CadenzaInVivace

So, how much do you need to bribe Maitreya to get a kit?

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@Chic Aeon Agreed ...

If that post had been about TMP I would have agreed but Maitreya support is on point. Of all the mesh bodies I own—TMP had the worst product support. It was getting old going to events and seeing all the cute stuff I "couldn't wear" ...

To the OP, the decision is/was probably related to quality control. Due to the popularity of the body I am sure they have an over abundance of applications for dev kits. Could a personal relationship influence who, or how quickly someone gets a dev kit? Probably! But that isn't very different then what you might expect in a real world business environment now is it.

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One more thought on this topic since someone brought it back on my notifications.

I get a LOT of Maitreya clothes demos. Some fit perfectly and others not so much. I am wondering if the ones that DON'T really fit are the ones made with the bootleg body. I did watch the beginning of that video (I don't make clothes) but not really something I am interested in. The person making the video said that there were issues with the bootleg body. 

In the meantime the folks with the items that fit like a glove WILL stand out among the crowd for anyone who pays attention and is discerning when buying their clothes. Unfortunately some of the big names have really pretty awful fitted mesh for Lara, so you can't go by that. 

What's in a name? Not much really. I could make a skirt and call it Maitreya but if I didn't have the kit (possibly the real one) it is unlikely it would fit well unless I spent an awful lot of time on the beta grid testing and redoing a vertices at a time (well maybe a handful :D).

 

 

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I was told because I don't intend on selling my creations, or don't have a store on Marketplace already selling mesh, I can't get a kit from SLink. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

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32 minutes ago, Sini Nubalo said:

I was told because I don't intend on selling my creations, or don't have a store on Marketplace already selling mesh, I can't get a kit from SLink. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

no it's not ... it's also protecting their brandname getting slandered by mediocre and scamming merchants.

If there's a real issue now they can claim they never gave out the dev kit.

( i'm not saying you are such bad creator, but in policies always some good intentions get crushed by the proctetion against he bigger bad things.)

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I don't create anything.
When I buy clothes and they don't fit and they say “this is for body so-and-so”, to me its just as much a fault of the body as it is the clothes.  A creator may think something different, but I'm not a creator, and if something does not fit, I feel there is more than just one simple reason.  Its to easy to just point and say, they did it.  I personally blame both the body and the clothing creator.  But all I do is buy and use, I don't create.  A different world?  And this is, IMHO.

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SL should handle it on their end. I feel if any bodies are used by a huge amount of the SL population, then the creators should have to have their kit openly available, even if they price the kit to ~ 1k. If not, SL should blacklist the content creators store until they agree. I only say this, because SL content creators shouldnt be able to control other peoples income.

On 11/16/2017 at 1:11 AM, Alwin Alcott said:

no it's not ... it's also protecting their brandname getting slandered by mediocre and scamming merchants.

If there's a real issue now they can claim they never gave out the dev kit.

( i'm not saying you are such bad creator, but in policies always some good intentions get crushed by the proctetion against he bigger bad things.)

As far as this, when creators block people from getting kits, if anything it promotes people to copybot. POPULAR designers had to use a bootlegged kit in order to develop anything, because some of them had to wait a year or more to receive a kit, some still have not.

No SL content creator should be able to control any form of the market. Allowing these designers to pick and choose who can develop is awful, especially when making clothing for certain bodies is the only way you can make any profit now for clothing. Imagine if SL originally made people apply to create, but could deny you if you had no 3d store online or portfolio? SL would not have many designers at all.

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4 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

 the creators should have to have their kit openly available, even if they price the kit to ~ 1k.

there's no reason at all... if they want they can keep the whole brand and supplies to themself, but they mostly don't, the more supply, the more their brand will sell.

5 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

, SL should blacklist the content creators store until they agree.

there's more or less a free market, what you want is suppression.

6 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

 because SL content creators shouldnt be able to control other peoples income.

... you can always start your own brand, nobody else can be hold responsible for your income, you want to lift on their success.

I can't start selling a lot of brand materials in rl... thats in control of their licenced affiliates

8 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

As far as this, when creators block people from getting kits, if anything it promotes people to copybot.

most real copybotters do it because they are able to do it, they even take free items ... The copybot stores are here because people buy it for 10L instead of the 1000 the real creator wants .. we all know when we see the product that it stinks......but we (lot of us) will sitll buy the cheaper one, it's nearly the same with the eco clubs protesting against cheap meat and veggies... as long it's in the store, people will buy it, and give no sh*t about the welfare for the animals or pesticides used in the mega productions.

15 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

 POPULAR designers had to use a bootlegged kit in order to develop anything, because some of them had to wait a year or more to receive a kit, some still have not.

that's bad they have to wait but a illegal action to get a botted kit, they are not better than any store that sells botted items.

