Lolas Tango vs Lush Mesh Breasts

[Korruptive]

So, I want to commit to having mesh breasts, But I don't know which brand to go with, I would like to get the people who've had both give me their personal thoughts on both breasts,  My main worry is all of my appliers not working with the Lush ones,  I know they have their differences but I want to hear from personal experince with the two brands.  So.. To start the disscussion,  Here's my main three questions on both brands.

Appliers: Do the Lush mesh breast really work with ALL appliers that are made for the LolasTango brand? (Skin, Bra, Top, ect.)

Features:  Which one is easier to work with compaired to the two of them, What are their cons aside from the obvious main one (No demo for Lolas)?

Overall,  Which brand would be best for someone whose just getting into wearing Mesh breasts, which set is the less confusing to use of the two?

I'll be checking this thread later tonight, right now my laptop is about to die on me. x.x  See you all and hope to hear everyones experince with the two.

Please do not refer me to the big boobie babes site, I've already read that stuff, I want to hear about personal experince from people who acutally own and use them on a daily.

[Pussycat Catnap]

If the item works with even one of the other brands appliers then it should work with all.

The applier system is merely a system that takes a UUID of a texture and loads it onto an object. The object's UV map doesn't change. So how it applies the supplied textures will also never change.

So if one texture fits for item A, and item B, any texture that fit A will also fit B.

As to which is better - I can't speak to that. You're just going to have to give them both a glance and decide which has more appeal for you personally.

[Sephina Frostbite]

I have lolas and they look good. I dont always where them with all outfits but you can size them smaller so they are not so huge. I have a friend who wears lolas smaller and it look good.  I am going to get the lush ones as well. They have a more natural look to them although lola also carries two other shapes with her.. I got a more natural lola but I havent figured how they work just yet. 

[NeroGoth Nightfire]

Actually there is more then those two and many options, choices, pay ranges, as well as features that can help influence your decision, the least of which is just how you like how they look. 

http://www.bigboobiebabes.com/p/what-boobs-do-i-get.html 

A quick bit to help people about these 'implants' there is a MAJOR difference between what many knew about the breasts and what has come out these past 24 months since Mesh has taken hold. I was hired on to manage a maker of Furry clothing apparell, but we were a bit chaffed by all the Furs having this large breast, and that large breast, as a maker we couldn't make the different appliers (if there was even a applier at all) to support each model. At the time, breasts were made from prims, then finally sculpties, but like your hair on your head your talking ALOT of prims and scultpies to make each breast, then the layer for the tattoo on the skin, then for jewlery for the nipples or wearing a shirt, then add a jacket layer of even more prims, etc. (you get the idea OMFG!!!). 

There was NO way to apply a UUID (as suggested) to PRIM breasts and have things line up perfectly no matter what size the breast was, and FORGET about matching skin colors (the biggest reason people were pissed off). 

Two years ago Lolas came out with the more simple form of a Mesh Breast with layers (basically the same breast just .05m larger each 'layer') and the coding to call for the UUID of a standard SL template, then apply that to the Mesh Breast. This made a PERFECT match for skins, and made it ALOT easier to making clothes. 

Sadly Lolas basically just sat back and raked in the cash and didn't do much more to support ANY of the breasts, and further made it quite pointed to anything other then 'human' wasn't comfortable for them to be associated with which alot of Furs were thier customer base. 

Violet Studios, already a heavy hitter in many market spaces, came out with the EVO update to thier line X_X breasts, which allowed not only clothing but SKIN appliers from any Tango Skin Maker. Shortly around this time Muse (MilkMade) breasts were also made compatible, iBoobs came out with a new breast, and some others are now coming out with thier own variants with distinctive changes; especially as wearing Tango breast GOT PEOPLE BANNED FROM SIMS. What? You say? Not true! No actually it was true because of the HORRID coding the breasts consumed so much scripting / SIM memory that people wearing the breasts were repeatedly kicked / banned from Sims for 'having too many scripts'. 

Finally the first EVER update to a Lolas product was issued, to the Tangos thanks to the new Lola Mirage breasts (yes they accept ALL Tango appliers as well) coding was extremely better. But sadly not many other added features like the iBoobs Layer Texture mover (push / pull the clothing texture to make more / less of your breasts show) without EDIT, etc. the breasts manally each time. Nor was Milking system added, nor was RLV, and a few other things that other breasts did offer. In face the Violet Studios X_X breasts are almost HALF the cost of Lolas, and gives SIX different shaped breasts in the package to use (Cleavage, Puffy, Hanging, etc.) and as noted FULLY Tango Skin/Clothing applier working. 

