The marketplace DESPERATELY needs a change. My open letter.

[Dresden Ceriano]

---

Ceka Cianci wrote:

no i was just agreeing to the gag thing..

---

In which case, I don't disagree... but my observation about the other thread still stands.

...Dres

[Ceka Cianci]

---

Dresden Ceriano wrote:

---

Ceka Cianci wrote:

no i was just agreeing to the gag thing..

---

In which case, I don't disagree... but my observation about the other thread still stands.

...Dres

---

i really didn't notice any of that myself..

i was only in that thread for a short time..more or less just skimmed a lot of things..

 

i was agreeing that no merchant is gonna gag my review if i ever give a bad one..let alone intimidate me..

but i've never given a bad review so far..

i usually just contact the merchant and end up giving a good review on their customer service if i had to use it..which is usually always good..

[Griffin Ceawlin]

I think most people are willing to give merchants or creators (in or out of SL) a chance to make things right before writing scathing reviews on the internet that may or may not have any basis in fact.

No, no customer is ever "obligated" to do so, but the squeaky wheel gets greased, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, etc., etc., etc.

[Melita Magic]

Thanks for the feedback on the 'does the customer have a right to review' issue.

No offense but if skimming a thread a lot of the subtlety would be lost, including subtext. (My posts were long as were some other people's, to be fair; just saying: I was trying to be helpful, my points were being ignored though and the others' opinions hammered repeatedly, trying to drown anyone else's out. Was I repeating mine in reply? Yep. But also trying to continue discussion in a meaningful sense.)

As for Dres your reaction is as valid as mine is to anything either of us have read.

As for my 'ganging up on me' post that was clearly a joke - notice the LOL?

FFS when did this forum lose ALL of its humor (except for Ceka.)

 

 

[Melita Magic]

---

Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

I think most people are willing to give merchants or creators (in or out of SL) a chance to make things right before writing scathing reviews on the internet that may or may not have any basis in fact.

No, no customer is ever "obligated" to do so, but the squeaky wheel gets greased, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, etc., etc., etc.

---

And yet I never said I wrote a 'scathing' review - I was replying to someone's post about being harassed for writing a barely even tepid review. (That's what the topic was actually about - is it wrong when a merchant harasses someone for that. That was, as I even said in the topic, what was coloring my posts there.) The topic became "a customer should contact a merchant before posting a review" which I find ridiculous. I never could have predicted the outrage my reply "that's not their obligation" would cause.

I even pointed out more than once in that topic, that the worst I'd written was a tepid three star review and that usually my reviews are glowing and five star and have likely increased business for those people. 

That was followed by long rants by some about horrible lazy customers and lots of other 'shade.' (Like the "dear sweet Melita" jab here.) But if called on it OMG the drama. (I'll give Dres this though: at least he doesn't pretend his vinegar is honey so, no need to even discuss it.) Apparently in some reality "maybe you never worked a day in your life" is appropriate and not an insult.

I am not saying your post was about me but since most of the replies in there are about or in reply to my posts (as well as some posts here now about whether or not anyone was being negative toward me, in that topic) there's a good bet some walked away with the impression you just posted. The people who actually READ what I posted in entirety and hopefully have good reading comprehension skills won't.

I think if some of the merchants in the other thread were being honest they'd simply state they don't feel a customer should ever post a review. Not unless it's absolutely glowing with praise. 

[Ceka Cianci]

---

Melita Magic wrote:

Thanks for the feedback on the 'does the customer have a right to review' issue.

No offense but if skimming a thread a lot of the subtlety would be lost, including subtext. (My posts were long as were some other people's, to be fair; just saying: I was trying to be helpful, my points were being ignored though and the others' opinions hammered repeatedly, trying to drown anyone else's out. Was I repeating mine in reply? Yep. But also

trying

to continue discussion in a meaningful sense.)

As for Dres your reaction is as valid as mine is to anything either of us have read.

As for my 'ganging up on me' post that was clearly a joke - notice the LOL?

FFS when did this forum lose ALL of its humor (except for Ceka.)

 

 

---

hehehe i'm really trying to cut down on my drama intake..so it's not really skimming more than it is avoiding  at times..

it doesn't even have to be drama really..it could just be slight tension and i start to reach for the door hehehehe

i used to really read  a lot of the posts where you would see two people going back and forth.

i jjust don't have that kind of time anymore these days..so i tend to read the OP and then  the first page and then by that time if something is gonna be a little warm it's usually around page two hehehehe

then i start  just skimming..

although on those days when i do have time..i'll throw down a cat fight or two myself hehehehe

 

 

[Melita Magic]

I have to remind myself to do that with any thread one or two people are posting in. 

