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Hey Ebbe, Ideas to Retain Users in the New World


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Derek Torvalar wrote:


madjim wrote:



Hey, you just reinvented Microsoft's Bob!

And that went well, didn't it...?

Father "Ebbe would probably go for that - again" Jim

Even if 'fleshed out' this one needs to be flushed out.

Notice how the negative people do not give any other ideas. I find this kind of strange. So, you think you have thought deeply about my proposal, yet this didn't lead to your own ideas. More likely, is that you aren't thinking deeply about it at all, and just want to put other people's idea down. Notice also, that no real arguments, as to why my idea will not work, has been given.

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Medhue Simoni wrote:


SLAddict Allen wrote:

A Linden Pet?

The Linden Home fiasco came to mind right off the bat.

Linden Lab needs to stop giving away things that content creators are trying to sell.

Seriously, if people can't compete with what LL gives out for free, then they should probably rethink their business plan. I owned a Linden Home, of course, but I literally gave it up, as it was just annoying to be there when I own a whole sim. The vast majority of people that have a LH, just use it as their home base, as you can't really do much there. Even the community areas are no script. Plus, a free product is a bit different than free land, which is not free cause they pay for it with their premium membership.

Another important point that I'll make is that the Default avatar was given to the community for free. What that did was establish a standard for creators to build off of. These pets could do exactly the same thing. Maybe a creator is good at mesh, but not an animator. So, they use the pets animation, and then code in their own behavior. As I stated, the Linden pet has a specific purpose, which is not competing with any business in SL, unless their whole business is teaching people how to use SL. If that is the case, I doubt they will be upset by free pets. Imagine you are a coder, but you can't animate or model. The coder could write in their own behavior and sell that. So, it actually encourages competition, which ultimate favors the consumer. I seriously doubt that any successful breedable company in SL will be in the least bit worried. They would likely love the idea because it will bring more functionality to their own products.

 

So, what is your idea for LL?

- Stay out of our inventories and leave that up to us.

- Move library items to regular inventory and allow deletion when we are done with the junk.

- Slash prices. Think of the old adage, less is more. The increase in volume sales will more than make up for the lost individual sales income. Bank on it. It works. Sell for cheap, move more inventory, make more money.

- KEEP FREE ACCOUNTS. I understand the security risks, but I cringe every time somebody begs for paid accounts only. Its a major insult to those who pay good money for Lindens when they so choose as opposed to paying every single month/year. And businesses don't like to just sit there empty. Creators would be begging Linden Lab to open Second Life back up to non-premium users pretty darn quickly I'm willing to bet, due to lack of market reach. Also, if everyone is forced to pay, Second Life, if successful, risks becoming a haven for credit card info theft. People WILL pay to attempt that kind of griefing.

- Bring back mentors.

- Advertise safety tips. It amazes me that some people in Second Life won't turn build off on their land. WE AS RESIDENTS can fix almost all griefing.

Just a start.

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Medhue Simoni wrote:


Derek Torvalar wrote:


madjim wrote:



Hey, you just reinvented Microsoft's Bob!

And that went well, didn't it...?

Father "Ebbe would probably go for that - again" Jim

Even if 'fleshed out' this one needs to be flushed out.

Notice how the negative people do not give any other ideas. I find this kind of strange. So, you think you have thought deeply about my proposal, yet this didn't lead to your own ideas. More likely, is that you aren't thinking deeply about it at all, and just want to put other people's idea down. Notice also, that no real arguments, as to why my idea will not work, has been given.

Why?

Why would I do that Medhue?

What's in it for me?

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Derek Torvalar wrote:


Medhue Simoni wrote:


Derek Torvalar wrote:


madjim wrote:



Hey, you just reinvented Microsoft's Bob!

And that went well, didn't it...?

Father "Ebbe would probably go for that - again" Jim

Even if 'fleshed out' this one needs to be flushed out.

Notice how the negative people do not give any other ideas. I find this kind of strange. So, you think you have thought deeply about my proposal, yet this didn't lead to your own ideas. More likely, is that you aren't thinking deeply about it at all, and just want to put other people's idea down. Notice also, that no real arguments, as to why my idea will not work, has been given.

Why?

Why would I do that Medhue?

What's in it for me?

Some brain exercising.....maybe, or a better virtual world? Some mental tennis?

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Medhue Simoni wrote:


Derek Torvalar wrote:

 

Why?

Why would I do that Medhue?

What's in it for me?

Some brain exercising.....maybe, or a better virtual world? Some mental tennis?

