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greek Wingtips

THIS NEW SL LIFE?

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I know this is probably mentioned somewhere in these forums, but the fact LL are looking or in fact have decided to build a new 2nd life raises some very important issues , now I not fully aware of the what they are planing to do and  I am all for expansion and modernisation , what cocerns me are folks like me and many more that have invested in SL some of the questions that come to mind are:

1: what happends to all those that have L$ in SL does that get transfered over?

2: Some have heavily invested in buying prim location land do they just loss that?

3: All those that have bought objects being very expension houses to bikes to template clothes the list is endless , do they all lose that?

4: And all those that have spend years on building clubs, shops bussinees , does that all go up in smoke?

I heard some say " oh dont worry SL will still be here" well I know in the Real world very unlike any bussiness to run two indentical or near bussiness closey related, If this is the final nail in the coffin of sl well LL better think very carefull as I for one will not be moving over to any other world and starting over again after nearly 7 years, if push comes to shove I would just move over to one of the other worlds and have a simple account.   PLEASE BECAREFUL LL AND I WOULD LIKE TOTALL TRANSPARENCY AS TO YOUR INTENSIONS AND SHARE THIS WITH ALL OF US, PLEASE DONT SAY YOU DONT KNOW YET, AS WE ALL KNOW  COMPANIES ALL HAVE THERE END GOAL IN SITE

THE LAST PART OF THIS STATEMENT  IS INTENDED FOR LL NOT YOU FOLK

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This thing doesn't even have a name yet, we haven't seen anything from it yet.

How about reading one of the 374586978 threads and what not about it? There is enough other folk to panic with. And LL doesn't care about you + doesn't read or care about this forum much.

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well not much point in reading about anything if your right, but we do have a thing called rumours and if so, then LL should least explain rather then let people hear what being said, if the they were to make a statement to either agree or deny the fact then they should do it here too

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greek Wingtips wrote:

well not much point in reading about anything if your right, but we do have a thing called rumours and if so, then LL should least explain rather then let people hear what being said, if the they were to make a statement to either agree or deny the fact then they should do it here too

If you ask me, LL has made a terrible mistake by leaking any information (which basically just was "we plan to make something new in the future") at this point. Because its not wise to mention something that is still just a blurry idea in your own head. And therefore they can't give any solid informations.

People simple started calling it SL2 for the lack of a name and somehow everyone developed a sense of entitletment to keep money, property, inventory and what not, when they move over.

Every statement they would make at this point as basically no value, as I doubt that they are even in an alpha testing phase for the new product yet. That they will make something new in the future was predictable, because no company want to run dry. But when it will be there? Nobody knows...probably not even LL themself. And maybe it will never come to life or not in the form we or they expect it. I have seen companies developing software for multiple years to then dump the entire project and start over.

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greek Wingtips wrote:

 

I heard some say " oh dont worry SL will still be here" well I know in the Real world very unlike any bussiness to run two indentical or near bussiness closey related, If this is the final nail in the coffin of sl well LL better think very carefull as I for one will not be moving over to any other world and starting over again after nearly 7 years, if push comes to shove I would just move over to one of the other worlds and have a simple account.

Actually it will not be "new Second Life". Ebbe was referring to it as "Next Generation Platform". He also said that it will be "in the spirit of Second Life". So that gives a hint that it will have some similarities with Second Life. Ebbe has also said that it will be "better and more advanced" in many ways compared to Second Life. Also there are no plans so far to close Second Life. It will be around for many years to come. Naturally if the new platform will be a lot better in all ways more and more people are going to move there. So at some stage Second Life is not economical any more and it will die out of old age.

You're not moving to the Next Generation Platform? Instead you will go to some other less advanced and less populated virtual world? Why is that?

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And you believe that?, I tend not believe that, why would a company run two versions of a similar thing, it would a transision, but thats not my worry, its all those that have invested in here, I want some of the answers to what I wrote

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thats interesting what they say, but it would not make sense to have both running as they would be direct competion with each other , and doubling the employee to both, so it would not make viable financial sense, and lets be real do you really thing LL would tell us they they be closing down SL no way the panic would drives us in drones away and close our accounts I reken they should come clean as to what they are going to do

 

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Forget it. Just another silly statement by another CEO who obviously has no clue on what the spirit of SL is (Who on earth has one??), nor a clue on what this fabulous "Next Generation" thingy will be or not will be all about. When some former Yahoo and BranchOut exec guy starts to talk technology or "Virtual Reality" everyone should relax, calm down and do a reality check.

