Are European Visitors on Decline

[DarkRavenWolfie]

6 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

To be honest Linden Labs policy of the L$ Not being real Currency, more like Play money is open to dispute, because in every game I have played, be it WOW, SWTOR, Dark Orbit, Battlefield 3-4, Penny Dreadful and most Android for Phones or  used on Blue stacks through the Google Play store are set prices every month. Linden Labs float the L$ against real time Market rates, hence in my opinion that makes it a bona fide Virtual currency. Why its linked to The finance markets I have never known, because Lindens have always maintained this a GAME, not a Financial Business Model or has any sort of official standing in World markets. 

 

Lindens do themselves no favours by still not setting land or parcel Tiers at a frozen rate. That would help struggling people, who live in areas with economic uncertainty's. Perhaps If Lindens froze Their L$ rate without floating it against real currencies or a couple of years, More Euro residents like from UK and Greece, and other countries struggling to cope, maybe could at least have a chance of their virtual little stores to survive. LL fail to recognise that  CA is a state which probably has the highest Real Estate prices, High tourism, Actors and Rich Sporting heroes living there make CA One of the Richest Areas of the world, but They seem to forget, 90% of the worlds population live in tiny apartments, small terrace houses, and Not the huge Mansions that exist in CA and surrounding states, that benefit form CA's massive income. Don't forget CA also makes nearly 1Billion$ income PER year from legalised Cannabis Taxes and sales tax rather like Colorado that returned figures much the same for 2015................Nearly all European Cities are stubborn to legalise it and benefit from Millions of Euro's or GBP from its sales.  So, really CA lives in its own rich Bubble, many Sims are turning the SL Map ever more yellow or abandoned land, left empty because Their previous owners haven't the disposable income any more that we enjoyed pre 2011. Lets not forget, that terror attacks, like life , still goes one, But does have an impact on peoples security & that does have a negative impact on the worlds markets.

Financial markets hate uncertainty, and if Russia and the US get into the so called Proxy war over Syria, Wall Street and London to name a few, could see a financial collapse of the like not seen since the 1900's. Already today China and Japan, ( I note Toshiba) is to be sold off and broken up, leaving thousands with uncertainty if there going to go back to work in  the morning. All these factors have NEVER been taken into consideration by fat cat Executives of Linden labs living in sprawling Mansions with swimming pools, that most us could only dream off. In the end LL will pay a heavy price for being  complacent and not changing its pricing policy to most of the mainline gaming Companies, that don't use their game coins or jewels currency as a means to make even more Money. L$ is outdated, unfair game money, that should not be floated to make easy money, its like LL is playing the stock market, To me thats not a GAME as LL says, it is not a game, it a business financial Structure made to maximise LL profits, the insane 10L charge to upload one image should be abolished, as that's just A punitive exploitation of residents who. like me, have to upload a lot's of images for store photo Sets, slide shows, media presentations and lots more.

As an example last June 2016 My 65k Blakes Sea Airport Land cost me £49 a week. After Brexit, the next weeks Tier had shot up to £55. I , on a state pension along with the wife, had to let my Friend take it over, as it just wasn't possible to cope with a £6 rise a week, even after that, my friend had to give it up last month, as we are both Brits and lots of renters were Brits, hangers started to go empty, flights became none existent, and even though I helped out with some tier for her, by renting a parcel for my HM Coastguard station and vessels, She sold the Sim, she had taken a year to buy, because she was losing money, by the tiers not covering the outgoings..... LL maintenance policy which I always think is illegal. You buy a car its yours. You buy 65K land for £900 it still not yours, LL creams money from a maintenance charge. They dont need that, they have enough income coming in  already.  Its little wonder old 2005 bugs still remain, still no seamless oceans to sail or fly in, Abandoned land is never put up for sale like it should be, leaving huge swathes  of Governer Linden land devoid of residents.  Thats some Governor, who cant be bothered to put the abandoned land up for sale  as soon its been vacated??

