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Tal Tuqiri

Not really a New Subject but still puzzled why games such as No Devil are allowed

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The betting in Brag is the same as poker in that each player bets, and continues to bet (or drops out), on his own hand, regardless of whether or not he has a good hand. There are minor difference, but it's basically the same system of betting.

I still say that the actual game of poker is as I said - deal, then highest hand wins - and the betting is another part of the whole thing. I agree that the two together are what people generally think of as poker, but I still say that the actual game itself is just the cards.

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That sounds fun - especially the way you described it :)  I'd never heard of it before but I fancy playing it.

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Ilithios Liebknecht wrote:

Sounds like fun. That game is, of course, not poker in any way, but sounds like a good time :-)

Of course it's poker. If you think about it, there isn't a game called poker - except what I described. You described a game but you called it draw poker. All the gambling poker games that I'm aware of are multi-word games; e.g. draw poker, stud poker, Texas holdem, etc. They are all varieties of the simple game of poker, which is deal the cards, then the highest hand wins. With the gambling varieties, you can't play a game of poker, because nobody would know how it goes. You have to decide which variety of poker to play for everyone to understand how to play it.

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with all the table talk in the chocolate game then is all about trying to put people off when they deciding which cards to discard

is lots of bribery. Like: if you discard that card and not that one then when I win I will give you 3 chocolates

and threats. Like. Can try to beat me, which will never happen like ever bc you not gunna get the card like ever, and when you lose which you will, then you will get nothing ever off me ever again in your whole life ever !!!

and sobs. if you dont discard those cards and you beat me, bc you just being mean to me, then I am going to cry. And my heart will be broken like forever, and will be your fault, and everybody will know and say that is your fault. And you will go to hell as well ! And until then Father Xmas will know that you just being mean for no reason at all, and Father Xmas wont give you any Xmas presents like ever either !!!

and bc they are like 9yo they go: i like it when you cry. And you go: You little monster !  And they go: I know. I am the monster that is gunna eat all your chocolates

and you go: Whose family you in to teach you to be such a horrible little person ? And they go: yours!  And then everybody cracks up laughing (:

 

 

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Phil Deakins wrote:


Ilithios Liebknecht wrote:

Sounds like fun. That game is, of course, not poker in any way, but sounds like a good time :-)

Of course it's poker. If you think about it, there isn't a game called poker - except what I described. You described a game but you called it draw poker. All the gambling poker games that I'm aware of are multi-word games; e.g. draw poker, stud poker, Texas holdem, etc. They are all varieties of the simple game of poker, which is deal the cards,
then the highest hand wins
. With the gambling varieties, you can't play a game of poker, because nobody would know how it goes. You have to decide which variety of poker to play for everyone to understand how to play it.

Unless you're playing low ball, where the low hand wins. And the dealer has the option to say that you're playing low ball before he/she deals a hand in any poker game, because that's how a poker game works.

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Pamela Galli wrote:

What a fun family you have

thanks (:

can get a bit manic at our house sometimes. So we have to quiet time quite often (:

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Yep. Poker is not a single game. It is a family of games, and the defining thing games of poker have in common with each other that differentiate them from other card games is the betting style. Some mistakenly think of poker as being the "poker hands" like flush, straight, full house etc, but there are plenty of poker games that don't use those (Razz and Badugi being two very popular ones) and many non-poker games that do use them.

I suppose it's time to put my cards on the table (pun intended :-P). I was a professional poker player for a few years and then later developed, coded and ran an online poker site as well as having developed my own game of poker that got some regional popularity. So I'm a bit more knowledgeable on this subject than I let on. I was just kind of curious to see if it was at all possible that Phil Deakins could admit to being wrong before I pulled out the authority card.

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Hehe. Whilst you no doubt have plenty of expertise in the realms of poker, and I have virtually none, I still maintain what I've said all along. It doesn't require poker expertise to think logically about what we've been discussing, so your experience does not constitute an "authority card". You can forget that idea because you have no authority concerning this discussion. I.e. your experience doesn't trump anything in this particular discussion.

Poker is all about the hands in the cards dealt. The highest hand wins. But, unless chocolates are involved, it's necessary to make it interesting by adding something, and that something is betting. I've said all along that, by 'poker', people assume and expect betting. I accept that. I've never denied it. All I'm saying is that the actual game is nothing more than dealt cards and high hands. It doesn't need betting, or chocolates :), to be the game. All it needs is dealt cards, and rules about which hands are higher than which hands.

