Is goodwill running thin?

[Masami Kuramoto]

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JeanneAnne wrote:

The thing I think you need to realize tho is that it's LL executives & shareholders who are the real parasites, much moreso than SL "freeloaders." Execs & shareholders rake in profit while contributing nothing. The freeloaders freeload with LL's blessing because that's the way they've decided to run their business. There's no use resenting freeloaders when LL allows & encourages the freeloading.

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Well, to be fair, LL's shareholders took a risk by investing capital and creating the platform. So of course they want to see some return on their investment. I would not call them parasites because SL would not exist without them.

But yes, resenting freeloaders is shortsighted. The SL boom period of 2007 would not have happened if LL had not opened the gates for "freeloaders". If all the freeloaders of today became productive tomorrow, doing business in SL would be harder, not easier. And if all the freeloaders said goodbye to SL and hello to OSGrid, a lot of paying customers would follow them. Because the main thing that keeps people coming back to SL is other people. Don't underestimate the social value of freeloaders. After all, these people spend most of their in-world time on nothing but socializing.

[Dilbert Dilweg]

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Masami Kuramoto wrote:

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Well, to be fair, LL's shareholders took a risk by investing capital and creating the platform. So of course they want to see some return on their investment. I would not call them parasites because SL would not exist without them.

But yes, resenting freeloaders is shortsighted. The SL boom period of 2007 would not have happened if LL had not opened the gates for "freeloaders". If all the freeloaders of today became productive tomorrow, doing business in SL would be harder, not easier. And if all the freeloaders said goodbye to SL and hello to OSGrid, a lot of paying customers would follow them. Because the main thing that keeps people coming back to SL is other people. Don't underestimate the social value of freeloaders. After all, these people spend most of their in-world time on nothing but socializing.

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Yep I agree. And the freeloaders end up with a pocket full of lindens one way or another. What do they do with the money? Most of them spend it in world on products or services.

[Boudicca Littlebird]

My own view is that there is no goodwill, whether there was once I don't know, but I am reminded of a linden statement over the homesteads, "added value", they saw homesteads were selling well and upped the tier, I like many others just abandoned my Sims, estate owners had no choice, most tried but only those with grandfather agreements survived and undercut all others, that is now part of sl history.

Below a statement from wiki

"A banana republic is a politically unstable country that economically depends upon the exports of a limited resource (fruits, minerals), and usually features a classed  society — a large, impoverished working class and a ruling plutocracy, the rich élites of business, politics, and the military. "

That is what sl is, replace the "fruits, minerals" with "tier & marketplace cut", it is a business model that has been forced on most the world so no surprise it is forced here.

Like in RL dissenters are suppressed and even destroyed, that shows by the amount of people that just "disappear" from these forums, so to expect any kind of law and order that you would get in the UK for example is not an option here.

[Masami Kuramoto]

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Boudicca Littlebird wrote:

Like in RL dissenters are suppressed and even destroyed, that shows by the amount of people that just "disappear" from these forums

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I found that the risk of getting banned for expressing controversial opinions is smaller here than it is on other SL-related forums.

[Perrie Juran]

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Masami Kuramoto wrote:

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Boudicca Littlebird wrote:

Like in RL dissenters are suppressed and even destroyed, that shows by the amount of people that just "disappear" from these forums

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I found that the risk of getting banned for expressing controversial opinions is smaller here than it is on other SL-related forums.

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From what I have seen here the primary reason for bannings is continually engaging in inter-personal disputes.

It seems that the most common place for these to occur is in the context of controversial subjects.

Because of this correlation it gives the appearance that the bans are the result of expressing controversial opinions.

Have there been unjust bans?  No doubt.  I can think of a few that I completely disagree with.  

Do some subjects get deleted simply because they are controversial?   Possibly. 

But overall we get to discuss a pretty wide range of subjects here complete with ones that specifically disparage Linden Lab.

 

[Boudicca Littlebird]

LOL, far from real, I have observed some here get very abusive and never banned, they are the bullies of this forum and get away with it, yet I have seen people react to them and get banned, very rose tinted specs some have.

Just observe, some here with red icons are very rude and personal, yet nothing happens to them.

[Perrie Juran]

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Boudicca Littlebird wrote:

LOL, far from real, I have observed some here get very abusive and never banned, they are the bullies of this forum and get away with it, yet I have seen people react to them and get banned, very rose tinted specs some have.

Just observe, some here with red icons are very rude and personal, yet nothing happens to them.

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Given your registration date in the Forum I am going to guess that you posted here previously under another name and perhaps may have even been somehow involved with one of these "unjust bans" in order for you to speak so eloquently on the subject.

I could have added to my statement regarding unjust bans that perhaps there are those who have been allowed to get away with too much also.

But it's never been a secret that I feel the Forums should be moderated.

I stand by my statement regarding the reason for the banning.  It was not for bringing up or discussing controversial subjects.  It still was the inter-personal dispute.  Now as to who threw the first punch, that would be another subject, the individual discussion of whom on a name by name basis I'm pretty sure would get nuked very fast here.

 

[Phil Deakins]

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Boudicca Littlebird wrote:

My own view is that there is no goodwill, whether there was once I don't know, but I am reminded of a linden statement over the homesteads, "added value", they saw homesteads were selling well and upped the tier, I like many others just abandoned my Sims, estate owners had no choice, most tried but only those with grandfather agreements survived and undercut all others, that is now part of sl history.

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That was the single largest thing that turned me against LL. It didn't affect me (financially) in the slightest, but it showed the nature of LL. They did plenty of things against their customers that made my heart sink (for want of a better description of the effect) and that was the biggest of them.

But I disagree when you say that "there is no goodwill". There is none from me but that's because I've seen, over time, how they've treated their customers. Before I saw it time after time, I had a great deal of goodwill towards the company, as tends to be normal with a compies we are new to. Most current users haven't seen it over time because they haven't been here very long, so I would guess that there is plenty of goodwill towards LL, albeit unjustified.

[Boudicca Littlebird]

I had 5 full sims and 26 homesteads all rented out, I also paid vat,, when they did that lots left and went to the estates that had grandfather agreements because they offered such cheap rent, they charged less than what was cost to me, to stay alive I had to subsidize all the sims by at least 20%, I could see it was hopeless and that I could only keep my estate if I was willing to put money in every moth, I saw this as corruption, seems there was a cartel of grandfathered estates and the policy makers of sl, this was a huge shock to me when I realized I was expecting justice from the mafia, so I abandoned all 31 sims, the cost to me was huge.

 

But your right most here won't see that unless they make a large investment in sl.

I think banana republic is the correct definition of a virtual world.