Are free account residents really this low a priority?

[Phil Deakins]

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Qie Niangao wrote:

And sure, Basic members are customers. They're customers of the service--they get to experience Second Life, create things, maybe even sell stuff. They are

not

, however, customers of

support

for the service. Same as Microsoft products: buy Office, you get to use it; have problems with Office, buy support.

---

Sorry, Qie, but Basic members are not LL's customers, unless they pay LL directly for something. They are LL's users, which is different. See the dictionary definitions that I posted after your post.

[Knowl Paine]

I share your viewpoint.  :matte-motes-smile:

 

 

 

[Rhys Goode]

I have a premium account.  One reason I do it to qualify for customer service.  Not the best customer service in all the world, but better than nothing.  And at least on the yearly plan, not very expensive at all.  After taking into account the weekly stipend, it costs me about $1 a month.   When I have had problems over the years, I have had pretty good help from customer service.  They have not re-designed the entire game to suit my preferences, but they have been well worth that $1 a month.

[Qie Niangao]

Yeah, they aren't necessarily customers of LL, but it's pretty likely that they are, at least to the extent that they've paid upload fees.

(Those fees are, technically, just L$ "sinks", but those sinks are one reason Supply Linden ever gets to sell on the LindeX. It seems more correct to think of such fees as being paid to LL, and LindeX transactions as not paid to LL, since such a tiny share of them ever are, as you rightly point out.)

I'm not sure, however, that it's safe to exclude rent-payers as LL customers. It's really channel sales and I think, for example, that my wireless carrier considers me a customer, even though I bought my phone and service through a channel outlet. It's muddy in this case because I also pay the monthly service charges directly to the carrier... but I'd also go through them, not the channel, for problems with my phone. Isolating just the phone-purchase transaction, I really think I was a customer of both the channel and the carrier, and I think the carrier thinks so, too.

[Leia36]

Answer this then, why does LL provide customer support for non premium users?

[Phil Deakins]

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Leia36 wrote:

Answer this then, why does LL provide customer support for non premium users?

---

They call it customer support but it's actually user support.

 

[Leia36]

Well then I disagree with you and leave it at that, obviously neither of us is willing to back off our point, have a great day

[Phil Deakins]

---

Qie Niangao wrote:

Yeah, they aren't necessarily customers of LL, but it's pretty likely that they are, at least to the extent that they've paid upload fees.

(Those fees are, technically, just L$ "sinks", but those sinks are one reason Supply Linden ever gets to sell on the LindeX. It seems more correct to think of such fees as being paid to LL, and LindeX transactions as

not

paid to LL, since such a tiny share of them ever are, as you rightly point out.)

I'm not sure, however, that it's safe to exclude rent-payers as LL customers. It's really channel sales and I think, for example, that my wireless carrier considers me a customer, even though I bought my phone and service through a channel outlet. It's muddy in this case because I also pay the monthly service charges directly to the carrier... but I'd also go through them, not the channel, for problems with my phone. Isolating just the phone-purchase transaction, I really think I was a customer of both the channel and the carrier, and I think the carrier thinks so, too.

---

I hadn't thought of upload fees. That's paying LL directly and that would make a person a customer. Starting a group is another way to pay LL directly, and it would also make a person a customer of LL. So there are more Basic users that I'd though who are actually LL's customers. Probably most aren't though.

I think it's safe to exclude rent payers. The renter is clearly the customer of the landlord as far as buying is concerned, and it's buying that makes a person a customer. Your wireless carrier may well treat you as they would a customer because they have been paid and have an obligation to keep the service running for you, and it can be a lot easier to sort problems out by dealing directly with the user who is having the problems. But the wireless carrier has been paid by someone else and that is who their actual customer is. You are only a user if you don't pay the wireless carrier.

Unlike your wireless carrier, LL has no obligation to provide anything to anyone who hasn't paid them for it.

[mikka Luik]

Interesting point... so my paying (as part of a group) around 30 bucks a month (to a landlord) doesn't qualify but my oh lets say 2 bucks worth (approx 50) of uploads do.... Hmm...one to mull over =^^=

[Trinity Yazimoto]

---

Phil Deakins wrote:

---

I hadn't thought of upload fees. That's paying LL directly and

that would make a person a customer.

 Starting a group is another way to pay LL directly, and it would also make a person a customer of LL. So there are more Basic users that I'd though who are actually LL's customers. 

 (emphasis is mine)

yes ! you said it !!! 

