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A guy claimed he could see IP - was he hacking us?


ParisEugene
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Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

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Don't overreact. You were never in any danger and changeing your password was not necessary at all. Your IP adress has nothing to do with your SL account. Its the adress your computer has on a network (in this case the internet), which it uses to communicate with other devices on the same network (in this case the SL server).

There is no hacking or magic needed to see your IP adress. As soon as you connect to any sort of music stream or media in Second Life, your IP adress gets visible. So for example the DJ providing music at a club could see the IP adresses connected to his stream.

IP adresses are nothing too private, but disclosing someones IP adress still violates the TOS. If this person would have done that, you had a reason to report him. In any other case...well nothing will happen. The thing you should absolutly do in such a case is to not feed this person with attention. He or she probably only made that avatar with the purpose of trolling and scaring people. Any sort of reaction is fun to this person. So next time just mute/ignore someone like him/her.

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Just a bit of further information for you.

The place you live in RL has an address. The address itself, and the fact that you live at that address, are both public knowledge. The address is the means by which the postal service is able to deliver post right to your home.

For you to be able to receive anything on the internet, you need an internet address. Without it, you can't receive web pages, or anything else. So your address needs to be known by every website and system you visit. In other words, your internet address cannot be a secret.

On a personal level, the difference between your RL address and your internet address is that your RL address is specific to one particular building in the world, whereas your internet address is specific only as far as your internet provider's hub. After that, your provider routes stuff to your computer. Therefore, the only thing that anyone can know from your internet address is where your internet provider's hub is, and not where you are, although you will almost certainly live not too far away from the hub, so someone will be able to know what state you live in, for instance, and maybe even your city, but that's it. That is all known, and has to be known, by any system, such as a website server, that sends stuff to you over the internet. It has to know where to send it.

Therefore, someone knowing your internet address is not a breach of privacy.

 

In practise in SL. As has been said, when you receive a DJ's music from SL, it's coming from the DJ's setup and not from LL's setup. So the DJ's setup needs to know where to send it, which, of course, is your IP address. Anyone can create a prim with an image on it, so that the image is delivered from his/her own server. Anyone seeing the image has provided their IP address, so that the image can be sent to it. And, of course, the IP address can be seen by the one who is sending the image. It's the way that the internet works, and is nothing to be concerned about. If anyone goes around claiming to be really clever because they know IP addresses, then they are only fooling those who don't know how the internet works. They are not really clever at all.

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ParisEugene wrote:

... he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double.

Just to add even more, this "double" is getting at the sole reason that IP address disclosure is sensitive in Second Life: It's sometimes possible to detect that two or more avatars share (or have shared) the same IP address, and that's some evidence that those avatars may be alts, operated by the same human.

There are all sorts of ways this can go wrong, so it's entertaining only for those truly desperate for drama. Most likely your three day old party-goer was getting all the drama with none of the data: the falsity of such an accusation makes no difference to its ability to arouse suspicion. 

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Right now I am on my work computer.  I work for a large company with many offices around the world.  Everyone in the 48 contiguous states all have the same IP address as far as the world outside our network is concerned.  This is because we all go through the same firewall.

It works the same way for many places that offer internet connection as part of being there.  Hotels, college campuses, even some apartment complexes.  It HAS to be this way.  There are more devices connected to the internet than there are addresses available.

 

Anyway, as far as this particular instance goes I would say there is a 99.99% chance the guy was lying and a 100% chance of ":so what?" It doesn't matter anyway and proves absolutely nothing even if two people did have the same IP.

 

HOWEVER!
That said, I applaude you, Paris, for keeping a healthy level of paranoia that is needed when dealing with anything on the net. :)  Better safe than sorry as they say.

 

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ParisEugene wrote:

Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

I'm curious to know the category under which you reported this person, simply because I don't recall any category titled "Revealing Public Information". And for everyone else wondering why their (sometimes) less frivolous reports are generally ignored, this guy multiplied by 1000 is likely the reason why.

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Radium Soup wrote:


ParisEugene wrote:

Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

I'm curious to know the category under which you reported this person, simply because I don't recall any category titled "Revealing Public Information". And for everyone else wondering why their (sometimes) less frivolous reports are generally ignored, this guy multiplied by 1000 is likely the reason why.

 

  • Disclosure

    Residents are entitled to a reasonable level of privacy with regard to their Second Life experience. Sharing personal information about your fellow Residents without their consent -- including gender, religion, age, marital status, race, sexual preference, alternate account names, and real-world location beyond what is provided by them in their Resident profile -- is not allowed. Remotely monitoring conversations in Second Life, posting conversation logs, or sharing conversation logs without the participants' consent are all prohibited.

 

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Radium Soup wrote:


ParisEugene wrote:

Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

I'm curious to know the category under which you reported this person, simply because I don't recall any category titled "Revealing Public Information". And for everyone else wondering why their (sometimes) less frivolous reports are generally ignored, this guy multiplied by 1000 is likely the reason why.

 
  • Disclosure

    Residents are entitled to a reasonable level of privacy with regard to their Second Life experience. Sharing personal information about your fellow Residents without their consent -- including gender, religion, age, marital status, race, sexual preference, alternate account names, and
    real-world location beyond what is provided by them in their Resident profile
    -- is not allowed. Remotely monitoring conversations in Second Life, posting conversation logs, or sharing conversation logs without the participants' consent are all prohibited.

