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Belldandy Schmajuk

Ongoing issue: flood of freebies on all marketplace search results

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

Just to point out, JCNY has a 10L mood ring in the 3d spot. perhaps you need to rethink which merchants are to blame.

 

That's the same ring I saw when I did my "experiment" lol - although I just typed "ring" into search without any item filters and that same ring STILL came up. ;)

 

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Perrie Juran:

Actually, when I am looking for something I expect RELEVANT results in response to the search term I entered REGARDLESS of the price.  So the "sort by relevance" is not only redundant, it is dumb, dumb amd dumber to have in the drop down.  No matter how you sort, be it by Best Seller, Newest, Price, etc, the results should be relevant already.


See, there you go thinking logically. :matte-motes-tongue:  

At least you got some kind of rings...due to misuse of keywords I got several pose stands (by the same merchant) on the first page.

 

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Czari Zenovka wrote:

Perrie Juran:

Actually, when I am looking for something I expect RELEVANT results in response to the search term I entered REGARDLESS of the price.  So the "sort by relevance" is not only redundant, it is dumb, dumb amd dumber to have in the drop down.  No matter how you sort, be it by Best Seller, Newest, Price, etc, the results should be relevant already.

See, there you go thinking logically. :matte-motes-tongue:  

At least you got some kind of rings...due to misuse of keywords I got several pose stands (by the same merchant) on the first page.

 

Long before Douglas Adams came along we knew on Mars that the answer was 42.

 

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

the OP stated that JCNY only had a freebie on the front page  (I'm assuming the 10L item is what she calls a freebie) and all of their other best selling items were getting pushed down the list due to the other freebies.. as i stated many times, perhaps the freebies are selling better than the higher priced items since a lot of people have less money to spend in SL.

Yes to the first statement, and no to the rest... I stated quite clearly in my last post that the freebies did not get their new position "due to hard work and steady sales", not at all. This was the result of a sudden change in the algorithm done by the commerce team in a single day (or whoever pulls the cables).

If you have searched for rings in the past, you should know, these stores (JCNY, Earthstones, etc.) had several high priced items in the first positions (1-6) now, nothing appears, just a freebie now and then.

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Rival Destiny wrote:

So you are saying that LL has deliberately 'fine tuned' the search system so that their revenue stream will generate far LESS revenue?

Is this some new kinda masochistic marketing trend?

Yes.. is my guess.. but "VonGklugelstein Alter" has mentioned/suggested (and I agree) this happens every now and then (2-6 months), and the problem is always fixed due to pressure from merchants, so... its more like a problem waiting to be fixed by a person taking a nap @ LL headquarters (think about Homer).

btw. I not sure if their revenue stream is affected at all, a study should be done on that matter to reach such a conclusion.

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

You are stuck on the "best selling" filter.. i have asked many many people in SL that use the MP how they sort things... number one answer: RELEVANCE!!

Get off your high horse and deal with it. Are you still selling things? if so stop complaining, if not perhaps you need to revamp things.

 

well this is kinda of dumb, "relevance" is the default for all searches, no action is supposed to be taken by anybody to sort of lists by relevance. And who said "relevance" is not also affected? to my understanding, all the sortings have been affected in more or less degree. That said, if this issue affects me personally or not is not relevant to this discussion at all.

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VonGklugelstein Alter wrote:

 there is no tuning..it is their default template which is higest sales volume and age > oldest first as the algorythm..

Incompetent marketing trend is more acurate.

 

Agree.. btw.. "fine tuning" was the "wordage" they used in the reply.

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

Screw it, you know what. i went onto the Mp, under the avater accessories>jewelry>rings catgory and hit best selling.... you spout off about freebies and cheap items pushing the "high quality merchants" off the fromt page. Just to point out, JCNY has a 10L mood ring in the 3d spot. perhaps you need to rethink which merchants are to blame.

