AR when mesh isn't seen?

[Porky Gorky]

What's a Lola?

[Paul Hexem]

It's boobs, dude. Prim boobs. Mesh, so they're popular.

[Porky Gorky]

Cool!

I need to get out more :matte-motes-evil:

[Cerise Sorbet]

Remember that meshes can fail to render even on viewers that fully support it. Slow/failed asset delivery to the viewer, packet loss, plain old bugs that are still out there can all make clothes vanish.

[Perrie Juran]

---

Cerise Sorbet wrote:

Remember that meshes can fail to render even on viewers that fully support it. Slow/failed asset delivery to the viewer, packet loss, plain old bugs that are still out there can all make clothes vanish.

---

Which should become a moot point when we go to Server Side Ava Rendering.

Which now raises this question.  Why is every assuming that Server Side Rendering is going to take more computer power?

Shouldn't it actually take less?

That's assuming that everyone is assuming.  I have no idea what 's going on with Beta Viewers.

[solstyse]

So, the summary here is that because one person complained wrongly, anyone and everyone with an older or underperforming pc should be punished. And LL should take the hit to their revenue streams that results. And it all comes down to, of all the stupid things it could be, whether or not you're a fan of Mesh.

Oh, and if sl is the worst performing program on your computer, then it's your fault. And, if you work two jobs but LL isn't your absolute top priority, causing you to spend money just for that while your computer does everything else you want it to quite well, then, you're lazy.

And soehow, even though you can't see someone else's screen, that screen that is out of your vision and should be out of your mind is somehow so offensive that the owner of that computer should be banned, cause they affect you that much.

But in other threads, Gadget, you flamed people for asking how to optimize their hardware so that they could see all these you say they should be banned for not seeing. Can you please clarify why someone trying to do the best with what they have is so offensive to you? I mean really, think about how illogical this hatred for anyone who has less than you really is.

Now, over time, requirements will increase. They always do. So of course, someday we'll all be using different computers. But the problem will always be there. When all computers can display mesh, there will be some other LL feature that can't be enjoyed by everyone. Because in the future, the same thing is going to happen. Since it can't go away, the best you can hope for is that it'll be limited. There are things that are being done right now by plenty of other companies that are easier for them than for LL because they aren't dealing with a decade of old code, old methods, and old machines.

I've been saying for a long, long time that the best fix is for LL to improve the performance of it's product. Reintroduce optional lightweight viewers for x86 machines, and make them able to see mesh. Lumiya can do it for 1ghz phones and tablets. Even most xp machines have faster clock speeds than that.

More careful implementation of new features is a must. Many people's first experience with Mesh was quite poor. Before mesh, many who were capable of running v2 were still using v1 for the speed and stability. v2 and v3 viewers have finally made headway in the stability department, but they're still heavier viewers than v1. And the v1 viewers that do display mesh are far more obscure, and took way longer to implement the code than the v2 and v3 viewers did. That's where the perception that mesh causes lag comes from. I'll bet everyone who says that only switched because of mesh.

Instead of this stupid "You don't deserve Second Life because my computer is better than yours." attitude that the militant meshies seem to possess, why not do what I did, and start a thread about how to optimize your machine? It's a stupid thing to argue about, especially when those arguing have done absolutely nothing to try to help.

So, of course then those who can't see mesh, and either can't afford to upgrade their computer, or see sl as the only motivation to, are perfectly right to feel offended. It's a weak point of view that comes from weak minded people. When there's a problem, you try to solve it, and "throw money at it" is the exact kind of answer one would expect from someone who is too inept to help themselves, let alone anyone else. As for the "laziness" of not upgrading... Some of us actually take the time to analyze our machines, or finances, and the cost vs benefit of upgrading. Some of us who do have the finances consider our "overall user experience" quite adequate, despite the low marks we would give sl's performance on our machines. Some of us prefer to come up with a more educated, more technical, more practical method of problem solving than opening our pocketbooks. In other words, some of us do the work to figure out that there's a better method.

Some of us have priiorities. Some truly can't afford to upgrade. I have a challenge for anyone who thinks there's no excuse. make friends with someone who's on disability. Or on unemployment. Make friends witha  minimum wage earner. make friends with someone who's dealing with medical expenses that aren't adequately covered by their health plans. make friends with someone who has an unreliable car that seems to rob them of every dime they make. Maybe take a walk through a poor neightborhood, and take a glimpse at some people who could never afford a new computer. Know any single parents? Sl is full of them. It takes the income of two to run a household where I live. On the opposite end of the spectrum,maybe you can meet someone who has real life goals. Someone who would rather upgrade their real life than their second life. Someone who is saving up for a house. Or someone who is going to college. Or a starving artist. Or someone trying to start a business. Someone with something better to spend their time on than belittling those who don't make sl a top priority.

