Damien Cygnet Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I am aero constructor for 2 and half years in SL and we come with a problem that few modern vendors aircrafts dumped prices off - 50 percent for Xmas season on overall vendors In-World - it would mean at term other vendors cannot develop anymore - and the concurrency is deloyal.It is the term of a threat to all other producers and vendors. And it is the end of an economic sector in SL being Aircrafts.We have nice products like other community AERO and Military Aircraft Viced in SL but we cannot fight such a deloyal concurrency - as for Xmas in RL is striclty illegal to bargain as it is a commercial period.Many vendors have closed like Rogue yet departed ; it doesn't emulate a good spirit to the market place as wellit will prevent developers old or newbies to continue or invent. The VICE system will not have upgrades and the team is departed yet from SL. Vice web doesn't exist to support us anymore. Many factors would issue also for smaller vendors that if there is not a rule associated to freemarket exchanges with concurrents into the market place and in-world vendors ; the market would be anarchy and unprofitable as well...It looks now like a Far-West epoch.As regarding SL - the market is not regulated if not regulated in terms of Advisory board having ethic and loyalty - it will loose. The marketplace makes SL. The actual economy not helping : if the marketplace sinks and no new development is refreshing the market - SL will not sell estate land anymore and slowly the all value and economy of the virtual market will flow like a sinking ship... I would then write and send a ticket to report that it needs a wise community as advisory board to find a way to regulate prices upon any merchandizings and periods settled to the use of loyal bargains. At term I want to say to Aeon Voom = he will benefit an entire market ; but forgetting to treat a stability in this market by sharing with an entire community - will not help his sales ; this because it needs quality but quantity sales will not occur to profit to him at long term anymore in the end. And in the end with the economy not having different colors and flavors ; with us smaller vendors young and departed from SL then ; his market will loose the equilibrated profit that was established upon shares. It is also a social rule different from Keynes and the free market economy maybe ? It is a rule we can see acting into a small virtual Lab and following up the realistic economy. Don't forget...Will it be possible to find a way to regulate the market from the value and time spent into developing a product ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Jetaime Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 While it is disheartening to have a competitor drop prices farther than you think you can drop yours, SL is a free market and merchants are allowed to set the price for their items at any amount they wish. Overall this is a good thing. It could be that some vendors close as a result, but I doubt it would end aircraft creation. New creators will arise to take their place. This isn't happening with just aircraft either, There are several product sectors that are going through the same thing. With the economy so tight people are changing their marketing strategy to charging a low price and making their profit in volume of sales, the same strategy Walmart uses. But not everyone shops at Walmart. If you make a higher quality product and offer excellent service you will make sales to people who are looking for the Cadillac of aircraft. You need to market your products to this type of consumer. If prices were regulated who would decide what a product is 'worth'? Right now the consumer does by buying or not buying an item. I for one would not want anyone telling me what I can charge for something. BTW, you have broken with the community guidelines in mentioning the name of your competitor and his business. I suggest you remove those or the moderator will remove this post and may remove you from the forum as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porky Gorky Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Prices are in the toilet in SL nowadays. The only way to get a consistently decent price for content is to createsomething new and innovative or very high quality that is not available elsewhere at a cheaper price. This needs to be an ongoing process of continued innovation because within a few weeks or months of releasing a product you will find that your competitors have copied you and undercut your prices. So you always need to stay ahead of the game and have new products in development. Get them out there first and reap the benefits by selling it at a high but fair price with limited competition, but always make sure you have something better in your pipeline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziggy21 Slade Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 SL is a free market, in this sense at least it regulates itself. You claim aircraft developers are going out of business because they can't compete on price, this would suggest their costs are greater than their earnings, if this is the case how is another developer able to sell at half the price and make a decent profit, either he has found a way to develop and sell aircraft at very low cost, or if his costs are similar to the rest of you, he will go out of business. As an owner of several aircraft (one of the few things in SL I actually buy) I can tell you, price is the last thing to affect my buying decision, I doubt many people go out with the intention of buying the cheapest aircraft. For me top of the list is the quality and authenticity of the build, then I would consider its functionality, then its prim count and only then would I concern myself with price, if this guy is beating you on all these factors, he deserves to take your business, thats the free market, it rewards the best and it rewards the consumer with the best . So, you are wasting your time coming here for sympathy, this isn't kindergarten, no one is going to be asked to play nicely and share, get to work, develop more and better products than your competitor, market them more imaginatively, if you can't compete on price, be better in some other way(s), add value to the deal you offer the customer and you will succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Hello, In my side, I am so disgusted by how this unfair system, that I decide to sell all my avatar products for 0 l$. So, I just hope in average term there will not big shop or small shop, shop with favor or not. Just all to 0 l$. Plenty of "designer" have money to put in ads on marketplace but use illegal license software !!! The only way to break all the system is break with 0l$ products. I see only this mean for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Not agree, free market with plenty of "designer" use illegal license software or go on 3D free market and resell it ! I am sure if on second life control designer and ask themto provide a proof of legal license software, that make a buzz '_' But , they prefer close eyes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Strange, moral lesson about name vendor but Photoshop : 1000 $ 3D Max : more than 3500 $ Maya : 3500 $ ICAD : more than 5000$ How many people sell in second life and have legal license ? is it controled by LL ? I paid my software, and I advise clearly any true designer make nice jobs with legal lcense that fights against unfair system ro try to see with what software product done and search if it with legal license I think we will laught ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 In addition, it is easy to imagine if one people pay 1000 $ for CS6 Photoshop and try to sell his products against people paid 100 $ in ads on second life and use illegal license for CS6. Between the two, who will win ? And who will be in good paper of second life, I let you imagine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Jetaime Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 It is not illegal to use any software to create something for SL, unless you mean they pirated it If you are implying that other creators pirate software , then how do you know that ? You are throwing out accusations against competitors that you have no way of knowing or proving. Gimp and Blender are free and are just as good for creating things in SL as the programs that cost a lot so while a few may use pirated software I serously doubt that the majority do.. So aside from that issue how is a free market unfair? You have the same opportunities as anyone else to market your products. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Okay, so I advise LL before authorize import mesh, for example, to ask for a proof of legal license. And we will see the result '_' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 And in addition, just for example, it is easy to see with what software wear in mesh are created. When you know the cost of their softwares I will be very surprised to know the number of legal software used ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madeliefste Oh Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Mitsuko Kytori wrote: Photoshop : 1000 $ 3D Max : more than 3500 $ Maya : 3500 $ ICAD : more than 5000$ The Gimp is a good alternative for Photoshop and free. Blender can do the same as 3D Max and Maya. Price: 0 $ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porky Gorky Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Mitsuko Kytori wrote: Strange, moral lesson about name vendor but Photoshop : 1000 $ 3D Max : more than 3500 $ Maya : 3500 $ ICAD : more than 5000$ How many people sell in second life and have legal license ? is it controled by LL ? I paid my software, and I advise clearly any true designer make nice jobs with legal lcense that fights against unfair system ro try to see with what software product done and search if it with legal license I think we will laught ... Why stop there, why not have LL validate the operating system license of every single user, every time they log onto a grid? And whilst they are at it, maybe LL could run background checks on all of SL's users, see if they have ever downloaded a torrent link or find out if they have any unpaid parking tickets or if they have ever accidentally stepped on an ant? We only want people of pure moral fiber in SL and anyone who steals software does not belong in a virtual world as pure and morally correct as SL. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josephodo33 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 HELLO LADY I LOVE YOU ALL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 It is just an advise, but if your real life don't depend of revenue from second life, sell all your products for 0 l$, break the market, try to sell service and try to innovate and relaunch market with an innovative product. I am sure that make a good lesson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I just take an example to show free fair market doen't exist here, no more. And yes morality, probity, and sens of equity are totally outside. So, I am in true when I think without their values a system represent nothing and have no value, so it is why it is good to sell for nothing in nothing ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 So aside from that issue how is a free market unfair? Easy to answer : make believe that there are bugs, true or false bugs ... (http://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussion-Forum/Marketplace-how-subscription-work/td-p/1774547) How explain that second life is a masterpiece of software despite some little problem, and in the time they have bugs on simple program with PHP language ? They can develop sophisticated and unique 3D environment and can't develop proper some PHP pages on a website ? I have anough proofs to show pseudo bugs or perhaps true bugs. But in all case, I am sure if a big vendor answer make a ticket they will obtain an answer, me not, because I have a small shop. Just with this difference market are not fair. In addition, in the link between parenthesis, why my impression per week never reach the same level ? A people speak about 2500/2800 impressions per week is okay, I never reach this level ? why ? Now I have an answer, system is unfair, and it is easy to show how. i spend enough time and make enough screenshot to proove it and I send it to Linden Lab via email 8 times and two tickets : 01575625 2012-12-18 05:43:22 01576355 2012-12-18 18:07:23 First answer was create jira report bug ... it is not my job second ticket, no answer so I closed it ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanara Zenovka Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 This thread makes my brain hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Why please ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziggy21 Slade Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Zanara Zenovka wrote: This thread makes my brain hurt. Quite!!, The OP Started off complaining about price gazumping and has now responded with this barage of other issues, illegal use of photoshop, LLs coding and support and now advertsing impressions. The general underlying theme seems to be - making money should be easy and without challenge, well good luck with that!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medhue Simoni Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Amethyst Jetaime wrote: So aside from that issue how is a free market unfair? You have the same opportunities as anyone else to market your products. The principles of a Free Market have nothing at all to do with being FAIR. Actually, the marketplace and the inworld search are not based on Free Market principles. Years ago, when the marketplace was Xstreet, and inworld search was based solely on stature, we had a completely Free Market. Probably the closest thing to a Free Market the world has ever seen. Today, things are much different. Both the marketplace and inworld search, are now based on socialist principles, where LL directly influences who gets seen by the public. Possibly, LL just doesn't have any1 at the Lab that has seriously studied Austrian economics, but my guess is that they are all just Cali commies and think what they are doing is best for all, much like our current US government. For example, when the marketplace was Xstreet, and privately owned, the owner had a big incentive to make as much money as he could. The algorythm was set up to maximize the profit to quality ratio. Today's algorythm leans far too much to free and quality is of no consideration. Inworld search used to basically rank merchants by how large their supply was, and how much land they owned. Today, I have no idea, or can make any sense at all of what they are trying to do. All I can say is that it looks like some1 is trying to make the inworld search FAIR. Free markets have nothing at all to do with being FAIR. Free markets cater to the merchants that make the best products and gives the consumers the most choices with the best quality. In truely Free Markets, the consumers decide. The consumer is KING. In a centrally planned economy, no1 wins, especially not the consumers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitsuko Kytori Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Thanks, it is exactly what I thing, who translate better than I make, my think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela Galli Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Porky Gorky wrote: Prices are in the toilet in SL nowadays. The only way to get a consistently decent price for content is to createsomething new and innovative or very high quality that is not available elsewhere at a cheaper price. This needs to be an ongoing process of continued innovation because within a few weeks or months of releasing a product you will find that your competitors have copied you and undercut your prices. So you always need to stay ahead of the game and have new products in development. Get them out there first and reap the benefits by selling it at a high but fair price with limited competition, but always make sure you have something better in your pipeline. Really smart people skip the whole time-wasting business of coming out with innovative products first, and just copy what others do, at half the price. (I am not one of those really smart ppl.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela Galli Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I used to tell my third graders that "It's not fair!" does not mean "I don't like it!" It means something like, for example, that people are not given the same opportunities based on abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madeliefste Oh Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Pamela Galli wrote: Really smart people skip the whole time-wasting business of coming out with innovative products first, and just copy what others do, at half the price. (I am not one of those really smart ppl.) The smartest ones stop putting thier time in this blind alley at all, and move on to greener coasts. (I'm not that smart either) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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