 

smiles, well, I won´t considere JCNY a high quality product line, but certainly, they do not produce that many freebies as you suggest, I personally do like Earthstones the most and where are they on these lists even relevance? guess the answer: nowhere to be seen, at least to the last time I checked. The mood ring (the freebie from JCNY) we all see, is the remnant of several, high priced items who had the best selling positions in the past (+3 days ago) and now nothing, relevance sorting is also affected I repeat.

btw. "pushing" is not the right term, because it implies some sort of "tug of war" action going on for a period of time (like a sales battle), I would said its more like "instant replacement of high priced/relevant/high quality (in most cases) items by non relevant/cheap and low quality freebies" due to a template replacement done by LL where the highest sales volume and age>oldest-first items are getting an unfair promotion up to the top..

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obviously there is a problem with marketplace considering the "best selling product" is a pose ball selling for $1,000,000L worth about $100L at best, that no one in there right mind would buy for that price and somehow is outselling meeroo food and other way more popular items.

i dont think the problem has anything to do with freebies or pricing just second lifes filters are borked at the moment.

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Belldandy Schmajuk wrote:


Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

the OP stated that JCNY only had a freebie on the front page  (I'm assuming the 10L item is what she calls a freebie) and all of their other best selling items were getting pushed down the list due to the other freebies.. as i stated many times, perhaps the freebies are selling better than the higher priced items since a lot of people have less money to spend in SL.

Yes to the first statement, and no to the rest... I stated quite clearly in my last post that the freebies did not get their new position "due to hard work and steady sales", not at all.
This was the result of a sudden change in the algorithm done by the commerce team in a single day

 

How do you know? Where is your proof that LL "suddenly changed the algorithm"? How do you know the free items aren't selling better? 

btw. I DO consider JCNY a high quality merchant. you really shouldn't put down your competition in the forums.

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Belldandy Schmajuk wrote:


Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

the OP stated that JCNY only had a freebie on the front page  (I'm assuming the 10L item is what she calls a freebie) and all of their other best selling items were getting pushed down the list due to the other freebies.. as i stated many times, perhaps the freebies are selling better than the higher priced items since a lot of people have less money to spend in SL.

Yes to the first statement, and no to the rest... I stated quite clearly in my last post that the freebies did not get their new position "due to hard work and steady sales", not at all. This was the result of a sudden change in the algorithm done by the commerce team in a single day (or whoever pulls the cables).

If you have searched for rings in the past, you should know, these stores (JCNY, Earthstones, etc.) had several high priced items in the first positions (1-6) now, nothing appears, just a freebie now and then.

I guess I'm just wondering how do you know this. Did LL share with you all of their sales data so that you can make the statement that it can't possibly due to those freebies having just sold more than their higher priced competition? I guess I'm just not understanding how you are privy to knowledge of the sales volume of all of your competition and to those freebies being sold. If this was the case wouldn't it also be the case for all search terms that could possibly have freebies within them? Although it does make me want to go throw some freebies up there to see if it helps myself out.

it is possible this could truly be happening but without knowing the actual sales numbers of all of those items sold, we have no way of knowing for sure, except to assume freebies are selling really well right now.

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Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

How do you know? Where is your proof that LL "suddenly changed the algorithm"? How do you know the free items aren't selling better? 

Okey honey, I am not interested in a mindless discussion, I think I answered this question earlier in the thread.

Let me be a bit agressive towards you, and forgive me for that, I´m not that kind of person: I think you do not understand the issue because you are not a merchant period. or at least.. a "relevant" merchant, no disrespect intended. What I mean is, you have not been affected at all by the problem and you only know about it because you read my original post, and hence, this day looks like any other shopping day for you.

Rewriting this idea: from the perspective of a consumer or from the perspective of a store with little to near zero sales (near zero relevance as well), marketplace really looks like any other normal day, and I should agree with you: freebies outsell many many shops, these shops do not have enought sales to outpace the most relevant freebies, but like anything in the world, this is not enterely true... freebies really have a hard time trying to outsell most relevant shops.

