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AnneMarie Alcott

Rude Behavior

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So, this is a rant and I will just tell you that right off.  

In looking for something unique to do with my bf that he would enjoy, I looked on SL's main page for events.  I stumbled across the Star Trek Museum.  Not having been there before, I wanted to visit it before I took my bf there.  As SOON as I landed, this woman starts harassing me about what I was wearing, saying this is museum attire only.  I got a notecard with rules upon landing, but I did not even have a chance to look at them before she started in on me.  I was wearing a bra w/ a leather jacket, a skirt, and high heels.  I didn't see anything wrong with it, so I asked her not sure what the problem was.  She said to take off the 'bouncing boobies', so I removed the physics.  No issue.  then I started to walk inside the musem, and she began a long lecture to me about the rest of my attire.  "put on underwear" was her next statement, followed by a lecture about it being a real museum.  As I hadn't had a chance to even respond before she started in on me, I stated ok I'll just leave I won't stay where someone is rude to me.  She said that my hooha was in full view of everyone and she knows that I'm aware of that or I wouldn't be flashing it (this is not a direct quote, not violating the TOS here) so that's obviously me being ruder than her.  The skirt I was wearing was new and I had an alpha on--I wasn't aware I was flashing anything, and I tried to explain that to her but she muted me.

NOW...I realize people who own businesses are fully able to set their own rules.  I have no problem with dress codes, what I do have  problem with is people being rude to me.  I've been on SL a very long time--since 2006 and this is getting ridiculous.  I wasn't by any means rude to her, and quite frankly am puzzled as to why people feel that they have to treat others with such disregard.  Honestly...now I'm mad and I hope ya'll don't go to this "museum" or you'll be treated the same way.  

:catmad:

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AnneMarie Alcott wrote:

frankly am puzzled as to why people feel that they have to treat others with such disregard.

:catmad:

Because they can (in this anonymous world)

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AnneMarie Alcott wrote:

followed by a lecture about it
being a real museum.


 It's just someone roleplaying that they run a ST museum.  (Real museum my ass.  Good grief)

They're taking the RP WAY too serious. 

Just look up other ST places to visit in SL, there are others, and most are welcoming.

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AnneMarie Alcott wrote:

So, this is a rant and I will just tell you that right off.  

In looking for something unique to do with my bf that he would enjoy, I looked on SL's main page for events.  I stumbled across the Star Trek Museum.  Not having been there before, I wanted to visit it before I took my bf there.  As SOON as I landed, this woman starts harassing me about what I was wearing, saying this is museum attire only.  I got a notecard with rules upon landing, but I did not even have a chance to look at them before she started in on me.  I was wearing a bra w/ a leather jacket, a skirt, and high heels.  I didn't see anything wrong with it, so I asked her not sure what the problem was.  She said to take off the 'bouncing boobies', so I removed the physics.  No issue.  then I started to walk inside the musem, and she began a long lecture to me about the rest of my attire.  "put on underwear" was her next statement, followed by a lecture about it being a real museum.  As I hadn't had a chance to even respond before she started in on me, I stated ok I'll just leave I won't stay where someone is rude to me.  She said that my hooha was in full view of everyone and she knows that I'm aware of that or I wouldn't be flashing it (this is not a direct quote, not violating the TOS here) so that's obviously me being ruder than her.  The skirt I was wearing was new and I had an alpha on--I wasn't aware I was flashing anything, and I tried to explain that to her but she muted me.

NOW...I realize people who own businesses are fully able to set their own rules.  I have no problem with dress codes, what I do have  problem with is people being rude to me.  I've been on SL a very long time--since 2006 and this is getting ridiculous.  I wasn't by any means rude to her, and quite frankly am puzzled as to why people feel that they have to treat others with such disregard.  Honestly...now I'm mad and I hope ya'll don't go to this "museum" or you'll be treated the same way.  

:catmad:

 

You may very well have been "inappropriately" dressed by whatever standards the museum has. I won't get into how silly that whole idea is, I'll just accept it as part of the scene. 