 

How about if you make up a pack of lies about someone. But some of them are actually true?
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ChadUnfroyd wrote:


Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Radium Soup wrote:


ParisEugene wrote:

Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

I'm curious to know the category under which you reported this person, simply because I don't recall any category titled "Revealing Public Information". And for everyone else wondering why their (sometimes) less frivolous reports are generally ignored, this guy multiplied by 1000 is likely the reason why.

 
  • Disclosure

    Residents are entitled to a reasonable level of privacy with regard to their Second Life experience. Sharing personal information about your fellow Residents without their consent -- including gender, religion, age, marital status, race, sexual preference, alternate account names, and
    real-world location beyond what is provided by them in their Resident profile
    -- is not allowed. Remotely monitoring conversations in Second Life, posting conversation logs, or sharing conversation logs without the participants' consent are all prohibited.

 

How about if you make up a pack of lies about someone. But some of them are actually true?

What if you speculate about someone based on a promotional photo released by the Lab?

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Derek Torvalar wrote:


ChadUnfroyd wrote:


Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Radium Soup wrote:


ParisEugene wrote:

Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

I'm curious to know the category under which you reported this person, simply because I don't recall any category titled "Revealing Public Information". And for everyone else wondering why their (sometimes) less frivolous reports are generally ignored, this guy multiplied by 1000 is likely the reason why.

 
  • Disclosure

    Residents are entitled to a reasonable level of privacy with regard to their Second Life experience. Sharing personal information about your fellow Residents without their consent -- including gender, religion, age, marital status, race, sexual preference, alternate account names, and
    real-world location beyond what is provided by them in their Resident profile
    -- is not allowed. Remotely monitoring conversations in Second Life, posting conversation logs, or sharing conversation logs without the participants' consent are all prohibited.

 

How about if you make up a pack of lies about someone. But some of them are actually true?

What if you speculate about someone based on a promotional photo released by the Lab?

You're OK as long as you just stick to commenting on the dogs. The four legged ones, that is.

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ParisEugene wrote:

Maybe he was only faking it, he said at a party that he could see that some ip (Internet Protocol) were double. Is it possible that he was hacking us? He was 3 day old, did not rezz for anyone at the party. I reported him to Linden Labs. I will change my password (just in case).

The day I originaly came to SL. and first logged in, standing there at a safe hub, in my sad LL Issue Welcome Island Refugee Rags , I heard two drawling mid western voices shouting at each other...

 

ur an a$$...

no ur an A44, i hacked ur ip, i gunna call the  fbi and report u fer callin me an a$$, ur gonna be pikinup soap in jail

ur an a$$, feebies wunt do nuttin...

 

About 20 seconds into my SL, I disabled voice spam permanently, and I've tried as much as possible to avoid safe hubs.

 

The whole "i haxord ur IP" thing is a pointless useless no-talent hacker wannabe thing, there are people who can do bad things to a web connected pc if they have it's IP address, but you will never hear one  say s/he has your IP, or admit s/he can do anything.

 

Relax, you are safe, the real hackers are more interested in the Federal Reserve and the CIA than what kind of porn you watch or how many patent leather stripper heel thighboots you have in your clothing folder...

 

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  • 2 weeks later...


Phil Deakins wrote:

 

Therefore, someone knowing your internet address is not a breach of privacy.

As noted, any computer (e.g. web site) that you connect to, knows your IP address.

That's how the Internet works: two computers know each other by IP address in order to communicate.

However, your IP address can be used to identify you in real life. Anyone who knows it can trivially figure out your real life location, with varying accuracy. In some places, just the general area that you live in.  In other cases, your block or maybe even street. That depends on how your provider (ISP, e.g. phone company) has things set up. But with access to commercial databases, it can fairly well identify you individually. Most people do not have access to those databases. They get the information from you yourself. When you use web sites, the people running the web site know your IP addres. And then you go put in all manner of personal information into their web site, so they know who you are. And then that is all shared with other companies who pay for the information - mutual cooperation for commercial gain in "knowing the customer" and all about them. Some ISPs (such as Verizon) have been known to monitor your entire web browsing history and sell that information to whoever wants to pay, for example.

But in general, random individuals you encounter on SL will not know much about you (except perhaps which city you live in) based on your IP address.

They can trouble you without knowing who you are, though, just by knowing your IP address, For eample, they can launch attacks on your ccomputer if they know your IP address. These are rather unlikely to be successful if you are on a home computer because your ISP filters out most things like that. If it's  work computer, you could be inviting an attack on your company's systems (in fact, the IP address can tell them exactly who the company is, and which IP addresses belong to the company, while at the same time not identifying a particular computer at the company).

So, someone knowing your IP address is not "nothing", but it usually doesn't amount to much.

Can someone on SL figure out your IP address? Yes, in at least two ways. First, if you are playing any media (e.g. streaming audio) on a parcel will know your IP address, because that's exactly the same as your accessing a web site on the Internet. Secondly, there may be (probably are) bugs in the SL systems that will allow people to do it in ways that were not intended.

People you enounter on SL who threaten you about IP addresses are 99.9999% likely to be complete fakes, just bullying you and assuming that you don't understand these things.

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