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namssab1nad Piers

Whats good wage?

36 posts in this topic

I call it as I see it, and I am fully aware this is cultural differencies at its best. In germany you would actually get dragged into court for offering these type of wages to people.

Personally I would feel absolutely horrible offering such a low wage to anyone because I know I would be taking advatange of them.
Those that do work for such wages are either doing it for the love of the job, or because they're desperate.

Did you ever think about that?

Taking advantage of people is never okay.

Fair pay for their actually WORK should be a given but alas...

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Come on, Cade...I'm not sure what is influencing your ire in this discussion, but Melita expressed an opinion based on her experience.  Heart expressed an opinion based on her's, Perrie on his, I on mine, etc.  I disagree on some of the opinions (on some rather strongly) and agree or partially agree on others.

And we're talking about SL.  Of course $0.50/hour USD is ridiculous...in real life.  In the US we have minimum wage laws which vary according to state due to cost-of-living.  In my state the 2012 mininim wage is $7.67/hr, in the state of Washington it is $9.04/hr for example.  For my state, $7.67/hr. is roughly $15,953/yr BEFORE taxes - barely a liveable wage for one person and some families in this economy are trying to exist on this.

But back to SL - a small percentage of people make a RL full-time living from their SL businesses, but it is generally as a land baron or VERY successful merchant.  Another percentage of people make a decent part-time income from their SL endeavors.  The majority of people either break even, their SL income "supports" them in SL ie. they do not put any RL funds into SL, or are doing whatever for the sheer fun of it. 

We can continue to give examples all day long, but I don't see that Melita's opinion should be trounced upon so vehemently.  I disagree with a lot of opinions I see on the forums - unless it hits one of my hot buttons I generally don't respond.  I'm guessing Melita inadvertently pressed one of your buttons. ;)

 

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It's not so much the fact that she stated her opinion, it's the fact that she had the audactity to call 50 cents for an hour of actual work a better than average wage as if she's doing that someone a favour when it's simply taking advantage of someone.

But I guess this is one of those times were people get upset about my bluntness because I was not raised to do political correctness nor to sugar coat and coo at people. Culural differences do that, so I am fully aware I'll be painted the bad guy here again and the issue at hand - taking advantage of people - is the point here.

To the OP. Do not undersell yourself, you're putting in actual time and the fact that you're concerned enough to make a post here speaks in your favour that you'll take it seriously. As some have said in this thread, free land would be one option, a fair wage another. Speak to your future boss, throw out your best case scenario wage and haggle from there until you're both satisfied.

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Czari Zenovka wrote:


You didn't feel it was "worth it" to make 300L for 2 hours; I was pleased with 300L for 3 hours.

 

I wasn't  really into doing this job.  It was during a prime time when most of my friends were on and as I said, my  primary focus was simply having fun. 

I know there are Clubs like Junkyard Blues that the hosts/hostesses don't get paid and don't put out tip jars and except for a mention by the DJ's, no comments are made about tipping them.  For them it really is about doing it for the fun and love of it.

Nothing wrong with that. 

It will always be a matter of how someone wants to live their SL.

 

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iCade wrote:

It's not so much the fact that she stated her opinion, it's the fact that she had the audactity to call 50 cents for an hour of actual work a better than average wage as if she's doing that someone a favour when it's simply taking advantage of someone.

But I guess this is one of those times were people get upset about my bluntness because I was not raised to do political correctness nor to sugar coat and coo at people. Culural differences do that, so I am fully aware I'll be painted the bad guy here again and the issue at hand - taking advantage of people - is the point here.

 

I'm not painting you as the bad guy Cade and that wasn't my intention in my post. :)  You and I have had some good exchanges on the forums.  We agree on many things and I daresay we disagree on others.  Because of the positive exchanges you and I have had I was a bit surprised at your post to Melita but it could very likely be, as you said, a combination of slight cultural differences that come out more strongly in text or possibly even a misunderstanding of what was written. (Going to go back and re-read the posts.)  Even amongst people of the same identical culture, text chat can come across in a way colder or stronger than meant sometimes. 

I'm a redhead and, in my younger years, had a very short fuse on my temper and was quite opinionated.  In some circles I was seen as "controversial" just because I wasn't afraid to step in with my opinion at any given moment.  As I've gotten to be *ahem* "a woman of a certain age" I have mellowed a bit. That point is debatable amongst some of my friends...lol.  My point being I definitely understand expressing strong opinions and personally don't agree with the "PC" culture in general.

As a sidenote:  Melita does a great job in defending her own statements, she doesn't need my help...lol.  I just know her to be one of the most giving people I have met in SL. :)

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Perrie Juran wrote:

 

It will always be a matter of how someone wants to live their SL.

 

And this is the crux of anyone's time in SL and kind of the point I was trying to make.  You stated it precisely. :)

 

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They are interesting points you bring up and it would be interesting to see how a Court of Law actually dealt with "employment" in SL.  I think the question would be at what point did it move from people playing a 'game' to it being something that you could call Real Life work.

A contrast would be my dancing for "fun" as I did and then someone who took the job with the requirements I listed above.

I can't speak for other Countries but here in the U.S. you can not give up certain rights.  The law will not allow you to.  If I agree to work for someone for less than minimum wage, the Court will on my behalf order that employer to pay me the shortage. I have no say in the matter.  I don't have to file the complaint.  If it gets discovered in an audit they act on my behalf and "protect me from myself."

Someone taking a job with the skill set I listed above, that I would call "real work."  Me swinging from a pole on a computer screen while I chat with people, I'd be less likely to make that judgement.

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I'm a firm believer in "Do what makes you happy" so if you wish to earn L$, do something you enjoy and do it when you enjoy it.

Nobody is forced to work here for any amount of money, small or large so if you're not happy, don't do it!

Myself, i've done jobs for tips only, jobs with a salary and some i've done just because I had fun doing it.

Isn't that what SL is supposed to be about?

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Perrie Juran wrote:

They are interesting points you bring up and it would be interesting to see how a Court of Law actually dealt with "employment" in SL. 

I often wondered about the legalities of that. At one point I decided to ad In our employment agreement that the job they perform is a virtual job and not real. and that they are compensated by tokens/ virtual currency.   " nuff said " lol

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Dilbert Dilweg wrote:


Perrie Juran wrote:

They are interesting points you bring up and it would be interesting to see how a Court of Law actually dealt with "employment" in SL. 

I often wondered about the legalities of that. At one point I decided to ad In our employment agreement that the job they perform is a virtual job and not real. and that they are compensated by tokens/ virtual currency.   " nuff said " lol

Probably a good thing that you did that.

I really do have RL experience with this.  Some of this will vary from state to state but they all follow basically the same template.  There are "hourly" workers and then what are known as "exempt" positions.  Most Mgt and many Sales positions are considered exempt. You don't get time and a half for overtime. But there are strict definitions.

In my case another (disgruntled) employee filed a complaint.  The Court found that based on our actual job duties we did not meet the requirements for being exempt.  Our employer had to pay all of us back wages.  You can't "define it" away.

This is also why in today's work environment a company will not and can not allow someone to "work off the clock."  If you get caught doing this you will get wrote up and more than likely you will be terminated WITH CAUSE which means you can't draw unemployment insurance.  Most employee handbooks I have seen state this loud and clear in bold type.

 

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I haven't read every post in this thread, but I have to say this: If they pay you anything at all, you'll be making more than the Estate owner these days.

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