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Dear Ebbe Altberg and Philip Rosedale - Public Vote Request

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Tex Monday wrote:

Please forgive me if I'm wrong on this, but I think what Kayleigh meant by leaked is the that the news did not come in an official SL press release. The way residents and third party developers found out is from that meeting where Ebbe "happened to mention" there was a new platform coming out.

It probably wouldn't have caused less outrage, but might have been better (IMHO) if an official press release was put out stating that LL is developing a new platform that will co-exist alongside SL..blah blah blah.
Even the third party developers, Jessica especially, had no idea this was coming and felt blindsided
. That's why all these forum posts are out there and why some in the community were panicing as to the future of our world.

I just noticed the bolded part when someone else responded to it. There is no reason at all why TPV makers should know anything in advance of the rest of us. So your "Even the third party developers..." is simply nothing.

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Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

Yep. It's not too difficult to let something accidentally slip out in a verbal discussion, but it's *very* difficult to let something accidentally slip out in a typed one.

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LaskyaClaren wrote:


Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

This is an interesting perspective, and certainly at odds with the perception of most people here.

In your view,
is this strategy "working"? Or is it too early to tell yet?

May I give an answer to that? Gonna do anyway :)

Imo, it's working just fine. From what i've read in the threads, most people are actually looking forward to the new platform, and accept that all of their stuff won't go over. And this was achieved so much in advance that everyone, except a few die hards, will settle down to continuing with SL as normal. So SL will continue as normal and without any ongoing panic or similar. That seems like a success to me.

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LaskyaClaren wrote:

This is an interesting perspective, and certainly at odds with the perception of most people here.

In your view, is this strategy "working"? Or is it too early to tell yet?

 I think it's a mixed bag...and here's why:

On the positive side, the new platform is supposed to be similar to SL1 (I think). Your textures and lindens are supposed to transfer over as well, which leads me to believe that you'll be able to carry your name and identity over as well. Which will be a big bonus to those of us who've been here for a while.

On the negative side, most of your inventory won't carry..I remember hearing that textures may carry over but due to a lot of items being prim heavy, they all won't go. I believe a lot of the new platform will work with new technology (Occulus Rift, for example) which may leave some older users or those who can't afford that kind of stuff, out. I don't know anything about the viewer technolgoy, but from what I understand you will only be able to use the official SL viewer and not Third Party, like Firestorm or Singularity.

Another concern is this....SL has been around for 11 years. That's 11 years of fantastic builders and designers creating the landscape inworld. They've been able to make everything: Dance Clubs, Momunments, Museums and entire cities. I am under the impression (and correct me if I'm wrong) that all those things will have to be recreated. Can you imagine having to build Bay City or Crack Den (as examples) all over again. Work that hundreds of builders, some who aren't even with us anymore, created.....now gone...lost forever.

It's not going to be the same, I don't think. I understand why they're doing it: you have to change..you have to go with new technology..but I don't have to like it.

As I said, I'll probably be the last one out...so I'll hit the lights before I go. :matte-motes-sunglasses-3:

Edited to correct basic gramatical errors...because I think faster than I type....

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Phil Deakins wrote:


Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

Yep. It's not too difficult to let something accidentally slip out in a verbal discussion, but it's *very* difficult to let something accidentally slip out in a typed one.

I'm still trying to figure out the why of letting this info drop... They have zero concrete info to give anyone.. why not wait a few months while they hash out some of the features?

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I've no opinions or ideas about that. All I know is that, imo, now was a good time to let the news out, simply because it's so far in advance of the new platform that it won't, or shouldn't, affect anyone's use of SL for quite some time, and we still get to know that the new thing is on the far horizon.

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I'm still stunned that there has been no word of the official SL website or viewer.. It's like they wanted to let the forumites and TPV users know but not the users of teh official viewer.

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Yes, that's odd. An official announcement (blog) would tend to do away with all the speculations and misunderstandings that have been floating around as word of mouth spreads the news.