Some people like the shape of one over the other, some like the added benefits of one over another, and some just like to save the L$ and instead just go with the much less boobs. 

Just remember, Lolas mantra to date is, you want new boobs you need buy them we dont' "upgrade". Many other makers do not feel this way and offer great FREE updates and features. If you look at the boobs as a LONG TERM INVESTMENT, you might want to also include this factor. 

[Pussycat Catnap]

Lolas may have been anti-non human before (no idea, I had no stake in all of this until recently when I got one for an alt), but the current update includes a HUD with a menu to match to either human or fantasy. Matching to fur... is not possible without a texture to start with. The applier system is one of the easiest to work with. You don't even need their script - any script using LLSetTexture can do if you guess the right faces, and have the UUID of your desired texture.

BUT at this point any furry or skin maker not putting out an applier alongside their skins is hurting their business.

Now I've bought the Lolas for an alt - but I buy a lot more furries, for self and almost all my alts, a couple each. I have to find a single furry maker that included an applier for Lolas or any other brand.

 

So don't push that blame onto the Lolas people.

The furry makers are being the snobs here.

 

If you go skin shopping, about 2/3rds of the brands include appliers. Many for free. For Lolas and Slink - as everybody else pretty much is now compatable with Lolas and Slink has no viable competition (there is one other major mesh foot maker, but they put a transparent layer over the foot so when you walk over things like a glass floor, or in front of plants, or anything with a transparency, you get a halo-effect. Which results in only Slink being worth money...).

I have met exactly one 'human' skin maker that refused to make Lolas appliers on principle (and anyone with an official viewer can get around it still by looking up the UUID of their skin's texture).

I haven't asked furry makers, but I have seen plenty of furry avatars come out in the last two years - yet again, no appliers.

 

Anyone who's read me over the past few years knows I have been extremely harsh on the 'prim boob' community and what I see as some silly absurd attachments they run around pushing in people's faces. I haven't really changed that opinion at all. But the newer Lolas and Hush things are closer to reasonable in size, and actually have natural shapes - so I can see the non-fetish appeal of them.

And again, even if one personally doesn't care for them, there is nothing morally offensive about them - so any skin or furry makers not supplying them have no reasonable ground for hurting their sales that way...

 

Furry makers need to wake up and look at the market. Don't blame Lolas for that

- the developer kit to make your own appliers is even included in the sale that every buyer of Lolas gets, and has multi-language instructions and everything you need other than the desired UUID. To make an applier takes about 1 minute: The time to rez the prim, open the config card inside, paste a UUID, and hit save. The maybe change that notecard to no-mod if you want to make it harder for people to know your texture UUIDs (even though this information is available in the official viewer).

So even some of the big furry shops could turn out a stack of appliers for their entire line and place them next to vendors with little more than a day or two's work. Appliers that would then work for Lolas and Lush, and maybe anyone else using a like mesh system.

 

---

NeroGoth Nightfire wrote:

 

Just remember, Lolas mantra to date is, you want new boobs you need buy them we dont' "upgrade". Many other makers do not feel this way and offer great FREE updates and features.

---

 This is patently untrue. My alt was given a free update just recently when the Lolas updated.

According to them, they manually sent updates to every single past customer that ever bought a Lolas - the automatic updater system they went for was unable to handle it for them, I suppose because they hadn't had the foresight to have it in place before selling that first Lolas way back when... so instead of give up, they took the last month to do nothing but send people copies if they could find that person in their sale's history.

If you didn't get one, contact them.

 

******

As for people getting sim banned - no surprise there. The old Lolas used 1700kbs of memory. After getting mine sized to fit my faun alt, I ripped out the scripts. Many people don't know how to do that, or don't know to do it with a copy to be safe.

People weren't getting sim banned for the Lolas, they were getting sim banned for excessive scripts. When you take that 1700, and then add in something like a 2mb AO/Dance HUD, a 1mb facelight, a 3mb hair, a 5mb RLV/XXX hud, and so on... yeah - ban time. Most sims that ban by scripts cut it somewhere from 3 to 5mbs, and the old Lolas could throw you to that limit really fast. I still see people with over 10mb of scripts multiple times a week.

 

The updated Lolas however, I think use 16 or 64kb - super small. I've left the scripts in for convenience because its so well done this time around.

I have seen some sims that will ban anyone with 'prim body parts' that they feel are not realistic - but that's a whole other topic. One that before these newer well-shaped mesh things I had sympathy with (though felt was an over-reaction).

 As for the whole 'milk' & RLV thing... that's a fetish crowd. I don't think the Lolas were ever meant for fetishists. They're more aimed at people fed up with the horrid shape of the default avatar, though they're a tad too big... (The Lush ones seem better in this regard - will have to see if they are fetishist free. Frankly I would not buy one for my alts if it had all that fetish stuff in it, and if I could find a fetish-free one at normal size, I might even get it for my 'main' account).

 

[NeroGoth Nightfire]

DSD makes Tango appliers. Maehem is a skin modder and always has tango applier for any of the mod kits (find them in the Madcatcreations store on Sensual Tails, at Yiff, Furry Fashion and few other spots). That is all I know of ANY Furry related making skin match up, because normally the skins weren't 'intricate' so if you just colored to the same coloring (white belly, black skin, etc.) that was enough on the Furs to get away with it. Only if you know someone that might make it by hand or happen to have the UUID for some reason would be able to get you around it. Personally for myself and my Mate (whose AVI I use as my alt now) when we deal with issues like this for Mesh, we just grab a mod kit for our Furs and use those textures to create the Mesh based parts (be it my muscle body or her Tangos). 

Actually there is quite a 'few' of the human skin and dress makers whom refuse, LAQ comes to mind quite often. Basically they feel any 'fake breasts' is a horrendous insult to thier 'artistic work'. Personally anyone whom is making 'parts' to sell for people to use needs to get off thier high horse, your a blue collar 'painter' in a house, not Michealangelo painting the Chistine Chapel. your product is NOT ART. 

Which then reasserts your own statement too, that if the Furry Avatar makers would get off thier arses, they would be providing better customer support by recognizing business trends and marketspace changes (the old adage change or DIE). But that would mean these people wouldn't be 'artists' and instead would be business people whom they LOATHE immensely, but also are quite (and I have been told this even by close friends or the 'artists/avi maker themselves') paranois after all the copybotting that happened over the years to give even a inch of ground that would potentially let anyone copy ANY of thier work (i.e. forget to make it no mod on the NC and now you have the SKIN UUID to do with as you will). 

 "This is patently untrue. My alt (Mocha Edenflower) was given a free update just recently when the Lolas updated."
- No actually you just reproved my point, Tangos have been out for numerous years not THAT Lolas update is the FIRST EVER update to ANY of the Lolas products (which they have several breasts BTW besides Tangos). Also you don't seem to be aware of the whole backside end of what caused them to do that. As a business person whom makes business contacts with alot of people, there was a very LARGE rebuff back when Mirage was released AS A NEW PRODUCT, no update provided. While sales did happen briskly, a serious amount of people went with pitchforks in hand and told Lolas they were refusing to spend another $1750L when there were already NUMEROUS updates that SHOULD have been 'corrected' in the Tangos, and alot of third party people WERE DOING LOLAS JOB FOR THEM.
   As normal they were very tight lipped to anyone whom asked (including the very influential and long time BBBF group!) till KelleeC of the Tango Clothing Group nailed them down hard (and the only one to get them to do it) on the RECORD saying they would try to release a update to the Tangos. So no they didn't do it because they were trying to do customer service, it was simple economics and realizing they F* up. They were not going to get all 8000 (yes there is that many) Lolas customers to change breasts like Microsoft tried to get every computer to change from XP to Vista. 

   As for 'Fetish' element, while I understand you maybe 'anti-kinky' (some would call prude if you would go so far as to refuse a product that had them in there though you never use them), realistically I view it in a business manner oif looking at cars (or a dress, or anything else you 'shop for'), does the breasts come with A/C, Power Windows, All Weather Tires, and a nice MP3 Player, plus cost less then the competitor breasts?, or do they not come with them and you only get one color (one shape) to choose from but pay more?. If you can see how I am looking at it in comparisions, it isn't a 'touchy feely thing' as it maybe for you, but still there is a way to measure beyond the concept of 'how kinky is / it is not?'. 

[Pussycat Catnap]

Was not aware of DSD. I've got quite a few DSD avatars and as recently as manybe a month ago - no single applier was in the shop for any of them. Not that I was shopping for appliers, but they were not there to begin with.

Agree with your criticism about people refusing to make them. I'd just only seen it voiced once from a 'human skin maker'. Almost every human skin maker seems to supply them now if they have product put out in the last year. But I've not seen it in any furry shop yet.

Will look at DSD over the weekend and see if I can find them. My faun alt that has lolas, also has the DSD goat avatar.

 

It hurts your sales, furry or human, if you ignore a rapidly growing segment of the market.

 

Mirage is a new product. Has a different shape, a different look. I did not buy it for my Faun because its got a cleavage look and the only reason I got them for my faun was as a 'woodland nature spirit' I wanted a sort of 'unbound' look.

- An owner of Lolas Tango SHOULD not get the Mirage free. Thinking they should would be like saying "hey I bought a mini-dress from coldlogic, now you have a strapless dress, why wasn't I sent it free?"

Answer: different dresses.

 

Just because you bought one product from a merchant does NOT entitle you to the entire rest of their product line for free.

And on the fetish thing... The lolas are made for a different market.

If I make a motorcycle in SL, and it drives well on the roads, why should it also have sex-animations (and yes such exists - got one from an MM board when I was a newbie)? Just because somebody else makes one with sex-animations is NOT justification. We're selling to different audiences.

Just because it looks like a product your demographic likes does not mean its made for them. SL is full of starships and boats that cannot fly or sail - but are meant as skyboxes or water-top homes instead. I have a few. I bought DIFFERENT space ships and boats for sailing.

They look the same in kind, but are sold to different needs.

That is NOT the same as providing appliers for skins: one is making your product viable for a wider base (the applier), the other is what kind of product are you selling.

Now you -could- make an argument based on that though, that Lolas ought to sell a second version that has XXX-animations like your milking thing... but then again, that's still not the same as asking a skin maker to provide wider useability of the existing product. Its asking someone to enter into a different kind of market that they don't presently sell to. And particularly with sex-toys, that is a sensitive issue - a line some people do not like crossing. Lolas could lose as many sales as they might gain from becomming a sex-toy. The first time I heard of them was on a blog specifically calling them out as 'finally a prim boob I [the blogger] don't feel embarrassed to use."

 

[caterina Coba]

Thanks for this comment ...it was really useful

[Pussycat Catnap]

That's a serious necropost.

Note that in the intervening year a LOT has changed in this market.

Lolas first seem to vanish as a viable brand when everyone else went fitted mesh and they didn't.

But then they came in strong with a new deliq (or a name like that) fitted mesh item that is a different shape from the mirage and the tangos.

I still hold to my claim that tangos people had no right to expect mirage for free - they are completely different shapes and that would be like buying a cat furry avatar from somebody and then being mad when you didn't get their new dog avatar free.

On the other hand if what the person had been talking about was just the scripting updates inside of mirage and tangos - I get that. But also... tangos DID get that updated.

Dileq (or delaq, or desomething-q) is now very different from the old tango or mirage. Not just a whole new shape, it is also fitted mesh. So far its the best fitted to the body fitted mesh item I've come across. And the new shape is aradical departure away from fetish - its natural in shape and size. If you set your chest to '48' and then add these, you will seem to still have an almost '48' size - but just smoother formed and less "lumpy" than the default avatar.

Their delay really helped them avoid quality blunders some earlier entrants made.

But one needs to remember that if they want a fetish-boob with lactation or other effects... Lolas is the wrong brand. Their focus seems to be on 'natural, mature but not XXX, and light weight scripts' (they used to be known for bloated scripts - that's changed).

I've gone from bring critical of them, to supportive, to critical, to now supportive again.

Though I will say... they could really use a demo. Asking people to drop 1750L blind is kind of tough. Just because it looks right one your friend's avatar doesn't mean it will on yours - demos are vital these days.

 

[NeroGoth Nightfire]

LAUGHS! Yes this is SO out of date, not only for fitted Mesh breast (which no longer matter) but now the 'standard' has shifted to the Mesh Fitted bodies. So now you don't need seperate ass, **bleep**, etc. you get a nice body that you can increase SOME measurements on, but yes no Fetish specific. The big issue is getting a Mesh body with a LARGE variety of Alpha HUD based ways to turn off parts of the mesh body to wear with mesh clothing better, OR if you do want Fetishy breasts (thinking about the multi titted 'cow like' set of **bleep** for example) you can wear them without it being conflicting.