Flaming someone and trying to make an arguement that they should be banned for getting fewer fps or being able to enable fewer features in sl than you can is a clear demonstration of just how pathetic your rl is.

[Paul Hexem]

---

solstyse wrote:

So, the summary here is that because one person complained wrongly, anyone and everyone with an older or underperforming pc should be punished. And LL should take the hit to their revenue streams that results. And it all comes down to, of all the stupid things it could be, whether or not you're a fan of Mesh.

..

Flaming someone and trying to make an arguement that they should be banned for getting fewer fps or being able to enable fewer features in sl than you can is a clear demonstration of just how pathetic your rl is.

---

 

That's what I read of that post. It shows me you didn't read the whole thread and you're too over-emotional to have a conversation without resorting to insults. Go back and read all the replies, calm down, and stop getting so whiny and upset over a forum post.

Unless you are actually a 12 year old girl. Then your response is fine.

[solstyse]

---

Gadget Portal wrote:

---

solstyse wrote:

So, the summary here is that because one person complained wrongly, anyone and everyone with an older or underperforming pc should be punished. And LL should take the hit to their revenue streams that results. And it all comes down to, of all the stupid things it could be, whether or not you're a fan of Mesh.

..

Flaming someone and trying to make an arguement that they should be banned for getting fewer fps or being able to enable fewer features in sl than you can is a clear demonstration of just how pathetic your rl is.

---

 

That's what I read of that post. It shows me you didn't read the whole thread and you're too over-emotional to have a conversation without resorting to insults. Go back and read all the replies, calm down, and stop getting so whiny and upset over a forum post.

Unless you are actually a 12 year old girl. Then your response is fine.

---

Quite the opposite. The problem is that I not only read the whole thread, but several other posts by you also. I have accounted for the fact that someone who is in the wrong mood may post the wrong thing, but a wrong mood doesn't account for the consistent snobbiness that you exhibit toward anyone and everyone who hints that sl may be underperforming on their machines. The message is consistent. That indicates a general outlook on life. And, call me judgemental if you want, but from what I've seen it's that your outlook on life is that anyone with less than you is someone to look down your nose upon. And to use sl as a method of putting yourself on a pedestal is a sign that there is little if anything going for you in rl. In other words, yes, quite pathetic. Note that I am not insulting you in your entirety. I am simply insulting that attitude that you have demonstrated on multiple occasions.

Over several threads, each and every time someone has asked for advice on how to improve their performance in sl, you have replied with the same snotty, "Upgrade your computer because mine is better than yours" response. There is a definite pattern. Then you start a thread stating that anyone on a viewer that is beneath your standard should be disabled.

So, since you didnt' answer the first time, I ask again.... How does having a better computer than someone else who uses SL make you a better person? And how is this disdain for anyone running lesser hardware a demonstration of anything other than your ineptitude to offer any solution beyond the simplistic "throw money at it" solution?

I have read your posts very carefully, and if I got the wrong impression of you, then the problem is not my ability to comprehend. It is your inability to express yourself in a manner that is not insulting and overly simplistic.

Now, do you want to offer a counterpoint that has the potential to change my mind? Or do you want to take the simple path and just question my age again?

[Malanya]

---

Gadget Portal wrote:

---

solstyse wrote:

So, the summary here is that because one person complained wrongly, anyone and everyone with an older or underperforming pc should be punished. And LL should take the hit to their revenue streams that results. And it all comes down to, of all the stupid things it could be, whether or not you're a fan of Mesh.

..

Flaming someone and trying to make an arguement that they should be banned for getting fewer fps or being able to enable fewer features in sl than you can is a clear demonstration of just how pathetic your rl is.

---

 

That's what I read of that post. It shows me you didn't read the whole thread and you're too over-emotional to have a conversation without resorting to insults. Go back and read all the replies, calm down, and stop getting so whiny and upset over a forum post.

Unless you are actually a 12 year old girl. Then your response is fine.

---

Then you need a pair of glasses besides a concious. Just another rude poster who can't think out of the box. You actually insult humanity. Hope you never fall short in life, you can in a blink no matter how prepared for something you THINK you are.