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Phil Deakins wrote:


Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

Yep. It's not too difficult to let something accidentally slip out in a verbal discussion, but it's *very* difficult to let something accidentally slip out in a typed one.

I watched the video of the TPV meeting where this blurting... erm.. slip of a tongue... hum.. I mean the announcement :matte-motes-big-grin: of the next generation platform was done by Ebbe.

It appears that it indeed was a planned thing to announce the next generation platform in that meeting. Ebbe's voice was very confident when he released the news; there was no sign at all of an accidental slip of a tongue.

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Qie Niangao wrote:

Too soon to tell, I think. I'd feel better about it if they also had business changes to announce now -- like an immediate start to shifting their revenue sources from such a near complete dependence on Land to some transaction-based "tax", but that was something Pete Linden was clear they weren't going to announce now.

Other than that, honestly, I've come to realize that we really have no clue how similar the new platform will be to SL1. Right now (and my sense of this shifts all the time), I'm thinking SL2 will be so different from SL1 that most of us won't have any more interest in it than, say, a new release of Grand Theft Auto. Other days I think it will be so similar to SL1 that we'll all just naturally migrate over to it, our Inventories nearly intact. In fact, either of those extremes would be fine with me; it's the space in between where I think their business is at risk, and where it would be extraordinarily tricky to plan communications

I'm sure later, we'll be able to look back and say that it should have been obvious, and it was all telegraphed by what they communicated and when they communicated it. I'm not seeing it yet, though.

I think I'd agree: the impact of this isn't going to be dramatic, but rather attenuated over the time it takes for the new VW to be developed. It will be interesting, however, to see if the next round of grid stats and other numbers suggest something.

I obviously don't know anymore than you (and probably less) what is really intended for this next gen world, but certainly, if what Ebbe has said is to be credited, it will be recognizably like SL in many fundamentals: in-world creation tools, land sales and rentals, an economy founded upon user-generated content, free (perhaps) accounts, a ratings system and CS guidelines at least similar to those in SL.

The devil will be in the details, and I don't just mean the tech stuff. It won't be how the draw distance, crispness of rendering, or fps rates that determine whether this works or not.

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Phil Deakins wrote:


LaskyaClaren wrote:


Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

This is an interesting perspective, and certainly at odds with the perception of most people here.

In your view,
is this strategy "working"? Or is it too early to tell yet?

May I give an answer to that? Gonna do anyway
:)

Imo, it's working just fine. From what i've read in the threads, most people are actually looking forward to the new platform, and accept that all of their stuff won't go over. And this was achieved so much in advance that everyone, except a few die hards, will settle down to continuing with SL as normal. So SL will continue as normal and without any ongoing panic or similar. That seems like a success to me.

You may be right, Phil. I hope you are right. At the moment, however, it may be too soon to really know, and most of the information we are working with is anecdotal. The SL forums, for instance, are hardly representative of the in-world population as a whole.

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Qie Niangao wrote:


Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

For example, as I type this, Oz is currently talking at the Firestorm meeting about SL1 going forward. Later today there will be an announcement (complete with Torley video) about Experience Tools -- something we've been trying to get details about for a year, and I think there's no coincidence that the communications about it have been delayed until after the new platform was announced.

Oz also mentioned releases just around the corner for:
  • group chat improvments,
  • better embedded web support -- e.g., Media On A Prim -- replacing WebKit with Chrome Embedded Framework, and
  • continued improvement of texture loading speeds (HTTP pipelining).

Some are known quantities, but they're ready to talk a lot more about them. (For these, cause and effect of the timing is debatable, I know. But the obvious delay in the Experience Tools stuff, in particular, sure seems to have been intended to make this exciting news follow the new platform announcement.)

I agree completely that it was planned. I mentioned in another post about the current VR hype cycle and the timing was actually a little late but caught the cycle. LL isn't banking on the new platform yet, so keeping interest up in the old platform is paramount for the time being. Once the marketing shift occurs, people will see a change.

