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Casidei

help for submissives

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It's sl.  A game, right?  Yes it's a game.  But it's real people and when you meet someone you click with, it doesn't really matter if you're sitting across the table from them or if you're behind a computer screen.  The feelings and emotions are real in sl.  The love we sometimes find is real.  And the pain we experience is just as real.

 

submissive women especially become disillusioned.  As a submissive, we give everything we have.  When it doesn't work out, it's devastating.  If you need a safe haven, contact me.  If you need help learning what this lifestyle is about, I can help.  Or maybe you just need someone to be there.  I'd be honored. 

 

If you're new to the lifestyle, there are things you need to know in order to protect yourself and red flags you need to look for.  If you're not new to the lifestyle...well those of us who have been around can still be hurt.  I'd like to help.  Please send me a notecard inworld.  I'm in sl normally in the evenings but I will make a point to find you if you list your online times in your notecard.

 

I've created a new account but I've been in sl for almost 7 years and have much experience with helping those in the BDSM, D/s lifestyle.  I'm not trying to make lindens.  I'm just trying to make a difference.

 

I hope to hear form you.

 

Casedei

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BDSM people feeling special again?

Oh, right, I forgot...your feelings are deeper and better than those from others.

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I think it would be wise to remember that while feelings can be real, that doesn't necessarily mean they are.

Some people do take the phrase roleplay very seriously. On screen, in sl, they are a character. They are not themselves. What they say, what they do and the feelings they express may not always be real. Some people are extremely well rounded actors and can do a fantastic job of bringing out your real emotions without ever expressing theirs. It's actually quite an interesting thing. Unfortunately, it also has a downside. That being some expect what is expressed, is also real, because the person behind the screen is. That's not always so. It would do anyone who is into rp of any sort well to remember this.

That goes for anyone and everyone, not just those in the BDSM sort of rp. Since really, this happens all the time. I'm not certain why someone would feel submissives, or even just people into that type of rp hold some sort of trophy when it comes to allowing themselves to get hurt.

I've actually found the opposite. Many I've encountered in that lifestyle do treat the actions, words, emotions, thoughts and feelings as if the character and human behind, are two separate entities. I can't say the same for all other areas of rp I've encountered. But this ability to separate is one thing that draws some people to a virtual world in the first place. It gives them the opportunity to play, feel, speak and act like someone or something they are not.

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Syo Emerald wrote:

BDSM people feeling special again?

Oh, right, I forgot...your feelings are deeper and better than those from others.

no, but sick and tired of condescending people claiming that "it's just roleplay". Especially condescending people who've no idea about what we do, or that BDSM while often part of a D/s relation isn't all of it.

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Casidei wrote:

 the pain we experience is just as real.


Of course it is!

Awe . . . is astonished that subs who rp vore and dolcet manage to survive the agony sitting in front of their keyboards.

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Vor and Dolcet?  I never said anything about those things.  If you believe that's what BDSM is about, then you need to educate yourself.  I've never ever even considered going near those things and neither has anyone I know.  All I'm doing is offering some help and support to people who are in a category that I know something about.  Four people have contacted me already less than 24 hours after I posted this.  I'm not sure why some lash out and attack anything that is not what they themselves are.  I could go on about judging other people, but why bother? 

 

I'm offering my help to anyone who needs someone to listen and be there.  Just contact me INWORLD.  I have no intentions of responding to anything else that's said here.  It's ridiculous. 

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Casidei wrote:

Vor and Dolcet?  I never said anything about those things.

Hmmm, you were unspecific about the particular aspects of BDSM in which you suggested you might have some expertise, but it appears you are now contradicting yourself and suggesting that perhaps the pain you feel in SL is NOT the same as you might feel with equivalent activities in the real world? Would you like to provide clarification?

 


Casidei wrote:

I have no intentions of responding to anything else that's said here.

Erm . . . rather pointless of you to initiate a potential dialogue in these forums then, isn't it.

 


Casidei wrote:

It's ridiculous. 

Awe . . . is pleased to see that you concur with his own assessment of virtual BDSM.

 

 

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jwenting wrote:


Syo Emerald wrote:

BDSM people feeling special again?

Oh, right, I forgot...your feelings are deeper and better than those from others.

no, but sick and tired of condescending people claiming that "it's just roleplay". Especially condescending people who've no idea about what we do, or that BDSM while often part of a D/s relation isn't all of it.

If someone wants "a real 24/7 thing" I always suggest this thing called RL. If it has to be in SL or just developes here, the first thing to do is to make sure both parties want and expect the same thing (but thats nothing special to BDSM folks, this applies to everyone in SL).

While I never said or experianced that someone got to hear "cheer up, it just rp", I have to say to some point BDSM IS RP in Second Life by definition of what roleplay is. Nobody here gets really restrained, tied up or spanked. Emotes get written....its basically RP.

