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iceing Braveheart wrote:


Czari Zenovka wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:

I have also seen countless posts with amd users posting second life is not compatible with there pc's with so many compatibility issues highly I recommend you savour and enjoy every last second of second life like it is the last as this business may go under if it cannot maintain clients or bring in new as
there software appears to be incompatible with new pc's
and laptops ect preventing new users from joining sl and incompatible with amd based pc's preventing new and old users from continuing to play or from joining sl

(Bolding mine)

You keep referring to "new pc's."   My current PC is only three months old and runs SL amazingly well.  From your other posts it seems that the graphics card is your issue with SL.  My (currently uninstalled) graphics card is an nVidia GeForce GTX 660 SC which I purchased after doing a TON of research plus this card being recommended by others in the forum using this card or one in the same family.

Have you done any research online to see if others are having the same issues as you in SL with your vid card?  (And I don't mean contacting LL.)

At any rate, the issue isn't "new PCs."

The 600 series has been retired and replaced by the 700 series 

The geforce 660 is about a one year old card, as it launched on September 13, 2012

it is now almost 2014 which will bring about the series 800
;)

you should of went with a 760 for some real power 

personally I would never recommend a 600 card period unless it was nearly free 

and yes everyone with a new modern pc/laptop ect has this problem it is completely across the board

the issue is new pc's but thx for trying
;)

On the plus side, I'm able to be in SL. ;)

 

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Czari Zenovka wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:


Czari Zenovka wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:

I have also seen countless posts with amd users posting second life is not compatible with there pc's with so many compatibility issues highly I recommend you savour and enjoy every last second of second life like it is the last as this business may go under if it cannot maintain clients or bring in new as
there software appears to be incompatible with new pc's
and laptops ect preventing new users from joining sl and incompatible with amd based pc's preventing new and old users from continuing to play or from joining sl

(Bolding mine)

You keep referring to "new pc's."   My current PC is only three months old and runs SL amazingly well.  From your other posts it seems that the graphics card is your issue with SL.  My (currently uninstalled) graphics card is an nVidia GeForce GTX 660 SC which I purchased after doing a TON of research plus this card being recommended by others in the forum using this card or one in the same family.

Have you done any research online to see if others are having the same issues as you in SL with your vid card?  (And I don't mean contacting LL.)

At any rate, the issue isn't "new PCs."

The 600 series has been retired and replaced by the 700 series 

The geforce 660 is about a one year old card, as it launched on September 13, 2012

it is now almost 2014 which will bring about the series 800
;)

you should of went with a 760 for some real power 

personally I would never recommend a 600 card period unless it was nearly free 

and yes everyone with a new modern pc/laptop ect has this problem it is completely across the board

the issue is new pc's but thx for trying
;)

On the plus side, I'm able to be in SL.
;)

 

That is funny :catlol:

but you still would of been abled to run second life better on the 760 vs the 660 and everything else but only if and when linden lab's fixes second life but that remains to be determined but anything and everything else besides second life would work on the spot with a 700 series card in a laptop or desktop ect

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iceing Braveheart wrote:

That is funny :catlol:

but you still would of been abled to run second life better on the 760 vs the 660 and everything else but only if and when linden lab's fixes second life but that remains to be determined but anything and everything else besides second life would work on the spot with a 700 series card in a laptop or desktop ect

 

Did Gadget send you?

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iceing Braveheart wrote:


Summer Tison wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:


Summer Tison wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:


Care to explain elaborate how I am having pc issues?

like I said on starting post for thread I am sorry I bought a new pc and linden lab's is not compatible with it I will just go use other apps and stop using this one it is very simple if it makes you feel better go ahead blame my pc but I am sure other companies will enjoy the money I spend there as for second life I have tried countless times contacting them and they just do not give a damn so there is nothing I can do but leave

I have also seen countless posts with amd users posting second life is not compatible with there pc's with so many compatibility issues highly I recommend you savour and enjoy every last second of second life like it is the last as this business may go under if it cannot maintain clients or bring in new as there software appears to be incompatible with new pc's and laptops ect preventing new users from joining sl and incompatible with amd based pc's preventing new and old users from continuing to play or from joining sl

Care to explain how LL is to blame because YOUR pc isn't working with SL? Surely that is an issue your end, and as I explained I have a new Laptop that runs SL perfectly well, so it's not ALL new PCs/Laptops that are having this problem.