Answer his questions Medhue. You sound like Ebbe saying the things that Peter Gray tells him, obfuscating the issue and offering information not germane to the subject. Derek IS exercising his brain and is certainly playing mental tennis, to a level that you can only aspire to achieve.

The better virtual world certainly won't come to pass as a result of ANYTHING posted in these forums; Ebbe will be an ex-employee before the time V2 gets consigned to the Boulevard of Broken Dreams.

"And you STILL haven't said what's in it for Derek.

Father "Cynic is the label applied by a hopeless optimist to a realist" Jim

 

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Oh, and the big question Ebbe now has to resolve is not retention of users in the new world.

It's how to retain SL's current user base so that a flow of funds is available for investment to develop the new world.

His premature, and obviously unprepared, announcement will be driving the current SL economy further into recession until concrete plans for the "BetterWorld" are revealed.

Once they are, things may improve, but more likely those plans will be derided as much as Ebbe's lack of PR nous.

Father "enjoy it while you still can" Jim

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madjim wrote:

Oh, and the big question Ebbe now has to resolve is not retention of users in the new world.

It's how to retain SL's current user base so that a flow of funds is available for investment to develop the new world.

His premature, and obviously unprepared, announcement will be driving the current SL economy further into recession until concrete plans for the "BetterWorld" are revealed.

Once they are, things may improve, but more likely those plans will be derided as much as Ebbe's lack of PR nous.

Father "enjoy it while you still can" Jim

I love it when people talk about things they have no knowledge of at all. The drama is really just about over. I can see it in my sales. So, basically, all this drama created by people that don't know a thing about 3D creation, nor game engines, has just about runs it's course.

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Medhue Simoni wrote:


Derek Torvalar wrote:


Medhue Simoni wrote:


Derek Torvalar wrote:


madjim wrote:



Hey, you just reinvented Microsoft's Bob!

And that went well, didn't it...?

Father "Ebbe would probably go for that - again" Jim

Even if 'fleshed out' this one needs to be flushed out.

Notice how the negative people do not give any other ideas. I find this kind of strange. So, you think you have thought deeply about my proposal, yet this didn't lead to your own ideas. More likely, is that you aren't thinking deeply about it at all, and just want to put other people's idea down. Notice also, that no real arguments, as to why my idea will not work, has been given.

Why?

Why would I do that Medhue?

What's in it for me?

Some brain exercising.....maybe, or a better virtual world? Some mental tennis?

You are going to have to do a lot better than that Medhue. lol

And I am not talking about some paltry incentive programme instituted by the Lab offering 10K L$ to help them improve their product  or clean up their buggy software. Or some sponsorship like that given to that ass licker Drax. I do not aspire to be one of Ebbe's b*tch bois.

You may start at $500 USD per hour with a 25K retainer. Alternatively, a three month contract at 250K.

 

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Derek Torvalar wrote:


You may start at $500 USD per hour with a 25K retainer. Alternatively, a three month contract at 250K.

 

oooo! reverse auction

i bid $499.95 but reserve right to go down to 99c if anybody else bids. Or 23c if I have to. if I have to go below 23c then other person probably needs the work more than me. so they can have it ok

 

 

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LaskyaClaren wrote:


Ceka Cianci wrote:

I'm curious,Is this actually a new SL or is it  another virtual world/another product of linden lab's?

 

That may be a question of semantics.

It will be, apparently, a new VW built around an entirely new code base, with the result that many elements present in the current SL will be incompabible with it. It sounds as though it will not support prims, sculpties, animations in their current file format (BVH, right?), or LSL scripting.
It may also be close-sourced.

In other regards, though, it sounds as though it will be very similar to Second Life, with free avatars, land for sale or rent, user-generated content, community standards, etc.

 

I am surprised at you Lasya. You don't normally make such mistakes. It WILL be closed source. However the viewer will initially be closed source and may later become open source - but that's the viewer.

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Derek Torvalar wrote:



You are going to have to do a lot better than that Medhue. lol

And I am not talking about some paltry incentive programme instituted by the Lab offering 10K L$ to help them improve their product  or clean up their buggy software. Or some sponsorship like that given to that ass licker Drax. I do not aspire to be one of Ebbe's b*tch bois.

You may start at $500 USD per hour with a 25K retainer. Alternatively, a three month contract at 250K.

 

Well, you kind of prove yourself wrong right here by responding to me, as I have not, and will likely never, pay you a dime.

That said, I make it a point to only charge for labor, and only contract for work that requires labor. Because of this, I'm constantly in talks with different companies, and contracted by them for various work. For 1, they wanted more animation work, but I couldn't do those yet, as their main character wasn't ready. They only had the head. So, I had a good conversation with them, threw out some ideas that I knew I could handle for them, and now all of a sudden, I'm attaching the head to a body, and creating all the facial morphs and clothing for him. The clothing, of course, I contracted out to a good SL designer, in which she was paid a good amount over her normal custom job rate. All this because I free give out ideas. It's not just to get me jobs too, as I'll get jobs when they actually do need me. Like, right now, I'm making new flying animations for all their birds. I was the 1 who found them those birds in the Unity MP, and the creator  included all the animations, but the company doesn't like the flying animations. They saved a ton of money, and I still got work out of it. They originally asked me to make the birds, but that's not how I felt like spending the new month. Plus, by not being hired by the company full time, I can do work on anything else, or work for anyone else, which is how I prefer things. Right now, I do regular work for about 4 companies, and I have time for more, if it's interesting enough.

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I just want to add that, imo, your idea is a very good one. It could include much more than the box messages we get in the first few days when doing something for the first time. The 'pet' could be an attachment - sitting on your shoulder, for instance, or even an invisible one pretending to be in your pocket.

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Phil Deakins wrote:

I just want to add that, imo, your idea is a very good one. It could include much more than the box messages we get in the first few days when doing something for the first time. The 'pet' could be an attachment - sitting on your shoulder, for instance, or even an invisible one pretending to be in your pocket.

I would hope that it could not be an attachment, and the pet could still sit on your shoulder, and teleport with you. This is kind of why it would be cool for LL to do this, as it will automatically add more functionality to the pet system. Or maybe, it attaches and detaches from you in the background, when it wants to ride on you.

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I'm thinking in tems of what we know in SL, and not interms of the new system. My mistake. Although I'm wondering how attractive a nearby pet would be. As you said, sitting on your shoulder but not attached would be nice.

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Medhue Simoni wrote:

 

I love it when people talk about things they have no knowledge of at all. The drama is really just about over. I can see it in my sales. So, basically, all this drama created by people that don't know a thing about 3D creation, nor game engines, has just about runs [sic] it's [sic] course.

And there we have the crux of your problem. You seem to believe that technical knowledge regarding 3D creation or game engines means that you understand business. As with most creators and artists, you really don't have the first clue. You remind me of the answer to the question: How do you get a creative person to run a small company? You just give them a big company and wait a year or so.

But keep talking, you might persuade other creators and artists to buy your stuff so you can pretend that the world is not going to end very soon.

You also remind me of the guy who jumped off the top of the Empire State Building, and was seen smiling and talking all the way down.

Father "What he was saying was 'All right so far. All right so far . . . ' "

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madjim wrote:


Medhue Simoni wrote:

 

I love it when people talk about things they have no knowledge of at all. The drama is really just about over. I can see it in my sales. So, basically, all this drama created by people that don't know a thing about 3D creation, nor game engines, has just about runs [sic] it's [sic] course.

And there we have the crux of your problem. You seem to believe that technical knowledge regarding 3D creation or game engines means that you understand business. As with most creators and artists, you really don't have the first clue. You remind me of the answer to the question: How do you get a creative person to run a small company? You just give them a big company and wait a year or so.

But keep talking, you might persuade other creators and artists to buy your stuff so you can pretend that the world is not going to end very soon.

You also remind me of the guy who jumped off the top of the Empire State Building, and was seen smiling and talking all the way down.

Father "What he was saying was 'All right so far. All right so far . . . ' "

You do not know me very well, do you? Hmm, let's see, yesterday my sales were above average. OMG, the sky is not falling! See, what some people don't understand, is that markets can only be slightly rattled by the fear mongers who aren't basing their predictions on sound economic principles. Eventually, the market goes back to those sound principle, and not the hype. SL is not going anywhere, hence what was profitable before the hype, is still profitable today, next week, and likely next year. Of course, if you don't know a dang thing about the actual market you are predicting for, you likely aren't going to be correct. It's understandable why people like yourself want merchants to fail, as jealousy is a powerful motivator for some, but it has nothing to do with reality.

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Suspiria Finucane wrote:


Maryanne Solo wrote:

\0_ !!!! 

Hi Susy!

BigHeapTrollothon got smacked down bad?? lol :smileyvery-happy:

Back tho of course.:smileytongue:

Regurgitators are wilting hahahaha.:matte-motes-tongue:

Interesting what a CEO can do
giggle.gif

Even more interesting is what a CEO and his combined "might" of technical, legal and PR forces are unable to do...

Father "Their impotence is illuminating" Jim

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Medhue Simoni wrote:

 

You do not know me very well, do you?

