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Lacy217 McLuhan

RAPE PARTIES

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Drey Blackheart wrote:

Frankly I abhor the idea that rape should be represented as a "happy sexy" thing to do.  Sure there are people who want to RP it.  So it's politically correct to keep my mouth shut in sl, but I've got a right to my opinion too, just as the OP does.  I don't think everyone should pig pile on the OP for having an opinion.  Or are we all leaning so far to the politically correct side now that we have to applaud every out-there idea for RP someone's twisted mind comes up with.  Oh!  "Roasting kids on a spit?"  Why yes!  Let's have RP about that!  Let's all applaud it as perfectly ok.  "Cannabalism?  Eating our own young?"  Sure!  Why not?!  Let's applaud for that too!  It's their right to get off on it, isn't it?  Hannibal Lectar could have a hay day in sl.

We already accept the glorification of slavery in sl.  The gorean sims prove that as well as all the BDSM sims.  Dragging someone around on a chain like a dead pig is perfectly fine and dandy.  You've got to realize that somewhere people have mentally crossed the line here, because it's only pixels and anyway, we must be politically correct at all costs.

1. It's all RP.

2. they have dolcett sims.

3. Hannibal Lecter is not a real person.

4. Calm down and carry on.

5. Want some popcorn?

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To the first part:

So you say BDSM is rolepaly? People seem to sell it as a lifestyle pretty often. I wouldn't compare that to a fantasy some live out only in a virtual world (as you may notice: This was only about SL. Rape in RL is horrible and should be punished as hard as possible).

Those rape stuff is not my cup of tea, but the fine thing about it is, people stay far more discrete and nice with that fantasy than with BDSM, which is all over the place and as I said in another thread celebrates itself sometimes to anoying point.

To the second part:

No, I don't. There is a difference between opening threads about "look what they are doing! omg!" and expressing my opinion on a already discussed topic. Also I never said its terrible. I just can't stand that attidude. And I think I still have the right to reply to opinions I don't share. (going into detail here would blow up the main topic...)

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As has been said, everyone is there by choice, even the rapees, not to mention....THEY ARE AVATARS......honestly, I get offended by **bleep**e spelling (really, there is spell check and everything)  and do you see me posting complaints about it?

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It's not that 'its only pixels so it doesn't matter, lets be politically correct' to paraphrase. Political correctness is more about stifling what is deemed to be bigoted or prejudiced expression that is not in line with what is considered sensitive or inoffensive. It's the politically correct people who object to such things as BDSM, rape, cannibalism, etc.  in SL.

Rape sims, forced sex, scat, cannibalism, there's a long list of things I personally find objectionable. I don't know that slavery is glorified in SL, most "vanilla" people, when they see a slave on a chain tend to react with HUH? Not OMG THAT IS SOOO COOL! I WANT A SLAVE TOO!

So say people who want to stifle free expression (that violates no RL laws because this is a cartoon world) get their way .. what's the difference between shutting down a sim that hosts rape parties because they're offensive and shutting down a G rated sim with cwute widdle todwers wiff speech impediments cuddwing their fwuffy widdle bunny wabbits dwessed up wike giant strawbewwies? Both are fantasies, both are seen as objectionable by many, both support stereotypes  (all women secretly want to be violated and all men secretly want to hurt women/all young children are sappy, dumb as posts and can't express themselves clearly). What makes one person's view of what is offensive more valid than someone else's?

Your world, your imagination .. and some  imaginations run more toward David Lynch directing a science fiction vampire porn flick and some run more toward a treacle soaked Care Bares cartoon.

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Lucretia Brandenburg wrote:

Your world, your imagination .. and some  imaginations run more toward David Lynch directing a science fiction vampire porn flick and some run more toward a treacle soaked Care Bares cartoon.

 

I would LOVE to see a David Lynch sci-fi vampire porn flick....Eraserhead meets Twin Peaks meets Deep Throat (or neck, since it's a Vampire flick) :matte-motes-sunglasses-3:

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I have to agree with the OP on that topic, I would feel offended too, when reading about this type of events or places.