SL needs to downgrade to a normal game platform, most newcomers I have met recently are leaving after a couple of weeks because, now the mentors are no longer, (which I was one and A mentor in the old urban combat sims,) because, most  go about Second Life, trying to work out what a ban line is or an orb,( cant understand why they being chucked out of sims)  and group and land and media is far over complicated, for gamers used to just putting a disc in the PS4 tray or playing a hi graphic Online game like "Revelation", which I have just started playing, and spent no money on it so far. "Crowfall", a new game that I was a fund raiser for, as some Second Life residents Like the "Chung" family were in the staff of making it, has failed to to open on  time, because of various issues, pushing back the release date and that's also losing funding backers unless its team open it soon, and millions of $ or GBP already pledged by myself and others, may have to call for refunds if it fails to launch.

oh well. time to shut up!!, and pull down my new cinema complex, as 5 people a week only visit, no tips no visitors, waste of weekly tier money and classified advert cash if I have to fund the whole parcel & advertising. The time is ripe for Lindens to introduce a monthly sub to access SL, like Star wars the Old Republic. In my opinion this needs doing to verify age, because there is some Vile places around, which in the UK that are actually illegal to look at or interact with, like Zoophlia doggy stuff. Thats illegal in the UK wether its virtual or not. Lindens should be concerned about making a family orientated SL instead of bizzare sickening adult places which gives SL a bad name like in the Sky News reports os some years ago. Thank you for the comments, but seems the answer lies in Lindens hands to make this a better, less complicated and affordable place to enjoy.. Micha

After Note: (One poster mentioned new Avatar and clothing. I still have a classic Avatar as born in 2007, I dont understand mesh and all these new heads and layers, but one club actually ejected me for not wearing an appropriate Avatar and mesh clothes, talk about giving newcomers a chance? owners of clubs must be on drugs to eject avatars just because there not using a Maitreya shape and skin...)   at my age I do not understand layers and alphas, but to remove a visitor for using his original clasic avatar just pushes even more people away.....as Spock would say. "Its Illogical"...??

 

 

 

a monthly fee is not going to happen, since that would scare away people even more

Family oriented SL you say? yeah because we all know how went it well for IMVU when after having more than one very much scanty ads thry decided to make everything family friendly and people howling about how their Acces Pass is basically worthless because even the so called adult places dont have enough adult content

 

Reality of fact is: sex sells, whether you like it or not.

 

"it a business financial Structure made to maximise LL profits,"

 

welcome to capitalism pal, well companies dont work exist for rainbows and sparkles

 

" LL maintenance policy which I always think is illegal. You buy a car its yours. You buy 65K land for £900 it still not yours, LL creams money from a maintenance charge. They dont need that, they have enough income coming in  already."

 

Remember that little thing you agreed to upon signing  up just like all of us called Terms of Service? Yeah, if you dont like its conditions you are free not to use it.  Not sure if you believe in some sort of word magic but calling random things illegal because you dont like them doesnt make it that way

 

 

" and pull down my new cinema complex, as 5 people a week only visit, no tips no visitors, waste of weekly tier money and classified advert cash if I have to fund the whole parcel & advertising. "

 

And just because things dont work out all that well for you they should radically system something that so far seems to be working out rather well.  That makes a whole lot of sense doesnt it?

 

The equation here is dead simple: vote with your wallet, dont buy Linden Cash, dont buy premium sub if you are unhappy with their service.

 

 

[DarkRavenWolfie]

4 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

yes Marigold Bots are giving a false visitor numbers, I own two of my own, they not there to push real visitors up, there there to provide entertainment for visitors, to be served by Daniel Craig or pay Stephanie 1L to peel off her pole dancing clothes. As second life as a Hobby, well, I got involved with Aviation in SL  many years ago.    I fly Virtual Airbuses IN Flight Sim x in real time, with actual real time procedures, and Air traffic control interaction. My Hub is Manchester Airport. I have an addon, that looks jut like the real Airport.  I fly to many European cities with Nice and Monte Carlo being my favourite destinations, I used to have a mock up cabin of an A320 in a box room, with panels which was physical, meaning to raise the landing gear, you have to pull the lever on  the panel to do so.  I Love flying in SL, apart from ocean sims not being seamless. LL refuses to make oceans seamless, And I have argued for the case many years. I used to own two 65k lands . For my British Airways complex over two sims, based on BAA land (British Airways Authority). But before LL upped the land fees the two combine lands only cost me £40. a week. But offset by £20 of that being income from fliers renting hangers and tie downs.   We had more income then,  and still ran a car as petrol was still relatively cheap. However since becoming disabled with crippling Arthritis, and now I have a suspicious  tumour plus other ailments you get when you approach 66, I don't really have a life any more, except on the computer, and Second Life as it says, allows you to do things that are impossible in real life.  The problem for us, is the Government changed lots of rules on changes to benefits we used to get. We have to pay council tax now, which pensioners were exempt from up to now.  Also because of my needs we moved into a warden controlled large sheltered 34 apartment building 40 miles away which is safer for us both, in  case I take a fall. Although some charges we dont have to pay here, we have to find £36 a week towards the rent here,because of housing benefit has been capped.... so both combined our two weekly pensions have been robbed by nearly £60 a week .  So for me, making themed sims is part of my life, I manage to use photo shop Elements 11 to make textures and posters. SL is a Hobby I used  to enjoy. An admin, a moderator, a diplomatic officer in GOR and Urban combat leader.

So I really felt in those days I was contributing a lot to the Second life community. However residents just dont seem to realise how much work and cash goes into an entertainment centre just for them. My streaming Hoster to deliver HD720 cinema quality videos on the HD VEA setup, cost me another £15 a month.  But when only 5 people visit for 10 minutes, leave without putting some Lindens in my donation jar,  It says to me, residents have no idea how much it costs to give them what they want.. They except everything to be free, thats not possible to sustain, Im not a charity after all. I am a creator (typical Gemini), but creators are not getting the financial reward for their efforts. only the Mega Sim renters make an actual living from SL. maybe quite a few clever people who understand How to build a mesh item from one those external software programs, make good money from clothes and sophisticated yachts and Airliners. Unfortunately I only know about Analogue equipment, bought up without internet and DAB radios and electronics. I ran my own garage business for 23 years before my back started to go, but Now I have no idea how modern cars work, because all the vehicles i worked on up to 1987 were simple to repair. Like escorts, Mini Clubmans, Hilman Avengers and Cortina's plus all the vans, like Transits, HA Vauxhall vans, and Commer vans the post office used. If i was maybe 20+ odd years younger, I may have got training into the digital Era, and making my own mesh models to make and texture, sadly that is beyond my capabilities, I am a mechanic, A VHS recorder Engineer for some years, so for me, SL has become even more technical , and these new avatar types, I really have no idea how to use them. I used to have 60-70 friends in SL. now I have but 10, with all my other residents long gone, which is sad.

 

 

 

last time I checked donations jars are usually meant to be donations. Why dont you make a paywall if you want to get cash so badly instead of yelling at people that they arent generous enough, like seeesh.

 

You also dont seem to realise something: your visitors dont owe you jack*****. You likely dont want to hear this but thats the truth.

"ut creators are not getting the financial reward for their efforts. "

 

Then dont put all your eggs in one basket then.   You know, this reminds me this whole debacle with youtube monetisation and youtubers crying who somehow thought that the gravy train will be going on forever without stopping. Well thats sadly not how things works

 

People still havent learned anything from history, from the Dotcom bubble burst.

Remember that Linden Labs is not your boss nor are they obligated to make sure that you can draw a profit from their service.

 

 

Some people really desperately need a reality check

Edited April 11, 2017 by DarkRavenWolfie

[Phil Deakins]

3 hours ago, DarkRavenWolfie said:

Michaelatv said: My streaming Hoster to deliver HD720 cinema quality videos on the HD VEA setup, cost me another £15 a month.  But when only 5 people visit for 10 minutes, leave without putting some Lindens in my donation jar,  It says to me, residents have no idea how much it costs to give them what they want

The problem I see with that statement is that, if what you offer is actually what they want, they would stay longer than 10 minutes.