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greek Wingtips wrote:

thats interesting what they say, but it would not make sense to have both running as they would be direct competion with each other , and doubling the employee to both, so it would not make viable financial sense, and lets be real do you really thing LL would tell us they they be closing down SL no way the panic would drives us in drones away and close our accounts I reken they should come clean as to what they are going to do


It would not make sound financial sense to close SL while it is profitable if the new platform (SL2) hasn't largely attracted the SL population. So LL will do as the CEO has said, and keep SL running at the same time. It's my opinion that SL2 is intended to be the replacement for SL, but that doesn't mean they'll close SL down when SL2 opens. They will make a sound financial judgement when they close SL.

LL has said that they do not have any plans to close SL. I believe that. What I believe they do have are intentions to close SL as soon as SL doesn't make enough money. That will happen if and when the bulk of the SL population goes over to SL2. I believe that the bulk of the population will go over quite quickly - almost straight away. I think that many or most will use both worlds for a while, but then they'll find that SL2 is so much better (if it really is so much better), and tend to stay there. So I don't think it will be too long before SL becomes unprofitable and is closed down. I give it 2 year at the most, and maybe even just 1 year.

ETA: The CEO did say that L$ will go over the SL2, so we have no concerns on that score. He also said that some things will go over but he doesn't know what yet.

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greek Wingtips wrote:

And you believe that?

I just quoted what has been said by Linden Lab in other threads and in other forums.

Why do you care what I believe or not believe?

You can find some answers to your questions if you would read all the posts done so far. Linden Lab have given some answers - naturally they cannot answer all questions what we might have because the new world is still in very early stages of development. Surely there are vast amount of things not even defined yet.

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"Naturally if the new platform will be a lot better in all ways more and more people are going to move there. So at some stage Second Life is not economical any more and it will die out of old age."

If you claim THIS to be what "LL answered", show me the exact quote. No Linden employee ever said something like this in the context. Never ever. Negativism? No, reality check.

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Phil Deakins wrote:


greek Wingtips wrote:

thats interesting what they say, but it would not make sense to have both running as they would be direct competion with each other , and doubling the employee to both, so it would not make viable financial sense, and lets be real do you really thing LL would tell us they they be closing down SL no way the panic would drives us in drones away and close our accounts I reken they should come clean as to what they are going to do


It would not make sound financial sense to close SL while it is profitable if the new platform (SL2) hasn't largely attracted the SL population. So LL will do as the CEO has said, and keep SL running at the same time. It's my opinion that SL2 is intended to be the replacement for SL, but that doesn't mean they'll close SL down when SL2 opens. They will make a sound financial judgement when they close SL.

LL has said that they do not have any plans to close SL. I believe that. What I believe they do have are intentions to close SL as soon as SL doesn't make enough money. That will happen if and when the bulk of the SL population goes over to SL2. I believe that the bulk of the population will go over quite quickly - almost straight away. I think that many or most will use both worlds for a while, but then they'll find that SL2 is so much better (if it really is so much better), and tend to stay there. So I don't think it will be too long before SL becomes unprofitable and is closed down. I give it 2 year at the most, and maybe even just 1 year.

ETA: The CEO did say that L$ will go over the SL2, so we have no concerns on that score. He also said that some things will go over but he doesn't know what yet.

I think you are being overly optimistic.  The new grid won't be ready for beta for at least a year, and that assumes everything goes well.  When it opens for beta there will be practically no content, no places for people to go, not much if anything to buy.  It will be an empty world full of the new grid's equivalent of ruths.  It will take at least a year before creators are able to generate enough content to have even a fraction of what is now available in SL.  It will be a lot like open sims now, with very limited selection on most things and a complete absence of some other things.

Most people in SL may create an account and visit the new grid as soon as they can, but won't move over permanently until there is enough content there to satisfy them AND they are willing to leave behind most of their inventory, if not all of it and buy new things there.  Even then a segment won't move for various reasons and a lot of people will probably continue to use both grids for a long time.

SL will eventually close, but we all knew it would if and when it no long was profitable.  At that point, the remaining residents will either migrate permanently to the new grid,go to one of the open sims if they or their computers can't handle the new grid, go to another virtual world, or just quit.

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Vivienne Schell wrote:

"
Naturally if the new platform will be a lot better in all ways more and more people are going to move there. So at some stage Second Life is not economical any more and it will die out of old age.
"

If you claim THIS to be what "LL answered", show me the exact quote. No Linden employee ever said something like this in the context. Never ever. Negativism? No, reality check.

To your satisfaction :smileyhappy: I hereby confess that the text in blue above, what you quoted from my post, is my conclusion what will most likely happen. SL will stay as long as it is profitable, when not profitable any more there is no incentive to keep it alive. It's a logical business choice for Linden Lab. It's not positivism nor negativism. It just is.

 

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It had already been stated that their will be a new scripting language and that LSL will be dead so scratch anything with scripts. No prim/sculpt objects either. (I believe 90% of all inventories will be dead. Well they will be alive AS LONG AS SL 1 exist.