[Malanya]

I respect your post as some of the others who have posted about rl and priorities. It's amazing how some of these people think that they know a person's rl situation. I find it odd that having a computer upgraded for the use of sl, even as a content creator because there are many workarounds, shows these are the type of people that put sl before rl and in a way that's sad to not enjoy what you can touch, smell and feel better than pixels. I enjoy sl a lot, I do a lot in sl, but it is in no way a priority for me to change anything about my computer. my rl business made me upgrade my computer.

[Czari Zenovka]

---

Malanya wrote:

Hope you never fall short in life, you can in a blink no matter how prepared for something you THINK you are.

---

This is sooooo true.

[Cerise Sorbet]

---

Perrie Juran wrote:

---

Cerise Sorbet wrote:

Remember that meshes can fail to render even on viewers that fully support it. Slow/failed asset delivery to the viewer, packet loss, plain old bugs that are still out there can all make clothes vanish.

---

Which should become a moot point when we go to Server Side Ava Rendering.

Which now raises this question.  Why is every assuming that Server Side Rendering is going to take more computer power?

Shouldn't it actually take less?

That's assuming that everyone is assuming.  I have no idea what 's going on with Beta Viewers.

---

The only thing that is changing is how system clothing and skin textures are assembled. It has nothing at all to do with mesh or other attachments, and nothing to do with rendering.

[Paul Hexem]

---

solstyse wrote:

---

Gadget Portal wrote:

---

solstyse wrote:

So, the summary here is that because one person complained wrongly, anyone and everyone with an older or underperforming pc should be punished. And LL should take the hit to their revenue streams that results. And it all comes down to, of all the stupid things it could be, whether or not you're a fan of Mesh.

..

Flaming someone and trying to make an arguement that they should be banned for getting fewer fps or being able to enable fewer features in sl than you can is a clear demonstration of just how pathetic your rl is.

---

 

That's what I read of that post. It shows me you didn't read the whole thread and you're too over-emotional to have a conversation without resorting to insults. Go back and read all the replies, calm down, and stop getting so whiny and upset over a forum post.

Unless you are actually a 12 year old girl. Then your response is fine.

---

Quite the opposite. The problem is that I not only read the whole thread, but several other posts by you also. I have accounted for the fact that someone who is in the wrong mood may post the wrong thing, but a wrong mood doesn't account for the consistent snobbiness that you exhibit toward anyone and everyone who hints that sl may be underperforming on their machines. The message is consistent. That indicates a general outlook on life. And, call me judgemental if you want, but from what I've seen it's that your outlook on life is that anyone with less than you is someone to look down your nose upon. And to use sl as a method of putting yourself on a pedestal is a sign that there is little if anything going for you in rl. In other words, yes, quite pathetic. Note that I am not insulting you in your entirety. I am simply insulting that attitude that you have demonstrated on multiple occasions.

Over several threads, each and every time someone has asked for advice on how to improve their performance in sl, you have replied with the same snotty, "Upgrade your computer because mine is better than yours" response. There is a definite pattern. Then you start a thread stating that anyone on a viewer that is beneath your standard should be disabled.

So, since you didnt' answer the first time, I ask again.... How does having a better computer than someone else who uses SL make you a better person? And how is this disdain for anyone running lesser hardware a demonstration of anything other than your ineptitude to offer any solution beyond the simplistic "throw money at it" solution?

I have read your posts very carefully, and if I got the wrong impression of you, then the problem is not my ability to comprehend. It is your inability to express yourself in a manner that is not insulting and overly simplistic.

Now, do you want to offer a counterpoint that has the potential to change my mind? Or do you want to take the simple path and just question my age again?

---

Alright. I'll spell it out for everybody.

My complaint is and has always been with people that use the wrong computers to access SL, then complain about the experience, or worse, want the experience dumbed down to their level. If you're the type that uses one of those underperforming computers and doesn't complain, doesn't expect technology to stop for you- great. All the more power to you, and I respect that you can put up with the SL experience that way.

But as long as LL keeps spending resources on obsolete technology, things will never improve. It's nice that they're finally implimenting something like server side baking. That's going to help lag, help framerates, and overall, improve the grid for everyone. Does it suck that some viewers will be left out? Sure. Would I rather see that than see the grid not improve? Absolutely.