How do I know LL changed something from one day to another? its simply, when you notice a sudden sales drop, you start looking for problems, delistings, issues with the magic box (in the past), problems with the mainstore (SIM isues etc.)... etc. in this particular scenario, a change in the algorithm LL uses to sort results seemed to be the problem after careful examination on how MP looked that day. 

example: oh my gosh! my item dissapeared from the first page relevance/best selling! and.. what the heck? what are these freebies doing around? never saw them before! and so many!! <--- merchant severely confused.

This kind of perspective is the result of years of experience dealing with MP trying to survive and making a living from SL. And this constant check and care for your business gives you a deep and daily insight on how MP really looks normally on its best days (most of the time) and how MP looks like when LL decides to go nuts.

pd: read the whole thread, I think I mentioned somewhere that LL tacitly acknowledged the changes in MP in the reply I got from my ticket. (if you are still needing a proof written in stone).

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Belldandy Schmajuk wrote:


Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

How do you know? Where is your proof that LL "suddenly changed the algorithm"? How do you know the free items aren't selling better? 

Okey honey, I am not interested in a mindless discussion, I think I answered this question earlier in the thread.

Let me be a bit agressive towards you, and forgive me for that, I´m not that kind of person: I think you do not understand the issue because you are not a merchant period. or at least.. a "relevant" merchant, no disrespect intended. What I mean is, you have not been affected at all by the problem and you only know about it because you read my original post, and hence, this day looks like any other shopping day for you.

Rewriting this idea: from the perspective of a consumer or from the perspective of a store with little to near zero sales (near zero relevance as well), marketplace really looks like any other normal day, and I should agree with you: freebies outsell many many shops, these shops do not have enought sales to outpace the most relevant freebies, but like anything in the world, this is not enterely true... freebies really have a hard time trying to outsell most relevant shops.

How do I know LL changed something from one day to another? its simply, when you notice a sudden sales drop, you start looking for problems, delistings, issues with the magic box (in the past), problems with the mainstore (SIM isues etc.)... etc. in this particular scenario, a change in the algorithm LL uses to sort results seemed to be the problem after careful examination on how MP looked that day. 

example: oh my gosh! my item dissapeared from the first page relevance/best selling! and.. what the heck? what are these freebies doing around? never saw them before! and so many!! <--- merchant severely confused
.

This kind of perspective is the result of years of experience dealing with MP trying to survive and making a living from SL. And this constant check and care for your business gives you a deep and
daily insight
on how MP really looks normally on its best days (most of the time) and how MP looks like when LL decides to go nuts.

pd: read the whole thread, I think I mentioned somewhere that LL tacitly acknowledged the changes in MP in the reply I got from my ticket. (if you are still needing a proof written in stone).

You take much liberty with the facts & blend them with your own opinions.  which I should add, doing this doesn't make them true.

... freebies outsell many many shops, these shops do not have enought sales to outpace the most relevant freebies, but like anything in the world, this is not enterely true... freebies really have a hard time trying to outsell most relevant shops.

Like this statement which is entirely false. 

Most of what you say is based on your own experience, not everyone else's.  Then again, the one thing I have discovered in sl is that 'projection' seems to be rampant.  ie, it's happening to me so it must be happening to everyone else.

And as for your self important attitude, who are you?  I've been in sl a very long time, I shop everyday, am always buying something.  I look for quality mostly and there are some awesome creators out there.  But, I've never seen you or any of your products until this thread. 

I've seen threads like these come and go with regards to LL 'doing something' to manipulate 'something'.  99% of the time there is nothing too it & it's just another slow day or week on the MP.

And btw, who is 'honey'?  Just because you have what you think is a successful business in SL, doesn't give you a license to condescend to others.  Also, I can see why you mention 'bad costumers' in your profile which is at the top of your Rules list.  Your attitude sucks.  No offense.

'

 

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Belldandy Schmajuk wrote:


Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

How do you know? Where is your proof that LL "suddenly changed the algorithm"? How do you know the free items aren't selling better? 

Okey honey, I am not interested in a mindless discussion, I think I answered this question earlier in the thread.

Let me be a bit agressive towards you, and forgive me for that, I´m not that kind of person: I think you do not understand the issue because you are not a merchant period. or at least.. a "relevant" merchant, no disrespect intended. What I mean is, you have not been affected at all by the problem and you only know about it because you read my original post, and hence, this day looks like any other shopping day for you.

Rewriting this idea: from the perspective of a consumer or from the perspective of a store with little to near zero sales (near zero relevance as well), marketplace really looks like any other normal day, and I should agree with you: freebies outsell many many shops, these shops do not have enought sales to outpace the most relevant freebies, but like anything in the world, this is not enterely true... freebies really have a hard time trying to outsell most relevant shops.

How do I know LL changed something from one day to another? its simply, when you notice a sudden sales drop, you start looking for problems, delistings, issues with the magic box (in the past), problems with the mainstore (SIM isues etc.)... etc. in this particular scenario, a change in the algorithm LL uses to sort results seemed to be the problem after careful examination on how MP looked that day. 

example: oh my gosh! my item dissapeared from the first page relevance/best selling! and.. what the heck? what are these freebies doing around? never saw them before! and so many!! <--- merchant severely confused
.

This kind of perspective is the result of years of experience dealing with MP trying to survive and making a living from SL. And this constant check and care for your business gives you a deep and
daily insight
on how MP really looks normally on its best days (most of the time) and how MP looks like when LL decides to go nuts.

pd: read the whole thread, I think I mentioned somewhere that LL tacitly acknowledged the changes in MP in the reply I got from my ticket. (if you are still needing a proof written in stone).

Personally, i think you are a paranoid, nasty, condescending *****. No disrespect intended.  What gives you or anyone the right to say who is a "relevant merchant?"  Honestly, i hope everyone reads this thread and sees how nasty and self centered you show yourself to be.

I did read the whole thread. you mention some ticket to LL and their vague reply. With all of the ways to sort how we search the MP you seem awfully stuck on this one. As i said before, if you don't want to see freebies all you have to do is insert a minimum price and refine the search.

I have been in SL for over 7 years, so i know how the MP works. This happens every so often and then goes away. If you really have been "dealing with MP trying to survive and making a living from SL" for years , you would know this and understand its "normal" for the MP to bork out after major code changes.

 

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Belldandy Schmajuk wrote:


Drake1 Nightfire wrote:

How do you know? Where is your proof that LL "suddenly changed the algorithm"? How do you know the free items aren't selling better? 

Okey honey, I am not interested in a mindless discussion, I think I answered this question earlier in the thread.

Let me be a bit agressive towards you, and forgive me for that, I´m not that kind of person: I think you do not understand the issue because you are not a merchant period. or at least.. a "relevant" merchant, no disrespect intended. What I mean is, you have not been affected at all by the problem and you only know about it because you read my original post, and hence, this day looks like any other shopping day for you.

Rewriting this idea: from the perspective of a consumer or from the perspective of a store with little to near zero sales (near zero relevance as well), marketplace really looks like any other normal day, and I should agree with you: freebies outsell many many shops, these shops do not have enought sales to outpace the most relevant freebies, but like anything in the world, this is not enterely true... freebies really have a hard time trying to outsell most relevant shops.

How do I know LL changed something from one day to another? its simply, when you notice a sudden sales drop, you start looking for problems, delistings, issues with the magic box (in the past), problems with the mainstore (SIM isues etc.)... etc. in this particular scenario, a change in the algorithm LL uses to sort results seemed to be the problem after careful examination on how MP looked that day. 

example: oh my gosh! my item dissapeared from the first page relevance/best selling! and.. what the heck? what are these freebies doing around? never saw them before! and so many!! <--- merchant severely confused
.

This kind of perspective is the result of years of experience dealing with MP trying to survive and making a living from SL. And this constant check and care for your business gives you a deep and
daily insight
on how MP really looks normally on its best days (most of the time) and how MP looks like when LL decides to go nuts.

pd: read the whole thread, I think I mentioned somewhere that LL tacitly acknowledged the changes in MP in the reply I got from my ticket. (if you are still needing a proof written in stone).

No of offence "honey" but this entire discussion would remain pretty mindless if all we did was simply believe something just because you said so. You are also a very condescending person and highly rude to others who are just looking or some facts that can backup what you claim is happening. Most of us merchants are smart enough to not believe someone blindly without proof other than because they said so. And because there are apparently "relevant" merchants as well as merchants who haven't been affected, again, means its not an issue across the board. And I'm not even saying what you think is happening, isn't happening. I think what people are trying to get across is that you are coming onto a forum, that honestly you aren't even an active poster on which means people here may not even know who you are so again not a person we would just blindly trust and youre stating "facts" that aren't really facts, they are your best guesses and determinations. What you might try instead of being condescending to those who disagree is simply to say these are what I think is happening instead of saying you know for a fact because unless you can see sales data...you have no way to backup that claim.

again I'm not disagreeing this isn't happening, just giving some thoughts on why people are having issue or at least questioning why it's happening.

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I do not want to get into this disagreement , I only want to state what i do know.

Each day faithfully at about 3am SLT I do a search to check which pages my items are on. Generally I see the same type of results each day. When I woke up Friday morning i was shocked to see myself, as well as my other fellow merchants, pushed off the front pages, pages that were suddenly filled with 0-10L items. I have been doing this search faithfully each morning for a very very long time. It is easy for me to see when something has changed and this was a drastic and very easy to see change. Also, along with the search result change my sales plumeted. 

 Addition to this post:

Also, in addition to my own products, I am also a consumer and shop and buy often on marketplace. I am used to the results I get for things such as women's clothing, jewelry, necklaces, bracelets, shoes, boots, the list goes on. After seeing the change in the search results for my product categories i searched all the other areas i usually search for and again...they were flooded with 1-10L items where normally I would see the top designers that I love to buy from so much.

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Belldandy Schmajuk wrote:

example: oh my gosh! my item dissapeared from the first page relevance/best selling! and.. what the heck? what are these freebies doing around? never saw them before! and so many!! <--- merchant severely confused
.

 

This is exactly what also happened  with my products (from one day to another). Listing filters have radically  changed since few days ago. PERIOD

 

 

 

 

 

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jazon Uxlay wrote:

obviously there is a problem with marketplace considering the "best selling product" is a pose ball selling for $1,000,000L worth about $100L at best, that no one in there right mind would buy for that price and somehow is outselling meeroo food and other way more popular items.

i dont think the problem has anything to do with freebies or pricing just second lifes filters are borked at the moment.

As the creator of that fine product, I can tell you that it has that place in search because it sold 27 times that day.

"worth" is very subjective, just because one person wouldn't pay it doesn't mean that others wouldn't.

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Damn Sassy! I am uber impressed! Id love to sell something for a million linden even once per day. awesome job...you go girl!

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Sassy Romano wrote:


jazon Uxlay wrote:

obviously there is a problem with marketplace considering the "best selling product" is a pose ball selling for $1,000,000L worth about $100L at best, that no one in there right mind would buy for that price and somehow is outselling meeroo food and other way more popular items.

i dont think the problem has anything to do with freebies or pricing just second lifes filters are borked at the moment.

As the creator of that fine product, I can tell you that it has that place in search because it sold 27 times that day.

"worth" is very subjective, just because one person wouldn't pay it doesn't mean that others wouldn't.

You made $ 104,000 dollars in one day?  I am calling Associated press and CNN and Fox news.. get ready for a visit... lol

 

 

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