Jump to content

Premium reservations: In case you missed the news post.


You are about to reply to a thread that has been inactive for 1407 days.

Please take a moment to consider if this thread is worth bumping.

Recommended Posts

It makes sense.  If there are 110 people on a sim and 10 non-premium members leave, their spots can only be taken by premium members.  The ratio of premium to non-premium will change.  I still don't see it being that big of a problem.  No event stays at capacity forever.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 179
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

/me pops the popcorn  While there will be people who go to the extreme for the drama of virtual goods,  I believe most won't notice.   Premium members who pay a monthly fee to SL keep t

You forgot, "This parking lot is full except for these spaces reserved for handicapped people." Aren't you going to complain about that?

I'm just going to jump in here and say that the important thing is that, clearly, no one heard me say BREEDABLE SHOES, they EXISTED! Pffft.

@Cinnamon Mistwood I agree Cinnamon. I really think this isn't going to change a whole lot in the grand scheme of things but it is a signal that LL knows that events are a big part of the current SL culture for a lot of people and its a good thing IMO for them to create perks centered around popular activities or necessities. At the end of the day more premium members benefits all of us.

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, HarrisonMcKenzie said:

Will it though? I don't remember reading that in the blog post. How will non-premium players be forced out of Sims when the non-premium cap is still 100%? Why would there be a disproportionate amount of premium players or any lasting once the area is no longer full?

Right, non-Premiums won't get pushed out of a sim when it passes the capacity threshold into "only Premiums admitted" -- but once it gets into that range, no non-Premium will get in again until demand gets back down below threshold. Suppose that takes a few hours, during which the non-Premiums have all finished shopping, all replaced by Premium members. The demand falls below threshold and some non-Premiums are again allowed in, but starting at 100% Premium (and still adding new Premiums along with the non-Premiums) it will take a while before some "normal" balance returns -- assuming demand doesn't bounce back past the threshold again.

Clearly there are many variables that can determine how large an effect this will have. Just in passing, I mention "still adding new Premiums along with the non-Premiums" above because it's one aspect of the system that delays restoring "balance": there's no waiting queue. That is, it's not like a busy TSA line at the airport where they let those on departing flights go ahead of others and the others stay in line, and the line is slightly shorter without those selected passengers. There's no such line, so when both Premium and non-Premiums are being serviced again, the system will not have a batch of waiting non-Premiums who'll get ahead of any Premiums who arrive later and get added to the end of the queue. There is no queue, so the new Premiums have the same likelihood of access as the non-Premiums who were denied entry before, for however long.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 16.4.2017 at 0:04 AM, Qie Niangao said:

But if demand ever creeps into the 10 reserved slots, those 100 slots will not be as available to non-premiums as they were before. No non-premium will get in again until demand from premium users falls below 100.

Yes, of course. For non premiums its alot more difficult to hammer yourself into a full sim. That seems to be a problem for some or even many people. So LL made a reason for the shopaholics to become premium. Mission accomplished :D

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Nova Convair said:

Yes, of course. For non premiums its alot more difficult to hammer yourself into a full sim. That seems to be a problem for some or even many people. So LL made a reason for the shopaholics to become premium. Mission accomplished :D

If the sim is full, it will not be harder, but simply not possible at all to "hammer your way in", or in other words, try to teleport in and try your luck.

When a sim is at full non-premium capacity +1, then no non-premiums can enter until there are basically no premiums anymore that also want to enter (and bump the sim to +1)

 

As far as tp hammer goes, there are people that try to enter a sim for several hours (6-8 from what i've heard) for popular events, before being able to get in in the first 3-4 days. This Premium VIP line means that there is effectively zero chance of getting in until the event starts falling in popularity. Lets not forget, that popularity breeds popularity. It's the frenzy that keeps the frenzy ongoing.

 

So if locking basic accounts out of popular events first days, and deterring tp hammer is part of the point of this change, it might very well succeed.

It'll be interesting though to see what happens with the events popularity once they become a premium walled garden. Maybe that's how the full sim problem gets sorted out in the end. Not sure if the event sims will be stoked at falling public interest and less sales tho.