I can understand your sentiment as i feel the same, people like myself have invested heavily over 5 years and LL offers nothing in return.   What bothers me is this has not been billed as an upgrade to sl1 or even mentioned that it will be anything like sl 1 which makes me wonder. I know they are after the gameing aspect of things.

But lets face it folks this goes back to me laying a weary eye on Oz Linden. He has ALWAYS been LL's fall guy. When ever there was bad news to be told it fell on Oz to tell us and LL would mostly never supply explantions to Oz so he had none for us. SO, LINDEN LAB tell me why I should not think Oz Linden is now being used again as the bad news for the sl 1 population? It has ALWAYS been that OZ WAS the BAD NEWS GIVER FOR US SO i FEAR ONCE AGAIN HE MAY BE BEING USED AS THEIR FALL GUY IN SL1. I mean lets face it putting Oz in charge of sl1 is like going from a landlord who cares to having a slumlord!

 I have a good 5 thousand dollars in inventory invested here in sl1. And I am not buying this catch 22 Line that Ebbe is handing out, get the merchants to upgrade the items, first off many of my items owners have gone out of business or left sl, and the catch 22 is that owners say "well why should i upgrade because of a situation that Linden labs created? While Linden labs says to get the merchants to upgrade. Linden labs will make every excuse and talk around the fact that they are about to ask a community to sacrifice a trillion dollars in inventory WITH NO COMPENSATION, but I guess thats where Oz comes in eh?

 

 

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Amethyst Jetaime wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:


greek Wingtips wrote:

thats interesting what they say, but it would not make sense to have both running as they would be direct competion with each other , and doubling the employee to both, so it would not make viable financial sense, and lets be real do you really thing LL would tell us they they be closing down SL no way the panic would drives us in drones away and close our accounts I reken they should come clean as to what they are going to do


It would not make sound financial sense to close SL while it is profitable if the new platform (SL2) hasn't largely attracted the SL population. So LL will do as the CEO has said, and keep SL running at the same time. It's my opinion that SL2 is intended to be the replacement for SL, but that doesn't mean they'll close SL down when SL2 opens. They will make a sound financial judgement when they close SL.

LL has said that they do not have any plans to close SL. I believe that. What I believe they do have are intentions to close SL as soon as SL doesn't make enough money. That will happen if and when the bulk of the SL population goes over to SL2. I believe that the bulk of the population will go over quite quickly - almost straight away. I think that many or most will use both worlds for a while, but then they'll find that SL2 is so much better (if it really is so much better), and tend to stay there. So I don't think it will be too long before SL becomes unprofitable and is closed down. I give it 2 year at the most, and maybe even just 1 year.

ETA: The CEO did say that L$ will go over the SL2, so we have no concerns on that score. He also said that some things will go over but he doesn't know what yet.

I think you are being overly optimistic.  The new grid won't be ready for beta for at least a year, and that assumes everything goes well.  When it opens for beta there will be practically no content, no places for people to go, not much if anything to buy.  It will be an empty world full of the new grid's equivalent of ruths.  It will take at least a year before creators are able to generate enough content to have even a fraction of what is now available in SL.  It will be a lot like open sims now, with very limited selection on most things and a complete absence of some other things.

Most people in SL may create an account and visit the new grid as soon as they can, but won't move over permanently until there is enough content there to satisfy them AND they are willing to leave behind most of their inventory, if not all of it and buy new things there.  Even then a segment won't move for various reasons and a lot of people will probably continue to use both grids for a long time.

SL will eventually close, but we all knew it would if and when it no long was profitable.  At that point, the remaining residents will either migrate permanently to the new grid,go to one of the open sims if they or their computers can't handle the new grid, go to another virtual world, or just quit.

I may be being overly optimistic, Amethyst. Bit it's the way I think it will happen. I don't think I'm overly optimistic by thinking that all the serious creators will be over there like a shot, and creating stuff like there's no tomorrow, because they know that there will be an almost guaranteed market.

My optimism is based on the assumption that SL2 will be a lot better for everyone than SL1. So much better that SL users in general will positively want to be there. When content is sufficiant for them, they will stay there. That's the basis for my thinking.

A year is along long time - plenty of time for all the serious creators to produce plenty of content. They won't be starting from scratch because they'll start out copying what they've already created for SL, so it'll be much quicker to build up plenty of stuff. Also, I do think that LL may allow serious creators to create stuff well before SL2 is open to the public, just as they allow creators to do what they can with Experience Keys, in advance of that system being put out to the grid. LL has a history of getting some users involved in new stuff well in advance of the new stuff going grid-wide. I don't think SL2's launch will be anything like SL1's. SL1 opened its doors to the public as an empty world, and the first users tentatively started building bits and pieces to see what could be done. I am sure that, when SL2's doors open, there will already be a fair amount of content in there.