Can't blame you Ceka. There was a LOT of tension in that topic.

I tried joking at one point that it was ironic that some merchants were harassing people for even mentioning the customer right to a review. Completely ignored.

I have to learn that when I'm being talked AT and not TO, it's time to go.

[Griffin Ceawlin]

---

Melita Magic wrote:

I think if some of the merchants in the other thread were being honest they'd simply state they don't feel a customer should ever post a review. Not unless it's absolutely glowing with praise.

---

I think some of the merchants in that other thread are being honest when they say that they appreciate the opportunity to make things right before being given a bad review (which they may or may not deserve).

Pretty sure we've all seen them before. Poor reviews for products that nobody else seems to have issues with.

There was a thread a couple days ago that went like: "Duuuuuuuh. My man parts won't work... What should I do?" Not only did the person not bother contacting the merchant (as far as anyone could tell) for technical or other support, but he wrote a poor review before posting his questions on the Forum (yeah, he linked to it on Marketplace).

Who's at fault there? I doubt it was the merchant...

[Melita Magic]

Except that wasn't how they said it. (That's actually what I was saying though; which of course was ignored since I somehow becasme the villain of the piece. I said 'yes it's wonderful when that happens but there's no reason they SHOULD - SHOULD - go through all of that first.' In an attempt to understand just how much they expect a customer to go through before being allowed to post a review - and that's really the correct word if what they expect is this delay - I asked "how long?" I never got a real answer on that - not a direct one. A partial one.)

The customer you find "Duh" is probably an average customer. If he found it difficult to use, others likely will as well. 

He has no obligation to go to the merchant before posting his review.

That's all I was saying. 

And some were insisting the opposite.

[Sassy Romano]

---

Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

I think if some of the merchants in the other thread were being honest they'd simply state they don't feel a customer should ever post a review. Not unless it's absolutely glowing with praise.

---

I think some of the merchants in that other thread are being honest when they say that they

appreciate

the

opportunity

to make things right

before

being given a bad review (which they may or may not deserve).

Pretty sure we've all seen them before. Poor reviews for products that

nobody

else seems to have issues with.

There was a thread a couple days ago that went like: "Duuuuuuuh. My man parts won't work... What should I do?" Not only did the person not bother contacting the merchant (as far as anyone could tell) for technical or other support, but he wrote a poor review before posting his questions on the Forum (yeah, he linked to it on Marketplace).

Who's at fault there? I doubt it was the merchant...

---

Now that merchants DO get an email when a review is left, there's really very little time for harm if the merchant is attentive.  If they're not then let the review stand.

I'm as interested in how a merchant handles an issue as what the product or problem might be like in the first place.  I'm not always interested in glowing reports of product quality if it doesn't it me because it has a resizer and the permissions are incorrectly stated.  On the other hand if several other people write up good reports following rectification or I see a comment from the merchant that illustrates how the situation was resolved, that renders any scoring system moot in my mind as it's clear what the resolution was.

*shrugs*

[Dresden Ceriano]

---

Melita Magic wrote:

Apparently in some reality "maybe you never worked a day in your life" is appropriate 

and

not an insult.

---

If anyone has difficulty perceiving reality, my dear, it's you... as evidenced by the fact that no one actually wrote what you quoted in reply to you nor anyone else in that thread.

If your intent is to start arguments with people, at least have the common decency to reply to what they've actually said, rather than what you've conveniently misinterpreted in some vain attempt to paint yourself as some sort of martyr.  It's as if you think that every post is about you or what you've had to say, therefore you must scour them all in order to find the one sentence that you can twist into something of which you are able to take offense.

That was actually an interesting thread until you got all bent out of shape over nothing.

...Dres

[Melita Magic]

---

Dresden Ceriano wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

Apparently in some reality "maybe you never worked a day in your life" is appropriate 

and

not an insult.

---

If anyone has difficulty perceiving reality, my dear, it's you... as evidenced by the fact that no one actually wrote what you quoted in reply to you nor anyone else in that thread.

If your intent is to start arguments with people, at least have the common decency to reply to what they've actually said, rather than what you've conveniently misinterpreted in some vain attempt to paint yourself as some sort of martyr.  It's as if you think that every post is about you or what you've had to say, therefore you must scour them all in order to find the one sentence that you can twist into something of which you are able to take offense.

That was actually an interesting thread until you got all bent out of shape over nothing.

...Dres

---

YAWN.