You're full of doom and gloom, you seem to think I care if you go elsewhere with your money, what a strange conclusion you made there. 

Did you buy your new PC with SL in mind? I know when I had to renew my Laptop I bought the best I could within my budget knowing I would want access to SL. You have been given some good advice on this thread, it's your choice if you want to take it, it doesn't matter to me one way or the other.

it is common for all stores and retailers to sell off all old and even liquidate it that doesn't mean it is modern because you bought something several years old new at best buy that is like going to a flee market and buying action figures that are 40 years old and still in the package and saying they are modern you just bought them post your cpu and gpu and we will see if we can find the real age
;)

Built with MSVC version 1600

You are at 255061.4, 257453.2, 558.2 in Cayman located at sim10290.agni.lindenlab.com (216.82.50.12:12035)

Second Life Server 13.10.03.281989

Release Notes

CPU: Intel® Core i3-2330M CPU @ 2.20GHz (2195.09 MHz)

Memory: 4003 MB

OS Version: Microsoft Windows 7 64-bit Service Pack 1 (Build 7601)

Graphics Card Vendor: Intel

Graphics Card: Intel® HD Graphics Family

Windows Graphics Driver Version: 8.15.0010.2361

OpenGL Version: 3.1.0 - Build 8.15.10.2361

Viewer SSE Version: SSE2

libcurl Version: libcurl/7.21.1 OpenSSL/1.0.0g zlib/1.2.5 c-ares/1.7.1

J2C Decoder Version: OpenJPEG: 1.5.2

Audio Driver Version: FMOD Ex 4.44.08

Qt Webkit Version: 4.7.1 (version number hard-coded)

Packets Lost: 1/599 (0.2%)

For your pleasure...you still didn't answer the question about your PC purchase...did you buy it with SL in mind? Or do you just feel too stupid to admit that you never considered the suitability of your chosen PC and now want to blame LL because you made a bad choice?

I do not have the best set-up in the world, far from it, but it certainly seems to be more than enough for my SL enjoyment.

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iceing Braveheart wrote:


PeterCanessa Oh wrote:

Aha!  Thanks for that, I'll be sure to look out for all the complaints from people with new modern pc/laptop etc.  There must be millions since it's completely across the board.  Or is it only ones where all components were manufactured within the last year ... month ... week?

LOL.

Be serious, please.

iceing Braveheart wrote:

Okay seriously this only effects Second Life software so don't fear buying a new modern laptop or pc ect as it will work anywhere else in the world or web just not with second life software. for second life software your gonna want to check city land fills and hope you find something that still functions


Nope, still waiting for you to be serious.

How did u make 4.4k posts trolling people out like this?

I am just curious why your account hasn't been terminated yet is all 

this is just an example

manufacturers usually send there hardware off to reviewers to be tested and reviewed before they are launched and they are tested in benchmarks and across a ton of games the release date means nothing for when a card will start to function you can use a card the second they release the beta drivers for the card or earlier sometimes so a week means nothing in reference to your jabs at modern hardware is unrelated to modern hardware it is a second life only issue

Most of my posts come from answering, or assisting with, the issues people raise in the forums in a serious way.  I've had a couple of warnings - usually when I swear at people who are extremely rude or self-centered to the point that if they have a problem it must be because LL did it to them deliberately and everyone else must be shills or trolls.

I contend that it is ridiculous to say that no modern hardware will run SL, or that LL have "gone out of their way to make SL incompatible".  While there are, beyond doubt, specific issues with specific equipment you just are not being serious, or in any way looking for a fix, when you make such blanket statements.  Furthermore you simply reject any statements from other people who say they are using modern computers just because they aren't using exactly the same as you.

You should, at least, set a time-frame for what you mean by 'modern' - it is a time-based word - since you don't accept other people's definitions.  That's what I'm asking you - to be serious if you want to be taken seriously.

I realise that you're not an English-speaker but I have no idea what you mean about 'modern'.  You say things like "a new modern laptop or pc ect as it will work anywhere else in the world or web just not with second life software", "for second life software your gonna want to check city land fill",  SO WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY 'MODERN'?  I haven't made any jabs at modern - or any other - hardware just your refusal to say what you're talking about ^^

 

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In my own experience, from my first days in SL until now, the official SL viewers have never run on my computer very well. I was pointed to phoenix and now I use firestorm. The other day I installed the new official view as I was testing  a script of mine, my graphics card almost had a seizure. I do not know why the official viewer is so graphics demanding, but there are very successful third party viewers online. 

To be fair on LL, it's not easy to define an acceptable viewing standard. The younger members (LOL, I only 30) want super hi-def and generally play hi end games a lot and the mid to older that use there computers for just about everything and it certainly is not LL fault that my laptop is 3 years old and not upto the spec. Its like any thing in life, if you want top end standards then one has to pay for that spec, other wise accept that ones Fiat Punto is not a Rolls Royce.

On a foot note, LL have and still are in profit, which most others are gone or bearably hanging on. LL get alot of complaints that are really not there fault.

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Dillon Levenque wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:

That is funny :catlol:

but you still would of been abled to run second life better on the 760 vs the 660 and everything else but only if and when linden lab's fixes second life but that remains to be determined but anything and everything else besides second life would work on the spot with a 700 series card in a laptop or desktop ect

 

Did Gadget send you?

*Spews Coke on the monitor*

 

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iceing Braveheart wrote:


manufacturers usually send there hardware off to reviewers to be tested and reviewed before they are launched and they are tested in benchmarks and across a ton of games the release date means nothing for when a card will start to function you can use a card the second they release the beta drivers for the card or earlier sometimes so a week means nothing in reference to your jabs at modern hardware is unrelated to modern hardware it is a second life only issue

I don't know why the heck LL has been so slow updating the GPU Tables in the official Viewer.  It does smack of misplaced priorities.  We do know that they are working on adding other features and upgrade  to the Viewer.  But that really does not excuse them for not getting the GPU tables updated. 

 


iceing Braveheart wrote:


but you still would of been abled to run second life better on the 760 vs the 660 and everything else but only if and when linden lab's fixes second life but that remains to be determined but anything and everything else besides second life would work on the spot with a 700 series card in a laptop or desktop ect


 

Being able to run SL better on a 760 than on a 660 is an assumption.  While logic may say that you should be able to, it doesn't mean that it will necessarily work that way.

Sometimes when people bring up problems (I am refraining from using the word 'complain' here) I will google for the same problem on War Of Worldcraft.  And people are having problems with 700 series cards.  So not every game is immune to problems.

But what interested me most were these comparison tables I found.

Tech Power Up (pops)

At the bottom of the page there is a drop down list with about twenty games with performance comparisons.  I didn't check every game but I did see the 660 outperforming the 760 on a few.

It's really interesting to see how much performance comparisons can vary on those charts from card to card and from game to game.

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Ah, yes getting programs to run on a PC, it is impossible for a software developer to test and make their software work with all the possible PC configurations.

 

I have a ton of 8-track tapes and a player for them. I recently tried to convert them to CD but sadly the magnetic stripes have worn over time and I can no longer get the music off the tapes. Companies and individuals have released newer conversion devices that may recover the information on the tapes but sometimes recovery is not possible. Second Life is nowhere near the non-recoverable stage.

 

Software makers rely on user feedback so they can add to hardware compatibility. Implementation takes time for these issues and sometimes the maker does not release a fix, and it is up to the community to develop their own fixes, sometimes called Unofficial Patches. OP, have you tried looking for an unofficial graphics driver patch that might work with Second Life?