16 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

No SL content creator should be able to control any form of the market.

yes, anybody can protect his own designs, go tell Armani, DG, P&G, J&J that they can't... please come tell the outcome of your survey

18 minutes ago, Sick Venom said:

Allowing these designers to pick and choose who can develop is awful, especially when making clothing for certain bodies is the only way you can make any profit now for clothing. Imagine if SL originally made people apply to create, but could deny you if you had no 3d store online or portfolio? SL would not have many designers at all.

So a original creator has to take care for the ones that want to jump on the moneytrain THEY created... thats not how life works.

If a secondary designer isn't able to be creative, he will make no profit.

Have a look at MP... pick a certain body, and look at the appearal sections. How many real original clothes are there?  ... whole bunches are templated stuff, thats no creation, thats multiplying and more of the same. No original creator is responsible for that.

For original designers there's always a market, and profit.

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40 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said:

1) there's no reason at all... if they want they can keep the whole brand and supplies to themself, but they mostly don't, the more supply, the more their brand will sell.

2) there's more or less a free market, what you want is suppression.

3) ... you can always start your own brand, nobody else can be hold responsible for your income, you want to lift on their success.

I can't start selling a lot of brand materials in rl... thats in control of their licenced affiliates

most real copybotters do it because they are able to do it, they even take free items ... The copybot stores are here because people buy it for 10L instead of the 1000 the real creator wants .. we all know when we see the product that it stinks......but we (lot of us) will sitll buy the cheaper one, it's nearly the same with the eco clubs protesting against cheap meat and veggies... as long it's in the store, people will buy it, and give no sh*t about the welfare for the animals or pesticides used in the mega productions.

that's bad they have to wait but a illegal action to get a botted kit, they are not better than any store that sells botted items.

yes, anybody can protect his own designs, go tell Armani, DG, P&G, J&J that they can't... please come tell the outcome of your survey

So a original creator has to take care for the ones that want to jump on the moneytrain THEY created... thats not how life works.

If a secondary designer isn't able to be creative, he will make no profit.

Have a look at MP... pick a certain body, and look at the appearal sections. How many real original clothes are there?  ... whole bunches are templated stuff, thats no creation, thats multiplying and more of the same. No original creator is responsible for that.

For original designers there's always a market, and profit.

1) Yes there is, because not everyone can make a fully rigged mesh body (duh) some take off, and literally OWN the SL market. 

2) Not when they(body devs) control who gets to participate in the marketing and designing, that's suppression. SL in general is supposed to be about open creating. And technically anything uploaded to SL belongs to SL.

3) See 1), and also the bodies success also relies on content being available. More content people like for the bodies, higher chance they buy said body.

I dont even know what youre talking about with brand materials RL.. RL marketing isnt always comparable to SL marketing.. especially how you're comparing it.

I dont agree with copybotters at all, I dont purchase from them.
I will agree the stolen kit isnt a good idea, but they forced peoples hands. People who made income on fashion, were unable to get the kits, to keep their income. All bad.
SL is very controlled in what becomes popular. People very rarely purchase any default avatar clothing, or lower end mesh body clothing. For instance on the female side.. Maitreya, Belleza, Slink own the market. You dont hear of other brands. On the mens side its Slink, Signature, Belleza.
When they can choose who can develop, it messes up the whole market. For instance if a really good 3d designer cant get a kit, just because they dont have any store proof atm, its a ***** awful deal, and shouldnt be acceptable to control within SL, because again, it effects the market and creative environment that SL should be, as a whole.

This has nothing to do with a secondary designer, so again you're way off. Many VERY talented designers that people enjoy in here, couldnt get the kit, so they have to make unmatched rigs, its a lose/lose.

Only way its a win/win is to have kits out in the open, so anyone can create. SL can literally delete any offbrand versions that popup later.. and also its not like that cant happen now, having a kit available to anyone, changes nothing about copybotting. *edit; Also as I said, setting the kit to 1k, allows the creator to squeeze more profit from future creators.. even more of a win!

We may not agree on this and thats fine, but as a creator, I know the struggle first hand.. although I have got the kits I need, I have watched people better than me unable to get kits on the female side. So I'm sure as a consumer, you don't care too much, but when you are in SL to create (even just for fun and yourself), this stuff matters a lot.

 

 

Edited by Sick Venom

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6 hours ago, Sick Venom said:

And technically anything uploaded to SL belongs to SL.

Not at all. Read the TOS, Sect 2.3 in its entirety, very carefully. It is legalistic and hard to follow in places, but the gist of it is in the first sentence:

2.3 You grant Linden Lab certain licenses to your User Content.

You retain any and all Intellectual Property Rights you already hold under applicable law in Content you upload, publish, and submit to or through the Servers, Websites, and other areas of the Service, subject to the rights, licenses, and other terms of this Agreement, including any underlying rights of other users or Linden Lab in Content that you may use or modify.