But as many here have already stated, it is not against the SL rules, so you can do nothing against that. But only if something is not explicitly against the rules, it is not automatically correct.

Even if this is only a fantasy in a virtual world, it possibly might be that people who are enjoying this kind of fantasy might really have some mental issues.

 

I can imagine that if someone has experienced rape in RL would be heavily offended if he/she hears about that stuff in SL.

Oh, and one more thing, the people who are attending this party, are all going there willingly in order to have sex with each other. And in the end, it is consensual cyber-sex they are having there, so rape is really the wrong term for that, because in reality rape is forced.

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Suspiria Finucane wrote:


16 wrote:

every time we have these debates it come down to what linden allow us/residents to do. linden allow whatever is legal in USA. this the correct position for a USA provider to take. regardless of our own personal beliefs or moral stance

if we do not like some things or do not believe they should be permitted then we take political action in RL to bring about change. this the correct position also

is some things that happen in SL and generally online which I find morally bankrupt and have distaste for. and which I will not do personal. but I will not interfere with what others do lawfully. I respect the institution of law and the democratic process. and I expect this same from others

 if is lawful then I will not do what I dislike nor do I have to agree with it or think is ok. but I will not argue against lawful behaviors on moral grounds either. I will tho campaign RL to effect change on safety grounds. bc that works

 

I concur. While I abhor the desensitization of rape as an (*coughs) enjoyable experience, I agree with to each their own in accordance with the law.
That said, it's clear who views rape as a triviality.

 

Would that be those that compare something as horrible as real life rape.. to an online virtual fetish?

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Well  since i started this thread I would like to repond to some comments

1."So say people who want to stifle free expression (that violates no RL laws because this is a cartoon world) get their way
"
I am not out to stifle anyone's expression, but you are because it seems you don't like that I have an
opinion different from yours.  The First Amendment protects my right to free speech as well as yours.

2 There are many things in Second Life that I find repulsive and disgusting AND I don't participate
condone, or have anything to do with them .  I just ingore them AND the scum who participate.
 But when people start advertizing on  the Main Event Page in Second Life for a  12 hour long party it is no longer "Private" between two consenting adults.
That was the only reason I noticed this .  It was blatently stuck in front of me. I did not go looking for it.

3.Second Life does reflect or imitate real life, beacause in real life I am also now expected to
approve of every disgusting thing everyone does.  I am no longer allowed to criticize or have opinions.
That is not  "free speech "  either.  Only people who want to justify their disgusting life style and behaviors
are allowed "free speech"  it seems.

4.  Zebras, men, women etc don't change their " stripes, believes, ethics or morals" just because they turn off the computer.
If you find rape, child abuse, slavery, etc etc  ok to participate in online.. you don't turn
into a teddy bear  when you turn off the computer.  If you have a belief that it is ok  to
rape, bite, chain, abuse, kill   or whatever.....then you will have that same belief in your
real life.  In case you don't know about this let me refresh your knowledge.  Rape, Spousal abuse,
violence, murders, child abuse and such behaviors are on the rise  in real life.
Could it be also that due to video games and bad parenting, that young people think the way
to solve problems is to pick up guns and go shoot the people who offend them  or better yet
just innocents who have nothing to do with their situation.  I guess they learn these things
from the" Tooth  Fairy"  or "Santa claus".


5.  VANILLA AND PROUD OF IT !!!


6. Just for the sake of argument:  If you say that this is a virtual world of pixel people and not
"real" and therefore anything should be allowed then  why is it against TOS to "role play" pedophilia
here?  It is just pixels , non-real people here who are over  18  and who consent or choose to be a
child.  So if the people are adults and consenting why is it illegal ??
Not sure I understand  the difference.   Aren't rape and murder illegal in real life also ??



Rant for Day 2  :-)   Love a good discussion

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First of all, let me say that was a very well thought out and interesting rant. Thank you for following up.

You're going to get bombarded by opinions from everyone in here...so I hope to make mine brief.


1 No one is faulting you for having an opinion. That is what the forums are all about. You are welcome, and incouraged to express your thoughts. That's what makes a good discussion.

2. I believe it is still between two concenting adults. Just because the ad is on the main page (no matter how horrible it may be), no one is forcing you to go. You can ignore it or partipicate in it...your choice. And MINE as well

3. Please go back to #1 for my response to Free Speech.

4.  I disagree with this one. I, personally, have a number of slave and servants in my home who I leash, put on various BDSM equipment, spank and have sex with...sometimes treating them horribly (mostly because they want to). That does not mean that when I turn off the computer I go upstairs, grab my wife, throw a collar around her neck, attach a chain to it and beat the crap out of her on an X cross. I will admit that there may be some people who are unable to seperate SL and RL and that's horrible. But please don't make a blanket statement about people not being able to change their "stripes".

As for the issue of video games and guns...that goes to parenting. Teach your kids the right way to do things...don't let them play on the game until they are old enough..and they should be fine


5.  VANILLA AND PROUD OF IT !!!

Good for you!! That's great. And you have the right to do that.....



6. Can't answer that question....why not ask LL? They set the rules, not me. And on that note, if things like this bother you that much, send a ticket or get a petition together. I'm sure lots of people would like to see things like that go away and not be shown on the front page anymore. Maybe doing something instead of ranting and arguing might be in order here.



 

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Lacy217 McLuhan wrote:

 

 

 

6. Just for the sake of argument
:  If you say that this is a virtual world of pixel people and not

"real" and therefore anything should be allowed then  why is it against TOS to "role play" pedophilia

here?  It is just pixels , non-real people here who are over  18  and who consent or choose to be a

child.  So if the people are adults and consenting why is it illegal ??

Not sure I understand  the difference.   Aren't rape and murder illegal in real life also ??

 

 

 

Rant for Day 2  :-)   Love a good discussion

The reason it's not allowed here, even though it IS just pixels, stems from some rl legal issues brought up some time ago. You can search that for yourself, or someone else can link it, I don't have the links on this pc and I'm not gonna google it atm either lol. But there is a real life legal basis for why this rule is in place. Aside from that real life legal issue, not every person in sl is an adult. Sl has allowed minors for quite some time. This rule is especially important now that there is no longer a teen grid. Regardless of the fact that minors are supposed to stay on G sims and sexual play of any sort is not permitted on G sims, there still needs to be a rule for those in case moments which we all know will and do happen. And basically for ll to cover its own rear, too. Some rules do have some merit and very solid reasons for why they're in place. Some rules also have rl legal backing as their reason for being. I don't know why some things have that rl backing and others don't, even though they're illegal in rl. I'm not even sure ll knows. I just know the ageplay stuff only came about because it was made into a huge deal in rl and it woulda been really bad pr for them not to do something about it.

As for the rest, I say live and let live. There is so much that goes on in sl that i just don't like and choose to stay away from. Sometimes though, I come across it, without looking for it. I too sometimes think things like "oh, that's just wrong" or whatever, to myself. Ok usually I think worse things than that, and the words are much more colorful too. But unless someone chooses to talk to me about it, I leave it as just my thoughts. 'Cuz I know I'd offend people otherwise. There are some things I'd love to see added to the TOS. Some things that are illegal in rl, but perfectly fine in sl. It's prob. a good thing I don't get to decide what's in the TOS and what isn't though, lol. Opinions aren't bad things, whether or not anyone else agrees with us. We just have to know when we talk about it publicly, we're gonna run into people who don't agree. Life would be awfully stupid if everyone agreed with everyone else on everything and every topic. Good god that was a lot of every. I probably need  a nap.

 

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Lacy217 McLuhan wrote:

I am not out to stifle anyone's expression, ...

Apparently, you are, though. Not only that, but you imply those that you disagree with on this matter are mentally ill: 'I  think that people who need  this type of "fun" should find a Second Life Psychiatrist  and work thru their rape fantasies instead of promoting it to others .'