[Melita Magic]

---

Dresden Ceriano wrote:

If anyone has difficulty perceiving reality, my dear, it's you... as evidenced by the fact that no one actually wrote what you quoted in reply to you nor anyone else in that thread.

...Dres

---

Here is the quote, nit picker:

"even if you are not employed and never have been"

 

[Dresden Ceriano]

---

Melita Magic wrote:

---

Dresden Ceriano wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

Apparently in some reality "maybe you never worked a day in your life" is appropriate 

and

not an insult.

---

If anyone has difficulty perceiving reality, my dear, it's you... as evidenced by the fact that no one actually wrote what you quoted in reply to you nor anyone else in that thread.

If your intent is to start arguments with people, at least have the common decency to reply to what they've actually said, rather than what you've conveniently misinterpreted in some vain attempt to paint yourself as some sort of martyr.  It's as if you think that every post is about you or what you've had to say, therefore you must scour them all in order to find the one sentence that you can twist into something of which you are able to take offense.

That was actually an interesting thread until you got all bent out of shape over nothing.

...Dres

---

YAWN.

---

Oh, why couldn't all of your replies be so concise and well thought out as this?

...Dres

[Melita Magic]

---

Dresden Ceriano wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

---

Dresden Ceriano wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

Apparently in some reality "maybe you never worked a day in your life" is appropriate 

and

not an insult.

---

If anyone has difficulty perceiving reality, my dear, it's you... as evidenced by the fact that no one actually wrote what you quoted in reply to you nor anyone else in that thread.

If your intent is to start arguments with people, at least have the common decency to reply to what they've actually said, rather than what you've conveniently misinterpreted in some vain attempt to paint yourself as some sort of martyr.  It's as if you think that every post is about you or what you've had to say, therefore you must scour them all in order to find the one sentence that you can twist into something of which you are able to take offense.

That was actually an interesting thread until you got all bent out of shape over nothing.

...Dres

---

YAWN.

---

Oh, why couldn't all of your replies be so concise and well thought out as this?

...Dres

---

Why can't your insults at least be accurate?

[Griffin Ceawlin]

Take things out of context much?

"And I notice you did not answer the question -- even if you are not employed and never have been, surely you must have had some responsibilities to someone at some point, whether you were paid or not."

How that translates into something putting you down as never having worked a day in your life is... puzzling, to say the least.

[Czari Zenovka]

---

Ceka Cianci wrote:

although on those days when i do have time..i'll throw down a cat fight or two myself hehehehe

 

 

---

CAT FIGHT!!!

[Trinity Yazimoto]

---

Melita Magic wrote:

OMG where are you in the other thread? The merchants are ganging up on me in there! LOL

Yes I agree with you 100%. 

No one puts a gag into my mouth. Period.

---

well, that's probably humor, indeed...

but as a merchant who posted in the other thread, i dont know what to think about the " The merchants are ganging up on me in there! " (bolding is mine)

AFAK there was a lot of different merchants in this thread and they dont have the same opinion on the topic. I know, you had a huge disagreement with ONE merchant, but a lot of other had a different opinion than this one merchant. So, really i dont recognize me in "THE" merchants you talk about, nevertheless i was in this thread and i am a merchant (and i can say same for some of other posters i saw there too).

i usually have a good sense of humor, but i dont really like to be put in a basket that is not mine.

I would appreciate if you rectify. Thank you.

PS : and althought i have a lot of respect for the merchant who you argued with there, i have a total different opinion about reviews, and like you, it irks me a lot when i see merchants comes  like babycries in the forum to complain about a bad review or harrass the reviewer... i said in the other thread what was my opinion already about what is a review i wont repeat again.

[Czari Zenovka]

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

OMG where are you in the other thread? The merchants are ganging up on me in there! LOL

Yes I agree with you 100%. 

No one puts a gag into my mouth. Period.

---

well, that's probably humor, indeed...

but as a merchant who posted in the other thread, i dont know what to think about the " 

The

merchants are ganging up on me in there! 

" (bolding is mine)

AFAK there was a lot of different merchants in this thread and they dont have the same opinion on the topic. I know, you had a huge disagreement with

ONE

merchant, but a lot of other had a different opinion than this one merchant. So, really i dont recognize me in "THE" merchants you talk about, nevertheless i was in this thread and i am a merchant (and i can say same for some of other posters i saw there too).

i usually have a good sense of humor, but i dont really like to be put in a basket that is not mine.

I would appreciate if you rectify. Thank you.

PS : and althought i have a lot of respect for the merchant who you argued with there, i have a total different opinion about reviews, and like you, it irks me a lot when i see merchants comes  like babycries in the forum to complain about a bad review or harrass the reviewer... i said in the other thread what was my opinion already about what is a review i wont repeat again.