What feelings lie behind this RP is a totaly different thing. But part of this relationship is always RP as long as part of the action stays in SL.

 

What botters me is just how again people more or less involved in this "lifestyle" express that they think that the feelings of other inside this group are deeper, better and what not. Its not the first time I get this feeling. Same applies also to their point of view about relationships.

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What you have to remember when you are involved in a virtual BDSM roleplay is that while you, as a dedicated submissive, may be sincerely making every effort to reflect your inner conflicts and repressed emotions a la Sylvia Plath, there is an excellent chance that there is someone the other end of the 'net saying to his frat-mates "Hey dudes, come see what this masochistic chick is willing to do if I act like Alan Rickman on a bad hair day".

Awe . . . or it might even be that obese guy with the combover in the corner of the office who not only hacked your email and found out your avatar name, but knows where you live; or maybe that's what you want?

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ImaTest wrote:

...But this ability to separate is one thing that draws some people to a virtual world in the first place. It gives them the opportunity to play, feel, speak and act like someone or something they are not.

I would instead say that it gives people a chance to play, speak and act like a part of themselves they have not developed in RL (and have no plans to pursue in RL).

As far as everyone gets hurt and everyone cries, that's true but I think the amount of hurt and betrayal one feels depends on how much one has invested in the partner or how much they have trusted them.  Some of the practices in BDSM require an extreme amount of trust. If people feel jealous because a BDSM group is forming to support submissives and they are not included then they can form their own support group for those going through a rough break up. (This last was not directed at you but the whole thread in general.)

I used to ride so am going to use a horse analogy.  Some trainers break a horse by breaking their spirit.  They will use cruel practices to quickly establish their dominance over the horse.  On the other end of the spectrum are "horse whisperers" who take the time to understand the particular horse and entice them to submit to their will without breaking the horse's spirit.  Although I am not part of the BDSM lifestyle I speculate that doms/dommes fall into this same wide range of styles.

When I'm ready to dip my toes in the BDSM pool, I am interested in experimenting with D/s and mild bondage but am not interested in SM or discipline.  I was thinking that every sub would want a "horse whisperer" type dom so those who ended up with a "bronc buster" could end up in a world of pain (granted only emotional and psychological in SL) and would need support.  Then I realized some might actually prefer that situation so I guess I can't think in generalities.

 

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Syo Emerald wrote:

If someone wants "a real 24/7 thing" I always suggest this thing called RL. If it has to be in SL or just developes here, the first thing to do is to make sure both parties want and expect the same thing (but thats nothing special to BDSM folks, this applies to everyone in SL).

While I never said or experianced that someone got to hear "cheer up, it just rp", I have to say to some point BDSM IS RP in Second Life by definition of what roleplay is. Nobody here gets really restrained, tied up or spanked. Emotes get written....its basically RP.

What feelings lie behind this RP is a totaly different thing. But part of this relationship is always RP as long as part of the action stays in SL.

 

What botters me is just how again people more or less involved in this "lifestyle" express that they think that the feelings of other inside this group are deeper, better and what not. Its not the first time I get this feeling. Same applies also to their point of view about relationships.

and condescending again. Might as well say you should take your personal relationships out of sl because it's just rp and not real, that you can have no feelings for other people in sl because they're just avatars and there's no real interaction between you and them.

I don't, because I know better.

And again you're claiming that a D/s relation is limited to bdsm and inflicting pain, which is simply not the case.

Just like a vanilla relation isn't limited to shagging each other 24/7.

And yes, many in the SL D/s community have far more meaningful relations than most others in SL. Most SL relations are so shallow, they last only a few weeks on average. Many D/s relations in SL last for years, and often do indeed migrate to RL if circumstances allow to a far greater degree than other types do.

As to "simply take it rl", a lot of us come to SL because we are restricted in the ways we can express ourselves RL, either because of legal hurdles, cultural stigmas, and/or physical disabilities. That's far less a problem than if you simply want to have pixel sex with your boyfriend, just take that RL and don't forget to use protection.

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jwenting wrote:


Might as well ... take your personal relationships out of sl because it's ... not real ... you can have no feelings for other people ... and there's no real interaction between you and them.

I don't ... know better.


FIFY!

Awe . . . loves the word "condescending".

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As soon as you take a virtual seriously and  think it is the same as in real life, you have a problem.

That is not to say you can do whatever just because it is virtual and there are no reprocutions to what someone does.It simple means you need to lower your expectations.Bottom line SL is not RL.We just come here because there is something in our real world that we can not have or find.

 

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Studio09 wrote:


ImaTest wrote:

...But this ability to separate is one thing that draws some people to a virtual world in the first place. It gives them the opportunity to play, feel, speak and act like someone or something they are not.