I'm going to add something else, too. As of January 1st, I was laid off. The company I worked for closed their doors. My income went from fairly decent to essentially nothing, while I still have bills that need to be paid. And even with that being the case, I still made that offer to spend my time and my money to help people if they asked me for help. I've made the offer before, too, in world and on the forums. I've seen threads, including by solstyse, on how to better optimize a computer to run SL...

Yet there's never any followup from the people that supposedly need the help. Only fresh posts complaining that their computer can't handle SL. And instead of "Hey, yeah, can you help me find a cheap way to upgrade?" or "Sure, I'll take your old GPU, since you offered to mail it to me for free.", the replies to my offers have been that I'm mean and have a pathetic RL.

So at this point, I absolutely believe that most (keyword, most.) people in SL that complain about their junk computers just want everyone to pity them, and don't want to do anything to fix it. And so, as long as we're talking about "just how pathetic [my] rl is", or how I "actually insult humanity", despite these things, then yes. You people are whiny little girls that would rather complain than take steps to fix the problem.

[Trinity Yazimoto]

im sorry, im just waking up and have to get ready for RL work, so i dont have time for now to read the whole thread carefully, (i will read it later for sure ) but at this point id like to say smth.

@Gadget and to all the other ones who seems to think that life is so easy that everyone is able to upgrade their comp anytime....otherwise they are guilty :

Firstly, you should be ashamed to think that way, you are so spoiled that you forget that life is not the same for everyone...and as said sm1 i hope for you that you wont never have financial difficulties in your life..

Secondly.... really really.... if i had to choose between those silly and ugly (yes they are not improving anything ... you re just crazy about them bec their are new... like for everything... just a silly behavior) Meshes and between some pp with real human value ..... you know what ? Ill choose these humans and without any hesitation.... You want to condamn those pp who cant afford a better PC that can see meshes ? for what ? for such unexciting improvement ? Ill always choose the human !!! Meshes are not so worthwide that for them you hurt persons, real humans, that doesnt live the same reality than you.

And thanks, my comp is ok... i can see meshes pretty well... i still dont like them... they are not flexible and ugly for most part of them..and i dont see why i should miss dear friends that i enjoy really more than meshes just bec YOU and others want meshes and not the pp who cant afford a new PC.

And you said you can send to Czari a new PC mesh compatible for less than 200 usd ?

Ok. i challenge you. if she cant afford the 200 usd i will,  Contact her via private message and ask to her her adress and SEND IT. Too much easy to talk and send words..... stop talking and act !

Im sorry, really reading thread just while im waking up, is irking me a lot

[Paul Hexem]

Oh, where to start with this one...

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

@Gadget and to all the other ones who seems to think that life is so easy that everyone is able to upgrade their comp anytime....otherwise they are guilty :

Firstly, you should be ashamed to think that way, you are so spoiled that you forget that life is not the same for everyone...and as said sm1 i hope for you that you wont never have financial difficulties in your life..

---

After my last post, that's pretty much the dumbest thing you could have replied with. We'll let it slide since you admitted to not reading the thread.

Next up...

---

Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

And you said you can send to Czari a new PC mesh compatible for less than 200 usd ?

Ok. i challenge you. if she cant afford the 200 usd i will,  Contact her via private message and ask to her her adress and SEND IT. Too much easy to talk and send words..... stop talking and act !

---

What I said was I could build a computer for 300 USD that would run SL fairly well. For me to ship it would cost more than building it, though. However, since you're offering up 200 USD for the project, I'll take you up on that. I have a solution.

I can donate, on the spot, a valid Windows 7 CD key. I've got a few kicking around, and I've got one right next to me that's never been used. That's a 100 dollar contribution from me. Your 200 dollar contribution can allow her to order a barebones, build-it-yourself kit with all the essentials, minus a GPU. If we can get one more person to kick in a little money to cover the GPU, that'll be everything she needs to order all the parts for a decent computer. If she orders it herself, the shipping costs are negligible because the stores get to pay their commercial shipping costs that I don't. Often times the shipping is even free.

If you're honestly interested in doing this, we'll all get in touch in-world, I'll do the research for the exact parts/costs (and whether she needs a new monitor, mouse, keyboard, some of which I can provide myself if it's required), and I'll spend all the time necessary to walk her through assembling the computer correctly when it arrives.

[ImaTest1488314069]

---

Gadget Portal wrote:

---

---

Alright. I'll spell it out for everybody.