 :smileywink: 

So im a LL customer !!!!  And still.... no customer support !!! 

End.

(and well, you are just admiting half of your mistake, but well, its already a step, and i will aknowlelge you did a step... keep this way Phil, you are almost good :smileywink: but since you have been pretty studborn, you will be spanked at the end of the audition and not only one time.. but by Czari, 16 and I.... i hope you will learn from this lesson for next time :smileywink:)

 

[Marigold Devin]

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Phil Deakins wrote:

---

I hadn't thought of upload fees. That's paying LL directly and

that would make a person a customer.

 Starting a group is another way to pay LL directly, and it would also make a person a customer of LL. So there are more Basic users that I'd though who are actually LL's customers. 

 (emphasis is mine)

yes ! you said it !!! 

 :smileywink: 

So im a LL customer !!!!  And still.... no customer support !!! 

End.

(and well, you are just admiting half of your mistake, but well, its already a step, and i will aknowlelge you did a step... keep this way Phil, you are almost good :smileywink: but since you have been pretty studborn, you will be spanked at the end of the audition and not only one time.. but by Czari, 16 and I.... i hope you will learn from this lesson for next time :smileywink:)

 

---

Add me to the spankers list please. I'll give him ice cream afterwards.

[Trinity Yazimoto]

---

Marigold Devin wrote:

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Phil Deakins wrote:

---

I hadn't thought of upload fees. That's paying LL directly and

that would make a person a customer.

 Starting a group is another way to pay LL directly, and it would also make a person a customer of LL. So there are more Basic users that I'd though who are actually LL's customers. 

 (emphasis is mine)

yes ! you said it !!! 

 :smileywink: 

So im a LL customer !!!!  And still.... no customer support !!! 

End.

(and well, you are just admiting half of your mistake, but well, its already a step, and i will aknowlelge you did a step... keep this way Phil, you are almost good :smileywink: but since you have been pretty studborn, you will be spanked at the end of the audition and not only one time.. but by Czari, 16 and I.... i hope you will learn from this lesson for next time :smileywink:)

 

---

Add me to the spankers list please. I'll give him ice cream afterwards.

---

/me adds right away  Marigold's name on the list.... then looking around her "Someone else ? The list is still open"...

@ Marigold : Will the spankers have some ice cream too ? Vanilla for me :smileywink:

[Knowl Paine]

Volume Warning, tis loud :smileysurprised:

 

 

 

 

 

[Pamela Galli]

---

Rhys Goode wrote:

I have a premium account.  One reason I do it to qualify for customer service.  Not the best customer service in all the world, but better than nothing.  And at least on the yearly plan, not very expensive at all.  After taking into account the weekly stipend, it costs me about $1 a month.   When I have had problems over the years, I have had pretty good help from customer service.  They have not re-designed the entire game to suit my preferences, but they have been well worth that $1 a month.

---

This. 

 

Support is expensive. It's not unreasonable for a company to restrict it to those who subscribe to it.

As for Apple, which has very high support ratings, you get 90 days free support. If you sign up for extended support at the time of purchase, you get a longer time period. 

A lot of support issues are now handled by merchants. 90% of customer support requests I get have nothing to do with my products, but the viewer, server, database, ISP, weather, or price of tea in China. LL does have support pages and videos, some of them quite good, but it does not advertise them prominently, and people don't know about them and don't look for them.  I have an Inventory Loss support page, but many people with inventory problems are not interested in learning how to deal with them.

In the case presented in the OP, several ppl in this forum offered help.  The OP's friend could have come to the forum herself and asked for help and gotten some good advice. 

Bottom line is that there are a variety of support options available besides LL, if you look for it.  If you don't want to look for it, if you just want to use LL support, it is reasonable to pay a couple dollars a month for it. 

[Marigold Devin]

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Marigold Devin wrote:

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

---

Phil Deakins wrote:

---

I hadn't thought of upload fees. That's paying LL directly and

that would make a person a customer.

 Starting a group is another way to pay LL directly, and it would also make a person a customer of LL. So there are more Basic users that I'd though who are actually LL's customers. 

 (emphasis is mine)

yes ! you said it !!! 

 :smileywink: 

So im a LL customer !!!!  And still.... no customer support !!! 

End.

