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Massive Packet Loss


Don Ormega
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Ok here is the situtaion and has me totally baffled.  A network with two computers, one wireless, one wired.  Two people on SL at the given time, one likes to use skype most of that time as well.  This system has worked well for over 6 months (new router was installed then, and it worked fine for a long time previous to the new router as well).


Now the problem.  About 4 or 5 weeks ago we expereinced massive packet loss.  Sometimes the SL statistics would say 125% packet loss (figure that one out).  At first we thought it was becuase we were both in the same sim.  But recently we found that is not the case as it still happens when we are in different sims.  The really odd part is when the packet loss occurs it also knocks out the audio stream and or skype.  Now why?  they are seperate services and shouldn't be affected by packet loss on SL.


Tonight a test was done when sudden massive packet loss occured (around 15-25%).  One person had teleported to a different sim and the packet loss started right after landing (and was affecting audio streams AND Skype).  As so left and went back to their home sim.  The packet loss immediately stoped for both computers currently loged into SL.  And keep in mind neither avatar was in the same sim.  Two totatlly differnt sims the whole time.  Whatever the problem is it starts with SL and when it happens affects everything else on our network.  Not doing anything huge or unusual than before and no one is running torrents or anything like it that would suck up all the bandwidth.  Just SL (on two computers), skype, and a audio stream or two. 

Again this has only started in the last month or so.  Anyone else seeing this?  It is crazy and driving me nuts trying to figure it out.  When this packet loss happens it stops everything cold.  Makes SL almost impossible to use, and it takes Skype with it (along with the audio streams)

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Theres been Jira's about this and they all say that the problem has been fixed. It hasn't. I get logged off, after every teleport unless i turn my draw distance down to 32 or lower. After landing if i turn my draw distance up, my packet loss shoots up to insane number. I saw 147% packet loss, and my bandwidth shot all the way to 1000 kps.

My internet is only 1mb so its using every bit of juice its got, which isnt enough, and i end up being logged off. Usually afyer teleportingto a new sim i will have to log in about 2 or 3 ...sometimes more, times before my bandwidth and packet loss settle down and im able to keep my draw distance turned up.

This is my new normal. Im not gonna walk around SL with my draw disance set at 32 so i just deal with the constant logging off and try not to visit too many other sims

 

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Hello Don. It is possible you are having a conflict with Skype. If you so a search of Web for Skype conflicts you will see that at times it can cause issues with Routers and Modems. Packet loss can result form many different issues. One can be your ISP provider "throttling" down your connection when you approach you allowed limit. Another is the connected path you use to get to Linden Lab servers. Depending on where you live it may take 4 - 5 Hubs to get there each creating a possible packet loss. Try doing the search for Skype conflicts first and this may help you better establish correct settings for Router. Also you may want to try a test where you do not have Skype active on any system and see if you experience the same issue. Good luck.

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this is the Jira about the massive packet loss and insane bandwidth usage

https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8121

the fix says its its a duplicate of this Jira, which says fixed

https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8124

Like your saying its right after a teleporting. Its happening to a lot of people. hit Ctrl- Shift -1 and watch your bandwidth when you teleport to a new sim with a decent amount of draw distance.

I see in the new release notes they turned down the server messaging to try to bring bandwidth down, but im still getting sustained bandwidth usage over 600kps for several minutes before being logged off.

600kps is down from over 1000kps i was seeing, but still pretty high.

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This may be a wild goose chase but .. it's a guess based on personal experience so it might be worth a test.

You mentioned that one of the PCs was connected via WiFi. The primary drawback to using WiFi is the possibility of outside Interference.

In my case, my neighbor has his "computer room" located in a room that is directly across the thin strip of grass separating our houses. Unknown to me at the start of our "problems" was the fact that he had purchased a new WiFi Router and installed it for use with his laptop. Of course he did exactly what I did, leave the default WiFi configuration intact, only setting the name. Thus both his and my routers were set to use the same WiFi Channel.

Once I realized that the WiFi connections in my network had become spotty, I logged into the Router's configuration and changed the WiFi Channel to something else. And that immediately restored full functionality.

As I said up top, this may not be the problem at all, but it's well worth the few minutes it takes to twiddle the Channel setting on your WiFi Router. It could be that someone nearby you just installed a new WiFi Router. It might even be that they bought a new WiFi Router that is total shiiiiii .. worthless and it's being ill-mannered on sharing the airwaves too.

If you live in a high density area (such as apartments or condos) then it could be a good idea anyway .. just to make sure you're not trying to share the same channel with a lot of others.

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It is better now the past day or two.  I am still testing.  Also I found the computer on WIFI had the bandwidth set to 2000.  Lowered that way down to 600 and it also helped (odd it should have been at 600 to begin with, I know it set to that before but perhaps something happened causing the prefs file to get dumped going back to defaults, but that would affect more settings than that....).  I think it is a combination of elements coalescing to make one huge mess. :/  I have my router locked down and encrypted but it is possible that if there are a lot of people on the same channel that interference might result.  I will give it a try on a different channel.

 

At this point it seems that everything helps a little bit.  I will also contact my ISP, because it also seems that the speed on my connection is lower than it should be.  Still it would seem that the heart of the matter is LL's network not working properly.  At least they have improved it somewhat.  Here is hoping they actually DO fix it.  I do remember this happening in the past with their network (several times actually), I just don't recall a time where it affected other services at the same moment as well.


Thanks to everyone for offering their insight/input.

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Well after more experimentation I finally (think) I have figured it out.  Apparerantly adjusing the bandwidth didn't do anything.  I thought it did at the time, but it must have been another factor at that moment.  It would seem that LL totally ignores the bandwidth setting for most of the connections now (for the heavily touted faster HTTP system).  This has a negative effect on anyone that has had the experience of having the bandwidth set too high (aka lots of packet loss).  Now that LL's network ignores this, the servers try to stuff way more than what we use to get down though the line.  I would rather it take a little longer to see textures than have them missing or unable to move.  Actually this makes it slower since you loose packets and need to have them resent all the time.  Not to mention hard to move etc.  It is no wonder that people are having trouble teleporting, and/or moving around.  This is a nightmare.  I am surpised they even left the bandwidth setting in the viewer if they are going to totally ignore it. :/

 

I thought perhaps LL's V3 might make a difference, but nope exact same results.  Moving around makes the bandwidth spike in the extreme.  And makes it impossible to have two people on the same connection at the same time (or at least those with less than fibre optic lines).

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Don, I've been having the same exact issues for a couple of weeks now too. I also noticed the viewer ignoring the bandwidth max setting. I also notice this happening on certain regions and not on some. I agree with you, I rather things would load slowly but completely and not what it's doing now which makes some objects to say gray forcing you to have rebake objects all the time,

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Well I have some good news.  After MUCH experimentation I think I have found a workaround.  First the same thing happens with Viewer 3, not change at all.  However you CAN turn off the (muchly touted) HTTP transfers.  First you activate the advanced menu (via prefernces or ctrl-alt-d) then near the bottom a option for develop menu. Turn that on then under develop menu uncheck HTTP inventory and HTTP textures.  The bandwidth setting will now abide by what you set.  For other viewers the settings is often in different locations.  Check under advanced/network most of the time the HTTP settings are there.


One warning though, there are some periodic spikes above the bandwidth setting even when HTTP is turned off, but they are minor/short lived and not common.  If you are trying to balance your connection and want to make SURE it does not go above 600 set it to 300 or 400.  Then it will never go above 600.  But hey try 600 and if you have problems lower it a bit more.


It is interesting that the bandwidth meter in SL stats does NOT include HTTP connections at all (probably if it did the bandwith setting would also work like it should).  That stat never went above 600 or if it did very breifly.  And yet my connection was getting swamped.


While this works, LL may remove the abilty to turn off HTTP and still have a functioning viewer in the future so I do hope that they fix the bandwidth setting so this no longer needed.  But for now, I hope it helps others that are also having this issue.

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Second Life RC Magnum:

Magnum is getting the interest list improvement project.  This projectshould reduce the bandwidth usage of viewers due to object updates, and should improve simulator performance, especially in sims with many connected avatars.  This week's update addresses an issue where some users experienced high packet loss, leading to issues such as not seeing avatars or objects inworld.

https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_RC_Magnum/13

Scheduled Wednesday 2013-01-30 07:00-11:00 PST

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  • 3 months later...

Your not the only 1 getting serious packet loss in Sarcee.. up to 270% !! Definately not my ISP i have 100MB fibre optic connection 24hrs a day 7 days a week. No matter what i try its there. Definately not pc as get 0% loss on my other land parcels.... This is getting to be a joke now.

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