Qie Niangao Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Perrie Juran wrote: There are obstacles you will need to overcome. For instance you spoke of getting a "cover charge." There is a huge "play for free" attitude that pervades SL. To get people to pay you are going to need to come up with some very unique ideas. I'm not saying it can't be done. I've seen events that required a "cover charge" to attend. But they are very rare in SL, mainly because of the "play for free" attitude that pervades SL. This thread has more than a whiff of troll about it, but just in case: Perrie's advice here is simple and on the mark. I've seen parcel cover charges tried many times, and every single time it spelled doom for the business, usually sooner rather than later. Maybe the OP has the secret sauce to finally make it work this time, but one must weigh all that enthusiasm against ten years of failed attempts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celestiall Nightfire Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Qie Niangao wrote: Perrie Juran wrote: There are obstacles you will need to overcome. For instance you spoke of getting a "cover charge." There is a huge "play for free" attitude that pervades SL. To get people to pay you are going to need to come up with some very unique ideas. I'm not saying it can't be done. I've seen events that required a "cover charge" to attend. But they are very rare in SL, mainly because of the "play for free" attitude that pervades SL. This thread has more than a whiff of troll about it, but just in case: Perrie's advice here is simple and on the mark. I've seen parcel cover charges tried many times, and every single time it spelled doom for the business, usually sooner rather than later. Maybe the OP has the secret sauce to finally make it work this time, but one must weigh all that enthusiasm against ten years of failed attempts. A good way to handle the "cover" charge is to set the *Island to group, and charge to join the group. There are a lot of successful places in SL that operate this way. The group join fee acts as the cover charge, and a filter. People TP into a landing area, and have to join the group to go further. *Or the places on the island that are to be "member's only". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Clarence Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 IvanTwin Rogers wrote: I support your enthusiasm, and don't get discouraged by the negative comments of many here, what happens is that these forums are full of adult old people of more than 30 years and 40 years of age, and they are offended when someone tells them that second life is a game, in my personal opinion, second life is a game, but in a virtual world, here there are many people, grandfathers and grandmothers stuck in second life and for them is difficult to recognize that this is a game, along with your plans, these forums are full of a bunch of olders ancients of 40, 50 and 60 years old :matte-motes-angry: You can write comprehensibly in English! Go figure. A few less commas and a a few more periods would have nailed it. PS I love this thread as it is chockful of good drama. /tips his hat to the OP, well done standing your ground. Good luck with your venture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheriColette Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Yes I wish him good luck too. We dont have the right to stomp on anyones dreams. My rl name has the meaning. of one who is gifted with prophecies but that noone would believe them. I think he will build his concept and people will come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Jetaime Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 CheriColette wrote: Yes I wish him good luck too. We dont have the right to stomp on anyones dreams. My rl name has the meaning. of one who is gifted with prophecies but that noone would believe them. I think he will build his concept and people will come. No one is stomping on his dreams just giving him advice based on experience. In 71/2 years I've seen some fantastic concepts and fantastic looking places but I've never seen a bar or club that charged any kind of cover charge survive long, even members only places that appeal to the snob factor.. The overwhelming majority of people just are not willing to pay a cover period. People don't go to bars to drink in SL like in RL, they go to socialize, dance and listen to music or maybe go to pick up an escort or play a game. No matter how fantastic it is there is always going to be another one out there that suits the patron just as well and is free. Bars and clubs are also money pits. It is rare they make enough money to cover the tiers of the land they sit on, let alone support other things on a sim. You have one because its a hobby for you and you enjoy it or its a loss leader to get people to your sim to spend money on something else. Even if he came up with something fantastic and succeeded at first, it wouldn't be long before other bars/clubs did the same thing and either charged less than he does or were free and that would attract his customers. You can't copyright an idea so there is no way he can keep his idea exclusive to his venue. There are places that require group membership and it costs to join the group, but it is a one time charge and they generally offer a lot more than just a bar/club. They