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Second Life *IS* a Game


LepreKhaun
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Oh, yeah, many may try to say otherwise, but their arguments are along the lines of  "Checkers is a GAAAAMMMME! Show me how you can jump me!" But, specifically, SL is classified as a MMOSG/MMORPG (Massively Multiplayer Online Social Game/ Roleplaying Game) with the key word here being "Game" If you really doubt this, read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massively_multiplayer_online_game#Social very carefully.

 

This is no way to shoot down any of your involvement(s) on any level. It's just a fact, we are playing a game. You may choose to play to win (by whatever definition you have of "winning", which might not agree with mine), or to meet and interact with others (using the game interface) or maybe you're attempting to "make a living" or "become known as this century's Ld'Vinci within the constraits of the game's rules (which may change at any moment, possibly not in your favor).

 

No difference, except in approach. Second Life is still a game, whether you choose to believe it or not. This isn't Kansas, Dorothy, it's merely a a pixellated Oz.

 

Other than the drama you wish to pull up with the minions who wish to reinforce it, Second Life is not real. Here's your first clue: If the game gets too unbearable, walk away. Maybe go outside for a change and deal with the real world. Once you get that right, come back and attempt the game of Second Life.

 

Second clue: Don't invest money or time expecting anything more than (possibly) an enhanced game experiance. Yah hear me??? This is merely a game-> free to play, pay to enhance. OK? Nothing more, nothing less. If you don't know how it works, go to Kabam, WoW or whatever else you might come up with on a Google search for "free interactive game" where, at the top of the second page you'll see "guess who". And how do they advertise Second Life in that paid ad position? As a game!

Third clue: No one requires you to put up hard earned RL money or invest in RL time. You make that decision yourself: "I can afford X Dollars/Euros/Yen/RL Hours this week to play that Second Life game with the ONLY expectation that, at the very best, I'll have learned how to spend money/time on that game better next week."

 

Trust me on this: Try to approach it as anything else but a game and you will be hurt because: You are not only playing a game but the game is by someone else's rules. You may attempt to argue away the fact of the matter, it won't change it.

 

Only you can walk away from a game to stop playing it. Anything less is simply continuing to play a game.

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It ever amazes me the passion that people discuss if SL is a game, a social environment or anything else.

I like SL because it is SL. There are games that attract me, other's don't, there social envirmonts that I like or don't, same with sgrunfs.

If one want to call it a game or not, don't changes the way I see and use SL.

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Your point? Really not everyone is in secondlife every second of the day. I live an active life and I play sl late at night to relax. It doesn't take up my whole life. So really Game or not.. Who made you the boss of everyone. There are people who play games such as world of warcraft and sl with out being addicting. Most aren't as a matter of fact. Media likes to make you think we are. If everyone was so addicted there would be a lot less jobs. So once again I ask, you point is?

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Vania Chaplin wrote:

It ever amazes me the passion that people discuss if SL is a game, a social environment or anything else.

 

I like SL because it is SL. There are games that attract me, other's don't, there social envirmonts that I like or don't, same with sgrunfs.

 

If one want to call it a game or not, don't changes the way I see and use SL.

Exactly

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Sephina Frostbite wrote:

Your point? Really not everyone is in secondlife every second of the day. I live an active life and I play sl late at night to relax. It doesn't take up my whole life. So really Game or not.. Who made you the boss of everyone. There are people who play games such as world of warcraft and sl with out being addicting. Most aren't as a matter of fact. Media likes to make you think we are. If everyone was so addicted there would be a lot less jobs. So once again I ask, you point is?

Not sure about the game addiction reference. Certainly had nothing to do with anything I said, which was merely pointing out SL is a just game.

 

And that was the only point.

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LepreKhaun wrote:

Oh, yeah, many may try to say otherwise, but their arguments are along the lines of  "Checkers is a
GAAAAMMMME
! Show me how you can jump me!" But, specifically, SL is classified as a 
 (Massively Multiplayer Online Social
Game
/ Roleplaying
Game
) with the key word here being "
Game
" If you really doubt this, read 
 very carefully.

 

This is no way to shoot down any of your involvement(s) on any level. It's just a fact, we are playing a
game
. You may choose to play to win (by whatever definition you have of "winning", which might not agree with mine), or to meet and interact with others (using the
game
interface) or maybe you're attempting to "make a living" or "become known as this century's Ld'Vinci within the constraits of the
game's
rules
(which may change at any moment, possibly not in your favor).

 

No difference, except in approach. Second Life is still a
game
, whether you choose to believe it or not. This isn't Kansas, Dorothy, it's merely a a pixellated Oz.

 

Other than the drama you wish to pull up with the minions who wish to reinforce it, Second Life is
not
real. Here's your first clue: If the
game
gets too unbearable, walk away. Maybe go outside for a change and deal with the real world. Once you get that right, come back and attempt the
game
of Second Life.