No, but I know your type only too well. I spent most of the 80s listening to creatives who couldn't understand why their business was doing so well on Awards Night, had a string of blue chip clients, and seemed to win every pitch they wooed, yet there was not enough left in the bank to pay salaries at the end of the month.

I spent another decade around the turn of the century listening to technical creatives who thought that registering a cool domain was 90% of the effort in setting up an internet business, and insisted on building sites for the 5% of the market that had the same high-spec PCs on which they developed their undocumented systems.

What was I doing? Mainly trying to rescue them before their idiot funding ran out. Some listened - one in particular ended up floating in the US before allowing NCR to make millionaires of the founders, although I just took my usual upfront fee, dammit - but most didn't. I presume that several of my defunct ex-clients are now among the SL creator "elite", living in a fantasy world and selling unnecessary crap to other fantasists.

Oh, and I am also a Cambridge educated economist - taught by the Governor of the Bank of England whose belatedly-followed advice rescued the UK *and* the USA following the crisis - so please don't start trying to tell me about market behaviour; Keynes would have agreed with you about the confidence factor being critical, and I can understand your desperate but unavailing attempts to reassure anybody who might be listening that everything will be alright in the end, but I am afraid that Mr Altberg's PR disaster has fatally undermined the market as well as his standing with his customers and Board. The official silence is resounding.

Father "And I have a feeling the next major announcement may not be what you are hoping for" Jim

 

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madjim wrote:


Oh, and I am also a Cambridge educated economist - taught by the Governor of the Bank of England whose belatedly-followed advice rescued the UK *and* the USA following the crisis - so please don't start trying to tell me about market behaviour; Keynes would have agreed with you about the confidence factor being critical, and I can understand your desperate but unavailing attempts to reassure anybody who might be listening that everything will be alright in the end, but I am afraid that Mr Altberg's PR disaster has fatally undermined the market as well as his standing with his customers and Board. The official silence is resounding.

Father "And I have a feeling the next major announcement may not be what you are hoping for" Jim

 

Well, you just proved you know nothing about economics, as nobody needed saving, besides the people that caused the problem. Looks like Cambridge scammed you out of thousands of dollars. The average guy, would not have been affected at all by the crisis. Only the people that made irrational deals would have been hurt, which is exactly who should have be hurt by it. What the central banks did was save all the criminals and gave the public the bill. The average guy would have benefited from the crisis, because housing prices should had fallen greatly after the crisis. Housing prices did not because of all the money that was printed. So, again, the whole point was to save all the rich people and screw all the poor.

Where did I say that confidence means anything at all? That only applies to fake products, not real 1's. Real products aren't affected by confidence at all. Why would they be? People either need or want the product or they don't. The company's owners could all be known criminals, and it would not make even the slightest difference. It's all about the product. In a virtual world, it might have some affect, but not over and above the product.

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madjim wrote:


Oh, and I am also a Cambridge educated economist - taught by the Governor of the Bank of England whose belatedly-followed advice rescued the UK *and* the USA following the crisis

 

 

Of course you are. I remember you from those classes. I do hope the acne has cleared up.

I've since gone on to a quite successful career and life. I've even acquired a George Cross, for having disarmed and disabled a group of Provos whe were bent on harming the Queen as she parachuted into the Olympic Stadium.

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i was going to comment on Mervyn King before. But I didnt

Comment on his wonderful insights, dire warnings and mutterings on State Welfare for the unfortunate among us as is Right and Proper for a British Liberalist to do and is Right and Proper for the Nation to concede. Then the banks that he was supposed to be superintending on Behalf of the Nation fell over

then obviously State Welfare not only become a Good Thing. but Desirable even. A burn in the desert bush moment for him

and like St Paul nee Saul he realise the error of his ways. Humbled himself and become the Great Advocate for State Welfare. Same like is no one more virtuous than a born-again hooker i mean monetarist 

so great was his Newfound Virtue that he start off by giving 10 billions pounds of alms to the New Poor. Was really wonderful to see such generousity of spirit and unselfishness

so Great was his Virtue that he get rewarded for his newfound devoutness to Charity and Good Deeds and Kindness toward the new unfortunates. A Order of the Garter even and a seat in the Lords. Baron King of Something or Other

and Well Deserved as well. Apparently

but like I say at the start I dont want to comment on any of this

+

sooo tell me more about how you save the Queen. Must of been really fun and exciting. And a bit scary as well ?!?

i dunno if is actual true this story tho. but is way more believable than the story about Mervyn the Great Redeemer

like i bet there was at least 20 provos. Maybe even 50. and all you had was like a pen or something and a piece of string. Kinda like MacGyver and Daniel "Dreamboat" Bond. But Better !!!

(:

 

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