(and well, you are just admiting half of your mistake, but well, its already a step, and i will aknowlelge you did a step... keep this way Phil, you are almost good :smileywink: but since you have been pretty studborn, you will be spanked at the end of the audition and not only one time.. but by Czari, 16 and I.... i hope you will learn from this lesson for next time :smileywink:)

 

---

Add me to the spankers list please. I'll give him ice cream afterwards.

---

/me adds right away  Marigold's name on the list.... then looking around her "Someone else ? The list is still open"...

@ Marigold : Will the spankers have some ice cream too ? Vanilla for me :smileywink:

---

Vanilla is always on offer

But I'm having rocky road. Maybe Phil will have tutti frutti or something with nuts in.

[Janelle Darkstone]

---

Phil Deakins wrote:

Unlike your wireless carrier, LL has no obligation to provide anything to anyone who hasn't paid them for it.

---

LL should get down on their knees and kiss the feet of every live person that chooses to stay in SL.  Any avatar in world that has a living, breathing person behind it adds to the world in immeasurable ways, even if all they do is greet another avatar by saying "Hi.".  Buying L$ and helping move the world economy along should garner the lowly resident a LOT more respect than they receive now from LL.

 

Without life there is no Second "Life".  I wonder how long your business would stay afloat if it was all bots and driverless vehicles at your door.

[Dilbert Dilweg]

Last Friday I ended up with an already Banned IP . I am a premium member and submitted a support ticket 4 days ago and to this day it is sitting there un-answered by the next department.. Premium is not any more priority than a non. Worst support ever in my entire Second Life

[Leia36]

Very sorry to hear that Dilbert, that is rotten , hope LL help you out soon

[Marigold Devin]

---

Dilbert Dilweg wrote:

Last Friday I ended up with an already Banned IP . I am a premium member and submitted a support ticket 4 days ago and to this day it is sitting there un-answered by the next department.. Premium is not any more priority than a non. Worst support ever in my entire Second Life

---

That truly stinks, Dilbert.

I'm one of these people who has tended to be all butterflies and rainbows when sticking up for Linden Lab, and I have been extremely lucky with Support, although there have been occasions when I have been fed bullsh1t, and felt devalued. 

As Janelle says above, every single customer should be valued. Today's pauper could be tomorrow's millionaire, and what is it they say about the people you trample on on the way up, won't catch you when you fall back down again. Something like that.

And although Linden Lab haven't forced any of us to give advice on these here forums/answers, we do it because we genuinely love our Second Life and want others to enjoy it too.  If we totted up those hours of valuable time we've spent and sent in a bill of charges to LL, or if we refused to help any more, LL would have to rethink their customer services, or hope that Patterns and all the other stuff caught on.

 

[Trinity Yazimoto]

---

Dilbert Dilweg wrote:

Last Friday I ended up with an already Banned IP . I am a premium member and submitted a support ticket 4 days ago and to this day it is sitting there un-answered by the next department.. Premium is not any more priority than a non. Worst support ever in my entire Second Life

---

awww, sorry to read Dilbert....and yes... no matter you are a customer, a user or whatever else, there is no support at all providen by LL....and no communication either.... its just like there is noone in LL offices now.... well, except some forum moderators indeed who seems to be still active....

[Dilbert Dilweg]

LOL yes, it sort of feels like it was just stuck on the shelf for the weekend and has never been taken off that shelf yet lol. But very odd.  wish we could ad affects to our support page, custom sounds. I'd set crickets chirping on un-resolved/un-answered tickets. :matte-motes-big-grin-wink:

 

@ Marigold. Yes i fully agree

[Ted McGregor]

You cannot change your IP ? Is yours static for some reason ?

 

( Not about customer service, but thinking practical here on your behalf. )

[Dilbert Dilweg]

No, I am at a resort for a while, and don't  have access to the router. It all started after the Internet company came out to work on stuff and was shut down for an hour. So after the system comes back up. I get a new Ip which seems to be banned lol. Wish it was that easy this time lol. But using my VPN to log in with. So I am already worked around it . But still lowsy CS

[161488303349]

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Dilbert Dilweg wrote:

wish we could ad affects to our support page, custom sounds. I'd set crickets chirping on un-resolved/un-answered tickets. :matte-motes-big-grin-wink:

---

jejejejjeeje (:

 

[161488303349]

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mikka Luik wrote:

Interesting point... so my paying (as part of a group) around 30 bucks a month (to a landlord) doesn't qualify but my oh lets say 2 bucks worth (approx 50) of uploads do.... Hmm...one to mull over =^^=

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according to Pickys Law this is true. no mulling required q; (: