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Cully Andel

To all designers who use mesh....

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If your clothes are mesh PLEASE!!!!! put it on the poste of the item! I know a lot of people, myself included, who have a mesh viewer but we cannot see rigged mesh (And please no one tell me what settings I need to alter. I already know this. My hardware can't cope)

If you sell mesh clothing it would be nice if your customers knew before wasting their lindens on your outfits.

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Prims are mesh. (^_^)

Flexible prims are rigged mesh. (^_^)

Sculpts are laggy mesh. (^_^)

"Mesh" is the nickname for a different way of storing the information for what we've been seeing all along.  Storage is server-side.  (^_^)

When you say you "can't" see mesh; I can only respond with, you don't know what you're talking about. (^_^)y

 

 

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Cully Andel wrote:

(And please no one tell me what settings I need to alter. I already know this. My hardware can't cope)

So... Get better hardware?

Herp derp.

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Hello, no matter how you define it or name it, some people just cannot see mesh items. Usually thats only for rigged mesh or bigger things. Might be their older hardware or connection speed, don´t know and don´t care it´s fact.

To the OP, i fully agree with you. I do not buy rigged mesh at the moment but only about the fitting problem. No chance of me hiding or changing my shape for shiny new mesh-pants.

Please do not go on about terms used i know them, stay with the OP and stop suggest buy new things. The worldwide economy is bad and alot people just happy to buy the daily needs but still want to enjoy their free time on SL.

Smile and wave, Monti

 

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Cully Andel wrote:

If your clothes are mesh PLEASE!!!!! put it on the poste of the item! I know a lot of people, myself included, who have a mesh viewer but we cannot see rigged mesh (And please no one tell me what settings I need to alter. I already know this. My hardware can't cope)

If you sell mesh clothing it would be nice if your customers knew before wasting their lindens on your outfits.

Lots of places indeed do state if the clothing item is mesh.

If you are not going to update your harware to be able to see rigged mesh then your SL experience is getting worse and worse over time as more and more rigged mesh will flood into SL.

 

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Cully Andel wrote:

If your clothes are mesh PLEASE!!!!! put it on the poste of the item! I know a lot of people, myself included, who have a mesh viewer but we cannot see rigged mesh (And please no one tell me what settings I need to alter. I already know this. My hardware can't cope)

This bug has been fixed. Please update your viewer.


If you sell mesh clothing it would be nice if your customers knew before wasting their lindens on your outfits.

Their lindens won't be wasted because others can see the outfits correctly. If you use outdated viewers or hardware that doesn't meet the minimum system requirements, it's no one's problem but your own.

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“My computer can’t display mesh” is not something I’ll buy. “My computer has driver issues that I’m unable/unwilling to fix” is more like it. Invisible mesh is a problem you can solve on your existing hardware. To say anything else is ridiculous. (=_=)

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Also its pretty easy to see what is made with mesh and what not. I never had any problem with that. But I guess he is also lazy with that thing....

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Imnotgoing Sideways wrote:

“My computer can’t display mesh” is not something I’ll buy. “My computer has driver issues that I’m unable/unwilling to fix” is more like it. Invisible mesh is a problem you can solve on your existing hardware. To say anything else is ridiculous. (=_=)

My computer graphics cannot be upgraded (the card is built into the motherboard- already tried updating the driver and talking to tech support with the manufacturer).  My computer is capable of viewing mesh IF I have the graphic tab set at anything above the low setting, however, once moved to anything other than low I cannot move and the program locks up.  So having it set to low I cannot see mesh, people are missing parts (mostly hair - but hey bald is beautiful).  So tell me how do I solve that problem on my existing hardware and still be able to function in SL?

Wiki

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Gadget Portal wrote:

Sounds like it's time to stop using a toaster for SL and upgrade your hardware.

LMAO @ Toaster...

but thanks.. thats really the kind of help I was looking for.. NOT

Wiki

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My computer is a custom-built, high spec gaming rig using up to date hardware and the most current version of my TPV of choice. Go ahead and give me a smartass reply about how I should stop using a toaster because sometimes mesh refuses to render properly for me as well.