 

Second clue: Don't invest money or time expecting anything more than (possibly) an enhanced
game
experiance.
Yah hear me???
This is merely a
game
-> free to play, pay to enhance. OK? Nothing more, nothing less. If you don't know how it works, go to Kabam, WoW or whatever else you might come up with on a Google search for "free interactive game" where, at the top of the second page you'll see "guess who". And how do they advertise Second Life in that paid ad position? As a
game
!

Third clue: No one requires you to put up hard earned RL money or invest in RL time. You make that decision yourself: "I can afford X Dollars/Euros/Yen/RL Hours this week to play that Second Life
game
with the ONLY expectation that, at the very best, I'll have learned how to spend money/time on that
game
better next week."

 

Trust me on this: Try to approach it as anything else but a
game
and you will be hurt because: You are not only playing a
game
but the
game
is by someone else's rules. You may attempt to argue away the fact of the matter, it won't change it.

 

Only you can walk away from a
game
to stop playing it. Anything less is simply continuing to play a
game
.

See the nice thing  about second life is..It's your world and your imagination..

If you wanna call it a game..you go right ahead..it can be anything you want it to be..

let your imagination scream it loud and proud!! 

 

it's a game!! and i can quit it if i want too!!

swimming-bricks.jpg

 

 

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Wow, I guess you believe anything you read on the internet.  Wikipedia is not what I consider a reliable source of definitions as anyone can write what they please there. 

Gamers tend to call SL a game.  You can beat this horse all you want but your aren't going to change anyone's mind.

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LepreKhaun wrote:

... 
we are playing a
game
. You may choose to play to win (by whatever definition you have of "winning", which might not agree with mine), or to meet and interact with others (using the
game
interface) or maybe you're attempting to "make a living" or "become known as this century's Ld'Vinci within the constraits of the
game's
rules
(which may change at any moment, possibly not in your favor).

...


OK, so SL is a game.  What I want to know is what game are you playing by starting this thread?  You know this topic divides players into two camps, with fanatics on both sides, and probably no way of changing people's minds about their stance.

Could you be playing a game of "forum troll"?  Or maybe lets get everyone posting about something less gossip raggy (OK that's a stretch but you know what I mean)?  Before I play any more I'd like to know what game we're playing.

 

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Amethyst Jetaime wrote:

Wow, I guess you believe anything you read on the internet.  Wikipedia is not what I consider a reliable source of definitioins as anyone can write what they please there. 

Gamers tend to call SL a game.  You can beat this horse all you want but your aren't going to change anyone's mind.

fear my Wikipedia infromations..

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You cite Wikipedia as if it is THE AUTHORITY on a subject.

Do you want to know one of the quickest ways to a failing grade on a paper in school?  Cite Wikipedia as an AUTHORITY.  Some teachers now even forbid any reference to Wikipedia in a paper.

Did you read the top of those pages?  Let me help you.

citations.JPG

Do you see that statement, "needs additional citations for verification?"

Additionally, have you ever noticed how there are little tabs at the top of Wiki pages?  One of them is labelled "Talk."

talk.JPG

 

Did you take the time to read the "Talk?"  In it is discussions about all the various problems with the article.  As an example of one let me quote:


"Massively multiplayer collaborative art "game"?

What about browser based massively multiplayer real-time art projects such as seen at http://www.thebroth.com - should a new category be made for these? I am not sure whether there are many projects like TheBroth, but it sure is BBMM and it sure is fun - but is it a "game"? Should we call these BBMMCOA, browser based massively multiplayer collaborative online art, or just MMOA or BBMMOA ?"


So what you have in that Wikipedia Article is an attempt by people to define what an MMOG is and someone with out any citation of any AUTHORITY has lamely added Second Life to the article.

Both you and the person who included SL would get a big red F in my class.

Second Life is a Virtual World.  Calling it a game is a Massively Multiperson Mindless Error.

 

 

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Vania Chaplin wrote:

It ever
amazes me the passion that people discuss if SL is a game,
a social environment or anything else.

 

 

"In 1949, B.H. Wood suggested in the ILLUSTRATED LONDON NEWS that the total numberc of chess publications was about 20,000. Since then there has been a steady anual increase in the number."  Anon

I suspect now the number is closer to ~70,000

In 1913 the number was estimated at 5,000

If you change "Chess Books" to "Chess Literature" the number probably goes into the millions, with daily newspaper columns etc.

 

The passion of  the game.

PS

From amazon.com:

Football books: 50,999

Basketball books: 22,044

Ice hockey books: 5,688

 

 

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How about a dictionary as an authority?  It boils down to the definition of "game".  Now different dictionaries will have different interpretations but here is one:

 

"1. An activity providing entertainment or amusement; a pastime: ...

