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Is there anything I can do?


Stella Gravois
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I am a template builder. To protect the sales opportunities of my clients I have a EULA that states that products made with my templates are not allowed to be given away for free or listed as dollarbee items on the Marketplace. Still there are every now and then resellers that put my (unchanged) items for free or for just the one dollar on the MP. Usually an IM is enough, I tell them it’s not allowed and they take down or re-price the items. In 2 cases however they either bluntly refuse, of do not react at all. What on earth can I do? The EULA is pretty clear and a link to the full text is in every sale I make. Flagging the item in the MP is hard since this option is not in the lists to choose from. Violating Intellectual property is not exactly what it is, it is more Violating the End User License agreement. Any ideas?

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Hmm, I looked at one of your items, and saw no mention of not being allowed for free or 1 L$, if its the link you refer to, not sure if thats really clear, or fair. Any ideas you ask ... you are a template builder, build more templates. You claim to want to protect the sales opportunities of your clients, reasonable enough. Still though, please build more, its the only real way to succeed at all this. Your prices are a bit high i see, you may not think so, but whats hot at the moment is mesh and is being turned out daily by a couple of professional teams it seems, at 250 L$ an item, and full perm with textures and extras. Don't think for a minute that they wont soon be dollar items also.... they also have thier own TOS.... people want a lot more money from all this then a few years ago. Quality and price have never been equal on the market, what may be worth 500L$ to one person, is 50L$ to another, and often the 50L$ item is of better quality. Still new full perm makers are attempting to set prices higher... i guess what you should do is make it clearer.. say no free or 1$ sells there "in the discriptions of your sells items"... not in some link ok. Others say.. don't sell under 50L$ for first 60 days... or don't sell under 100 L$ etc... but i wonder how many sells they lose setting so many rules. I wont buy from any one with thier own end user agreement.

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Thanks for the reply Cisco :) But what I mean is what can I do about the fact that some customers give away the products despite the EULA. Building more templates will not solve that problem I guess.

That you decide not to buy from designers that use their own EULA - fair enough. That is indeed the reason for me not to list the complete EULA in each listing. 

I decided not to dive into the mesh business, rather stick to my skirt generators and the 'traditional' clothing templates. Doing what I am good at, rather than diving into the hype of the day :)) But anyway..  that still would not be a solution to stop people from violating my EULA

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I dont think anyone can stop people from violating this EULA. People may not even understand english. Is why is best to create and do what you know is good. To end free and dollar items has been talked about also, it has its good and bad points. There is one full perm creator ( redpoly ) that sends out a HUD with agreement you have to sign in on before they will sell you thier full perm kits.. maybe something like this would be good for you ?

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LL will not help you, it's a resident to resident dispute. If you want your EULA upheld, you'll need to take rl legal action. I suggest seeking counsel if that's what you really want.

Or you could not focus on the very few who would violate it in the first place, if you'd rather not go down that route. It's entirely up to you and no one here can really advise you on anything. EULAs and the like are enforcable, but only through rl means. You'll need to ask whatever lawyer helped you draw up your legally binding EULA the best course of action. Once you hand over those files to customers, it will be difficult to control what they do with it, without taking it to rl. If you don't want to do that, you're basically up a creek.

I know that's not what you wanted to hear, and it's harsh. I'm not saying I agree with it. But that is how things go in sl. There's not a whole lot of ways to ensure that someone who decides they no longer agree to your EULA actually gets rid of the files even if you did take them to rl court. I understand why you have the rules you have and I believe every business owner should be free ot have whatever rules they want. We's all free not to buy if we so choose. You're just going to be in a rough place trying to enforce it without going the legal route in some cases.

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Although some of your things say this:

Do NOT sell the sculpts full perm,
Do NOT sell or give away the sculpts full perm or copy/transfer.

 

Some others say this:

• You may not sell the textures or templates in their original form nor in any texture or template package.
You may not give for free the products you make from the templates;

You are selling TOOLS, not end products, and you don't have the legal right to control the output of those tools. It's like having Simplicity or Burda tell me that I can't make clothing and give it away. Or Microsoft telling me I have to sell the text I write, and forbidding my giving it away.