My complaint is and has always been with people that use the wrong computers to access SL, then complain about the experience, or worse, want the experience dumbed down to their level. If you're the type that uses one of those underperforming computers and doesn't complain, doesn't expect technology to stop for you- great. All the more power to you, and I respect that you can put up with the SL experience that way.

But as long as LL keeps spending resources on obsolete technology, things will never improve. It's nice that they're finally implimenting something like server side baking. That's going to help lag, help framerates, and overall, improve the grid for everyone. Does it suck that some viewers will be left out? Sure. Would I rather see that than see the grid not improve? Absolutely.

I'm going to add something else, too. As of January 1st, I was laid off. The company I worked for closed their doors. My income went from fairly decent to essentially nothing, while I still have bills that need to be paid. And even with that being the case, I still made that offer to spend my time and my money to help people if they asked me for help. I've made the offer before, too, in world and on the forums. I've seen threads, including by solstyse, on how to better optimize a computer to run SL...

Yet there's never any followup from the people that supposedly need the help. Only fresh posts complaining that their computer can't handle SL. And instead of "Hey, yeah, can you help me find a cheap way to upgrade?" or "Sure, I'll take your old GPU, since you offered to mail it to me for free.", the replies to my offers have been that I'm mean and have a pathetic RL.

So at this point, I absolutely believe that most (keyword, most.) people in SL that complain about their junk computers just want everyone to pity them, and don't want to do anything to fix it. And so, as long as we're talking about "just how pathetic [my] rl is", or how I "actually insult humanity", despite these things, then yes. You people are whiny little girls that would rather complain than take steps to fix the problem.

---

I can tell you why I'd never personally accept your help. I am only stating this because A-you told me to go re-read your other post, which I had already done and it still didn't change anything I had to say earlier, and B-I'm not sure you realize how you're coming across to people despite people, repeatedly, telling you how it seems. You're not alone in that, you're not the only one who's made similar statements. I guess my personal opinion is more a cover-all than just a direct comment to you and only you. Some of my comments are direct, but not all are only applicable to you. They could be applicable to just about anyone.

You may have clarified some of what you said, but you did not retract some of the most unkind statements you've made. That's actually a big one for me. No I'm not a 12 yr old little girl, or even a girl for that matter, but I'm not overly fond of people who look down on others for really any reason at all. Even less so when it's people being looked down on for having less.Rubs me the wrong way I guess, and it's a hot button. I'd have to share a lot more of my rl to make that clearer and explain just why it's such a hot button. I don't think anyone wants to, or needs to, read that though.

It doesn't make me whiney to complain when something doesn't work as I'd like it to. I'm allowed to complain. We all are, and we all do it. No one is an exception to that. You complain, I complain, others complain, whether or not the issue is something we can help ourselves with. Even people with high end systems complain when sl isn't working to their ideals. I don't see anythign at all wrong with it. Even if those complaining are just not wanting to fix things and just want to vent. I don't consider it whining. You can't tell me, with any amount of truth, you've never complained about something that others didn't/don't think you should be complaining about. Everyone does it.

Now I too have read these forums, pretty thoroughly over the last oh, however long they've been here(and the previous set before this as well). I've read a lot more than I post. I used to be too busy to post to be honest. Now I tend to post when my son is either busy or just doesn't necessarily need me right that moment, on break while working rl, late at night, things like this. I don't often have time to go inworld much at all these days. Part of why I love the forums is that I can keep up to date on some of the goings on. So before you tell me to re-read what you've said, please know I already have, numerous times. I too have seen you post unkind statements that look down on others. I'm not saying this to insult you. I am saying this because you seem to believe everyone else who has already said it, can't possibly be right. I am fairly certain they are, and you just aren't looking at your words from their perspective. We've all done it at one point or another I'm willing to bet-if I were a betting sort of man. So it's something we're all guilty of.

Some of the things you and others have said to, and about, others really is just very unkind and judgmental. I'd prefer to believe it's unintentional, but that's my rose colored glasses outlook on things talking. As I said earlier, I prefer seeing and believing in the best of everyone, even if they haven't given me reason to do so.

Please go back and read this thread yourself, both your comments and other posters who have made similar ones. Then go back to previous threads, all over the forums, where your posts and others' have been pretty much on par with what was said earlier in this thread. Don't look at it as the person who posted it, look at it as a person who could be offended by it. Look at it as a person who can't, not just won't, but truly can't, upgrade their machine(the reason why is irrelevant). Maybe you'll understand why people think you're being so judgmental. But, maybe not, maybe you won't understand. I couldn't possibly know either way with any amount of certainty.