I would instead say that it gives people a chance to play, speak and act like a part of themselves they have not developed in RL (and have no plans to pursue in RL).


Why would you choose instead here? When it's actually both.

I used the word some for a reason. Even a quick glance at this particular subforum will give you an idea on how some choose to use the term roleplay as it pertains to both their sl and their rl.

Yes some may be choosing to bring about a side or bit of themselves they feel unable to do so in rl. Again the keyword there being some.

Neither being right or wrong as it pertains to me, or anyone else. People needto do what feels right for them. I only posted that to point out that while you-general you-may be feeling everything you are emoting that does NOT always guarantee the other person(s) in your RP are doing the same. It would do all who participate in any type of RP to remember this. It can get both tricky, and sticky(not in a good way), otherwise.

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ImaTest wrote:


Why would you choose instead here? When it's actually both.

I used the word
some
for a reason. Even a quick glance at this particular subforum will give you an idea on how some choose to use the term roleplay as it pertains to both their sl and their rl.

Yes some may be choosing to bring about a side or bit of themselves they feel unable to do so in rl. Again the keyword there being
some
.

Neither being right or wrong as it pertains to me, or anyone else. People needto do what feels right for them. I only posted that to point out that while you-general you-may be feeling everything you are emoting that does NOT always guarantee the other person(s) in your RP are doing the same. It would do all who participate in any type of RP to remember this. It can get both tricky, and sticky(not in a good way), otherwise.

Your use of the word some was correct from your point of view.  I used the word instead because I think we humans at our very core are all things.   We may not be in touch with some of those aspects of ourselves but they are there.  Some may deny that it is a part of themselves but I  don't think that anyone can RP anything that they are not, even if they don't own it.  And RP can be a safe way to explore that aspect of themselves without bringing into their RL.

Your caution that some people are feeling real emotions while other could be faking it is valid.  Just like in RL.

 

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There was an interesting case covered by a UK paper recently. Several women who joined an online dating site discovered that the man whose photo they'd been attracted to and who they'd been writing to and talking to on the phone and arranging to meet up with - and whom they'd all very, very seriously fallen for - turned out to be a woman.

No SL involved. Not bdsm related. The women involved were apparently genuine in claiming to be broken-hearted, and one was unashamed about admitting she'd been absolutely convinced she'd met her soul-mate. None of the women, however, were interested in continuing their love-story with the obese 30-year-old female that their 'boyfriend' turned out to be.

My point? That the feelings may be real, however, they can be generated for the projection of a person - which doesn't actually exist - rather than an actual person.

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Casidei wrote:

submissive women especially become disillusioned.  As a submissive, we give everything we have.  When it doesn't work out, it's devastating. 

 

Sorry, but I can't see how these claims can be true. If any person genuinely loves, and then they lose that love, then surely it's always devastating?

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Awe Thor wrote:


Casidei wrote:

 the pain we experience is just as real.


Of course it is!

Awe . . . is astonished that subs who rp vore and dolcet manage to survive the agony sitting in front of their keyboards.

Considering the huge numbers of people whose feelings you've hurt, I'd have thought you'd be in big demand as a bdsm Dom, since you can, apparently, guarantee a SL-RL cross-over humiliation/masochism experience.

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Studio09 wrote:


"Some of the practices in BDSM require an extreme amount of trust."

Many practices in life require an extreme amount of blind trust. When I get into my car, I'm forced to trust that none of the thousands of completely unknown, unselected people driving on the same road will not swerve into the path of my car.

In a relationship context, even the most vanilla of sexual relations requires that a (usually) smaller, weaker women trust the man (sometimes unknown, or hardly known) will not hurt her - after all, a man hardly needs to use gadgets to inflict pain on a woman if that turns out to be his intention.

If you chose to add to the universal risks of living some extra layers of risk factors, well, that's fine and good and congratulations, if you feel they're in order - but don't forget - you choose freely to add on those extra factors for your own thrills.

I'm pretty convinced that nobody's jealous - there are loads of support groups out there for all sorts of human pain - I think what might have caused people to sit up in their chairs a bit was the oft-repeated claim (in the OP) that D/s relationships are somehow a wee bit more special than non-D/s ones.

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I am in a M/s relationship that has lasted for more than a year now. We are migrating it to RL and he is coming here RL soon.  6 months ago I would have vehemently disagreed with those in this thread who say SL is not the same as RL but now I know different. RL IS different, its all to easy to fake love and emotion behind a keyboard.  That said I support your initiative, there are various support groups inworld that also do what you are doing. Good luck with your efforts.

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Carole Franizzi wrote:


Studio09 wrote:


"Some of the practices in BDSM require an extreme amount of trust."