Your reception was a parsec out of line (those of you who burst into laughter at Han Solo's comment in another galaxy far far away that has nothing to do with Star Trek will note that I used the word correctly). The appropriate response (again, given that the scene is as they wish) would have been, "Sorry, we do have a dress code. Please take a minute to read the notecard before you go any farther and IM me if you have any questions."

If that didn't happen prior to the convo you've described, than yes. It was rude. Happens, but it is not excusable.

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You're right.  And no, there was no prior notification about reading a notecard or whatever.  I wouldn't have had a problem with being told there was a dress code but being treated the way I was immediately was seriously inexcusable.  I hate when people use their RP as an excuse to treat others badly.

 

Really, it's a game and a fun one.  Whether I'm exploring new places, shopping, or hanging out with friends at a club I use SL as an escape from RL and that type of abuse from others seriously ticks me off.  Really--can't we just have fun playing?

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Couple things:

- Was this woman, in fact, an authorized representative of the museum? Nothing in your story suggests she wasn't, and yes, some place owners (or staffers) are on a constant power trip, but then again, she might just have been another visitor who felt like volunteering to do, in her own inappropiate way, what the actual owners/staffers would've done only with a far better attitude. And if this is so, the place and its owners/staff shouldn't be blamed for something they can't fully control -but you could contact them about it, and maybe they'd do something about this woman. Even appointed staffers can misbehave, and eventually get the boot if the owners hear about it often enough.

- Even if she was the owner or a staffer acting in such way with full support from the owner, she can regrettably do that; as others have said, it's their place, and if they want to run it like jerks, they have that right -just as you have the right not to go there anymore, and recommend others doing the same.

- As much as you (and many others) want SL to be “an escape from RL”, remember: SL is made of RL people, whether they choose to have a different name, looks and whatnot. And if there are jerks in RL, they're going to bring their attitude here, so in that sense, you cannot “escape”. There's nothing in SL actually preventing arrogance, stupidity or any other bad trait of character from being reflected here just as it's done in RL.

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perhaps you could post a pic how you were dresses... leather jacket with bra and skirt can be reason to be asked to wear more or leave...

 

if it's so easy to see yo didn't wear underwear i wouldn't even ask to put it on but ban without notice.

I don't say you were indecent... but some people think they can do what they want...

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I agree with AnneMarie - it could have, should have, been handled much more diplomatically if they want people to dress a certain way (I have visited there but didn't come across anyone telling me how to dress).

I do find it kind a funny that people get sooo upset in SL about atire.....I personally don't give a hoot if an avatar is dressed or naked!

 

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AnneMarie Alcott wrote:

Honestly...now I'm mad and I hope ya'll don't go to this "museum" or you'll be treated the same way.  

:catmad:

Now ya'll are tempting us to go visit this place.  ;)

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You may not care that an avatar is naked but equally, if the situation is say a formal attire for a ballroom, naked avatars are not likely to be welcome.

 

Some places do have a dress code and like to enforce it. How that is done will vary.

 

I used to host a formal ballroom event and it did get tiring explaining the attire and still have people try to say "a miniskirt and boots and crop top is formal where I come from" doesn't cut it. In my case, the venue had a formal dress code for 2 hours in the whole week but instead of those who didn't want to comply just going elsewhere, they chose to argue.

 

 

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I went to see the place. Only dress code in the notecard was this:

"No nudity, no partial nudity except in scuba area where PG bathing suits are acceptable. Dress should be the same as in a real museum and that means shirts for men in most cases (its up to my discretion)."

I wore a mesh mini-dress, no shoes just bare feet.

There was a woman close by the landing spot - owner of the place. Nobody else in the whole region besides me and her. She said nothing at all while I was exploring the place. Out of curiosity I enabled "show look at" to see if she was actively checking the coming visitor. Yes she was alive, not afk.

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AnneMarie Alcott wrote:

... a lecture about it being a real museum. 

Okay, that's a dead give-away: you were being trolled.

At first I thought it was somebody who was looking for a virtual sex partner into humiliation-play, but this "real museum" -- of Star Trek, no less, hence absurd on multiple levels -- that's just somebody out to f^ck with trekkies.

 

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Based on what you've said and the content of the rules notecard, it sounds like your clothes and alpha didn't load for her. An experienced Second Life user ought to realise this happens (I usually open with, "Do you realise you're naked?" as the answer makes it clear if it was intentional). But it'd explain why the two of you were at cross purposes. You saw yourself as clothed and therefore fine. She saw you as only partially dressed and therefore breaking the nudity rules.

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They have a right to have a dress code and ask you to change if you don't meet it.  However they should give warning of the dress code.

Just out of curiosity I looked at the search listing for this place.  No mention of a dress code there.  I think if they are going to have a dress code then it should stated in the search listing so people can arrive dressed appropriately and not be subjected to this type of behavior.

Even so this person was out of line with you.  They should have just told you there was a dress code and told you to read the notecard before entering. Only if you still did not conform, should anything further be said to you.

Not sure what they meant by appropriate for a RL museum anyway.  That is just too vague.  Even in RL I can go to our local museums in a tank top and cutoffs and nothing will be said to me.  The only place there is a dress code is in the members sit down restaurants in the museum, which is to be expected as they are formal fine dining.

 

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Amethyst Jetaime wrote:

Not sure what they meant by appropriate for a RL museum anyway.  That is just too vague.  Even in RL I can go to our local museums in a tank top and cutoffs and nothing will be said to me.  The only place there is a dress code is in the members sit down restaurants in the museum, which is to be expected as they are formal fine dining.

 

 

As far as I know, the Milwaukee Art Museum has no dress code. I just saw a Kandinsky exhibit there. The museum is on the lakefront and a few people were wearing beach attire (one wore a bikini with a shawl and wrap skirt). The flip-flopping of flip-flops was more amusing than annoying, given the nature of Kandinsky's work. On a hot day, diners at the outdoor cafe can be seen baring a lot of skin.

Sometimes the patrons are more interesting than the art.

;-).

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final pitch.jpg

 


Madelaine McMasters wrote:


Amethyst Jetaime wrote:

Not sure what they meant by appropriate for a RL museum anyway.  That is just too vague.  Even in RL I can go to our local museums in a tank top and cutoffs and nothing will be said to me.  The only place there is a dress code is in the members sit down restaurants in the museum, which is to be expected as they are formal fine dining.

 


As far as I know, the Milwaukee Art Museum has no dress code. I just saw a Kandinsky exhibit there. The museum is on the lakefront and a few people were wearing beach attire (one wore a bikini with a shawl and wrap skirt). The flip-flopping of flip-flops was more amusing than annoying, given the nature of Kandinsky's work. On a hot day, diners at the outdoor cafe can be seen baring a lot of skin.

Sometimes the patrons are more interesting than the art.

;-).

It's amazing how times have changed.

I just grabbed this at random.  It is Yogi Berra hugging Don Larson after he threw the final out in Game Five of the 1956 World Series.

Notice all the suits in the crowd.  They would have never dreamed of going to a game not properly dressed.

I really do think sometimes we've gotten way to lax.

(I don't know if it is really true but the joke used to be when coming through Customs to get back into the U.S. they'd ask people who won the '56 World Series to proove they were American.  You'd find yourself in the hot seat if you didn't know the answer ;) )

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Perrie Juran wrote:

Notice all the suits in the crowd.  They would have never dreamed of going to a game not properly dressed.

I really do think sometimes we've gotten way to lax.

(I don't know if it is really true but the joke used to be when coming through Customs to get back into the U.S. they'd ask people who won the '56 World Series to proove they were American.  You'd find yourself in the hot seat if you didn't know the answer
;)
)

As someone who resurrected "Pajama Day" early in my work career, I may not share your opinion about laxness.

And I wonder if that Customs question wouldn't have kept a lot of American women from returning home. All I know about baseball is that guys scratch and spit overmuch when playing it.

Oh, I also know that the neighbor kid yelps when I hit him with a sneaky pitch.

;-).

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Perrie Juran wrote:

final pitch.jpg

 

It's amazing how times have changed.