2. a. A competitive activity or sport in which players contend with each other according to a set of rules:"

 

You seem to be using the second definition.  The OP seems to be using the first one.  I agree with that because the origin of the word is:  "Middle English, from Old English gamen; akin to Old High German gaman amusement"

 

 

 

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If you want to generalize, then Second Life is a Front Porch. You can choose

to play a game of checkers, or strip poker, for that matter, or you can

choose to sit there and socialise. Or not. The people who treat it like

a game, who either think there are rules, or try to bring their own - something

I've Benin guilty of myself, in the past - they usually want it to be a game

so that they can cheat. It's just best to avoid them.

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Studio09 wrote:

"1.
An activity providing entertainment or amusement; a pastime: ...

Sneaky, but you omitted a couple words there. The line ends with two examples: "party games; word games." I'm not too surprised though, since wordplay is very common in these threads (it's kind of necessary, in order to prove a definition after-the-fact).

This definition doesn't apply since it's talking about the sub-set of activities, not a creative space or set of rules - word games can be played anywhere, using anything. (See Perrie's post further down to see this explained better.)

You can play 'games' in a lifeboat, stranded at sea, but it doesn't make the lifeboat a game.

You can play 'games' in SL, with your keyboard/mouse, but that doesn't make Second Life a game.

Also no, sorry, dictionary definitions here are just more opinions, or pigeon-holing using semantics (you're doing it backwards by finding a subject and applying a definition to it). Unless you use the creator's definition of their work (not yours or anybody elses), this is a silly argument.

Skip authority that isn't the creator, because only the creator can define their own work.

Don't let that stop anyone though. Everyone knows where this thread is headed already.

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Studio09 wrote:


LepreKhaun wrote:

... 
we are playing a
game
. You may choose to play to win (by whatever definition you have of "winning", which might not agree with mine), or to meet and interact with others (using the
game
interface) or maybe you're attempting to "make a living" or "become known as this century's Ld'Vinci within the constraits of the
game's
rules
(which may change at any moment, possibly not in your favor).

...


OK, so SL is a game.  What I want to know is what game are you playing by starting this thread?  You know this topic divides players into two camps, with fanatics on both sides, and probably no way of changing people's minds about their stance.

Could you be playing a game of "forum troll"?  Or maybe lets get everyone posting about something less gossip raggy (OK that's a stretch but you know what I mean)?  Before I play any more I'd like to know what game we're playing.

 

Ohhh good idea!  Any time I play a game I like to know the rules.

@OP - so what are the rules for this "game" called SL. 

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Studio09 wrote:

How about a dictionary as an authority?  It boils down to the definition of "game".  Now different dictionaries will have different interpretations but here is one:

 
"1.
An activity providing entertainment or amusement; a pastime: ...

2.
a.
A competitive activity or sport in which players contend with each other according to a set of rules:"

 

You seem to be using the second definition.  The OP seems to be using the first one.  I agree with that because the origin of the word is:  "Middle English, from Old English
gamen;
akin to Old High German
gaman
amusement"

 

 

 

First off, this need citation.  ;)

Primarily yes, I am thinking in terms of the second definition, but not totally.

However, you make a mistake in your application or interpretation of the first definition.

While all games are ACTIVITIES, not all ACTIVITIES are games.  :)

For instance, in RL there were many times I found my work (employment) entertaining or amusing.  I did work in the entertainment field.  That however did not make it a game. 

 

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Game.jpg

 


Storm Clarence wrote:


Vania Chaplin wrote:

It ever
amazes me the passion that people discuss if SL is a game,
a social environment or anything else.




The passion of  the game.

PS

From amazon.com:

Football books: 50,999

Basketball books: 22,044

Ice hockey books: 5,688

 

 

Looks like they all have a ways to go.

Oh, and Amazon gave me 21,374 results for "Books > "Chess."

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A lot of this depends on how one defines game.

Seems that since the age of 'Dungeons and Dragons' game has been defined as challenges and win or lose. A very male centric definition that does capture the essense of many male games.

But games can also be seen as any form of social play. And play should be seen as merely the trivial there. Its a game when you skip rope, its a game when you gather the stuffed animals for a tea party [/and rant about black people being president], its a game when you toss Ken and Barbie into that pink corvette. Its a game when you play string-hand. Its a game when you all dress up in costumes and pretend to be various things.

People who think SL isn't a game need to stop thinking with the male anatomy, and look at a wider reference for what has historical been game play among human cultures - including the 'weird half' that isn't so male... :P

And if you think that be-littles SL, you might want to then also look at some internalized gender presumptions.

 

Almost no one in SL agrees with me on this though - so I don't bring it up often. From my POV, people are just too ingrained in a male-centric perspective on language to see what's been lost in recent decades from the understanding of a 'game'.

 

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