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Mira Kamiguwa

Does anyone in sl have morals or just cheating lying morons?

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I've been in sl for a long while now and had many relationships, mostly with other women.  How ever long I try to stick at it I always come to the same result.  People do not seem to be capable of telling the truth... Most recently I met some one who I thought was genuine.  We hung out,  and started to get closer,  I asked afew times if she was seriously into me and she said of course.  Now I had no reason to question this and was feeling bad for being paranoid.  Well one day we tped into a store and she was standing with a recent ex girlfriend.  I asked if they knew each other and she said of course we play around together from time to time.  Well this pretty much triggered some thing in my head, 'This person is a total fake and lying to me all along'.  Well I questioned her about it just in case and yep,  she has countless alts all with different subs slaves mistresses and all manner of things.  

So I've been done agian.   I told her what I thought of her and she told me I was crazy.. Then next day she had a partner who of course I had never layed eyes on before this.  This has happened before and maybe less than a month ago I was going through the same thing.  Beliving some one really liked me, then turning around and hooking up with some one else.  

When questioned it seems these people are not even awear of their actions.  All the blame goes on me for being crazy,  what had they deserved to be told they are lying and cheating?  It seems perfectly normal for many people in sl to be in love with one person and cuddling upto them saying how they ment the world then the next day admitting to have multiple other people who they were saying the exact same thing to.  

So whats going on here? 

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SL may in some aspects make cheating easier, and of course there's the whole “it's just a game so I can do whatever I please” mentality; but remember, the SL population is made of RL people, so ultimately there aren't any more cheating lying morons per square meter than in RL.

 

And though I'm aware it was just a rethorical question and very likely prompted by anger, yes, there are people in SL who have morals; but they don't have any sort of fool-proof verification to it... and “yes, of course I'm seriously into you” doesn't even begin to prove anything. Those are just words which even the worst can pronounce.

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People who rush with you into all this heavy relationshipstuff and this romantic sayings that you are the one and only for them, their soulmate and what not....those are the people which who you will have this experiances over and over again.

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You're like Diogenes, the Greek philosopher that carried a lamp and claimed to be looking for an honest man. He was one of the founders of Cynic philosophy.

Call me a cynic, but I don't think you're going to find anyone with the morals you're looking for.

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I suppose the real question that needs to be asked is, what exactly are you looking for in a SL relationship?

Can they have a RL partner? What if they don't want to share RL info?  Personally, if i am with someone in SL i am very loyal to them. However, it will go no further than SL. I have had to end things because people got far too attached.

It sounds like you are looking for a true love in SL. That is hard to find. There is a certain freedom in the anonymity of SL. People are  bound to want to play the field. We can do and be things in SL that we can't offline.

i truly hope you find what you are looking for.

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Well when I ask some one if they are into me and they said of course then I kind of take their word for it.  If they said they had multiple alts all with a different partner and I was just a bit of fun for them when their real partner doesn't log in then maybe it would make things a bit less complicated.  Telling the truth shouldn't be that hard for peopel and make things a lot more fun and less stress in the long run, but seems that a lot of people in sl are not capable of doing such a thing.  It doesn't seem to even make sense to them that they might actually be hurting some one elses feelings.  They just come to the conclustion that what they are doing it totally fine and if anyone questions it then its because they love to make drama.  Drama isn't just a one sided thing.  If some one continues to fool around with people constantly and expect not to be seen negetivly really needs to rethink how what they do in sl.  

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Let me tell you a little story (I'll try to keep it as short as possible). When I was fairly new to SL, I met a man and things were wonderful (or so it seemed). Eventually, he asked to partner and I was elated! We had the huge, beautiful SL wedding of my avies dreams. One day he introduced me to a friend of his and he seemed like a nice guy. He would pop in once and a while to visit us and would usually bring his "squeeze of the week" with him. Sometimes he would pop in when my SL husband wasn't home. He was never inappropriate with me, and usually had a girl with him then, too. Then I noticed little things that hadn't been apparant before. He was using terms that were familiar, made spelling errors that were also very familiar....his speech pattern became so obviously familiar that it couldn't be ignored. I'm sure you've figured out where this is heading. It was, indeed, an alt of my husband, right there in our home with other women. He was very proficient at running his main avie and an alt at the same time. All right under my nose. I'm sure there were hints there all along, but he just got lazy about hiding it, or just didn't care if I figured it out at some point. There are some people who are just sh*#@y no matter what. 