 

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Stella Gravois wrote:

I sell both tools and templates (besides sculpts and tutorials). On the tools there are no limitations on what people do with the products, but on the templates (that is textures that I uploaded, psd files that I made) there is a minimum price on the products.

What you are trying to do with the EULA - "resale price maintenance" is iullegal under California law and US law

US Law - H.R. 6971 makes it illegal for manufacturers to fix the prices of consumer products sold by retailers.

You can't write a contract that will require your customers to break the law, which means they are free to ignore that clause in your EULA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resale_price_maintenance

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Determining customer's prices does seem to be stretching things a bit. Not only does it seem like an odd decision tor a maker of tools, but it also limits the appeal of what you're making. I would not buy a tool that tole me I HAD to make money on it. Maybe that's because I'm just starting to create, and I'm not really sure if something should be sold or given away when someone asks where to get it. Here is a product I DID buy. https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/str8-Female-Shading-Highlighting-System/1818536

The agreement that this tool creator had is that customers can only check two of the three permission boxes, and that the item can only be used as a tool, not resold as-is. Since i plan to learn as I go, this is perfectly okay with me. If I don't want lindens for what I make, then I can still give items to friends, or maybe eventually as freebies when i feel I have enough to start a store. In other words, I won't be forced to "waste" my practice pieces. In case you don't feel like clicking the link, here's the copyright info.

© str8, All Rights Reserved

Buying this product you agree with the following terms:
These templates are only for private use and for Second Life content-creation only. You may NOT print, copy, redistribute or give them away as PSD files, textures or creations with full permissions under any circumstances. You are authorized to use them only in order to create and sell/give away your own clothes (mod, copy, no trans or no copy, mod, trans) The violation of this agreement at any way means a copyright infringement that could set under the risk of a prosecution and a DMCA take down notice.


This was right in the description, for me to see and agree to before I hit the buy button. The terms seemed reasonable, so I did go ahead and buy. Consequences of violating the terms of use are also clearly defined. So if you are right in your terms, and they are being vioilated, maye you can look into the same procedures as the person who wrote this copyright.

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Thanks Nefertiti - I have seen a lot of template builders do the same (setting a minimum price for reselling) I didn't realise that was illegal. Odd, but all in all it would prolly mean nothing can be done if people decide to give the item away. Shame for the residents that have paid good money hoping they will have a article to sell. Anyway.. if it is indeed not legal and I cannot hold this up or put any sanction on it when they do, I better take off this part of the EULA.

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To Solstyce - thanks your reply. There is a difference between a tool and a template. The article you refer to is a kind of template. The Shading sheets can be found on the web for free, but the designer added some wrinkles and sells it to other people to use in their designs.  Still it is a template and not a tool. A tool is a scripted 'machine' that builds something for you with prims. Things like bead or skirt generators, multipiers, permission changers and even creator changers. The creator of the tool cannot claim right on the itmes made with those tools. They can be given away and even sold full perms (the products, not the tool itself of course). Btw in case of the template you refer too I would not claim any rights to the eventual product either since it is only a small part of the eventual design and not a complete product. Anyway.. thanks all for the input. I guess I know what I need to know. :)

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I haven't even gotten into trying to work with prims yet. I'm an experienced shopper who always reads the fine print, but an absolute noob at creating. lol. If you could post some links with more info about these tools, I would be very, very grateful.

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  • 2 weeks later...

So, saying you must sell under a certain price,  isn't exactly legal ?

Something about it does seem wrong, is this normal market behavior ?

People can make thier own TOS... "See product details for permissions info",

one says "Terms may change",  guess anything goes... or not.


Nefertiti Nefarious wrote:


Stella Gravois wrote:

I sell both tools and templates (besides sculpts and tutorials). On the tools there are no limitations on what people do with the products, but on the templates (that is textures that I uploaded, psd files that I made) there is a minimum price on the products.

What you are trying to do with the EULA - "resale price maintenance" is illegal under California law and US law

US Law - H.R. 6971 makes it illegal for manufacturers to fix the prices of consumer products sold by retailers.

You can't write a contract that will require your customers to break the law, which means they are free to ignore that clause in your EULA.




 

 

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