Perhaps the fault lies in the Lab's half-assed implementation and rushed deployment of mesh? Oh heavens no, that couldn't possibly be the issue! Blame the end users, that's the ticket!

Maybe some of you LL apologists should climb down from those high horses you're perched on before you get a terminal nosebleed.

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Deej Kasshiki wrote:

My computer is a custom-built, high spec gaming rig using up to date hardware and the most current version of
my TPV of choice
. Go ahead and give me a smartass reply about how I should stop using a toaster because sometimes mesh refuses to render properly for me as well.

Perhaps the fault lies in the Lab's half-assed implementation and rushed deployment of mesh? Oh heavens no, that couldn't possibly be the issue! Blame the end users, that's the ticket!

Maybe some of you
LL apologists
should climb down from those high horses you're perched on before you get a terminal nosebleed.

Emphasis added.

How is it LL's fault if mesh doesn't render properly in your TPV? Doesn't that make you a TPV apologist?

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I'm far from an LL apologist, and not only is it half assed, it's borderline retarded. These people are idiots. That said... There's no excuse if you're trying to access gaming or game quality software with an integrated graphics chip. The fault is your own in that situation.

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Gadget Portal wrote:

I'm far from an LL apologist, and not only is it half assed, it's borderline retarded. These people are idiots. That said... There's no excuse if you're trying to access gaming or game quality software with an integrated graphics chip. The fault is your own in that situation.

Wow, I just simply asked for suggestions on how to make what I have.. work better, if possible. Yes, I know NOW that my machine is not designed for every type of software out there. Sadly, for me, it was the one I could afford to get.  Don't you think if I could manage to buy a new machine without an integrated graphics chip, so SL runs flawless (if that's even possible) I would? Unfortunately, it's not feasible at this time.  You want to buy it for me?  I highly doubt that... so thanks for the lack of help.  The insults?  You can keep for yourself.. this Idiot needs to go warm up her toaster so she can go work in SL for the next couple of hours. Oooh now that will probably give you more food for your insults"working in SL"? OMG the stupidity of that too!  Luckily for me... I LOVE my job and the people I work with, thats why I tolerate the toaster.

Wiki

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Jeez - bit harsh. Not everyone can afford a new computer or even some updates.

To the OP: Don't buy anything that doesn't offer a Demo first.

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Let me clarify. The insults were for LL. They did a terrible job with mesh. As for people with integrated graphics- most modern desktops have an expansion slot of some kind. Don't buy a whole new computer. Upgrade the gpu and one part at a time as you can afford it. Doing it that way can get you something that can run SL without breaking the bank.

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There is no inherent reason for meshes not to render properly on computers with integrated GPUs. Every "tangible" object in SL is a mesh, and every avatar is a rigged mesh. If rigged mesh attachments don't show up on your screen, it is due to a bug in the viewer, not due to a bug in your hardware. This sort of thing is not supposed to happen, even at low graphics settings.

However, before you blame LL, you have to confirm the bug in their own viewer. LL is not responsible for rendering bugs in third-party viewers, especially those based on viewer 1 where support for mesh assets had to be retrofitted.

You were looking for suggestions, so here's what you can do:

Confirm that your hardware meets the minimum system requirements as laid out by LL here. Intel integrated GPUs are officially supported if you are using Windows, but not if you are on Linux or a Mac. Nvidia Ion integrated GPUs (used in some netbook-type PCs) are supported too; they are identical to GeForce 9400M.

Confirm that the problem persists in the latest release of Linden Lab's official viewer. If it does, look for existing bug reports or file a new one. The issue with invisible rigged mesh attachments has been fixed according to SH-2779. Reopen that ticket if you have evidence to the contrary.

If the problem occurs only in a third-party viewer, file a bug report with its developer. At this point it is no longer LL's concern.

The idea that SL requires high-end hardware to run properly is a myth. I've seen Linden Lab's viewer perform just fine on Ion-based "nettop" PCs running Linux two years ago. This sort of hardware is now available for about $150. If that is out of reach for you, then SL should be the least of your problems.