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Mira Kamiguwa wrote: [...] when I ask some one if they are into me and they said of course then I kind of take their word for it [...]

Don't. Really. Saying “I'm honest” is incredibly easy to do, regardless of the actual honesty of the person... and it's been my experience that liars say it way, way more often than honest people.

The two only acceptable proofs of honesty are time and deeds; Aislin's story reflects one way how lies erode in time, and meanwhile your future partner's acts towards you show whether she's the real deal: if she gives without asking, if she doesn't mind your taking it slow and never pushes you... in short, if she's capable of acting like a true friend until such time as you're ready and convinced to take it further... then she's likely what you're looking for.

 


Mira Kamiguwa wrote: [...] Telling the truth shouldn't be that hard for peopel and make things a lot more fun and less stress in the long run, but seems that a lot of people in sl are not capable of doing such a thing.  It doesn't seem to even make sense to them that they might actually be hurting some one elses feelings.[...]

A lot of people truly believe that all misdeeds are done, the slate wiped clean and all problems solved as soon as they hit the “X”, and even accounting for other player's memory, that's what they use alts for. That's why I said it's a bit easier to be a jerk here than in RL; but the actual selfishness and lack of empathy that makes some SL residents into jerks, is almost invariably real. Those who lie here, cheat here, harass here, and hurt others here, are bound to do pretty much the same in RL, in as much as they can; which is another reason why you need to take time to see past the routinary self people project to gain easy symphathy or attraction, into how they really are.

And yes, telling the truth is hard, even for people reasonably grounded in moral principles... actually, make that especially hard for them. Selfish jerks lie far more easily, though they don't do it so much out of easiness but because it's just more convenient.

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The way I see SL is it is an extension of your RL personality - even if you choose to not involve SL into your RL with relationships and what not, that image of your personality is portrayed by who you are in world.   You are YOU controlling a digital avatar.

I see a lot of similar, err, well, should say "Saw" a lot of this happen when I formerly had a lot of friends to speak with which isn't the case anymore, SL is quiet now, it's just my husband and I wandering the realm together, but it would be people meeting someone, thinking OMGAH THIS PERSON IS FANTASTABLE, hey, even I am guilty of this too, and rushing in too fast and too hard, letting your heart run the show that your brain should be in charge of, and instead of seeing the signs and saying 'this isn't right' and running for the hills, it's easy to get swept away in the fantasy that the person that you are talking with is amazing, incredible, one of a kind.   But sadly, just like rl, for every handfull of good hearted people, there is 3 handfulls of not good hearted people waiting to prey on whoever gets close enough for them to sink their teeth into.

There ARE good hearted people, with good morales on SL, but the problem is - they've all experienced similar situations, and it's hardened them.   It's made them hide.   It's made them afraid to talk to people or get close because of the possibility that it could happen again and again and again.

Finding someone with good morales in SL is not an overnight venture.   You will not meet them on the forums, or a club, or anywhere random, and be madly in love the next day -it will take time,and lots of it, it will take resistance and understanding to establish a base.   It will take pain, loss, mistakes, and that is when you know the people around you are meant to be there - the ones that stay, or the ones that come back into your life when you least expect it.

You'll need to ask yourself what you want, and if what you want is important enough to you to work for it, to wait for it, to fight for it, and then you will seek what you are after.    As hard as it is, trust me i know, to stay at arms length, sometimes it's better to protect yourself because it could take a day, a week, even a few months, for that person you are smitten with to show their true colors.    

I was fortunate enough after 4 long years in sl to meet someone with good morales, someone that I had met off the forums and we had an instant friendship, it took a lot of pain for us, indecision, loss, upset, heartbreak, for us to finally get to where we needed to be to realize we were meant to be.   He came back for me, after I made mistake after mistake (I was stupid) and he forgave me and we've been together, extremely happy now, for a year, both SL and RL.   It just takes a lot of time and commitment.

Don't let these people break your spirit.   That's what they love to do.   I've encountered more of those types than any.   Be you, don't change, but be weary.   Read the signs, the surroundings, the way they act, if it's slightly off, consider it a 'red flag' and put that in the side of your mind, when they hit 3 red flags, chances arethe numbers are just going to keep going up and it's best to severe the connection.