SL is a hobby to you, and the SL hobby does cost many or most people real money. It's simply a case of what you can afford to pay each month for the hobby. If it's difficult to afford what you do now, then the sensible thing to do is scale back to lower the costs so that you can afford the hobby. Then, if the hobby is something that has donation jars, any income from that is a bonus. People can't be expected to tip/donate just because the venue they are at costs the owner money. That does happen, of course, but it needs regular and somewhat loyal customers. Probably, even then, the owners are losing money each month, but keep going because it's a hobby they enjoy, and enjoyable hobbies are always worth paying for.

ETA: I quoted the wrong person. He'd quoted the correct person, and I took my quote from his quote. So I've added the correct person's name in blue.

Edited April 11, 2017 by Phil Deakins
correction

[Michaelatv Destiny]

Well, all I can say to posters who disagree, is that Second Life as far back as when I joined in 2007, the slogan was "Come to SL and make a real life income"!!    10 years later and 37,000 items later and a conservative amount of £2,600 spent, I would say LL owes me something for my investment.  In 2008 when I first got taken on  to be a dancer I had nothing to my name, no payment on  file, a Noob, but  after a while, I learned some basics of interacting with customers, and I still remember the American guy who popped in most evenings, and always paid me 500L tips....this allowed me to buy my first dance hud, and together with more attractive clothes, I was raking in a nice 1000L a week. In further years, I became A dance manager for a  very busy German Shemale club, I got paid for my work, and worked with the girls training them in the etiquette of pole dancing. My weekly income then was around 2000L$ a week.  Then all that went pear shaped when LL upped the land rates, and literally overnight all the best clubs, the best Jazz themed sims just collapsed into empty sims, and SL after that was never the same again. Most girls tip jars I see now are empty, me and my manager made sure our dancers were given a start, the owner gave me 1,500L$ each day, and when I was on  duty, I had to fill the girls tip jars we employed, (10% of there takings) with 100L$ each to start them off.

Also the free money ball I had to put 500L in to last the night. We are supposed to be better off, since 2007, but In today's Second life making a SL living from dancing or club ownership now, seems to be impossible because people are so tight, for one reason or another. yes Phil, thank you for your input in the thread, I found in 2007-11 we had loyal customers you saw and talked to every night,and weekends were packed, that we had lag with 25 people in "jellys" club. and when I danced with the girls as well, which I enjoyed,  I never went home empty handed. it depends on the definition of a hobby in Second life. I was in it at first to make money as the slogan said, but later went on building courses, and how to form groups and  how to set up a hippo box. Think Im just grouchy that people want,  but dont want to give in appreciation, that seems to be the world over now, "something for nothing"? I mean i give people the latest interactive massage tables, a secondary screen, so they can still watch while under a sun bed, but I just dont get SL now, people seem to be forever flitting to one place and another like a fly on heat, not staying even to take a proper look round to see what the owner is offering. I see it as just lack of traffic. IE lack of resident numbers against a lot of places trying to get the most punters. I remember the Pandora Sims, I still own many animals and an Ikran, plus all the beautiful flowers and shimmering carpets of grass, that you saw in Avatar. but at 7000L$ a week for a homestead rent, to make another Pandora I and a friend used to run, I know we would be losing money left and right, because there is no way to recover 7000L$ to cover a weeks tier from a themed sim like that, but the cost to make it, including 500 hours, and between us around £200 in items, we leant the hard way that Second Life doesn't pay, or live up to its famous slogan, "Come to SL and make a real life Income", whatever happened to that?

[Alwin Alcott]

6 minutes ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

 whatever happened to that?

you keep talking about ten years ago.. you still play SL on your IBM?... if not, try also to follow SL on the trip it made to 2017

people change, worlds change... now you seem also have to change..

dont blame the traffic or people, come up with ideas from now to catch people. There are enough places who dó manage to get their tiers and profits.

[Pamela Galli]

2 hours ago, Phil Deakins said:

The problem I see with that statement is that, if what you offer is actually what they want, they would stay longer than 10 minutes.