depend on a lot of new people joining the group every day too. Even so, it is doubtful they make much if any money after expenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syo Emerald Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 CheriColette wrote: Yes I wish him good luck too. We dont have the right to stomp on anyones dreams. My rl name has the meaning. of one who is gifted with prophecies but that noone would believe them. I think he will build his concept and people will come. So you would rather lie to people like him and make him jump into something to waste around 300$, if not more? Yeah....thats so much support and so helpful...not. Thats like supporting a child in its idea to jump down from a balcony on the 3rd floor, because, you know, his selfmade wings sure look good. Every explaination about physics or dangers would stomp its dreams! :matte-motes-bored: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dresden Ceriano Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Storm Clarence wrote: PS I love this thread as it is chockful of good drama. The funny thing is that there was no real reason for the drama, but I suppose that's what makes it so amusing. ...Dres Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Clarence Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Syo Emerald wrote: So you would rather lie to people like him and make him jump into something to waste around 300$, if not more? Since when do participants of this forum discriminate? They seem to lie to everyone, not just him. Who are we to tell him how to spend his money? I am not his mother or his accountant or his friend. His world, your imagination? I was delighted to see him stand his ground against all the naysayers; the "older" players who think they know SL better than everyone else. I find it similar to Darrius writing last week what "we' need from the new CEO. I laugh so hard when I read such nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Clarence Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Amethyst Jetaime wrote In 71/2 years I've seen some fantastic concepts and fantastic looking places but I've never seen a bar or club that charged any kind of cover charge survive long, even members only places that appeal to the snob factor.. The overwhelming majority of people just are not willing to pay a cover period. Frank's Elite started 3 1/2 years ago and has 83,000 members at 500L$ a pop. That's 83,000 snobs. Ka-ching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jujmental Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 If you have to ask you won't be able to afford me. © The Judge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venus Petrov Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Hi Geremio, First let me say that I am happy you enjoyed your experience at Ambrosia Dance Club. I have DJ'ed there since 2007. Ambrosia is one of the most successful clubs, if not THE, in SL. It started on a modest parcel on a mainland sim in 2006 and slowly expanded as the owner acquired land around the club. Finally, he splurged and bought a sim in 2008. Now he has five clubs and four sims. Succeeding in the club world of SL aint easy but, with the right attitude (and it sounds like you have one), one can have fun with it. Since you are not a builder, you might think first about purchasing a building and equipping it with the things you need: dancefloor, bar, stages, tipjars, stream board, etc. Whatever you think would set the proper mood for your club. Most, if not all, staff (dancers, DJs, bartenders/security) are paid in tips. It is your choice to pay a salary and even a modest one plus tips can attract staff (not necessarily the best staff, but staff). I suggest that you visit busy clubs around the grid. Talk to patrons and staff and find out what they say they like about going there/working there. Good luck! Edit: When approaching staff, it is best that you make clear up front that you are not trying to hire them out from the club, that you can wait until they finish their shift to chat, and can chat at a time convenient to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perrie Juran Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Storm Clarence wrote: Amethyst Jetaime wrote In 71/2 years I've seen some fantastic concepts and fantastic looking places but I've never seen a bar or club that charged any kind of cover charge survive long, even members only places that appeal to the snob factor.. The overwhelming majority of people just are not willing to pay a cover period. Frank's Elite started 3 1/2 years ago and has 83,000 members at 500L$ a pop. That's 83,000 snobs. Ka-ching. I thought Frank's was older than that. I had joined because a few girls I knew liked going there and I enjoy Formal dancing in SL. I'm not sure where you got the 83,000. Current membership is about 23,000. We of course don't know how many people have left the group. It still however is a tidy sum and if you subtract tier it works out to a healthy profit if I did my math right. I don't know how much or if they pay their staff and DJ's. I do however consider the group description deceptive. "Frank's Elite Jazz Club, our member's exclusive destination, is an entire resort sim designed as an expansion to the Franks Jazz Club experience and provides a resort feel with the style and class you've come to expect from the Frank's Family. The cost to join this group is a ONE TIME, small fee of L$500 and entitles you access to the entire Frank's Elite Jazz sim." There is no "Exclusive SIM." What they have are Members only events. But a lot of the time it is open to any one. See screen shots above. As far as a "pay for group/destination," Frank's seems to be the exception. I know JunkYard Blues considered doing it when they were being extorted by griefers to control access but decided not to. There probably are other 'pay for' clubs or SIMs but I am not aware of them. I did notice in this thread that Geremio has decided to take his money elsewhere. "That said, doubt I'll spend a lot of effort and money in this game. Not worth it. I'll go play Entropia...." Go figure. I wish him well over there battling robots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syo Emerald Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Storm Clarence wrote: Syo Emerald wrote: So you would rather lie to people like him and make him jump into something to waste around 300$, if not more? Since when do participants of this forum discriminate? They seem to lie to everyone, not just him. Who are we to tell him how to spend his money? I am not his mother or his accountant or his friend. His world, your imagination? I was delighted to see him stand his ground against all the naysayers; the "older" players who think they know SL better than everyone else. I find it similar to Darrius writing last week what "we' need from the new CEO. I laugh so hard when I read such nonsense. People like him = people new to SL, who want to start a business And since when is it part of my imagination that clubs in SL don't make you rich? Saying the opposite is lying. Of course he can waste his money the way he want. I would like to see his struggle to apply his awsome pro-gamer skills (while lacking of any kind of usefull skill or sense for a good business). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLADEZRAVEN Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 BE RIGHT BACK I RAN OUT OF POPCORN LOL !!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irihapeti Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 how much ??? 1L for 15mins. 2L for 30mins and 4L for 1 hour. i dont do much tho. just sit and look pretty and dont say anything. lots of people will come to your sim tho. like newbies. heaps of them. bc i am really pretty (: i can also work a full shift every day. like 8 hours easy. i prefer to work nightshift. like 10pm to 6am if is ok with you. On weekends I can work overtime til about 9am on Saturdays and 10am on Sundays. you dont have to pay penal rates for my overtimes bc I am not in the union. but you can if you want q; (: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheriColette Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 BLADEZRAVEN wrote: BE RIGHT BACK I RAN OUT OF POPCORN LOL !!!!!!!! Very cute and funny too (the pug that is). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Jetaime Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Perrie Juran wrote: Storm Clarence wrote: Amethyst Jetaime wrote In 71/2 years I've seen some fantastic concepts and fantastic looking places but I've never seen a bar or club that charged any kind of cover charge survive long, even members only places that appeal to the snob factor.. The overwhelming majority of people just are not willing to pay a cover period. Frank's Elite started 3 1/2 years ago and has 83,000 members at 500L$ a pop. That's 83,000 snobs. Ka-ching. I thought Frank's was older than that. I had joined because a few girls I knew liked going there and I enjoy Formal dancing in SL. I'm not sure where you got the 83,000. Current membership is about 23,000. We of course don't know how many people have left the group. It still however is a tidy sum and if you subtract tier it works out to a healthy profit if I did my math right. I don't know how much or if they pay their staff and DJ's. I do however consider the group description deceptive. "Frank's Elite Jazz Club, our member's exclusive destination, is an entire resort sim designed as an expansion to the Franks Jazz Club experience and provides a resort feel with the style and class you've come to expect from the Frank's Family. The cost to join this group is a ONE TIME, small fee of L$500 and entitles you access to the entire Frank's Elite Jazz sim." There is no "Exclusive SIM." What they have are Members only events. But a lot of the time it is open to any one. See screen shots above. As far as a "pay for group/destination," Frank's seems to be the exception. I know JunkYard Blues considered doing it when they were being extorted by griefers to control access but decided not to. There probably are other 'pay for' clubs or SIMs but I am not aware of them. I did notice in this thread that Geremio has decided to take his money elsewhere. "That said, doubt I'll spend a lot of effort and money in this game. Not worth it. I'll go play Entropia...." Go figure. I wish him well over there battling robots. Franks has been around and popular for a long time, much longer than the three + years another poster mentioned. They've always had a large group since the early days when they became popular. That is the only group for Franks that exists. A good number of those members joined prior to when they started to charge that fee. What is unknown is