I am sorry you have had to deal with this, you sound like a wonderful person and nobody should be subjected to feel that way, but SL with it's limitless possibilities, also puts a barrier in communication that is sometimes hard to overcome.   Establish what you want right off the bat, and if they can't handle that - there's the door!


 

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Genuine honesty exists in sl, just as much as it exists in rl. The problem isn't necessarily that there aren't enough genuinely honest folks...its that some people have a more difficult time finding those people than others do. Sl is definitely not the trophy holder for "most failed relationships ever".

I do want to say that asking someone if they are really into you, is probably not the question you want to be asking, or should be asking.(no, not laying blame here, I promise) The question you might want to ask folks is if they are into *only* you. If you don't want someone that has alts, be up front about it. If you want to take a relationship quick, or even slow, be up front about it. If you don't make your desires known, early on, it isn't likely your desires will ever be met. Should your desires change, as they so often do, re-evaluate them, and then communicate them. Communication in any relationship is vitally important, mutual respect would come second, and honesty *should naturally come along with both of those(however if it doesn't, that would be #3).

I've known lots of folks who have gone from one failed relationship to another, for a myriad of reasons. Typically it's "the other person's fault" in nearly all cases. Though, as an outsider looking in, I can clearly see some instances where it was a mutual failing on both parts...so blame isn't really necessary. Not that blame is typically necessary in any situation. Relationships come and go in sl the same they do in rl. It happens, and it sucks when it happens, most of the time. But if you wanna have it, ya gotta seek it out, I say.

Hubby and I, for example, were friends before we had any kind of intimate relationship. I think that's a good way to start things out...slowly, regardless of what your desires are. Jumping in to any relationship too fast, is a good way to set yourself up to fail. Even if you both want to go fast, it's rarely, if ever, wise. Sure it works out now and again, but for the most part, I think lasting relationships that begin as friendships tend to last longer. Give each other enough time to get a real feel for things, communicate thoughs, opinions and desires...and then decide of pursuing a relationship is going to be worth it. Knowing that there will be bumps along the way, doesn't hurt either.

Dishonesty is no more prevalent here than it is in rl, we're just in a much smaller fishbowl in sl. So the numbers seem worse. Just as people seem to think things move at a faster pace in sl than they would in rl...it may not actually be true in the grand scheme of things, we just have a much smaller sampling to choose from. I know plenty of people in rl who jump into bed with the guy/gal they just met. That's certainly no different than sl, lol.

Trust me, it's out there, and lots of it, ya just have to know where to look. And if you're having what seems to be a lot of failed relationships, perhaps it is because you're both(you and those you seek out) are doing something wrong. My guess is poor communication, as it tends to be the number one relationship killer. That's not me pointing fingers, lord knows I've had enough of my own failed relationships(only one in sl, very early on, the rest elsewhere, including other platforms/games and rl). But when a pattern exists, sometimes the only way to stop it from repeating is find out where your own place, or your own shortcomings, in that pattern exist...and then change it. I had to do the same, before I met hubby. I was convinced that most people online are just dishonest jerks. I was wrong too, lol.

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Mew mew ma mew :matte-motes-asleep-2:

 

There are two types of women in the world, liars and old maids

 

Yay, been wanting to type that for months hahaha. A cookie to anone who can say where that quote came from.

 

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Well, I am 8 years in SL, had some serious relationships and I can tell you that nearly everyone is lying and cheating in SL.
People lie about their RL gender and their RL age. They lie about their feelings and they lie about their SL.

But you should not forget that SL is a fantasy world for most residents. Middle aged RL men are 20 year old lesbians here.
Married RL women with kids are young teens with big breasts....and so on...when you are long enough in SL you will spot the fakers very easily.

As for me I don't care about someome's RL age or gender but I don't like explicit lying about RL. If they can't be honest about it they should not talk about it.

Cheating your close friends with alts is a bad thing and for me a reason to end the 'friendship' Lying about feelings is even worse.

But once again, this is SL and real love and real friendship does not excist in SL. I gave up finding it.

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Ina Fairport wrote:

Well, I am 8 years in SL, had some serious relationships and I can tell you that nearly everyone is lying and cheating in SL.

People lie about their RL gender and their RL age. They lie about their feelings and they lie about their SL.

 

But you should not forget that SL is a fantasy world for most residents. Middle aged RL men are 20 year old lesbians here.