...

In a relationship context, even the most vanilla of sexual relations requires that a (usually) smaller, weaker women trust the man (sometimes unknown, or hardly known) will not hurt her - after all, a man hardly needs to use gadgets to inflict pain on a woman if that turns out to be his intention....

But it would require more trust to say allow yourself to be handcuffed to a bed.  Your responses to physical danger are removed or limited - can't flee and fighting is restricted.  So after having established this deeper level of trust, betrayal would hurt more.

A simple example:  If a stranger made an unkind remark, sure it might hurt for a moment, but if a friend made the same unkind remark it would hurt more. 

 

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Studio09 wrote:


Carole Franizzi wrote:


Studio09 wrote:


"Some of the practices in BDSM require an extreme amount of trust."

...

In a relationship context, even the most vanilla of sexual relations requires that a (usually) smaller, weaker women trust the man (sometimes unknown, or hardly known) will not hurt her - after all, a man hardly needs to use gadgets to inflict pain on a woman if that turns out to be his intention....

But it would require more trust to say allow yourself to be handcuffed to a bed.  Your responses to physical danger are removed or limited - can't flee and fighting is restricted.  So after having established this deeper level of trust, betrayal would hurt more.

A simple example:  If a stranger made an unkind remark, sure it might hurt for a moment, but if a friend made the same unkind remark it would hurt more. 

 

No, I'm sorry, I still dsagree. A big strong man - most men actually - if determined to hurt a woman, could easily. Your physically average man doesn't need handcuffs to injure or kill a woman - he can simply sit on her, for example. Happily, most of them don't.

Really, what you describe as a deeper layer of trust - using handcuffs - just doesn't make sense. If I go out tonight and pick up a stranger and bring him home, how am I less trusting than my married friend who, together with her husband of 20 years, use cuffs at fun-time?

The degree of pain over betrayal depends on how emotionally developed, how well-established the relationship is - with or without handcuffs. Vanilla people's husbands and boyfriends are not strangers to them, so your example doesn't work.

If you have a need to feel you're involved in something 'special', that's great - apparently, the secret for all long-lasting relationships is the shared belief they have something magical and unique - however, I think you'll find that people who don't do bdsm feel just as strongly about their relationships as you do about yours.

 ETA Sorry, but I went off to make a cuppa and kept thinking about this topic. The fact is that if either you or I pick up a total stranger at a bar, you doing your bdsm thing, me doing my non-bdsm thing, both of us run the exact same risks - worst case scenario - death. If you and I are both in long-term relationships, doing our thing within them - say married, with kids, and both our men walk out on us because they've got someone new, you really think your pain would be greater than mine? Seriously?

In all honesty, I think it's this 'chosen people' attitude which here in SL is very, very common (lost count of the times I've heard similar claims to yours both in-world and in the forums) which, not surprisingly, aggravates people - after all, you're basically telling them that you're better than them. However, in RL, I've never once heard one single person make such a statement - not a one - and that includes a couple of friends who are into the same stuff as you.

 

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I never held us up as anything, I explained my story as precursor to my point of view. Please show me where I said we are an example of a successful transition.

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Carole Franizzi wrote:

...

If you have a need to feel you're involved in something 'special', that's great - apparently, the secret for all long-lasting relationships is the shared belief they have something magical and unique - however, I think you'll find that people who don't do bdsm feel just as strongly about their relationships as you do about yours.

...

 

I see you are reading much more into what I have written than what I intented.  Sorry if I have mislead you.

I am not involved in BDSM in RL or in SL.  My first time encountering anything about it was my very first day on the forums here when I responded to Specer's post looking for a submissive (you know the thread you were quite active in it).  I did't even know that submissive refered to BDSM or any of the other key words he used in his post such as aftercare.  My initial reaction was to run the other way.  But instead I researched as much as I could using the internet.

I now know that I will probably never adopt a BDSM lifestyle in RL but I am interested in exploring the polarizing effects D/s can have on a play session or a short term RP situation.  My theory is that the more polorized the energies the more explosive the fusion of those energies will be. :matte-motes-bashful-cute:

Anyway to clear things up I am not involved in anything and not feeling any more special than normal.

 

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I am in a M/s relationship that has lasted for more than a year now. We are migrating it to RL and he is coming here RL soon.  6 months ago I would have vehemently disagreed with those in this thread who say SL is not the same as RL but now I know different. RL IS different, its all to easy to fake love and emotion behind a keyboard.  .

All of the above, really. I've re-read it several times and I continue to understand that your SL relationship has developed into what you consider real love in the outside world - but that you haven't actually met him yet (you don't say you have migrated it to RL - that's why I understood that you've not actually gone RL yet, but are organising it for 'soon').

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