So I'm sticking with my "overly-optimistic" estimate that SL1 will close 2 years at the most after SL2 arrives, and possibly even only 1 year later. Of course, that's just my own personal estimate - not even as strong as an opinion - and it may turn out to be very wide of the mark.

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When I hear all new I see a bare moonscape with nothing on it since nothing has been built yet, how can that be and everyone including sellers and creators being left with nothing to rebuild.

What creator who spent years on building houses will start from scratch and put in time to start over?

And what about estate owners who make a RL living (Chung), will they be bankrupt?

I fear this new SL because it seems to give little thought about the users in it, the people that bring life to this world.

Without us its a dead world

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I really don´t bother much at this point. Linden Lab didn´t specify anything so far.

Unless I see a working alpha and beta of this superficious "better" "next generation" thing (whatever it might be) I don´t worry much. My concern is that this project will be another total failure as so many ambitious LL projects before, and that the money invested in the development of "Betterworld" would be better imvested in evolving Second Life.

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Vivienne Schell wrote:

... the money invested in the development of "Betterworld" would be better imvested in evolving Second Life.

this pretty much sums it all up

SL cant evolve without rebuilding the sim grid infrastructure. The fundamentals of the grid itself is stuffed. Sim crossings and group chat the most visible signs of this

 

LL can do one of two things

a) rebuild SL according to a new infrastructure design and when done it will break most of the existing content

b) build a NextGen SL according to a new infrastructure design with new content. and keep the current SL running as is without breaking anything

LL have chosen to go with option b)

if I was the owner of SL then is what I would do also

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Coby Foden wrote:


greek Wingtips wrote:

 

I heard some say " oh dont worry SL will still be here" well I know in the Real world very unlike any bussiness to run two indentical or near bussiness closey related, If this is the final nail in the coffin of sl well LL better think very carefull as I for one will not be moving over to any other world and starting over again after nearly 7 years, if push comes to shove I would just move over to one of the other worlds and have a simple account.

Actually it will not be "new Second Life". Ebbe was referring to it as "
Next Generation Platform
". He also said that it will be "in the spirit of Second Life". So that gives a hint that it will have some similarities with Second Life. Ebbe has also said that it will be "better and more advanced" in many ways compared to Second Life. 

For this reason, I don't think anything - Ls or otherwise - is going to transfer. It doesn't make sense to bring 'old stuff' onto a 'new platform' that's rumored to be 'bigger, better, greater' than SL as we know it. If they wanted to support the 'old stuff', I doubt they would go to the trouble of creating a whole new platform to support it, rather than modifying the current one.

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Senobia Xenga wrote:


Coby Foden wrote:


greek Wingtips wrote:

 

I heard some say " oh dont worry SL will still be here" well I know in the Real world very unlike any bussiness to run two indentical or near bussiness closey related, If this is the final nail in the coffin of sl well LL better think very carefull as I for one will not be moving over to any other world and starting over again after nearly 7 years, if push comes to shove I would just move over to one of the other worlds and have a simple account.

Actually it will not be "new Second Life". Ebbe was referring to it as "
Next Generation Platform
". He also said that it will be "in the spirit of Second Life". So that gives a hint that it will have some similarities with Second Life. Ebbe has also said that it will be "better and more advanced" in many ways compared to Second Life. 

For this reason, I don't think anything - Ls or otherwise - is going to transfer. It doesn't make sense to bring 'old stuff' onto a 'new platform' that's rumored to be 'bigger, better, greater' than SL as we know it. If they wanted to support the 'old stuff', I doubt they would go to the trouble of creating a whole new platform to support it, rather than modifying the current one.

What the CEO did say is that they won't weaken SL2 just so that stuff from SL1 will port over (my wording). It doesn't mean that nothing will go over though. In fact he said that some stuff would go over but he doesn't know what yet.

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.."build a NextGen SL according to a new infrastructure design with new content. and keep the current SL running as is without breaking anything"

There is no hint on a "Second Life Two" so far. If Linden Lab would plan THIS, then they would simply have announced the development of "Second Life Two" instead of talking wishiwashi bubbles like "better", "spirit of SL", "advanced" and whatever else. And I think that their top executives are not stupid enough to plan a replacement for Second Life without backwards compatibility.

My guess is that this "Next Generation" thing will be completely different from Second Life in almost any way except that it uses avatars. And that it will allow user created content in some way. The only clear and defined quote there is that "It will run on more platforms". To me this is a proof for the intention to turn towards mobile devices and most probably some web based social media things and NOT continuing with the basical Second Life conception.

Note that Ebbie Altberg was exec at Yahoo and a Facebook related company before he joined LL, his relation to VR, 3D multiple user realtime enviroments/technology and Second Life in particular is zero, judged by his previous activities. To me, nothing I read so far indicates any kind of "Second Life Two". This sounds more like an attempt to develop a more mainstream and therefore stripped down, simplified, limited and regulated and basically different environment.

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