Here's a game of poker that doesn't involve betting. Deal the cards face up, one at a time - slowly, so that the interest can build. When all are dealt, the one with the lowest hand has to do a forfeit - remove an item of clothing, sing a song, buy a round of drinks, whatever. It's Forfeit Poker, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with betting. It's 'low hand loses' instead of 'high hand wins'. I just made that game up but it sounds like it could be fun - and it's poker.

ETA: Hmm. Isn't that how strip poker is played? Deal, change cards maybe, and low hand loses, with no betting?

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From here we can go round and round on it I guess, but I do have one question. Earlier, you pointed out Brag as a non-poker game. I agree that Brag is not poker as does pretty much everyone who is aware of both games. I contend it is not poker because it does not use poker-style betting. The betting is similar but significantly different than poker betting. However, I wonder why you say Brag is not poker. Brag fits exactly your definition of poker. Curious on that one.

As to strip poker, as far as I'm aware, it is not a standardized game and therefore does not have a consistent set of rules. It's just a good excuse to get people naked :-). Most times it's hardly a real game at all but just a laugh that is rarely played for more than a few hands. Here are the ways I have seen strip poker played that are or resemble real poker:

1) With chips like normal poker but but how many chips you have determines how many articles of clothing you are allowed to wear. In this version, people can win back their right to wear more clothes and put clothes back on.

2) People's clothes stand in for the chips so people bet and raise a number of articles of clothing. In this version, it is usually not possible to win clothes back as the winner of a hand doesn't win the actual clothes, they just win the right not to remove any themselves.

To this point however, it should be noted that there exist games with the word "poker" in their name which are not poker. As an example there is Video Poker. This is just a glorified slot machine. It does not fit either of our definitions of poker since it does not have poker style betting and also hands are never compared with any other hand. You just win (or not win) an arbitrarily set amount of money depending on what cards you have. And yet this game is called Video Poker so it's important to realize that just because a game's name contains the word "poker" doesn't mean it actually is a game of poker and most varieties of Strip Poker probably fall in this category.

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Yep. We could go on ad infinitum. We have different views, and that's ok.

You're right about Brag. It wasn't a good example. I've only come across 3 and 4 card Brag, so no full houses, but it's basically the same as poker.

I've never played strip poker, or seen it being played. It occured to me that the Forfeit Poker game I thought up might be how it's played.

All in all, it's been a pleasant, matter-of-fact discussion, the result of which is that we both maintain our original views, plus we both learned how to play Chocolate Poker :)

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On 7/21/2016 at 9:30 PM, wherorangi said:

it gets pretty exciting the way we play. Table talk is totally encouraged. Like everybody is also giving plenty of advice about what cards each person should discard

is heaps of fun 🙂

 

 

Sounds healthy and community building :)

I've been around for a while and am stricken by how similar the Skillz Games are to actual gambling. Viscerally, they feel exactly the same and encourage the same behaviors.

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3 minutes ago, Lex Perdide said:

 Sounds healthy and community building :)

I've been around for a while and am stricken by how similar the Skillz Games are to actual gambling. Viscerally, they feel exactly the same and encourage the same behaviors.

They are still a kind of gambling - the definition is that you need a brain to be able to influence your odds, you still can win by sheer luck but the odds are worse than using your brain. Apparently the regulations for those kind of games are easier to comply to, or the Lab would not have limited gambling to skill games. I am no lawyer for internatioanl online gambling but there are national and state rules to comply with, hence the ban of users of certain US states in Skill Gaming regions...

Nice necro though :D

 

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said:

Why am I reading a thread that is almost 3 years old?

What necromancy is this? voodoo.gif.d539c8acf6d8f14ea7a9fc2c4ee8919d.gif

Grand Mastery level right out of the Necronomicon:

"That is not dead which can eternal lie. And with strange aeons even death may die." H.P. Lovecraft

Edited by Fionalein
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40 minutes ago, Fionalein said:

Grand Mastery level right out of the Necronomicon:

"That is not dead which can eternal lie. And with strange aeons even death may die." H.P. Lovecraft

Can't decide if I wanna like it or laugh at it. So... I thanked you for it. ^_^

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On 7/17/2016 at 8:23 PM, SkillsFurrystorm said:

Report it and wait for the wheels to turn. Using the Zyngo example, you can expect swift action around 2019.

They didn't choose the Talk To The Hand corporate logo for no reason.

Well, what's the news?

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