---

I was feeling the same way about being put in the same basket and was debating on whether to say anything or not.

@Melita - You should know me well enough by now to know my stance on a lot of issues.  In the other thread I posted to each person's post with no hidden agenda.  Thus, I posted to you, to the merchant you had an issue with, to Trinity, probably to a few others - and my responses were to the specific posts.

I apologize if you think I was one of the merchants ganging up on you.  As Trinity said we, as merchants, don't all agree on given issues.  I know you don't read the merchant forums but trust me, we can get into some heated debates over there.   I've had debates on issues with Trinity...one that we just have to agree to disagree on...lol.  I've probably disagreed with every merchant that posted in the other thread at one time or another.

We're really not a bad lot, us merchants.

 

[Dresden Ceriano]

I seriously doubt that Melita honestly believes that either you or Trinity were ganging up on her, since the whole ganging up thing was completely fabricated from the start.  She said herself that it was a joke, a tasteless joke perhaps, but a joke, nonetheless.  Obviously, she thinks it's funny to say things that aren't true in order to get people riled up.

...Dres

[Celestiall Nightfire]

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

OMG where are you in the other thread? The merchants are ganging up on me in there! LOL

Yes I agree with you 100%. 

No one puts a gag into my mouth. Period.

---

well, that's probably humor, indeed...

but as a merchant who posted in the other thread, i dont know what to think about the " 

The

merchants are ganging up on me in there! 

" (bolding is mine)

AFAK there was a lot of different merchants in this thread and they dont have the same opinion on the topic. I know, you had a huge disagreement with

ONE

merchant, but a lot of other had a different opinion than this one merchant. So, really i dont recognize me in "THE" merchants you talk about, nevertheless i was in this thread and i am a merchant (and i can say same for some of other posters i saw there too).

i usually have a good sense of humor, but i dont really like to be put in a basket that is not mine.

I would appreciate if you rectify. Thank you.

PS : and althought i have a lot of respect for the merchant who you argued with there, i have a total different opinion about reviews, and like you, it irks me a lot when i see merchants comes  like babycries in the forum to complain about a bad review or harrass the reviewer... i said in the other thread what was my opinion already about what is a review i wont repeat again.

---

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

OMG where are you in the other thread? The merchants are ganging up on me in there! LOL

Yes I agree with you 100%. 

No one puts a gag into my mouth. Period.

---

well, that's probably humor, indeed...

but as a merchant who posted in the other thread, i dont know what to think about the " 

The

merchants are ganging up on me in there! 

" (bolding is mine)

AFAK there was a lot of different merchants in this thread and they dont have the same opinion on the topic. I know, you had a huge disagreement with

ONE

merchant, but a lot of other had a different opinion than this one merchant. So, really i dont recognize me in "THE" merchants you talk about, nevertheless i was in this thread and i am a merchant (and i can say same for some of other posters i saw there too).

i usually have a good sense of humor, but i dont really like to be put in a basket that is not mine.

I would appreciate if you rectify. Thank you.

PS : and althought i have a lot of respect for the merchant who you argued with there, i have a total different opinion about reviews, and like you, it irks me a lot when i see merchants comes  like babycries in the forum to complain about a bad review or harrass the reviewer... i said in the other thread what was my opinion already about what is a review i wont repeat again.

---

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

OMG where are you in the other thread? The merchants are ganging up on me in there! LOL

Yes I agree with you 100%. 

No one puts a gag into my mouth. Period.

---

well, that's probably humor, indeed...

but as a merchant who posted in the other thread, i dont know what to think about the " 

The

merchants are ganging up on me in there! 

" (bolding is mine)

AFAK there was a lot of different merchants in this thread and they dont have the same opinion on the topic. I know, you had a huge disagreement with

ONE

merchant, but a lot of other had a different opinion than this one merchant. So, really i dont recognize me in "THE" merchants you talk about, nevertheless i was in this thread and i am a merchant (and i can say same for some of other posters i saw there too).

i usually have a good sense of humor, but i dont really like to be put in a basket that is not mine.

I would appreciate if you rectify. Thank you.

PS : and althought i have a lot of respect for the merchant who you argued with there, i have a total different opinion about reviews, and like you, it irks me a lot when i see merchants comes  like babycries in the forum to complain about a bad review or harrass the reviewer... i said in the other thread what was my opinion already about what is a review i wont repeat again.

---

No one ganged up on MM in that other thread, I just read through the whole thing.  MM fabricated a bunch of BS, and took umbrage where none was intended. (in the other thread) That's what she does. 

 

The merchant that MM argued with tried her best to explain and keep things on track, and she also tried to get across the idea that she appreciates her customers.  But, that did not stop the hyperbole, attacks and off-kilter rants that MM is prone to.

[Celestiall Nightfire]

---

Czari Zenovka wrote:

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Melita Magic wrote:

OMG where are you in the other thread? The merchants are ganging up on me in there! LOL

Yes I agree with you 100%. 

No one puts a gag into my mouth. Period.

---

well, that's probably humor, indeed...

but as a merchant who posted in the other thread, i dont know what to think about the " 

The

merchants are ganging up on me in there! 

" (bolding is mine)

AFAK there was a lot of different merchants in this thread and they dont have the same opinion on the topic. I know, you had a huge disagreement with

ONE

merchant, but a lot of other had a different opinion than this one merchant. So, really i dont recognize me in "THE" merchants you talk about, nevertheless i was in this thread and i am a merchant (and i can say same for some of other posters i saw there too).

i usually have a good sense of humor, but i dont really like to be put in a basket that is not mine.

I would appreciate if you rectify. Thank you.

PS : and althought i have a lot of respect for the merchant who you argued with there, i have a total different opinion about reviews, and like you, it irks me a lot when i see merchants comes  like babycries in the forum to complain about a bad review or harrass the reviewer... i said in the other thread what was my opinion already about what is a review i wont repeat again.

---

I was feeling the same way about being put in the same basket and was debating on whether to say anything or not.

@Melita - You should know me well enough by now to know my stance on a lot of issues.  In the other thread I posted to each person's post with no hidden agenda.  Thus, I posted to you, to the merchant you had an issue with, to Trinity, probably to a few others - and my responses were to the specific posts.

I apologize if you think I was one of the merchants ganging up on you.  As Trinity said we, as merchants, don't all agree on given issues.  I know you don't read the merchant forums but trust me, we can get into some heated debates over there.

  I've had debates on issues with Trinity...one that we just have to agree to disagree on...lol.  I've probably disagreed with every merchant that posted in the other thread at one time or another.

We're really not a bad lot, us merchants.

 

---

Czari, you're classy, and so is Trinity, as you've offered an apology , even though you did nothing wrong.  If anyone needs to apologize, it should be MM, as she launched into repeated attacks on the other merchant in the other thread, then she fabricated nonsense about being "ganged up" on here in this one. 

 

 

[Pamela Galli]

Oh and I was not the first target  she claimed was "insulting" her by simply expressing the opinion that it is preferable (NOT obligatory!) to contact a merchant with a problem directly before writing a negative review:  http://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussion-Forum/Harassment-and-the-bad-review/td-p/2168077/page/2

 

[Celestiall Nightfire]

---

Pamela Galli wrote:

Oh and I was not the first target  she claimed was "insulting" her by simply expressing the opinion that it is preferable (NOT obligatory!) to contact a merchant with a problem directly before writing a negative review:  

http://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussion-Forum/Harassment-and-the-bad-review/td-p/2168077/page/2

 

---

Yup. 

Someone points out that, "lack of common sense" can be a problem, in the generic sense, and she takes it personal. (claims to have been insulted)   

[Solaria Goldshark]

---

Rosen Janus wrote:

 

 

The marketplace is already unfairly geared in favor of the vendor. It seems.. every time I don't give a FULL FIVESTAR "OMG THIS PRODUCT IS THE EPITOME OF MY EXISTENCE" review, the creator (and this usually always happpens with women) comes to bite my head off and try to bully me into changing my review!

Of course even if I don't, the review seems to magically disaapear the next day! 

(again, the system is unfairly geared in favor of the vendor)

 

 

---

 

The company I work for in another life has a nice website that details our product and services.  We offer the opportunity for people to post a comment or review.  The administrator of this particular site has final authority to approve what ultimately gets posted.  In every commercial venture there will be unhappy customers.  It should be no surprise that every commercial enterprise will do their very best to put their best foot forward to help bolster the image of their product or services.  This is not to say that negative reviews are not of any concern, they are, but I sure wouldn't want the odd unhappy consumer to put a dent in my bottom line.  I find this practice not in the least dishonest or unfair to those with a complaint.

My personal practice is this: I offer praise and thank you, and job well done where appropriate, for those times I feel grateful for the product or service I receive.  I let the negative review happen when I vote with my pocketbook and move on and never use that service or buy that product again.  I find no value personally for a vitriolic review.

 

I challenge you for the next year to never write a bad review.  The only review you should write are to those whose products you like.....I dare you.