 

I recently purchased a game called Freespace 2, released sometime before 2003. I have read that players have designed total conversions for the game and that they will provide regular content updates. Not just your typical new storyline/missions but also graphical updates including 4k resolution textures (which are available now for the game). Players took a game that they loved and updated it themselves after begging the company to do it.

 

I hate having to find a fix for an issue that should never have happened and it upsets me when the product company is not helpful. However, this is how life works and you just have to accept that. Using excuses like “I just wasted 30 minutes of my life! 30 minutes that I will never get back!” is stupid and immature. The knowledge that you gain from solving the issue either by yourself or with the help of others can be very rewarding. You might need this knowledge later in life and so you actually gained benefits in those 30 minutes rather than not gaining anything while playing video games for 30 minutes.

 

I remember the MMORPG called Everquest 2, before release, the developers talked of how the graphics engine had future hardware in mind and that "Currently available hardware technology would not be able to run the game on max". Of course, several years later, the community and developers found out that the graphics engine was flawed and that even with the most advanced hardware configuration of 2013, the Everquest 2 graphics engine can still cause the user to suffer massive performance drops down to 3 FPS every 5-10 minutes. 

 

I do not know if any of these issues exist within Second Life but sometimes games run into problems where the only way to fix the problem, would be to completely rework the engine. When considering this type of solution, companies may agree with the players that it would be a great idea but companies cannot allow their emotions to get in the way and so the companies look at the pros and cons of the fix, Is it a good idea financially?

 

Should old software be compatible with new hardware? Should old hardware be compatible with new software?

 

I tried installing an MSdos game onto my Windows 8 computer, I got installation errors, and turns out, I had to install some compatibility patches, not just for Windows 8 but also Graphics card and CPU (which was not recognized). The CPU and game software both needed unofficial patches.

 

I tried installing Crysis 2 onto my Windows XP Professional 32-bit, AMD Athlon XP 1400+, ATI Radeon 9000 64Mb AGP, 512Mb Desktop computer and sadly, I got errors. Why is this OP? Should newer Software be compatible with old hardware?

 

I remember an older MMORPG called Final Fantasy XI (2003); the game box had the system requirement on the back. One of the requirements said you needed an internet connection of Dial-up or better. 

When was the last time you saw a game that showed Dial-up as a requirement? How many games do you say that are not compatible with Dial-up? Second Life is probably not compatible with Dial-up, even though Second Life came out after the creation of Dial-up. 

 

So OP, you say that because of these software issues, Linden Lab not responding to your calls for help, and the optional viewers not meeting your expectations, you have decided to part ways with Second Life. Everyone may choose what they want to do but you then proceed to declare the decline of Linden Lab and Second Life. The resulting decline and soon to be deceased brought by hardware incompatibilities. Well you are wrong, there are many reasons why but I will tell you what fits in with most individuals who engage in MMORPG; Graphics do not matter. Graphics do not need to be good for you to enjoy the game.

 

Why do people continue to subscribe and pay $15 a month to play Everquest 1? (A game released in 1997). A year ago Sony Online Entertainment said that they had around 10,000 subscribers playing Everquest 1. Only 10,000 people playing the game yet they still run it? Well that is because they are still making a profit off of it. I laugh every time I see someone say that World of Warcraft is dying because there are only 9 million people subscribing. That is still a profit, they will continue to run the game till there is no profit and when there is no profit, then the game is considered dead. A game can never truely be considered dying unless the company is no longer making profits off it and is discussing whether to shut down all the servers or turn it into a free to play/sell it to another company.

 

You do not need good graphics to enjoy a game. If you feel that you cannot play a game without the best graphics than I suggest you go outside, that is better than a video game and the graphics are truly insane, performance issues are nonexistent.