If you have a belief that it is ok  to rape, bite, chain, abuse, kill   or whatever.....then you will have that same belief in your real life.

Then why aren't all of those people who are playing shoot-em-up games out there killing people? Can you explain that?


Rape, Spousal abuse, violence, murders, child abuse and such behaviors are on the rise  in real life.

Please provide links to (reputable) statistical analyses that show this. Further, please provide (reputable) evidence that this alleged increase in violent crime is in any way linked to video games, movies or other media.


5.  VANILLA AND PROUD OF IT !!!

Congratulations? I suppose next you'll tell us that it's the missionary position or nothing?


If you say that this is a virtual world of pixel people and not "real" and therefore anything should be allowed then why is it against TOS to "role play" pedophilia here?  It is just pixels , non-real people here who are over  18  and who consent or choose to be a child.  So if the people are adults and consenting why is it illegal ?? Not sure I understand  the difference.   Aren't rape and murder illegal in real life also ??

Because child rape (and most depictions of it) and abuse IS against the law in the majority of jurisdictions. ROLE PLAY is not.

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Yeah, I'm offended by this as well...

 

I mean really, what bunch of rapists think victims will come willingly to a party,

aren't they doing any effort anymore ?!  *Shakes head*

 

There should at least have been a kidnap scenario.

 

 

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Point 3:  SL can be imitating real life, but it can just as well not.

I for one don't see any anamorphic animals, vampires or elves walking around in RL.

 

Point 4: I like to play the victim in rape fantasy roleplay, and get all turned on from

stuff like forced burqa wearing for a jealous master, and to be owned and caged and all.

Yet in RL I'm a feminist and pro-equality and believe such things should only take place as

consensual fantasies.

 

 

P.S.: I like watching horror movies, sometimes really bloody and violent ones,

doesn't mean I want to see people get slaughtered in real life.

 

 

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Really?

I'm playing a Sith in an online roleplay game. My character can be cruel to the extreme including murder and torture. Does that make me want to murder random people? No. And if your idea would be true, half of the western world would run around and kill each other on sight.

Thats like saying Sim City turns people into great city leaders or Football Manager makes you be able to lead a footballteam. It needs more than just roleplay to get people to do stuff in RL.

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Oh my Dolcett, not really my thing, but I have been finding that for so long.  :womanlol:

 

I remember I was in Heaven&Hell club in SL once and there was a Dolcett themed area

there, did a bit of tongue in cheek RP there where my char was stripped naked
, tied up and lowered into a huge deep-frying pan.  :womanlol:

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Dolcett?? Dolcett?    are you kidding.... and you guys are trying to convince me you are not mentally ill?

Wow... am I glad i don't know you in real life and be grateful  you don't know me either !

Enough.... Discussion closed.........

But thanks for all the insights and comments !

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Funny you judge me on the fact I know about Dolcett,

even though I stated it is not my thing,

and that I only did a one time tongue in cheek RP on it.

 

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Lacy217 McLuhan wrote:

Bunch of stuff...


See, Lacy, roleplaying is like acting.  It's pretend.  If we were to use your logic, then Bruce Willis, John Travolta, and Samual L. Jackson are all pyscho-killers.   But, you know....they're just playing a role. 

 

 

 

As far I as know, role playing a killer, does not make you one.  

 

Sir Ian McKellen says it best:  

"I pretend to be the person I'm playing..."    "I imagined what it would be like to be a Wizard, and then I pretended, and acted that way..."

(watch the clip below  : )

http://www.wimp.com/goodactor/

 

 

 

 

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Lacy217 McLuhan wrote:

Well  since i started this thread I would like to repond to some comments

 

1
."So say people who want to stifle free expression (that violates no RL laws because this is a cartoon world) get their way

"

I am not out to stifle anyone's expression, but you are because it seems you don't like that I have an

opinion different from yours.  The First Amendment protects my right to free speech as well as yours.

 

2 There are many things in Second Life that I find repulsive and disgusting AND I don't participate

condone, or have anything to do with them .  I just ingore them AND the scum who participate.