Back to my original thought though...I would not accept help from someone who seems to have an "I am better than you" attitude. Why? Because I'm not supportive of that kind of attitude and in asking for and receiving help, I'd be doing just that. Free pc or not. I know that sounds weird, you might even think it's dumb of me, but it's just how I am. I can't speak for others. Now advice, that I will always take, even if I can't employ it. But actual help? No, I wouldn't. I just wouldn't personally feel right doing so. Not when my pc does, for the most part, do everything I need it to do. Save for a few things, that really in the grand scheme aren't super duper important to me. My experience in sl, even if it's not the best, absolutely does not get in the way of others' experience(s). So it's no skin off my nose, either way.

I don't personally see being supportive, rather finding a way to support, both those who do and can have a better performing pc, and those who cannot, as a bad thing. I don't believe it's impossible to implement things that benefit all, without causing the virtual world's growth to come to a screeching halt. This is where we disagree, I think. I could be mistaken on that, it's been a bit difficult to decipher. I don't think growth has to stop in order to make the sl experience better for all(or most) regardless of the machine(s) we are all on. I happen to beleive the best of both worlds, so to speak, can be achieved. Do I know how? Nope, I don't. But that doesn't mean it's impossible. Most things people say are impossible actually are, with the right person behind the wheel. I do think things can be optimized for all.

The reasons you get the replies you do is based entirely on the words you put on the screen. Maybe it's not everyone else that's in the wrong. It's possible that both are wrong, to some extent. It's possible people aren't as mean as their statements may suggest sometimes. In fact, that's probably more accurate. That doesn't mean however people are going to agree with continuing to state them in the manner they have been. The more times you make rude, mean or judgmental statements will directly reflect how serious people take your offers of "help". At least that's been my experience. I wouldn't think ill of someone who made one, or even a couple, statements that seem elitist when it's not a regular occurance. When it is, however, at least with one given topic, it's really hard not to. You(general) make it far more difficult for people to get past the rudeness when you put it out there too often.

Again, not saying it to be rude, mean, belittle or anything like that. I'm just being honest and explaining my point of view. No one ever said I was always right, including myself(wouldn't want to be anyway). I'm always open to change my opinion, if given a reason to. So far, I don't have much reason to. I also still stand by everything I said earlier. It wasn't just applicable to you, even if my reply was directly after yours or in response to something you've said. It could, and usually is, applicable for more than one person. A lot more people read these forums than post, and can benefit from things said here too. You aren't the only one who made statements that came off as rude or elitist. This isn't the first thread where it's happened. It surely won't be the last. But my opinion on looking down on others, still stands, whether applicable to you personally, or not.

 

[Paul Hexem]

I'm not going to bother with continuing this argument for two reasons.

First, clearly we'll never be on the same page. We could be at this for all eternity. Better to agree to disagree.

Second, I've just been told to put up or shut up, so I've opted to put up. That's going to be the focus now.

[161488303349]

---

Perrie Juran wrote:

---

Cerise Sorbet wrote:

Remember that meshes can fail to render even on viewers that fully support it. Slow/failed asset delivery to the viewer, packet loss, plain old bugs that are still out there can all make clothes vanish.

---

Which should become a moot point when we go to Server Side Ava Rendering.

Which now raises this question.  Why is every assuming that Server Side Rendering is going to take more computer power?

Shouldn't it actually take less?

That's assuming that everyone is assuming.  I have no idea what 's going on with Beta Viewers.

---

the server side rendering apply to avatar baking. like the skin and clothers layers. dont think it apply to objects or attachments. mesh or prims

Cerise saying that the mesh objects not rendering bc of the grid/network lag. same like prims. like they dont arrive from the server

[Rosie Eun]

Sorry to arrive to this conversation a little late, but just to clarify something:  

 

If the person in question is wearing a set of mesh breast implants, they don't need to wear an alpha, and are probably unlikely to be wearing any "normal" clothes underneath them.  

 

If the breasts fail to rezz, hey presto, they are topless (albeit with a flat or flattish chest) which could cause a problem in some areas.  

 

It's one reason why I prefer to avoid any G areas, and a lot of M ones.  

[Drake1 Nightfire]

---

Gadget Portal wrote:

So, I have a friend that had to appeal a ban because she was AR'ed for being topless in a moderate sim. Well, she was wearing mesh. If there was a screenshot, the prim should have still been obvious. If there was no screenshot, I would think the AR wouldn't have any proof.