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Summer Tison wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:


Summer Tison wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:


Summer Tison wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:


Care to explain elaborate how I am having pc issues?

like I said on starting post for thread I am sorry I bought a new pc and linden lab's is not compatible with it I will just go use other apps and stop using this one it is very simple if it makes you feel better go ahead blame my pc but I am sure other companies will enjoy the money I spend there as for second life I have tried countless times contacting them and they just do not give a damn so there is nothing I can do but leave

I have also seen countless posts with amd users posting second life is not compatible with there pc's with so many compatibility issues highly I recommend you savour and enjoy every last second of second life like it is the last as this business may go under if it cannot maintain clients or bring in new as there software appears to be incompatible with new pc's and laptops ect preventing new users from joining sl and incompatible with amd based pc's preventing new and old users from continuing to play or from joining sl

Care to explain how LL is to blame because YOUR pc isn't working with SL? Surely that is an issue your end, and as I explained I have a new Laptop that runs SL perfectly well, so it's not ALL new PCs/Laptops that are having this problem.

You're full of doom and gloom, you seem to think I care if you go elsewhere with your money, what a strange conclusion you made there. 

Did you buy your new PC with SL in mind? I know when I had to renew my Laptop I bought the best I could within my budget knowing I would want access to SL. You have been given some good advice on this thread, it's your choice if you want to take it, it doesn't matter to me one way or the other.

it is common for all stores and retailers to sell off all old and even liquidate it that doesn't mean it is modern because you bought something several years old new at best buy that is like going to a flee market and buying action figures that are 40 years old and still in the package and saying they are modern you just bought them post your cpu and gpu and we will see if we can find the real age
;)

Built with MSVC version 1600

You are at 255061.4, 257453.2, 558.2 in Cayman located at sim10290.agni.lindenlab.com (216.82.50.12:12035)

Second Life Server 13.10.03.281989

Release Notes

CPU: Intel® Core i3-2330M CPU @ 2.20GHz (2195.09 MHz)

Memory: 4003 MB

OS Version: Microsoft Windows 7 64-bit Service Pack 1 (Build 7601)

Graphics Card Vendor: Intel

Graphics Card: Intel® HD Graphics Family

Windows Graphics Driver Version: 8.15.0010.2361

OpenGL Version: 3.1.0 - Build 8.15.10.2361

Viewer SSE Version: SSE2

libcurl Version: libcurl/7.21.1 OpenSSL/1.0.0g zlib/1.2.5 c-ares/1.7.1

J2C Decoder Version: OpenJPEG: 1.5.2

Audio Driver Version: FMOD Ex 4.44.08

Qt Webkit Version: 4.7.1 (version number hard-coded)

Packets Lost: 1/599 (0.2%)

For your pleasure...you still didn't answer the question about your PC purchase...did you buy it with SL in mind? Or do you just feel too stupid to admit that you never considered the suitability of your chosen PC and now want to blame LL because you made a bad choice?

I do not have the best set-up in the world, far from it, but it certainly seems to be more than enough for my SL enjoyment.

I have one of the most advanced and powerful systems on the planet that can do anything though I only found out about Second Life's software problems afterwards though I still do not regret my purchase one piece of faulty software is hardly a deterrent. I only bought it because my old pc died and I bought it with everything in mind not a single piece of software even if I had of known in advance which I didn't I would not bought something that is in the gpu_table basing you pc up grades what are listed on game apps pages recommend sheet ect is completely stupid as they never up date that information or add all the required information though only second life is in the business of granting & blocking with permission scripts to be abled run there software on hardware I didn't know anything like this even existed until second life I have got games from the 90's that still work on my pc and older. second life is far from the only app I use and play. one app that does still work is imvu and it works with this pc so does any game or app I install. just not second life, just won't have a second life

how come your not using the 660?

http://ark.intel.com/products/53434/Intel-Core-i3-2330M-Processor-(3M-Cache-2_20-GHz)

2011

 

with out being an expert on second life here is what most everyone has to go on for deciding if there pc or laptop they have or chose will work with second life

http://secondlife.com/support/system-requirements/

your 660 is not here in fact they do not even have any direct x11 cards aka 400, 500, 600, 700 second life stopped up dating this after the 200 series cards which released in 2008-2009

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_200_Series

 

 

how is my research coming? because the only place you might find 200's card is a city land fill or something similar :smileylol:

sorry for not buying a pentium 4 with 200 graphics card I had no idea anyone was still using and recommending this hardware anymore 