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LaskyaClaren wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:


LaskyaClaren wrote:


Qie Niangao wrote:

I think the communications on this have been
very carefully
managed.

I also think it's quaintly charming, how folks imagine that the CEO just blurted something out accidentally, as if there weren't a detailed plan worked out in advance.

This is an interesting perspective, and certainly at odds with the perception of most people here.

In your view,
is this strategy "working"? Or is it too early to tell yet?

May I give an answer to that? Gonna do anyway
:)

Imo, it's working just fine. From what i've read in the threads, most people are actually looking forward to the new platform, and accept that all of their stuff won't go over. And this was achieved so much in advance that everyone, except a few die hards, will settle down to continuing with SL as normal. So SL will continue as normal and without any ongoing panic or similar. That seems like a success to me.

You may be right, Phil. I hope you are right. At the moment, however, it may be too soon to really know, and most of the information we are working with is anecdotal. The SL forums, for instance, are hardly representative of the in-world population as a whole.

I should think LL knows far more about what the in-world population is like than any of us. They know our spending habits, our total investments and divestitures, inventory size, visitation rates and durations, ad infinitum ad nauseum. They should also be easily able to discern if forumites are a different kind of creature. We can theorize. They know.

By this stage in Rod Humble's tenure, I'd already written him off.

I'm still enjoying the honeymoon with Ebbe.

;-).

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Kayleigh McMillan wrote:

I am not worried nor do I feel left out but I thank you so very much for your concerns that is very much appreciated :-)

Did you notice I placed leak between qoutes as such: "leak".

I'm awared this was a planned slip of the tongue or "official" announcement if you will.

It's just a shame they hadn't let Peter Grey know, so he could have prepared some damage limitation material.

Or even some prepared answers other than "We're not ready to talk about this yet".

Father "It's funny how those attending that discussion have suggested that it didn't seem intentional at the time" Jim

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Madelaine McMasters wrote:

I should think LL knows far more about what the in-world population is like than any of us. They know our spending habits, our total investments and divestitures, inventory size, visitation rates and durations, ad infinitum ad nauseum. They should also be easily able to discern if forumites are a different kind of creature. We can theorize. They know.

By this stage in Rod Humble's tenure, I'd already written him off.

I'm still enjoying the honeymoon with Ebbe.

;-).

I'm quite sure that LL has access to a great deal of data that we don't, and in that sense should "know" better than we do. But there is a world of difference between having such data, and interpreting and applying it correctly. I don't think one has to look far to find instances of companies with reams of information at their disposal making very poor decisions. Here in Canada, we are still recovering from the disaster that Research in Motion has become.

I hope your faith in LL is well-placed. My personal sense of loyalty to the company is just about zip; I seldom become attached to corporations. But Second Life is another thing: LL has produced something quite wonderful there, and I don't want to see it die.

As for Ebbe, well, I'll agree that I am still hopeful.

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LaskyaClaren wrote:


Madelaine McMasters wrote:

I should think LL knows far more about what the in-world population is like than any of us. They know our spending habits, our total investments and divestitures, inventory size, visitation rates and durations, ad infinitum ad nauseum. They should also be easily able to discern if forumites are a different kind of creature. We can theorize. They know.

By this stage in Rod Humble's tenure, I'd already written him off.

I'm still enjoying the honeymoon with Ebbe.

;-).

I'm quite sure that LL has access to a great deal of data that we don't, and in that sense should "know" better than we do. But there is a world of difference between having such data, and interpreting and applying it correctly. I don't think one has to look far to find instances of companies with reams of information at their disposal making very poor decisions. Here in Canada, we are still recovering from the disaster that Research in Motion has become.

I hope your faith in LL is well-placed. My personal sense of loyalty to the company is just about zip; I seldom become attached to corporations. But Second Life is another thing: LL has produced something quite wonderful there, and I don't want to see it die.

As for Ebbe, well, I'll agree that I am still hopeful.

It's not that I have faith in LL. It's that I don't have faith in myself. I'm hardly expert on what makes virtual worlds successful. It's possible that if SL1 worked the way I want, I'd be the only one using it.

;-).

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Madelaine McMasters wrote:

It's possible that if SL1 worked the way I want, I'd be the only one using it.

And the rest of wouldn't end up as toast :D

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Yes, I agree!

Somehow my gut feeling tells me LL wanted to let us know this exactly the way they did :-)

Especially because the media in our country knew it around the same time as it was told to the "selected few".

While SL isn't a hot topic here at all.

 

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Madelaine McMasters wrote:

It's not that I have faith in LL. It's that I don't have faith in myself. I'm hardly expert on what makes virtual worlds successful. It's possible that if SL1 worked the way I want, I'd be the only one using it.

;-).

Oh, well, I agree. I'm hardly an expert either, and I have "concerns" or "questions" rather than solutions, really, for just that reason.

Of course there's a paradox in your last comment: were you the only one using it, SL would hardly be working the way you want, would it?

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LaskyaClaren wrote:


Madelaine McMasters wrote:

It's not that I have faith in LL. It's that I don't have faith in myself. I'm hardly expert on what makes virtual worlds successful. It's possible that if SL1 worked the way I want, I'd be the only one using it.

;-).

Oh, well, I agree. I'm hardly an expert either, and I have "concerns" or "questions" rather than solutions, really, for just that reason.

Of course there's a paradox in your last comment: were you the only one using it, SL would hardly be working the way you want, would it?

I am divorced, remember?

And that's working well.

;-).

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Madelaine McMasters wrote:


LaskyaClaren wrote:


Madelaine McMasters wrote:

It's not that I have faith in LL. It's that I don't have faith in myself. I'm hardly expert on what makes virtual worlds successful. It's possible that if SL1 worked the way I want, I'd be the only one using it.

;-).

Oh, well, I agree. I'm hardly an expert either, and I have "concerns" or "questions" rather than solutions, really, for just that reason.

Of course there's a paradox in your last comment: were you the only one using it, SL would hardly be working the way you want, would it?

I am divorced, remember?

And that's working well.

;-).

Maddy, I'm hurt. :-(

And who would call you Nefarious if you were the only one here?

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Phil Deakins wrote:

Yes, that's odd. An official announcement (blog) would tend to do away with all the speculations and misunderstandings that have been floating around as word of mouth spreads the news.

LL's track record on communicating with it's Users and Customers has been abysmal for years.  They seem to lack an understanding of what is important to both.  Unannounced changes in "official policies" in the knowledge base that unless you happen to "stumble" on them have caught people suddenly in violation of things.

Changes have been made that weren't legal issues without giving people a chance to adapt or adjust what they were doing. 

I simply just do not get it.

If LL's track record on communications had been better, this slip of the tongue announcement at the TPV meeting might have gone over a lot better than it did.

 

eta: need to remember to proof read

second edit: additional clarity

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You're right, of course. I was wrong. It isn't odd at all. It would only be odd if LL were known to treat customers as most companies treat them, and not as abysmally as they have done through the years.

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Phil Deakins wrote:

You're right, of course. I was wrong. It isn't odd at all. It would only be odd if LL were known to treat customers as most companies treat them, and not as abysmally as they have done through the years.

One thing if you note, I am making a distinction between "Users" and "Customers." 

There is a difference.  I probably should make a second edit to my post.

The problem as I see it is that LL wants to manintain the Blogs as a "feel good" source of information.

So where do they announce things that might reflect negatively.

There was one rewrite of the Adult content policies that went beyond minor tweaks.  What will a someone with a "G Rated" mind think about SL and joining it if they see that?

(My opinion is still that there should have been a Blog Post).

(And I am going to make a second edit).

 

 

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I usually do too - differentiate between users and customers.

I'm very interested to know what the big change was to the Adult Content policy that was slipped in under the radar. My understanding of the policy is still the same as when it was first came in. I may have been breaking the rules for a long time without knowing.

 

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