Thats not lying, thats being who you want to be.

Married RL women with kids are young teens with big breasts....and so on...when you are long enough in SL you will spot the fakers very easily.

Again, who are you to judge what people want to  be in SL. Is your Avatar a perfect copy of your RL self?

As for me I don't care about someome's RL age or gender but I don't like explicit lying about RL. If they can't be honest about it they should not talk about it.

If you don't care why do you ask?

Cheating your close friends with alts is a bad thing and for me a reason to end the 'friendship' Lying about feelings is even worse.

 

But once again, this is SL and real love and real friendship does not excist in SL. I gave up finding it.

Sure it does, you just havent found it yet.

 

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:


Ina Fairport wrote:

Well, I am 8 years in SL, had some serious relationships and I can tell you that nearly everyone is lying and cheating in SL.

People lie about their RL gender and their RL age. They lie about their feelings and they lie about their SL.

 

But you should not forget that SL is a fantasy world for most residents. Middle aged RL men are 20 year old lesbians here.

Thats not lying, thats being who you want to be.

Well, it becomes lying when they turn their SL fantasy into a RL lie and that is my point.

 

Married RL women with kids are young teens with big breasts....and so on...when you are long enough in SL you will spot the fakers very easily.

Again, who are you to judge what people want to  be in SL. Is your Avatar a perfect copy of your RL self?

I am not judging people. I am judging their RL lies and no my avatar is not a perfect copy of my RL self, far from that. But when asked about my RL I will tell the truth or say nothing.

 

As for me I don't care about someome's RL age or gender but I don't like explicit lying about RL. If they can't be honest about it they should not talk about it.

If you don't care why do you ask?

I don't ask Drake because I don't care. But people often talk about their RL without asking and then the lies come.

 

Cheating your close friends with alts is a bad thing and for me a reason to end the 'friendship' Lying about feelings is even worse.

 

But once again, this is SL and real love and real friendship does not excist in SL. I gave up finding it.

Sure it does, you just havent found it yet.

Probably you have other ideas about real love and frienship
than me. For me it does not excist in SL.

 

Anyway, thanks for your comment. Your questions gave me the possibility to make my points more clear I hope 
:)


 

 

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Clear expectations and communication are key in establishing and maintaining a relationship. I like the six week rule myself. I'm not sure whether it's true, or just feels true. But I tend to move very slowly in a relationship for the first six weeks...that means no sex, being friends, spending time and getting to know one another.

This wasn't a conscious decision, it wasn't until reading this thread that I looked back on my relationships in SL to see whether I'd been involved with liars and cheaters. I found to things, that I didn't get involved sexually with anyone I was serious about for at least a month...again, it wasn't intentional, just a question of not being ready. With the exception of one guy who was a little weird (and my shortest relationship at 5 months), my exes are friends.

The second and last ex is a dear, dear friend. And my current relationship is going reasonably (okay realllyreallyreally) well. We've moved slowly, getting to know one another as people before entering into a dynamic (we're D/s), and not rushing to sex or declarations of adoration.

The mileage of others may differ, but this kind of pattern seems to have worked for me.

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Within Second Life, it is always practical to ask a prospective relationship partner if they are Roleplaying a relationship or they are seriously seeking the Real Thing. Getting that clear up front can save lots of heartache later, as will establishing whether or not the other person wants a "SL Only" relationship and your joint expectations about monogamy.

 

Unlike Real Life, people can manifest themselves as many different people ( avatars ) and a significant component of the SL population (a) has no desire to bring SL into RL and (b) sees SL as "a game" that has no deeper relational significance.

 

Truth is that most SL residents already HAVE a RL significant other, so any SL relationship has to remain compartmentalized within SL.

 

Being clear if the relationship is real or Roleplay is a first step, and making sure you both feel the same way about virtual monogamy across avatars is a second.

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and you can't be sure that all women are women..........my ex RL boyfriend is female in SL...........fell in love with HIS avi......plays a woman better than I do and I'm a woman...........how scary is this lol.

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i have alot or morals and im faithful but when ur single in sl u can have sex with loads of ppl sometimes at the same time sometimes furrys or whatever even aliens cuz its all just porno cartoons on screen seriously it is but if u wanna marry me in sl il be 100% faithful till u log off LoL naw seroiusly il be faithfull

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