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AlexandriteGem

Progeny, griefer attacks

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31 minutes ago, AlexandriteGem said:

I move on...

no you don't you started spamming related forumpost with your crap now, i hope others like me start reporting your spam and stolen content.

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I can say it is really annoying, to be put into a database without consent or knowledge of being in there. And the owners of said systems, will not let you opt out. It has nothing to do with intellectual property. It has everything to do with decency and respect, I wouldn't go and drop someone into a subscriber without their consent. So what gives them that authority to do so? And why can't they allow for an opt-out option?

 

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44 minutes ago, halebore Aeon said:

(...) And why can't they allow for an opt-out option?

 

How would they check who has opted out without keeping a list of those avatars? If people's objection is being put into a database, then I don't see how this can be possible. Maybe you look for opt-in instead of opt-out.

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1 hour ago, AlexandriteGem said:

I am out of this boring thread

A thread "YOU" created, so guess that makes you boring aswell xD

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Wasn't the garlic necklace always intended to be free and transferable? 

I don't understand why the creators of these games don't just restrict it to certain sims, perhaps with bots available to be the victims/mortals, or, if they must have it spread all over the grid like a bad case of gonorrhoea, restrict it to people who opt in and then give consenting players the chance to be a predator or a victim/mortal/whatever. Then they can just attack/feed off people who agreed to it. You know everyone on the game will use an army of alts so they can play every role anyway, so they'll get their numbers. 

The problem with these games, apart from being intrusive, rude, spammy and obnoxious, is that they almost inevitably DO affect your SL, even if they aren't IMing you or sending you anything. Because, as we've seen, they need to be close to you in order to involve you in their idiocy. Meaning you get followed all over the place by people who don't even want to interact with you in a normal way. Yes, I know these are public places and anyone can be there, and that's the strict letter of the law they're all counting on for their get out clause. But we also all know that if a group of people are following you to involve you in a role-play that you don't want, it's going to cast a shadow over your experience, and it's just not on.

You know, like this. But without the self-awareness or humour.
 

 

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4 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said:

Yes.

I thought so. So what's the issue with the PP who provided a link to get it for free?

I don't know about the other protective thing, this Progeny bollocks is new to me and I'm not inworld much at the moment. 

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10 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

I thought so. So what's the issue with the PP who provided a link to get it for free?

I don't know about the other protective thing, this Progeny bollocks is new to me and I'm not inworld much at the moment. 

Copyright infrigment.

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4 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

I thought so. So what's the issue with the PP who provided a link to get it for free?

I don't know about the other protective thing, this Progeny bollocks is new to me and I'm not inworld much at the moment. 

OP isn't the creator so some are making the assumption that posting it (for free) on the MP is a violation of copyrights. They seem to be overlooking fair use.

Quote

Amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole:  Under this factor, courts look at both the quantity and quality of the copyrighted material that was used. If the use includes a large portion of the copyrighted work, fair use is less likely to be found; if the use employs only a small amount of copyrighted material, fair use is more likely. That said, some courts have found use of an entire work to be fair under certain circumstances. And in other contexts, using even a small amount of a copyrighted work was determined not to be fair because the selection was an important part—or the “heart”—of the work.

Quote

Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work:  Here, courts review whether, and to what extent, the unlicensed use harms the existing or future market for the copyright owner’s original work. In assessing this factor, courts consider whether the use is hurting the current market for the original work (for example, by displacing sales of the original) and/or whether the use could cause substantial harm if it were to become widespread.

https://www.copyright.gov/fair-use/more-info.html

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1 minute ago, Syn Anatine said:

Copyright infrigment.

Does that matter if they're not benefiting from it financially?

I'm not trying to be a pain, I'm genuinely asking. I was given the garlic necklace several times back in the day, by different individuals. What's different about it being put up on Marketplace? Unless that person is claiming they created it, which I don't think they are?

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9 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

Does that matter if they're not benefiting from it financially?

Does it matter if I write a novel, self-publish it under my own name, don't charge a thing for it, but I've stolen large chunks of it from other peoples' books?

Of course it does. Different scenario, but similar concept. I'm still using their work without their permission (and in my example I'm also claiming it as my own).

Edited by Skell Dagger
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4 minutes ago, Skell Dagger said:

Does it matter if I write a novel, self-publish it under my own name, don't charge a thing for it, but I've stolen large chunks of it from other peoples' books?

Well, it depends. If the original novels were free and always have been, and were created solely because they contain magic words that stop vampires from attacking readers and the authors just wanted to protect people, I would look upon it a bit more leniently. 

I don't think the PP claimed to be the creator though? If not, it's more like creating your own print run of the free novels, and distributing them without charge from your own publishing house with the correct bylines. 

It looks to me as though the PP has put it up on MP but still credits the correct creator? I've never been a merchant so I may be misreading what I'm looking at. Happy to be corrected.

Like I said, I'm not trying to be a pain. Just trying to understand the objection.

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Why don't we create a whole new vampire system right here and now? It'll be fun!

Let's call it... TwiNight..

You are a vampire, obviously. You must feed regularly or you'll grow weak and eventually die. You have a "TwiHUD" that's going to be your blood tracker, and you can use it to detect vulnerable humans within 20 meters of you. When an avatar is found, the system checks whether they are a vampire, based on a list of known vampires (our database, for now just myself). If they are not a vampire, we can bite them and drink their blood. Only eight times though, after that they die and you have to find somebody else! Spooky!

So.. to track vampires, we'll just store their UUIDs. For humans, we'll store their UUID and a number indicating a percentage of blood left. A human that gets the ultimate suck will die.

So here is our code:

// list of known vampire UUIDs
list vampires = ["779e1d56-5500-4e22-940a-cd7b5adddbe0"];

// list of bitten human UUIDs and their blood level,
//  from 100 (healthy) to 0 (dead).
list humans;

default
{
    touch_start(integer n)
    {
        // Scan for avatars within 20 meters.
        llSensor("", "", AGENT, 20, PI);
        llListen(1, "", llGetOwner(), "");
    }

    sensor(integer amount)
    {
        if(amount > 12) amount = 12;

        // Go through each avatar and check who's human.
        integer avatar; list targets; while(++avatar <= amount)
        {
            if(~llListFindList(vampires, (list)llDetectedKey(avatar)))
            {
                targets += llKey2Name(llDetectedKey(avatar));
            }
        }

        // Show a list of human victims ready for feeding...
        llDialog(llGetOwner(), "Choose your target to feed on!", targets, 1);
    }

    listen(integer channel, string sender, key id, string humans_name)
    {
        string humans_uuid = llName2Key(humans_name);
        // Check if chosen human has already been bitten.
        integer database_index = llListFindList(humans, (list)humans_uuid);

        // This human has been bitten
        if(database_index)
        {
            // Check their current blood level.
            float blood = llList2Float(humans, ++database_index);

            if(blood == 0)
            {   // Oh no!
                llOwnerSay("This person is already a DEAD ZOMBIE!");
            }
            else if(blood -= 0.125 < 0.1)
            {   // Whoops!
                blood = 0;
                llOwnerSay("You've killed "+humans_name+"!");
            }
            else
            {   // Update database with lost blood.
                llOwnerSay("Om nom nom!!!");
                llListReplaceList(humans, (list)blood, database_index, database_index);
            }
        }

        // This human hasn't been feasted on yet, delicious!
        else
        {
            humans += [humans_uuid, 0.875];
            llOwnerSay("OM NOM NOM!!!!!");
        }
    }
}

And there it is!! A new vampire system, totally open-source too, so anyone can put this code into a their own script in any attachment, it'll be 100% totally undetectable by literally anybody (even if they try to make "detectors" even after seeing my code). It doesn't ask permissions either, there's no opt-out and you can bite as many times as you want and you could single-handedly zombify the whole grid and no one will be none the wiser OR able to stop you!! TRUE AUTHENTIC VAMPIRISM!

By the way, I've taken everybody in my personal contact list and given them my arbitrary "blood value" of 0. I mourn for their loss, what do we do now? Will they ever be saved?

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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Just now, Wulfie Reanimator said:

You are a vampire, obviously. You must feed regularly or you'll grow weak and eventually die. 

*Bites you.*

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12 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

A human that gets the ultimate suck will die.

These games are the very definition of "the ultimate suck". We're all doomed.

Edited by Amina Sopwith
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I think a lot of peoples grievances, is the same as being put into a subscription system, without knowledge or consent. I for one don't like my name being put into an external database, it won't ruin my SL. But I think out of common courtesy, that they have a roleplaying sim, that when you enter this place, that you are pretty much consenting to this. But this is the problem here, with Progeny for example. Since you don't know you are being bitten, and they can even come in non-scripted areas and bite. It kinda makes the whole grid consenting to be put on the database. But here is an idea, if you want to opt out. You can easily just go to the sim of the creator, and just like a subscriber machine. They can essentially unsubscribe, and at the same time, maybe have a way to put them in a list of people, to leave them alone.

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3 minutes ago, halebore Aeon said:

They can essentially unsubscribe, and at the same time, maybe have a way to put them in a list of people, to leave them alone.

Out one list and into another?

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2 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Out one list and into another?