SL is a hobby to you, and the SL hobby does cost many or most people real money. It's simply a case of what you can afford to pay each month for the hobby. If it's difficult to afford what you do now, then the sensible thing to do is scale back to lower the costs so that you can afford the hobby. Then, if the hobby is something that has donation jars, any income from that is a bonus. People can't be expected to tip/donate just because the venue they are at costs the owner money. That does happen, of course, but it needs regular and somewhat loyal customers. Probably, even then, the owners are losing money each month, but keep going because it's a hobby they enjoy, and enjoyable hobbies are always worth paying for.

Just want to point out that the text you quoted and are replying to is misattributed. Not your fault.

[Phil Deakins]

Thank you for that, Pam. It was my error and I've edited the post so that the correct person is seen.

[DarkRavenWolfie]

7 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

Well, all I can say to posters who disagree, is that Second Life as far back as when I joined in 2007, the slogan was "Come to SL and make a real life income"!!    10 years later and 37,000 items later and a conservative amount of £2,600 spent, I would say LL owes me something for my investment.  In 2008 when I first got taken on  to be a dancer I had nothing to my name, no payment on  file, a Noob, but  after a while, I learned some basics of interacting with customers, and I still remember the American guy who popped in most evenings, and always paid me 500L tips....this allowed me to buy my first dance hud, and together with more attractive clothes, I was raking in a nice 1000L a week. In further years, I became A dance manager for a  very busy German Shemale club, I got paid for my work, and worked with the girls training them in the etiquette of pole dancing. My weekly income then was around 2000L$ a week.  Then all that went pear shaped when LL upped the land rates, and literally overnight all the best clubs, the best Jazz themed sims just collapsed into empty sims, and SL after that was never the same again. Most girls tip jars I see now are empty, me and my manager made sure our dancers were given a start, the owner gave me 1,500L$ each day, and when I was on  duty, I had to fill the girls tip jars we employed, (10% of there takings) with 100L$ each to start them off.

Also the free money ball I had to put 500L in to last the night. We are supposed to be better off, since 2007, but In today's Second life making a SL living from dancing or club ownership now, seems to be impossible because people are so tight, for one reason or another. yes Phil, thank you for your input in the thread, I found in 2007-11 we had loyal customers you saw and talked to every night,and weekends were packed, that we had lag with 25 people in "jellys" club. and when I danced with the girls as well, which I enjoyed,  I never went home empty handed. it depends on the definition of a hobby in Second life. I was in it at first to make money as the slogan said, but later went on building courses, and how to form groups and  how to set up a hippo box. Think Im just grouchy that people want,  but dont want to give in appreciation, that seems to be the world over now, "something for nothing"? I mean i give people the latest interactive massage tables, a secondary screen, so they can still watch while under a sun bed, but I just dont get SL now, people seem to be forever flitting to one place and another like a fly on heat, not staying even to take a proper look round to see what the owner is offering. I see it as just lack of traffic. IE lack of resident numbers against a lot of places trying to get the most punters. I remember the Pandora Sims, I still own many animals and an Ikran, plus all the beautiful flowers and shimmering carpets of grass, that you saw in Avatar. but at 7000L$ a week for a homestead rent, to make another Pandora I and a friend used to run, I know we would be losing money left and right, because there is no way to recover 7000L$ to cover a weeks tier from a themed sim like that, but the cost to make it, including 500 hours, and between us around £200 in items, we leant the hard way that Second Life doesn't pay, or live up to its famous slogan, "Come to SL and make a real life Income", whatever happened to that?

 

 

Please tell me your not seriously piggybacking a 9-10 years old statement

 

[Klytyna]

I've fought the urge to comment on this thread but... I can't resist any longer...

This thread is a classic example of "Second Wave Lastnamer Entitlement Syndrome".

Back in the Glory Days of the SL Gold Rush, when the population mushroomed like mad, making money in SL was EASY!. Stand at an info-hub, rez a hat, pull out a prim violin and 1 hour of noises that sound like a cat trying to go to the toilet through a sewn up bumhole, hey presto you made 2,000 ls in tips!

Bad news, it's not 2007 any more.

I've seen too much of this, a DJ who demanded 1000 appearance money, PLUS a contract stating that if the host we were supposed to provide didn't squeeze 2000 per set for him out of the audience, we had to make good the short fall... We told him the current year and hired somebody younger & smarter.

Yes, back when SOME people DID make an RL living from SL, I knew one quite well, his SL business paid for 2 full regions, and payed for his RL, his SL business WAS his RL job. Not any more though, he refused to move with the times, refused to make appliers because he didn't like the shape of the women wearing 'fake boobs', refused to make mesh in standard sizes because he didn't like the sizes. His business is an empty shell now, drifting at the back end of the MP where nobody ever looks.

The OP's business model screams "out of touch", why would I pay to watch their preferences in porn on a prim tv in SL, if I wanted to watch porn, I''d log out, open my web browser and find my own porn. Why would a bot bartender that looks like some actor ( a bit, in bad light, if you squint) or a pole-dancer bot that loses it's clothes if you drop a linden in its slot, attract me to stay in what is essentially a tomb/museum dedicated to something thats gone and dust.

People tipping pole dancers want LIVE pole-dancers, actual humans at the keyboard, and they tip a damn sight more than a linden.

I was particularly amused at the implication that somehow, people collecting a share of the 500 ls placed in a "free money ball" would tip more than they recieved.

The OP complains that people "flit about" in SL now instead of visiting their parcel and staying. Well yes, people flit about, they tp away from places they find boring or dull or pointless. Don't stay long enough to see what you offer? Maybe you are offering the wrong thing or offering it badly.

But no, your plan worked in 2007 when SL was filled an almost endless supply of noobs walking lopsided from the weight of their wallets, so it has to work now right?

The OP talks proudly of making 1000 ls a week dancing back in the glory days when money grew on LL trees, that makes me laugh, 5 years ago, when all the oldies were stating that SL was almost dead, dancers at one adult club thats still open and still crammed most nights, expected to make 1000 ls an HOUR, so even then, in 2007, your product was apparently somewhat lacking.

Lastly, the OP has complained that they don't have the same kind of disposable income to squander in SL that they did "back when"... Heads up, neither does any one else. That's one of the biggest blows to SL's service sector over the last few years, people generally have less money to spend in tip jars for places that don't give them what they want.

I find it ironic that somebody complains of SL today being a "something for nothing " culture, while expecting to make a comfy living for offering nothing that anyone wants anymore..
 

[Misty Selentiak]

Might be timezones, cos i keep meeting Europeans and fellow Brits lately  Been on here a long time and i have noticed more from Austrailia too

[Phil Deakins]

12 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

Well, all I can say to posters who disagree, is that Second Life as far back as when I joined in 2007, the slogan was "Come to SL and make a real life income"!!  

You are misunderstanding what that slogan actually means. Making a real life income doesn't mean being able to live on it. I merely means taking some real money out of SL that you can use in RL. That's how I read it, anyway. Quite a number of people have made enough money from SL to actually live on it, and a great many more have, and continue to have, an RL income from SL, although not enough to quit their day jobs. Some only a little bit, but it's RL income just the same.

 

12 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

10 years later and 37,000 items later and a conservative amount of £2,600 spent, I would say LL owes me something for my investment.

I completely disagree with you. £2,600 spread over 10 years = £260 a year = approximately £5 a week. That's what you've paid for your hobby. You've obviously enjoyed your hobby or you wouldn't have been doing it for 10 years, and £5 a week on average is a very small amount to pay for an enjoyable hobby. Do you honestly think that LL should have spent their own money to support your hobby for free? If you do think that, why do you think it?

Imo, £5 a week is a pittance to pay for an enjoyable hobby, so LL owes you nothing. Not only that, but you didn't pay your £5 a week to LL, so they didn't get most of it, but still you continue using theirs. Other users got most of your money. I might have been one of them   Your reasoning doesn't hold up imo.

ETA: Just one more thing. You used the phrase, "... for my investment". You haven't put any 'investment' into your SL experience. You've been paying for your hobby, that's all.

Edited April 12, 2017 by Phil Deakins
addition

[Michaelatv Destiny]

Well  not to worry Guys I already had 12 weeks of a taste of the Second Life that is not the Second Life I knew and loved. I already pulled out and left.