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Some computers  do have a build in video card but that doesn't always mean that you can't upgrade it. Putting a second video card in will likely disable the build in card. Also check other settings in the viewer. You might be able to specify to not see other things but still at least the meshes. What you are seeing or not seeing isn't just a matter of what I call "flexy sculpties" aka rigged mesh clothing or hair. Sadly enough if you are on a laptop the only way to make a better upgrade is to get ready to replace that thing and don't get a laptop that is equipped for graphics. Any 3d software or graphics software is so demanding that a laptop won't cut the mustard. Even if you do buy a desktop, get more of a computer than you think you need since the software sometimes go so far up the scale of improvements that it causes problems with the hardware. 

There have been enough times I haven't seen something or I'm invisible but it is also because of the other issues that are going on with SL. It might have nothing to do with a computer at all. Hard to say. Some of the things I've said might not apply to any single one person but if it helps anyone to take another look at the reality of our virtuality. We are "victims" of the inability of the Lindens to keep pace with technology. 

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Masami Kuramoto wrote:

...

...

The idea that SL requires high-end hardware to run properly is a myth. I've seen Linden Lab's viewer perform just fine on Ion-based "nettop" PCs running Linux two years ago. This sort of hardware is now available for about $150. If that is out of reach for you, then SL should be the least of your problems.

No it's not a myth.

It runs. Does it run smoothly, like more than 5fps? No. I can run SL with a computer made 10 years ago, hurray. It manages to reach maybe 1fps. Is that even remotely playable? No. The preceding statements make the assumption that your avatar is actually wearing something and doesn't remotely resemble anything like the default avatar which is acidic to the eyes. Any computer can handle a primless avatar, that's the most basic of basic 3D models.

In order to run SL at any proper framerate you NEED a discrete card, or at the VERY LEAST Intel HD 3000 (not anything before it, like Intel HD 2000) integrated. GPU > CPU in the case of SL. An AMD C-3xx, one of the slowest processors commercially available today (excluding netbooks), will fare better than an Intel i5/i7 if it has a discrete graphics card. Yes I've done tests as I own an i5 with Intel HD and another with AMD-C3xx.

Laptops with integrated cards can see mesh, but rigged mesh puts a very heavy burden on the performance, and is guaranteed to drop your fps even lower. As for if it's invisible or not, it doesn't matter. If your SL runs at 1-5fps you might as well just uninstall the client anyways.

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mew mew ma mew :matte-motes-asleep-2:

 

Well, i have found that sometimes mesh clothing, hair will not update properly. Ie, you dont get the updates, but if one or the other relogs, then all is fine.  Some people seem to get it a lot and others dont.

There is definitly bugs with mesh stuff that goes on the avi, bugs bugs bugs, ooohhhhhhhhhhh baby hahahha

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Nope because the same thing happens in the craptastic LL viewer as well. And lest you forget all TPVs are 95% or so based on LL's code...

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Suki Hirano wrote:

Does it run smoothly, like more than 5fps?

Absolutely.

I ran my tests on a dual-Atom nettop with Ion 2 chipset two years ago. The device came with 2 GB RAM and 500 GB HD and cost EUR 300. Today you can get it for half that price. The framerates I saw in graphics mode Low were on par with what many people get in Ultra mode on dedicated hardware. 28 FPS in a shopping mall sim with few people around. 12 FPS at an infohub crowded with avatars, most of them dressed properly. The system was running 32bit Linux and Viewer 2. Voice chat was off.

Graphics mode Low is not pretty, but it exists for a reason. Windlight effects would have brought that machine to a halt, no doubt. There are no miracles here, the laws of physics still apply.

However, I'd be the last person to recommend an Intel GPU. I wouldn't even recommend ATI. Second Life is an OpenGL application, and Nvidia has the best OpenGL drivers hands down. The fact that I wasn't running Windows may have helped, too. Call it a rigged setup if you will. But the point is that anyone can afford it.

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Deej Kasshiki wrote:

Nope because the same thing happens in the craptastic LL viewer as well. And lest you forget all TPVs are 95% or so based on LL's code...

No, it doesn't happen in LL's viewer. Those 5% of the code make all the difference. Mesh was not developed for Viewer 1 but shoehorned into it. Being a luddite is no fun these days, you have to live with buggy mesh or no mesh at all.

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