It was cleared up and it's not really an issue now, but it made me wonder something.

Why are people that won't update to see mesh even taken seriously at all when they file that sort of AR? Isn't this sort of thing fuel for the argument that viewers that can't see mesh should be disabled from logging in?

---

Sorry.. i call BS. Being topless is completely allowed on Moderate sims. even with a screenshot.

 

[Drake1 Nightfire]

---

16 wrote:

---

Qie Niangao wrote:

Or could there be avatar shapes so perfectly matched to their mesh attachments that they don't even need the alphas?

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is this one

some mesh clothes designers getting really good now at fitting perfect to the Standard SIzes. the alpha layer hide is a klutz way. meaning is not ideal

many people would rather not have alphas bc it mess with your head a bit. like it appears that you have to cut off parts of your body to wear your clothes

in technical terms alpha is not a biggie. in headspace terms it can be. and is the second main reason (after having to change your shape) why women mostly are really keen to get the deformer

 

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i have yet to find any mesh piece of clothing that fits my av without the alpha layer. no, i am not a giant barbarian. I am 6'3", just like in RL. for some reason, mesh designers have made all mens mesh with sloped shoulders.. like we walk around depressed. Standard sizes is a joke. Thats like saying there are only 5 sizes in SL.  And THAT is why i wont buy mesh till the deformer is done.

[Trinity Yazimoto]

So i ve read the whole thread Gadget. Carefully.

you made some steps backward indeed saying, ok, your rant against pp who cant upgrade their pc doesnt apply to every of them... Great... but i will tell you what Solstyce told you... This is not the first time this happen in this forum... this is not the first time you act like this... there are others thread where you came to feed the clique of the pp who hate pp that are poorer than them... And really... there is no pride to get from this...

Ima posts touched me so much, that suddendly after reading them, i had a big willing to hide myself under my desktable, bec i felt ashamed to belong to the same humanity than the haters i saw writing here in this thread... i felt guilty for not being able to make myself a revolution and change mentalities .... i felt guilty to belong to this silly society who forget plain and simple the human values.

yeah... keep runing after consumation.... this is what the powerful pp expect from you.... run, run... and forget you are a simple human and forget other humans too.... all together for the consumation society !! This is how they want us to act ! Lets be sheep and lets run together... lets buy tv that are done to last less than 5 years... lets upgrade and upgrade every 6 monthes.... yeah.... 

im not saying progress is bad... you wont never see me saying this.... but following progress without cleverness and be a simple sheep... yes !!!! this is pure sillyness..

First.... let me tell you.... i have real doubt about the fact SL server are really performants... on top, i have huge doubt on the fact the maintenance is correct...not blaming ll employees.... they do what they can.... they are less than what they would need to be... but the managing wont win the oscar of the best managing ever according to me... They take out every penny from SL to give to Rodvick projects.... So what do you think it's remaining to SL .... Crumbs !!!! no more than crumbs... So when i see some pp daring to say that the old comp users cost money to sl.... i dont even know if i have to cry or laugh reading this.... but what are you thinking ? Do you think LL is a philanthropic company ? wake up !!! its a capitalist company and as every other ones, all they want is do money from you and nothing else....They wont pay for poor pp who cant afford new comps...If V1 and V2 are still usable, there is not doubt that there is still a benefit for LL.

so now technically... 

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Gadget Portal wrote:

What I said was I could 

build

 a computer for 300 USD that would run SL fairly well. For me to ship it would cost more than building it, though. However, since you're offering up 200 USD for the project, I'll take you up on that. I have a solution.

I can donate, on the spot, a valid Windows 7 CD key. I've got a few kicking around, and I've got one right next to me that's never been used. That's a 100 dollar contribution from me. Your 200 dollar contribution can allow her to order a barebones, build-it-yourself kit with all the essentials, minus a GPU. If we can get one more person to kick in a little money to cover the GPU, that'll be everything she needs to order all the parts for a decent computer. If she orders it herself, the shipping costs are negligible because the stores get to pay their commercial shipping costs that I don't. Often times the shipping is even free.

If you're honestly interested in doing this, we'll all get in touch in-world, I'll do the research for the exact parts/costs (and whether she needs a new monitor, mouse, keyboard, some of which I can provide myself if it's required), and I'll spend all the time necessary to walk her through assembling the computer correctly when it arrives.