how many joined their group AFTER they started to charge for it. Franks has a total of four sims they pay tier on as well as live performers frequently if not daily and those events are free. Having live performers most every day is not cheap in terms of RL money. Most charge the equivalent of at least $20US for one hour, the popular ones much more. They also employ managers that receive a salary and at one time paid their staff by the hour, and still may. To staff a club 24/7 means a lot of people and they have more than one club there. Even with shop rents, donations to the club and membership fees I doubt they are doing more than breaking even on their entire business, IF they are doing that. If they are making a profit I doubt its much of one at all and probably not consistent every month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christin73 Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Clubs or any kind of business in SL is hard. It takes getting not just anyone willing to work but people willing to bring others into the mix. A club with a cover charge in SL will flop. NO club I know of in SL charges at the door to get in. You will need managers and a general manager to run everything. Not sure about the legality of the betting. LLs/SL is based in the US. We have certain gamming laws here. Also having an island or land of any kind takes alot of money. Are you prepared to spend alot of money on land? Perhaps start out small and see how it goes. You also say you don't have much time to be in world. Thats where a good general manager would come in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perrie Juran Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Amethyst Jetaime wrote: Perrie Juran wrote: Storm Clarence wrote: Amethyst Jetaime wrote In 71/2 years I've seen some fantastic concepts and fantastic looking places but I've never seen a bar or club that charged any kind of cover charge survive long, even members only places that appeal to the snob factor.. The overwhelming majority of people just are not willing to pay a cover period. Frank's Elite started 3 1/2 years ago and has 83,000 members at 500L$ a pop. That's 83,000 snobs. Ka-ching. I thought Frank's was older than that. I had joined because a few girls I knew liked going there and I enjoy Formal dancing in SL. I'm not sure where you got the 83,000. Current membership is about 23,000. We of course don't know how many people have left the group. It still however is a tidy sum and if you subtract tier it works out to a healthy profit if I did my math right. I don't know how much or if they pay their staff and DJ's. I do however consider the group description deceptive. "Frank's Elite Jazz Club, our member's exclusive destination, is an entire resort sim designed as an expansion to the Franks Jazz Club experience and provides a resort feel with the style and class you've come to expect from the Frank's Family. The cost to join this group is a ONE TIME, small fee of L$500 and entitles you access to the entire Frank's Elite Jazz sim." There is no "Exclusive SIM." What they have are Members only events. But a lot of the time it is open to any one. See screen shots above. As far as a "pay for group/destination," Frank's seems to be the exception. I know JunkYard Blues considered doing it when they were being extorted by griefers to control access but decided not to. There probably are other 'pay for' clubs or SIMs but I am not aware of them. I did notice in this thread that Geremio has decided to take his money elsewhere. "That said, doubt I'll spend a lot of effort and money in this game. Not worth it. I'll go play Entropia...." Go figure. I wish him well over there battling robots. Franks has been around and popular for a long time, much longer than the three + years another poster mentioned. They've always had a large group since the early days when they became popular. That is the only group for Franks that exists. A good number of those members joined prior to when they started to charge that fee. What is unknown is how many joined their group AFTER they started to charge for it. Franks has a total of four sims they pay tier on as well as live performers frequently if not daily and those events are free. Having live performers most every day is not cheap in terms of RL money. Most charge the equivalent of at least $20US for one hour, the popular ones much more. They also employ managers that receive a salary and at one time paid their staff by the hour, and still may. To staff a club 24/7 means a lot of people and they have more than one club there. Even with shop rents, donations to the club and membership fees I doubt they are doing more than breaking even on their entire business, IF they are doing that. If they are making a profit I doubt its much of one at all and probably not consistent every month. I didn't realise till your post that they owned four SIMs. And my memory of some things is a little blury. For my first couple of years in SL my computer really couldn't handle Frank's because of the number of peopl ether so I rarely went. Once I got a decent computer that changed and I started going again. So that would be about three years ago and when I joined the group back then there was a charge. Thanks for the additional info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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