it. You'd have to reverse the orientation of the stuff underneath,

I had this problem when I put my handbag on the counter in my pic: I had to reverse the angle and, although you fortunately can't see it because the sink is in the way, it was imperfect because I couldn't mirror the way the purse strap was lying.

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43 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   There are a few different methods to do 'mirrored' shots. Unfortunately, there's no such thing as a 'working mirror' in Second Life - with the exception of SL water surfaces, that with some specific water WL settings turn into blank mirrors.

   So the first method is to use actual water as the mirror, by turning your entire scene and subject onto its side, and either rolling the camera (only works in certain viewers, like Black Dragon) to shoot at that angle, or by shooting it on the 'wrong' axis and then turning the picture right way up.

   The second method, which is my preferred one, is to pose in front of a mirror - but turn the mirror into a green screen (a full-bright, blank prim). You then shoot the picture from two opposing angles in relation to the camera position and mirror surface, and layer the two pictures and mask the green screen.

image.png.bfc5b5c22c5a3ebb1fc4055ae272b0d0.pngBlue: subject. Green: Mirror. Red: Camera 1 & 2. Note that the wall is transparent on the 'outside'.

   In this particular shot, though, I'm guessing that Angelina is using a mirror backdrop. Such backdrops are specifically designed to make it look as if you're viewing into a mirror from a first person view, this works for as long as there's only one view of the subject visible.

 

Thanks for the detailed explantion, Orwar. :)

Best I ever managed was enabling an (experimental?) option in Firestorm, called  Screen Space Reflection. It really looked awesome on one of my concrete floors (but it really only works on floors). Sadly, though (and slightly to my annoyance, I must admit) they removed that option again. Step in the wrong direction, IMHO.

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53 minutes ago, Orwar said:

The second method, which is my preferred one, is to pose in front of a mirror - but turn the mirror into a green screen (a full-bright, blank prim). You then shoot the picture from two opposing angles in relation to the camera position and mirror surface, and layer the two pictures and mask the green screen.

The really difficult part of this procedure, at least for me, is always getting the right angle and distance from the subject/"mirror." For one of my earlier mirror shots, I went so far as to create long thing prims that traced sight lines, so that I could accurately reverse angles and establish a camera distance that would effectively reproduce the slightly smaller image you'd see in the mirror (because of the distance between subject-mirror-camera).

Waaaaaaaay too much work.

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2 minutes ago, kiramanell said:

Best I ever managed was enabling an (experimental?) option in Firestorm, called  Screen Space Reflection. It really looked awesome on one of my concrete floors (but it really only works on floors). Sadly, though (and slightly to my annoyance, I must admit) they removed that option again. Step in the wrong direction, IMHO.

   It's not that 'we' don't know how to make reflections, it's an issue of how things are rendered in SL. Back in the early 2000's, many computer games had reflective mirrors in them. The issue is that SL is rendered from what is in front of your camera view. If you look into a mirror, you're looking into a space which is not rendered. In a game where assets and textures are pre-loaded and cached from area to area (i.e. games with 'cells' separated by loading screens), this works pretty well - in a world where you couldn't possibly cache all assets and textures, and instead render based on what the client is looking at, this becomes a lot more difficult.

1 minute ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

The really difficult part of this procedure, at least for me, is always getting the right angle and distance from the subject/"mirror." For one of my earlier mirror shots, I went so far as to create long thing prims that traced sight lines, so that I could accurately reverse angles and establish a camera distance that would effectively reproduce the slightly smaller image you'd see in the mirror (because of the distance between subject-mirror-camera).

Waaaaaaaay too much work.

   When I've done it (I can't say 'usually' as I've done like 3 photos using the technique), I've just free-handed it. I don't know how many times I've posted this picture in this thread (I should make a new one!) but this was done using that setup, with a one-way transparent wall and eyeballing the mirrored shot.

 

The Catoptromancer

   Theoretically (I think) you could also make two prims to represent the cameras and position them using the grid to match them ... Again, though, I'm script blind: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetCameraParams

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Orwar said:

Theoretically (I think) you could also make two prims to represent the cameras and position them using the grid to match them ... Again, though, I'm script blind: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetCameraParams

Yeah, actually I've tried something like that too. You'd theoretically want to catch both horizontal and vertical axes though, unless your shot was perfectly (or close to perfectly) level. In the shot I mentioned above, the pic was from a ceiling-mounted "security camera," so it became really complicated in that regard.

Coincidentally, I took a quick look last night at the feature in FS's Developer's menu (I think?) that displays camera parameters. I suppose some very clever soul could probably produce a script that would automate the procedure of placing the camera appropriately, depending on inputs.

Any volunteers?

 

ETA: Pretty sure, looking at it now, that I got the camera angle in this new pic wrong. Oh well.

Edited by Scylla Rhiadra
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Posted (edited)

I'm feeling like a shadow of my normal self today...

Snapshot_2742_p.thumb.jpg.704d9a77fd210957cb49caa7fce4ac18.jpg

Edited by Angelina String
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1 hour ago, Orwar said:

   It's not that 'we' don't know how to make reflections, it's an issue of how things are rendered in SL. Back in the early 2000's, many computer games had reflective mirrors in them. The issue is that SL is rendered from what is in front of your camera view. If you look into a mirror, you're looking into a space which is not rendered. In a game where assets and textures are pre-loaded and cached from area to area (i.e. games with 'cells' separated by loading screens), this works pretty well - in a world where you couldn't possibly cache all assets and textures, and instead render based on what the client is looking at, this becomes a lot more difficult.

 

Orwar, I was specifically talking about Screen Space Reflection (SSR, for short), a graphical option, which existed in Firestorm, to create reflective floors. Fortunately, I still found a screengrab of it (see below). As you can tell, it turns the floor into a true reflective surface. I understand wall mirors aren't currently possible, but it's a real shame they removed this effect:

 

Skyhomes.thumb.jpg.b113185ca3f323cf14cfdb2463407a03.jpg

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I went out hunting earlier and found a nice campfire, which gave some nice highlights and shadows without messing around...………...

I'm addicted to dressing up like all the Newells……..😜

SL07.png

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, TatianaNikolay said:

Ready to go to work.

Work Day.png

 

Lovely! ❤️ I especially like how you placed yourself against that "M E" text in the background. So artsy!

Edited by kiramanell
Will I ever make a post without typos?!
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Daisy...…..Pfffft! that's nothing...…..

I went out hunting earlier, and on a beach sim, I found a cave with bats, and couldn't stop myself taking a picture...……………………...

I'm also addicted to dressing up like all the Newells……..😜

SL09.png

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3 minutes ago, DaisyJohnnson said:

I went out hunting earlier and found a nice campfire, which gave some nice highlights and shadows without messing around...………...

I'm addicted to dressing up like all the Newells……..😜

SL07.png

 

Sweet! And, for some reason, I got an incredible Tombraider vibe from this. 😍

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3 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Ah, but unless you have a perfectly symmetrical build, that wouldn't actually mirror it. You'd have to reverse the orientation of the stuff underneath,

I had this problem when I put my handbag on the counter in my pic: I had to reverse the angle and, although you fortunately can't see it because the sink is in the way, it was imperfect because I couldn't mirror the way the purse strap was lying.

There is a trick to getting the mirror image for various shots. It is based on the aspect of SL that renders only one side of a surface. Whether cubes or mesh you can use this aspect to get your mirror images. With a cube you use clear textures on one side of the cube. This can be done with a wall to create a sort of one way mirror effect for walls. Mesh is naturally transparent from the back side.

Mirror_002Comp.thumb.jpg.a30afe0f733539e118527f4ec04eb9b3.jpg

Because the wall and mirror in the backdrop are mesh it was easy to move the camera behind the mirror and take the shot. From the back they are both invisible.

I have a green screen skybox room with walls and floors that transparent from the outside. To get a reflection in the floor I can move the camera under the room take a shot. I have to think about camera angle and placement and sometimes it takes a couple of tries.

Nal-XMas2018_007.thumb.jpg.eaa686a87a9949d30f26e9e2d6c9d09f.jpg

The green makes it easier to clip me out of the background. The floor is messed up in this shot... that ceiling made a shadow across to floor. :/ 

The room does not have to be green. (Green-Screen is the name used for the concept. Green is also generally a good general purpose color.) Because I am wearing red, green is ideal. If I were wearing blue yellow walls would be better. If you IM in world I'll give you an LM to the skybox so you can see how it is made (2 hollowed cubes).

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8 minutes ago, Nalates Urriah said:

There is a trick to getting the mirror image for various shots. It is based on the aspect of SL that renders only one side of a surface. Whether cubes or mesh you can use this aspect to get your mirror images. With a cube you use clear textures on one side of the cube. This can be done with a wall to create a sort of one way mirror effect for walls. Mesh is naturally transparent from the back side.

Mirror_002Comp.thumb.jpg.a30afe0f733539e118527f4ec04eb9b3.jpg

Because the wall and mirror in the backdrop are mesh it was easy to move the camera behind the mirror and take the shot. From the back they are both invisible.

 

Love it! ❤️ Creating  a depth-chamber behind the mirror, as it were, to kinda get the 'reflection' to angle along with you (can you use 'angle' as a verb? Oh well, too late: I already did *g*), is actually a pretty clever idea! Thanks. :)

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14 minutes ago, Nalates Urriah said:

The green makes it easier to clip me out of the background. The floor is messed up in this shot... that ceiling made a shadow across to floor. :/

   If you make it fullbright, no shadows can be cast on the surface of it and makes the entire screen a consistent green.

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