Okay, it's an idea. At least you know that you did it and that it wasn't one of the vampires, that made you a "shade". Just trying to knock ideas out there, I know it has it's flaws. But it's better than anything for right now. 

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14 minutes ago, halebore Aeon said:

Okay, it's an idea. At least you know that you did it and that it wasn't one of the vampires, that made you a "shade". Just trying to knock ideas out there, I know it has it's flaws. But it's better than anything for right now. 

I don't mean to be mean (I'm very tired and on my way to bed), but..

"You can't kill me in your mini-game, I'll come in do it myself!"

I don't think anyone would say that this solution isn't a valid one, as it implies consent. One connecting miff everybody has is that they haven't given any explicitly. (But at the same time, I don't think any of these people would personally do it because of the fact they got upset in the first place.)

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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1 minute ago, halebore Aeon said:

Okay, it's an idea. At least you know that you did it and that it wasn't one of the vampires, that made you a "shade". Just trying to knock ideas out there, I know it has it's flaws. But it's better than anything for right now. 

I don't know. Years ago, browsing in a joke shop, I came across something that would rez a load of flying bums in the air to chase after a victim and poo on them. If you can identify who's following you with the presumed aim of involving you in this stupid game, I think the flying bums are a pretty appealing alternative.

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I think at the end of the day, many people are just getting sick and tired of being dragged into databases, without their prior consent. Hell, I was in both vampire RPs, and I wouldn't do any of that stuff, like biting and stuff. Especially with Progeny, I felt Immoral and wrong for doing something like that, without others consent. Yeah, I "Died" but I felt that my morals and my ethics were kept intact. But here is the deal, I have been in it. They tend to have this better than thou attitude. Which kinda annoys me. They clearly don't care, and would rather please their masters, and get their fake blood. But there was this one thing I remember, them calling these places "Doved" Sims. Essentially if they were to bite anyone, they would get sick and "Die". If we could figure out how to recreate that, then we can ultimately create deterrents. Even if it were to deter, the other RP systems like that. That would definitely be a bonus. 

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21 minutes ago, halebore Aeon said:

I think at the end of the day, many people are just getting sick and tired of being dragged into databases, without their prior consent.

People don't like what they don't understand. They assume a lot of things that aren't true. They act on gut reactions. (This circles back to me pondering "but why?")

You (general you) have no idea how many databases your actual, real-life info is being stored right now, or other aggregate data about your behavior that can be used to personally identify you across many places even without any "real" information about your person. This is one of the reasons why the EU got its new privacy laws, but I doubt most(/many) people even try to figure out what information is being stored about them. They might not even realize that services they don't use directly might have lots of information about them, and couldn't request it to be deleted because they don't know of its existence.

This is a fact of the internet in general, and a lot it is just a byproduct of keeping services functional and useful.

A "database" is not scary. It's just bookkeeping. Books aren't evil either.

P.S. That said, a game in SL recording your avatar's UUID (or any other data that can be gathered through scripts) holds no personal information about you. It is all public, provided by Linden Lab, and there's no harm in anybody copying it onto their hard drive.

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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1 hour ago, halebore Aeon said:

I think a lot of peoples grievances, is the same as being put into a subscription system, without knowledge or consent. I for one don't like my name being put into an external database, it won't ruin my SL. But I think out of common courtesy, that they have a roleplaying sim, that when you enter this place, that you are pretty much consenting to this. But this is the problem here, with Progeny for example. Since you don't know you are being bitten, and they can even come in non-scripted areas and bite. It kinda makes the whole grid consenting to be put on the database. But here is an idea, if you want to opt out. You can easily just go to the sim of the creator, and just like a subscriber machine. They can essentially unsubscribe, and at the same time, maybe have a way to put them in a list of people, to leave them alone.

Ideally, it should be OPT IN, not opt out. 

1 hour ago, halebore Aeon said:

easily just go to the sim of the creator, and just like a subscriber machine. They can essentially unsubscribe,

 

1 hour ago, halebore Aeon said:

when you enter this place, that you are pretty much consenting to this.

 

Do you not see the contradiction here? What you are suggesting is no different than zFire's idea for people to have to log into his website in order to be removed from the RedZone global ban list. Why on earth would anyone go to the sim where just by entering the sim you are consenting in order to opt out of what you just consented to opting in for by entering the sim? Those that don't want to participate shouldn't have to opt out. Forcing uninterested parties into being interested for the purpose of expressing their disinterest...

The whole thing is just wrong on so many levels. 

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3 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Why don't we create a whole new vampire system right here and now? It'll be fun!

Let's call it... TwiNight..

Do I get to sparkle in the sunlight or do I burn to ash?

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