I just grabbed this at random.  It is Yogi Berra hugging Don Larson after he threw the final out in Game Five of the 1956 World Series.

Notice all the suits in the crowd.  They would have never dreamed of going to a game not properly dressed.

I really do think sometimes we've gotten way to lax.

(I don't know if it is really true but the joke used to be when coming through Customs to get back into the U.S. they'd ask people who won the '56 World Series to proove they were American.  You'd find yourself in the hot seat if you didn't know the answer
;)
)

 

Funny that. There's film—video ?—of the end of that game that concentrates on the fans, because everyone was being practically silent, not wanting to be the jinx. Then they just exploded on the final out. I remember thinking the same thing as you when I saw it. "Wow, they're all wearing hats and coats and ties."

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Dillon Levenque wrote:

 

Funny that. There's film—video ?—of the end of that game that concentrates on the fans, ...

....

"Wow, they're all wearing hats and coats and ties."

In the beginning of the video - fans; also at the very end of the video.  Seems to be hot weather.  :matte-motes-big-grin:

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I'm old enough to remember when I was very young having to get dressed up even to go shopping.  I grew up in a conservative southern town, and mom made us wear our church clothes, white gloves, hats, the works. 

I for one am glad it isn't the thing now.  Dressed to go out then for a lady included the 'proper' foundations too regardless of how slender you were or the weather.  That mean girdle, stockings, heavy duty bra, slip, etc. They were hot in the warm months and uncomfortable all year round.

As far as museums, I think they have it right now.  Museums should allow great flexibility in every day dress so that everyone, especially kids, has access to great art even if they don't own dress up clothes.  I can see a dress code for dining rooms or special events, but not everyday other than for decency like not showing naughty bits.

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Interesting. There's a thread going on right now on another forum in which people are posting about bans they've received. Two different people mention being banned from the Star Trek museum (the banner was a female avatar), both for arguing about being told they were inappropriately dressed. One was told she was naked—an apparent viewer issue since she was fully dressed. She sent a snapshot to prove it and was then called a 'hacker'!

It appears the museum has at least one employee who is a bit off the rails.

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Dillon Levenque wrote:

Interesting. There's a thread going on right now on another forum in which people are posting about bans they've received. Two different people mention being banned from the Star Trek museum (the banner was a female avatar), both for arguing about being told they were inappropriately dressed. One was told she was naked—an apparent viewer issue since she was fully dressed. She sent a snapshot to prove it and was then called a 'hacker'!

It appears the museum has at least one employee who is a bit off the rails.

I suppose that explains how someone who has been in SL for a bit could not know about the naked viewer bug... believing that anyone who tries to explain it is a hacker, so it couldn't possibly be true. SL must seem like it has a remarkable number of hackers.

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Dillon Levenque wrote:

Interesting. There's a thread going on right now on another forum in which people are posting about bans they've received. Two different people mention being banned from the Star Trek museum (the banner was a female avatar), both for arguing about being told they were inappropriately dressed. One was told she was naked—an apparent viewer issue since she was fully dressed. She sent a snapshot to prove it and was then called a 'hacker'!

It appears the museum has at least one employee who is a bit off the rails.

It hasn't been that long really since we had the "real" naked bug.  But I'm feeling too lazy to dig out the old threads on it.  You were dressed and looked dressed on your own screen but everyone else saw you naked.  It resulted in a lot of bans and ARs.

Bu the accidental nudist has certainly returned.

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PerrieJuran wrote:
Bu the accidental nudist has certainly returned.


Then there are those people who teleport around the grid totally naked.  When told they're naked, they reply: 

"What?!  You don't see my cute outfit, I spent a fortune on it!"  ....."Let me rebake"    .......Ok, how about now?"   

*wink*

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Perrie Juran wrote:

 

Bu the accidental nudist has certainly returned.

Yes it has. Not long ago I TPed to Kuula. Almost immediately I got an IM "Coby you should wear top here. You're naked above your waist".

The thing was that I was wearing sculpted bra. It just didn't rez to the person IMing me. Well, I just slapped one system top on me and all was good.

:matte-motes-big-grin:

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