Sorry you dont like my comments, but Im just an old codger missing the Sixties , where I would happily transport back to any time.

 

farewell and have a great Second Life, what ever is left of it. :))

[DarkRavenWolfie]

55 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said:

You are misunderstanding what that slogan actually means. Making a real life income doesn't mean being able to live on it. I merely means taking some real money out of SL that you can use in RL. That's how I read it, anyway. Quite a number of people have made enough money from SL to actually live on it, and a great many more have, and continue to have, an RL income from SL, although not enough to quit their day jobs. Some only a little bit, but it's RL income just the same.

 

I completely disagree with you. £2,600 spread over 10 years = £260 a year = approximately £5 a week. That's what you've paid for your hobby. You've obviously enjoyed your hobby or you wouldn't have been doing it for 10 years, and £5 a week on average is a very small amount to pay for an enjoyable hobby. Do you honestly think that LL should have spent their own money to support your hobby for free? If you do think that, why do you think it?

Imo, £5 a week is a pittance to pay for an enjoyable hobby, so LL owes you nothing. Not only that, but you didn't pay your £5 a week to LL, so they didn't get most of it, but still you continue using theirs. Other users got most of your money. I might have been one of them   Your reasoning doesn't hold up imo.

 

it seems to me that OP is in desperate denial

[Phil Deakins]

12 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

I was raking in a nice 1000L a week. In further years, I became A dance manager for a  very busy German Shemale club, I got paid for my work, and worked with the girls training them in the etiquette of pole dancing. My weekly income then was around 2000L$ a week.

Crikey. L$2000 a week? You were easily pleased lol. I used to make over L$60,000 a day! - well over a million L$ a month. That's around £3000 a month. I wasn't in the sex business, or anything remotely related to it. And still it was just a hobby.

But L$2000 a week in your good times doesn't amount to the LL quote you posted, about making an RL income from SL. It doesn't even amount to pocket money. And yet 10 years later, you complain that LL owes you something because of that quote. Why didn't you complain at the time you were making the tiny L$2000 a week. LL wasn't living up to your understanding of that quoted statement, so why wait until 10 years later?

Edited April 12, 2017 by Phil Deakins

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, Phil Deakins said:

. £2,600 spread over 10 years

i can only dream about it been only this amount... and many others i think ..

a sim .. 295 monthly... ten years ...i don't even want to see that amount!!....lol

/me pulls hairs out

[Phil Deakins]

LOL. That made me chuckle, and, as a reward, I won't do the sums or post the total for you

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, Phil Deakins said:

I won't do the sums or post the total for you

around 36k 

... i don't regret it, i still love SL  .. and it would have been spend on other things anyway... so why not at SL .. it brought good friends and great experiences

[Klytyna]

2 hours ago, Alwin Alcott said:

around 36k 

... i don't regret it, i still love SL  .. and it would have been spend on other things anyway... so why not at SL .. it brought good friends and great experiences

This is exactly the point...

Too many people in the last 10-15 years have started seeing hobbies on line, as some kind of part time job, where if they don't make as much in the game selling 'rare items' as they make flipping burgers at Col. Mc Kings Arkansas Grilled Turkey-Ham Nugget Burgers ( "So fresh the turkey-pig doesn't know his nuggets are gone! Look for the Golden Haunches sign in your town!" ) then they start to whine about how their VIP membership fee for an MMO is an "investment" or doing insane attempts to establish a conversion rate between an imaginary in-game currency earned for doing missions and the USD, and claiming that thei *should* charge a million "gold pieces" for the "Sword of Noobness" because thats equal to the hourly rate they earn at the burger bar times the hours they spent kicking orcs to get the sword.

Some of us "play games" for fun, to be entertained, to enjoy the company of others, long may that continue...
 

[Marigold Devin]

11 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

Well  not to worry Guys I already had 12 weeks of a taste of the Second Life that is not the Second Life I knew and loved. I already pulled out and left.

Sorry you dont like my comments, but Im just an old codger missing the Sixties , where I would happily transport back to any time.