2000-2005

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_4

it might run second life but it sure wont run anything else :smileyvery-happy:

do you perhaps have a time machine so I may go and purchase the 14 year old system? :smileyvery-happy:

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Excellent points, Finneli.  The mention of Everquest takes me back.  Although I played EQ2 for a time I could never get into it the way I had EQ, which I began playing in 2000 and played consistently for the next seven years, until I was introduced to SL.  I still go in and play from time to time...a lot of us "oldbie" diehards there.  I applied for the beta of Everquest Next which should be coming out sometime next year.  *Keeping my fingers crossed.*

 

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iceing Braveheart wrote:

 

do you perhaps have a time machine so I may go and purchase the 14 year old system? :smileyvery-happy:

A ten year old system will work fine - that was what my former PC (that ran SL and every other program I used) was based on the last time I upgraded the MB and graphics card, shortly before SEE2 became standard.  I couldn't see mesh and now I would likely see a lot of clouds as that PC didn't support server side baking.

I may have missed something in the thread - are you not able to get into SL or SL lags or does other weird things if you do get in?

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Czari Zenovka wrote:


iceing Braveheart wrote:

 

do you perhaps have a time machine so I may go and purchase the 14 year old system? :smileyvery-happy:

A ten year old system will work fine - that was what my former PC (that ran SL and every other program I used) was based on the last time I upgraded the MB and graphics card, shortly before SEE2 became standard.  I couldn't see mesh and now I would likely see a lot of clouds as that PC didn't support server side baking.

I may have missed something in the thread - are you not able to get into SL or SL lags or does other weird things if you do get in?

http://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussion-Forum/Second-Life-End-of-Life/m-p/2261167#M133443

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Once again, a bit of an exaggeration. SL is dying because you and a few others can't log on. Usual practice for graphics cards, unless you are a developer, is not to get the newest but the one the newest shiney but to get the card that the newest one replaced. You have to be patient and give the coders a chance to update the viewer to accept the graphics card. SL has been trying to fix problems, like bake fail. Isn't it a bit of hubris to say that SL is dying just because there are some that can't play with their new shiney?

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Behold the power of the internet! all of 2 seconds that it took me type type this "Radeon 9000 AGP buy" in, first listing:

http://www.amazon.com/ATI-Radeon-9000-64MB-Graphics/dp/B0068VSNBI

Finding graphics cards on Newegg is soooo easy. Geforce 210 for $25

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127705

 

I tried to find a cheap one for you, there are a ton of Pentium 4s on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Pentium-3GHz-800MHz-Socket/dp/B002T9DATS/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1382072840&sr=1-1&keywords=Intel+Pentium+4+531+3GHz+800MHz+1MB+Socket+775+CPU

 

By the way OP, your use of emote smily faces is rather stupid.

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Finneli Felwitch wrote:

Behold the power of the internet! all of 2 seconds that it took me type type this "Radeon 9000 AGP buy" in, first listing:

Finding graphics cards on Newegg is soooo easy. Geforce 210 for $25

 

I tried to find a cheap one for you, there are a ton of Pentium 4s on Amazon.

 

By the way OP, your use of emote smily faces is rather stupid.

Nothing is more stupid then you guys telling me to go wast good money a on 14 year old pc in order to play a borked app/game second life

you guys need to face it this app is dead and unsupported time to move on

I think the gpu in my cpu is probably bigger then those video cards though most likely unsupported too :smileylol: second life really is a lost cause in its current state

not that I would use it but it is there Intel® HD Graphics 4600

http://ark.intel.com/products/75123

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Thank you for explaining all of that, it raises another question that I'm interested in though, which is.....is it possible to create a virtual space which overcomes these problems, or at least speeds up the data transfer from node to node?  Does the technology exist yet?

Or am I expecting the impossible from LL, perhaps another problem is that some people come to SL having experienced ultra high graphics and content in gaming both on and offline and expect it everywhere.  I accept that the 'load' handled by SL is probably a lot more than conventional .....activities.... but agree that LL should have foreseen a lot of these problems and put resources into solving them.

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