I highlighted the bottom line. Anything you upload continues to belong to you. You grant Linden Lab a license to display your creations, but not the right to own them.  As a creator, you and you alone have the right to decide what other people can do with your work, including offering them tools to make it easy for their own creations to conform to your design, or making it difficult for them to do that.  That is not just Linden Lab's rule. It's what copyright law means.

 

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11 hours ago, Sick Venom said:

Lots of good stuff

 

 

Finally someone who gets the whole thing.

 

Be the father of my prim babies?

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@Rolig Loon : I think he might be refering to this ?

1.2 The Service exists only as long as and in the form that we may provide the Service, and all aspects of the Service, including your User Content, are subject to change or elimination.

Linden Lab has the right to change, limit access to, and/or eliminate any aspect(s), feature(s) or functionality of the Service (including your User Content) as it sees fit at any time without notice, and Linden Lab makes no commitment, express or implied, to maintain or continue, or to permit open access to, any aspect of the Service. You acknowledge that your use of the Service is subject to this risk and that you knowingly assume it and make your decisions to participate in the Service, contribute Content and spend your money accordingly.

Linden Lab may, but will not have the obligation to, display, maintain, or otherwise make use of, any of your User Content, and Linden Lab may, in its sole discretion, modify, delete, or otherwise make use of User Content without notice or any liability to you or any third party. Linden Lab reserves the right to treat User Content on the Service as content stored at the direction of users for which Linden Lab will not exercise control except to block or remove content that comes to Linden Lab's attention and is offensive, obscene, abusive, illegal or otherwise objectionable to Linden Lab, or to enforce the rights of third parties or the content restrictions set forth below (in Sections 2 and 7), when notice of their violation comes to Linden Lab's attention. Such User Content submitted by you or others need not, however, be maintained on the Service by us for any period of time and you will not have the right, once submitted, to access, archive, maintain, or otherwise use such User Content on the Service.

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That still does not say that Linden Lab claims ownership.  In fact, if you read the rest of the section that I quoted above, you see that by uploading your content to SL, what you have done is give Linden Lab a license to use it in carefully enumerated ways:

Except as otherwise described in any Additional Terms (such as a contest's official rules) which will govern the submission of your User Content, you hereby grant to Linden Lab, and you agree to grant to Linden Lab, the non-exclusive, unrestricted, unconditional, unlimited, worldwide, irrevocable, perpetual, and cost-free right and license to use, copy, record, distribute, reproduce, disclose, modify, display, publicly perform, transmit, publish, broadcast, translate, make derivative works of, and sell, re-sell or sublicense (through multiple levels)(with respect to each Product or otherwise on the Service as permitted by you through your interactions with the Service), and otherwise exploit in any manner whatsoever, all or any portion of your User Content (and derivative works thereof), for any purpose whatsoever in all formats, on or through any media, software, formula, or medium now known or hereafter developed, and with any technology or devices now known or hereafter developed, and to advertise, market, and promote the same. You agree that the license includes the right to copy, analyze and use any of your Content as Linden Lab may deem necessary or desirable for purposes of debugging, testing, or providing support or development services in connection with the Service and future improvements to the Service. The license granted in this Section 2.3 is referred to as the "Service Content License."

So, you have given LL broad permission to use your intellectual property, but that is contradictory to the OP's claim that

On 11/27/2017 at 2:32 AM, Sick Venom said:

technically anything uploaded to SL belongs to SL.

 

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On 11/27/2017 at 7:22 AM, Rolig Loon said:

Not at all. Read the TOS, Sect 2.3 in its entirety, very carefully. It is legalistic and hard to follow in places, but the gist of it is in the first sentence:

2.3 You grant Linden Lab certain licenses to your User Content.

You retain any and all Intellectual Property Rights you already hold under applicable law in Content you upload, publish, and submit to or through the Servers, Websites, and other areas of the Service, subject to the rights, licenses, and other terms of this Agreement, including any underlying rights of other users or Linden Lab in Content that you may use or modify.

I highlighted the bottom line. Anything you upload continues to belong to you. You grant Linden Lab a license to display your creations, but not the right to own them.  As a creator, you and you alone have the right to decide what other people can do with your work, including offering them tools to make it easy for their own creations to conform to your design, or making it difficult for them to do that.  That is not just Linden Lab's rule. It's what copyright law means.

 

Ah fair enough.. But I still feel with the way things are, it's a very unfair process. My greatest hope is SL buys out one of the bodies (for each gender), and then allows free access. The way things are seriously crushes a lot of the content and fun for people. Don't get me wrong, I dont dislike Maitreya or the owners, I only feel content creation (especially in clothing and accessories) has been crushed by allowing other people to judge who can design for which top body. Thats  my key point. 

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