 

farewell and have a great Second Life, what ever is left of it. :))

I've been out for 24 or so hours and the thread has certainly become a bit fiery - but we did have some fun (and we still DO have some fun).

I'm an oldish codger too - not missing the 60s perhaps (54 in real life), and still occasionally dipping into Second Life on a banger of a Windows Vista computer (aaaaaarggghhhh!!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!). (Using it now to type on this thread, and its perfectly adequate for that.)

So flippin' what. I thank my lucky stars for any little bonus, appreciate what I am able to have, and really try not to be frustrated by what I simply cannot have. (I chucked all my dolls out of the pram a l-o-o-o-ong time ago).

We all have to make of things what we can, and its ok to yearn for the "good old days" even if some of them weren't so great.

You're bound to get differing opinions on a Forum, @Michaelatv Destiny That is the nature of the beast.

 

 

[Marigold Devin]

8 hours ago, Alwin Alcott said:

around 36k 

... i don't regret it, i still love SL  .. and it would have been spend on other things anyway... so why not at SL .. it brought good friends and great experiences

All in all I think I broke even over the entire time I've spent in Second Life. I had a cute little job as a "newspaper" columnist early in 2008 and that paid for my rent and furniture and some pretty things, then I got into buying and selling land for a while, which made a tidy profit, but that caused me to lose time for exploring, and exploring was always what I enjoyed the most, and the land market changed so much.

I have some real life friends who didn't understand about the Linden dollar thing at all; I mean, they said there was nothing physically to show for the money spent on clothes and houses and furniture (and vehicles that fall to bits when driven around the mainland  ), but when I asked what had they got to show for a night on the p*ss? These same friends think nothing of spending £20/£30/£40 on a night boozing and eating, plus they buy a new outfit, perfume, earrings, hair dos. That all adds up. And what do they have to show for all of that? A raging hangover, fat belly (not always from the food!), and most of the times I've been in Second Life, having fun times with great friends, or fun times all alone, I can be in my jim jams inworld and out here in RL, and I don't have to worry about how late I play, because I don't have to find a taxi home! 

Its not a waste ... of time or of money ... if its something that feeds the pleasure centre of your brain.

[Madelaine McMasters]

16 minutes ago, Marigold Devin said:

These same friends think nothing of spending £20/£30/£40 on a night boozing and eating, plus they buy a new outfit, perfume, earrings, hair dos. That all adds up. And what do they have to show for all of that? A raging hangover, fat belly (not always from the food!).

Those non-food fat bellies can cost a fortune over time... http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/09/pf/cost-of-raising-a-child-2015/

[LittleMe Jewell]

4 hours ago, Marigold Devin said:

All in all I think I broke even over the entire time I've spent in Second Life.

I've never made a single $L in SL, though I've spent tons.  I am a consumer and love every bit of it.  Everyone spends money on entertainment of some sort and for me, SL is entertainment.  Most of my family does not understand that, but they think nothing of spending lots of money on types of entertainment that I find boring.  To each their own.

[Marigold Devin]

4 hours ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

Those non-food fat bellies can cost a fortune over time... http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/09/pf/cost-of-raising-a-child-2015/

Heck, all the magazines and books and chocolate (and sims) I could buy with that amount of money!

[Pamela Galli]

It is entertainment, but so much of it involves some form of creativity. In addition to amazing creators, I stand in awe of those who use their content purchases to create astonishing Avis, homes, landscapes, museums, historical re-creations, etc. , often for the purpose of role playing. 

I dont have many RL friends with a hobby nearly so creative. 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Pamela Galli

[Madelaine McMasters]

20 minutes ago, Pamela Galli said:

It is entertainment, but so much of it involves some form of creativity. In addition to amazing creators, I stand in awe of those who use their content purchases to create astonishing Avis, homes, landscapes, museums, historical re-creations, etc. , often for the purpose of role playing. 

I dont have many RL friends with a hobby nearly so creative. 

Agreed. The closest I've come to this kind of creative environment in RL is the local community theater, where I'm the Set Mistress. Not surprisingly, it's there for the same reason... role playing.

;-).