 But when people start advertizing on  the Main Event Page in Second Life for a  12 hour long party it is no longer "Private" between two consenting adults.

That was the only reason I noticed this .  It was blatently stuck in front of me. I did not go looking for it.

 

3.Second Life does reflect or imitate real life, beacause in real life I am also now expected to

approve of every disgusting thing everyone does.  I am no longer allowed to criticize or have opinions.

That is not  "free speech "  either.  Only people who want to justify their disgusting life style and behaviors

are allowed "free speech"  it seems.

 

4.  Zebras, men, women etc don't change their " stripes, believes, ethics or morals" just because they turn off the computer.

If you find rape, child abuse, slavery, etc etc  ok to participate in online.. you don't turn

into a teddy bear  when you turn off the computer.  If you have a belief that it is ok  to

rape, bite, chain, abuse, kill   or whatever.....then you will have that same belief in your

real life.  In case you don't know about this let me refresh your knowledge.  Rape, Spousal abuse,

violence, murders, child abuse and such behaviors are on the rise  in real life.

Could it be also that due to video games and bad parenting, that young people think the way

to solve problems is to pick up guns and go shoot the people who offend them  or better yet

just innocents who have nothing to do with their situation.  I guess they learn these things

from the" Tooth  Fairy"  or "Santa claus".

 

 

5.  VANILLA AND PROUD OF IT !!!

 

 

6. Just for the sake of argument
:  If you say that this is a virtual world of pixel people and not

"real" and therefore anything should be allowed then  why is it against TOS to "role play" pedophilia

here?  It is just pixels , non-real people here who are over  18  and who consent or choose to be a

child.  So if the people are adults and consenting why is it illegal ??

Not sure I understand  the difference.   Aren't rape and murder illegal in real life also ??

 

 

 

Rant for Day 2  :-)   Love a good discussion

I think that you have put your views quite well here

I think tho that you need be a bit more clear in the supporting statements. can lead other people to dismiss you entire argument. dismiss meaning invalidate by the rules of debate

like an argument is invalid when it use a factual error to support it. I don't personal make the debate rules up. they been the rules since the ancient greek philosophers. and even before them

in 6. you say:

why is it against TOS to "role play" pedophilia

here?  It is just pixels , non-real people here who are over  18  and who consent or choose to be a

child.  So if the people are adults and consenting why is it illegal ??

is against ToS to roleplay pedophilia in SL bc a image (moving or still - 2D or 3D) is a depiction as define by USA law. depictions of pedophilia are illegal under US law. so are acts of pedophilia

+

at one time the US Supreme Court struck down the law banning depiction of pedophilia as unconstitutional. bc the then law was written in moral terms. US Supreme Court rule that laws based on morality and for no other reason infringe on 1st Amendment. therefore unconstitutional. good bad moral or not. Unconstitutional is the measure of law in the USA. not anything else

straight after this the US Congress made a new law banning depictions of pedophilia. the new law was written to show that the law was to protect realworld children. bc of their minor dependent status they were entitled to specific protection.and to uphold their right to enjoy their constitutional birthright. pursuit of happiness. and not be portrayed/depicted as partners in sexual activities. which is an adult activity by law. like 16+

is their minor dependency that makes all the difference. they are not able by law (being minors) to make this distinction for themselves. the law is written for their protection and uphold their constitutional rights. and for no other reason

so this new law got passed and has been upheld by US Courts ever since

+

so this supporting statement you made is invalid. bc it not support your argument when extrapolate to acts against adults. like rape abuse murder etc. these acts are illegal. bc they result in realworld harm

depictions of them are not. bc the presumption is that adults are able to distinguish for themselves between acts and depictions. children/minors are not. at least not by US law anyways

bc of the way the US Supreme Court rule on constitutional matters then to ban depictions of acts against adults then would have to take away the adults constitutional birthright to make the distinction about themselves from themselves. which if accepted as a basis to proceed would create a constitutional paradox situation for the adult population

 

 

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