---

ok, so ill catch you in private message before the end of the week... before this, we need Czari's opinion and agreement. then you ll give me every technical details in private.. im not an engineer and also non native english speaker.. so i may ask questions that will sound silly for you but i ask you in advance to be indulgent. 

That said. this wont clear your conscience. This wont allow you more to be insulting with pp who cant afford a new pc... Just bec YOU CAN give your help to one person wont excuse yourself to insult them or even want throw them off SL. As you can easily guess, there is really more than one person that cant upgrade their pc, and we wont be able to help them all... but what we can do for them... is stop insulting them, stop disdaining them, stop considering them as less human than us....we can also give them more understanding, compassion and tolerance.....

im sorry to be so blunt and abrupt, Gadget, but really, i m more than bored to read such things about this topic...

To answer to your OP... the person who ar'ed, is surely a silly person, and you wont be able to empeach the world to be full of silly person.. sadly... but how can you say this person has a non meshenabled viewer ? how can you state this as sure ? Do you have evidence about this..? and who did ban ? the land owner ? how can you be sure its the real reason for the ban ? you know, Gadget, sometimes things are not really what they seems to be... Sillyness is not related to the comp performances.

but well, you're friend has been baned and she surely forgot it the day after and she found a lot of other place to go.... but you, with your thread, you made cry some peoples i know.. you hurted deeply their feelings, while they are already badly hited by life injustices and so they really dont need you add your contribution to this..Next time you ll have willings to write about this topic, i just hope you will remind this and think that your words may be hurtful for pp who really dont need to be hurted more than what they are already. i know you will, Gadget.

(sorry for my long post... its still less long that if i could have writen it in my native language btw... :smileywink:)

[161488303349]

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

---

16 wrote:

---

Qie Niangao wrote:

Or could there be avatar shapes so perfectly matched to their mesh attachments that they don't even need the alphas?

---

is this one

some mesh clothes designers getting really good now at fitting perfect to the Standard SIzes. the alpha layer hide is a klutz way. meaning is not ideal

many people would rather not have alphas bc it mess with your head a bit. like it appears that you have to cut off parts of your body to wear your clothes

in technical terms alpha is not a biggie. in headspace terms it can be. and is the second main reason (after having to change your shape) why women mostly are really keen to get the deformer

 

---

i have yet to find any mesh piece of clothing that fits my av without the alpha layer. no, i am not a giant barbarian. I am 6'3", just like in RL. for some reason, mesh designers have made all mens mesh with sloped shoulders.. like we walk around depressed. Standard sizes is a joke. Thats like saying there are only 5 sizes in SL.  And THAT is why i wont buy mesh till the deformer is done.

---

the standard sizes was worked out by some clothes designers wanting to start making mesh clothes. they just did to establish some guidelines for themselves to work to when making their stuff

is not an impostion on anyone or official or anything. was just to help them so that they could cooperate together when making their pieces in the absence of any guidelines at all. so that we their customers could mix n match

some people incl me happy to buy their stuff off them for these reasons. just bc we want to really

+

am personal not holding my breath for the deformer. the people who working on it finding out about all the problems which that kinda thing entails. is really not easy to do at all. without place massive restrictions on what can actual be designed

is a open computer science question the deformer for the general case. like the algo. no one has ever solved it. and for all cases it can be shown mathematically that it can never be solved

so dunno if we ever going to get it. not in the way we imagine it anyway. like imagine that any clothes can fit any body shape

 

 

 

[Jennifer Boyle]

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Leia36 wrote:

... a few mesh designers are including a non mesh replica of the outfit in the folder, that way you apear normalish on non mesh viewers. (wear both)

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What a good idea.  I have not encountered them,  Who are the designers that do it?

[Pussycat Catnap]

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16 wrote:

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

i have yet to find any mesh piece of clothing that fits my av without the alpha layer. no, i am not a giant barbarian. I am 6'3", just like in RL. for some reason, mesh designers have made all mens mesh with sloped shoulders.. like we walk around depressed. Standard sizes is a joke. Thats like saying there are only 5 sizes in SL.  And THAT is why i wont buy mesh till the deformer is done.

---

the standard sizes was worked out by some clothes designers wanting to start making mesh clothes. they just did to establish some guidelines for themselves to work to when making their stuff

 

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STANDARD SIZES HAVE *******NOTHING******* TO DO WITH HEIGHT.

Mesh could care less about your height.

 

Staying informed is half the battle folks...