Edited by Lexbot Sinister
Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say that I don't understand what all this fuss is about. I've never been to the sort of event that's being talked about here - new hair and such - and I never will. What I don't understand is why some people find it matters so much to get in and get the latest hair. Will it be better than the hair you've got? Maybe, but probably not. It'll probably be just another design. If the hair is acquired at the event, nobody will notice. Nobody will say, "Wow! Where did you get that gorgeous hair? It's much better than anything I've ever seen". If it really is better, it's no big deal to wait a few days for it. If it's an 'event only' model of hair, then it's not good enough to sell in the store, or it would be sold later. So why does getting into such an event matter so much?

Other types of event may be different, of course. A popular entertainer could well fill a sim so that Basic fans can't get in, but some Premium fans can. That would be different. It's things like hair and fashion that I fail to understand the urgency for.

Edited by Phil Deakins
  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, HarrisonMcKenzie said:

Will it though? I don't remember reading that in the blog post. How will non-premium players be forced out of Sims when the non-premium cap is still 100%? Why would there be a disproportionate amount of premium players or any lasting once the area is no longer full?

It works like this ... first no one sets a full sim at max because after about 40 people the whole thing lags and becomes difficult to move.  So the cap is set lower.  usually 40 but could be more or less.

With a limit set of 40, the last 4 slots are reserved for premium accounts.  So when the gun fires and the sim is opened up, 36 people can enter the sim and then 4 more premium members.  That's a heavy load.  in a few minutes, a couple of people TP out leaving 38 people in the sim and 2 open slots that can only be used by premium members.  If someone leaves every minute then that leaves the one open slot which can only be filled by a premium member. 

What if there are no premium members trying to tp in at that time?  Then the vacant slot sits empty until one does.  A minute passes, another person leaves and 2 slots are left open for premium members.  At this point there are 38 people on the sim so the extra is for premium only..  Two more minutes go by, two more people TP out and the 4 open slots are "the last four available" so no basic account can come in yet.  Oh, but now more premium members are tping in and fill up those empty slots.

This can go on as long as there are premium members wanting to enter.  As people leave this opens up more "last 10%" room for Premium members to fill.  As long as the server population never drops below 90%, only premium members will be able to enter.  For every premium account that leaves, a premium account enters for no net change.  For every basic account that leaves a premium account enters resulting in a higher percentage of premium accounts..Eventually all of the first 36 people will leave but for everyone that does, they can only be replaced by a premium account as long as the total population is 36 or more.

 

What is the percentage of premium members across the grid anyway?  I don't have a clue.  If it is sufficiently low that there is not enough demand for the final open positions then I don't see this being a problem at all.  I hope that te powers that be have chased these numbers around to have a good idea what will happen before now.

Hope springs eternal.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

@Rhonda Huntress Your logic is sound but your basics aren't :)

The limit is increased by 10%, so your example sim that is full at 40 avatars, can still hold another 4 premium avatars. When it gets below 40, basic avatars can get in, until it reaches 40 again, when only premiums can get in until it reaches 44.

Edited by Phil Deakins
Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Lexbot Sinister said:

accounts out of popular events first days, and deterring tp hammer is part of the point of this change, it might very well succeed.

It'll be interesting though to see what happens with the events popularity once they become a premium walled garden. Maybe that's how the full sim problem gets sorted out in the end. Not sure if the event sims will be stoked at falling public interest and less sales tho.

Ah yes,the old Yogi Berra quote: "Nobody goes there anymore; it's too crowded."

Most of the really popular events are already running mirror or cam regions, and you've said yourself that there's no problem accessing events if you take in the entire length of the run.

If someone's so needy that their self-worth depends on getting into an event right when it opens they might as well pay for it.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

@Phil Deakins This is Second Life, the land of limited-edition breedable gachapon houseplants. Any expectation of rational commerce is unfounded.

Certainly that's all the more reason not to take any of it seriously. This isn't like the moral equivalent of making tax laws more regressive, the current RL fashion. So it's not important, but it might nonetheless be interesting. For example, here's another possibly unintended consequence: if the change is successful in recruiting more Premium members, the benefit simultaneously loses value for the Premiums (because they'll be competing with more of their kind) and becomes more onerous for non-Premiums (because they'll spend even more time excluded by the expanded crowd of Premiums). I don't think I recognize this economic effect, where there's no apparent trend to equilibrium but rather ever increasing pressure to decrease utility. 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said:

@Rhonda Huntress Your logic is sound but your basics aren't :)

The limit is increased by 10%, so your example sim that is full at 40 avatars, can still hold another 4 premium avatars. When it gets below 40, basic avatars can get in, until it reaches 40 again, when only premiums can get in until it reaches 44.

In my example I was assuming the land owner had set the max to 40.  When it reaches 36, it can only be accessed by premium.  When it hits 40 it is full and no one enters --  with the exception of the region owner.

  • The current (owner controlled) limit on each region will automatically be reserved for Premium entry by the same bonus %:
    • If the owner of a Full Region had reduced the default 100 avatar limit to 50, the same bonus percentage (+10%) is reserved for Premium entries, so 45 entries will be usable by Basic members, and 5 additional spaces will only be available to Premium members.
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

@Phil Deakins This is Second Life, the land of limited-edition breedable gachapon houseplants. Any expectation of rational commerce is unfounded.

Oh God. Please tell me someone is making breedable houseplants.

To those who keep saying the sky-prim is falling, it really isn't. The unending wave of premium players teleporting into events is going to last... exactly how long? An hour? Two? I highly doubt that increasing capacity is going to have the weeks long effect people are somehow coming up with. It's not going to take any longer to get into a popular event than it does now. Can we please stop thinking the sky-prim is falling, relax for 5 minutes, and see how ridiculous this discussion is? Capacity has increased, not decreased.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2017-04-15 at 9:14 PM, Theresa Tennyson said:

You forgot, "This parking lot is full except for these spaces reserved for handicapped people."

Aren't you going to complain about that?

I don't know how it works where you're from, but at least here, handicap spaces are only given to those that need them the most.

Obviously, nobody complaints about that. Nobody is handicapped for fun.

But maybe where you're from, handicap spaces get sold at premium, and nobody even blinks at that?

 

I hope this isn't the first step in making basic accounts into second hand residents.

What SL needs is more residents, paying, non-paying to chat with, any type of live bodies on the grid in order to keep the economy going.

People with a stuffed wallet and willingness to pay find SL desolate and boring. This is where all these pesky basic accounts come in.

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, HarrisonMcKenzie said:

Please tell me someone is making breedable houseplants.

"I'm a mean green mother from outer space and I'm bad."

 

Forgive me if I came off as sounding like I am saying the end is near.  Changes excite me and I am looking at possibilities that I want to pick at, test and abuse just to see what happens..

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah yes, Rhonda. I see it now. I'd only read the top part of the page, and I knew that private regions could set the limit up to 100. So I assumed that stayed the same and that another (premium-only) 10% was added.

But it's not my fault, Guv. Whoever wrote the page did not take in to account that I might read it. I'm innocent 9_9

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Lexbot Sinister said:

I don't know how it works where you're from, but at least here, handicap spaces are only given to those that need them the most.

Obviously, nobody complaints about that. Nobody is handicapped for fun.

But maybe where you're from, handicap spaces get sold at premium, and nobody even blinks at that?

 

I hope this isn't the first step in making basic accounts into second hand residents.

What SL needs is more residents, paying, non-paying to chat with, any type of live bodies on the grid in order to keep the economy going.

People with a stuffed wallet and willingness to pay find SL desolate and boring. This is where all these pesky basic accounts come in.

 

My point was directed at someone who was complaining about things being empty because they were reserved at all. Handicapped spaces aren't sold, but parking spaces are reserved for customers and employees of businesses all the time.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

This is fantastic... Three pages on and the pro-premium apartheid supporters are still so busy dancing their victory dances that most of them STILL haven't actually read the official announcement all the way to the end. 

They didn't see the part where if the 'population cap' is reduced from the default, then the reserved spaces are DEDUCTED from the revised cap.

They claim that there's no need to worry about non premiums being driven off the land they rent because of premium tourists next door, but, in the FIRST thread on these forums about this (yeah this isn't the first) THESE same people claimed it was "good for landowners" being kept off their land by armies of "filthy free to play people".

We see guys, a segment of the SL: population that traditionally, simply don't shop, wondering why people would have problems about not being able to get into shops or shopping events.

The assumption seems to be that there are a few dozen or maybe a few hundred shopping types on the grid.

Something like the Hair Fair, will run 4 sims, at a capacity of 45 or 50 each, fairly solidly, almost 24 hours a day, for a couple of weeks, so that for those who can wait, it's often a case of waiting till the final 2 or 3 days.

Let's give the guys a taste of the kind of numbers we're talking about here, ONE Shopping Group for keen bargain hunters, has increased from 20k members to about 90-100k members in the last 3 years, so while SL declines in general, and 2/3rds of the Madlands lie empty, abandoned to Gov. Ebbe, shopping seems to be thriving. These people don't WANT to only shop on the MP, they want to shop in world where they can SEE others wearing the products and moving around, rather than peering at bad preview pictures, where they can see other shoppers and ask where they got some item.

And some buffoon has come up with a "hella kewl" plan to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs that fund the tier that keeps the grid open. Apartheid...

Sorry Customer, this customer parking is reserved for customers who are members of the Elite, you are the wrong (colour / gender / nationality / height / social class / whatever - delete as applicable) to park here, but feel free to put your money in an envelope and post it to us.

There was a comment earlier in this thread about how this will be good for small clubs based on Homesteads because they can squeeze in 2 more customers.

What happens to the Store that resides on a homestead sim, that loses a big chunk of it's customers because they can't get in to that popular and crowded store any more, because they are "F2P peasants from the islands", and yes I have a real store in mind, shoppers are fickle, if they cant shop at one place, they shop elsewhere.

There won't be much outcry at first, because the single announcement in a place most people never look at, coupled with the gradual rollout, and the essentially subtle nature of this thing, means most people simply won't KNOW why they can't get into a store, or an event, or a fair, or a club or a concert. But eventually it will become known and it will be another reason for people to give up and move on and take their cash with them.

You madlanders want to know how this ends, look at the madlands where you live, look at all those empty plots of yellow mapped mainland, that nobody buys, because most of the people looking for somewhere to live or work in SL are forbidden to buy mainland. That's where your segregation leads, you've killed the mainland, now you want to kill the islands.

Good plan...
 

Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, Klytyna said:

Let's give the guys a taste of the kind of numbers we're talking about here, ONE Shopping Group for keen bargain hunters, has increased from 20k members to about 90-100k members in the last 3 years, so while SL declines in general, and 2/3rds of the Madlands lie empty, abandoned to Gov. Ebbe, shopping seems to be thriving. These people don't WANT to only shop on the MP, they want to shop in world where they can SEE others wearing the products and moving around, rather than peering at bad preview pictures, where they can see other shoppers and ask where they got some item.

Because a region running near its maximum avatar load performs smoothly, with objects and avatars appearing almost instantly. Walking is lag free, scripts run efficiently without pauses and timeouts, and the shoppers enjoy witty banter and share useful tips with all the people around them.

 

Oh, wait...

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Klytyna said:

Something like the Hair Fair, will run 4 sims, at a capacity of 45 or 50 each, fairly solidly, almost 24 hours a day, for a couple of weeks, so that for those who can wait, it's often a case of waiting till the final 2 or 3 days.

Like Phil, I don't understand why anyone would care about getting something later rather than earlier. Must be more to it than we are aware.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

@Theresa Tennyson I agree! When an event first starts up its new cycle it is a miserable shopping experience. I go to get what I need and the get out of there asap!

It is really stupid that a region owner or estate owner couldn't enter the region if it was full. This is a positive change! Even most popular games allow an admin to gain access to a full server they moderate.

Link to post
Share on other sites
You are about to reply to a thread that has been inactive for 1407 days.

Please take a moment to consider if this thread is worth bumping.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...