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Royally Ripped Off On the SL Marketplace...


lottytotty
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I have just purchased an avatar that cost me L13,000 from the SL Marketplace. Everything went fine, I received the folder in my received items and once opened there was nothing in it. I went straight to my account history to get the details and then clicked on the link to visit store...

I couldn't find any way to contact the person so I left the comment below on their page review.  

I have just purchased this avatar and there is nothing in the folder??? L$13,000 and there is nothing in the folder???

Get in touch A.S.A,P and sort this out...Very angry right now!!!

I couldn't see a way of contacting you, hence me doing this!

 

When I went back to check, 20 minutes or so later(I was getting suspicious by this time)they had removed the avatar I purchased and my review, I then clicked on the name of the person and it said that name was not available.

I have not had a refund or a message from them so I am assuming I have been ripped off, what do you think???

They had the time to remove the avatar and my review so if they are genuine why not send me a message?

There are still 2 avatars up for sale from this person...

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/stores/157999

 

Seriously hacked off

>;-(

 

 

 

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I'm sorry you fell for that scam, but looking at the two avatars they still have up on the MP it's so obvious....Not only are these avatars copyrighted, one of them being a World of Warcraft Elf, but they also show a quality that SL avatars have not yet reached.

Even if it didn't seem to be an obvious scam at first, but this one is on you for buying copyrighted material from someone else. That is illegal, and ignorance won't help you out here.

LL does not get involved with resident to resident dispute, so you'll have to chalk this up as a learning experience. Never buy stuff that's being illegally sold on the market place, even if you DO get the stuff, as soon as the original copyright holder files a DMCA with linden lab, the items will be seized from your inventory at no compensation.

Only buy original creations and if you're not sure you can trust the seller, do not make a purchase.

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If the seller is not appearing in the SL in-world search, it looks as though you might be out of luck.

 

Not that it's much use to you now, but I'd always advise looking at an in-world store first, and if there isn't one, and the vendor is a new av, avoid buying from them. I may be being a little suspicious but there's no way I'd spend several thousand L$ on an item on the MP without being pretty confident the seller wasn't flaky.

 

Sorry you had such a tiresome experience.

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Just as I thought, I really just put it here to let other not so savvy people know not to buy them as I did...I thought the marketplace was a place you could buy with trust...So the message is, don't trust the people, don't trust the marketplace, super...

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

Seriously hacked off >;-(

 

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I am sorry to hear you got ripped off... :( here is the link to the original photo on DeviantArt http://hitmanx3z.deviantart.com/art/LisaKrov-3n-318346656

For future, if the store or the name of the merchant are not already known in Second Life please, before you buy the product, just check their in-world profile and see if the profile is empty or not, how old it is, do they have any pics in their profile about the shop, also you can check on My Second Life and see if other people have posted something on their profile feed there. And as a quickest way of checking is the product genuine or not, click on the marketplace image to have it bigger, right click on it and search Google for similar images. If its ripped off from any site like DAZ or Renderosity, Google will know!

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In addtion to Syns answer:

Yes, this scam is obvious. His currently sold "avatars" are not even ripped from games. Sure, the red haired elf is directly designed after the Bloodelf from WoW, but its not the ingame model. Its one of these render pictures. I forgot the names of the involved programs, but with them you can create detailed pictures of avatars you would only find in cut-scenes and trailers, because it takes ours to render them and if they would be part of an MMO, they would bring most PCs down to their knees.

So this is only a picture, there never was an actual avatar.

Some basic guidlines I would always follow to avoid scams:

- If something looks too good to be true, it certainly is. No creator will suddenly present an avatar that could be part of the cinematic trailer of an triple A game released in 2023.

- If its expensive, but no demo available, don't buy it there probably is a reason why no demo is offered. If you still are interested ask the person selling it to show it to you inworld.

- Look at the whole MP store. If a person suddenly has to ability to create EVERYTHING its possibly ripped. If a person (like in this case) as only few items on the marketplace but those speak for 10 years practice as a 3D artist, then its probably not real.

 

Get familiar with the look of "real" stores on the MP. They probably took much more care about banners and pictures and of course, you can see a certain unique style and often developement over time (older outfits released months ago and/or developement of skill over time). If you still aren't sure about a product, it doesn't hurt to get a second opinion.

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lottytotty wrote:

..I thought the marketplace was a place you could buy with trust...

 

Not sure why anyone would think that.  There is no cost or investment to list anything on the marketplace. There is no vetting. Scammer/ripper accounts are not routinely deleted. Anyone who reads these forums or any other SL oriented forums knows that the MP is full of scams. 

If the creator has an inworld store, at least you know he has invested something in his business, and has something set for sale, as opposed to empty folders.

 

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lottytotty wrote:

Just as I thought, I really just put it here to let other not so savvy people know not to buy them as I did...I thought the marketplace was a place you could buy with trust...So the message is, don't trust the people, don't trust the marketplace, super...
 

I don't think that's the best message.

I think a better one is: don't buy obviously stolen goods.

In the laws in most places when you knowingly (including through willful ignorance as is the case here) buy stolen goods you're also guilty of a crime. And even if not, you have no right to compensation when those goods are seized.

 

(Others have said these are not actual game models, so then it is still just an illegal knockoff - but there's still no right to compensation when that is seized.)

 

There's a reason I always tell people to look for an inworld store... And even if you don't find one, the search itself can often turn up enough info to still trust the seller...

Or enough info to know why not to trust them.

But sometimes it just comes down to: if they offer to sell the Statue of Liberty, and they're not the federal government... maybe its not a good idea to buy it.

 

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Syo Emerald wrote:

...

- If its expensive, but no demo available, don't buy it there probably is a reason why no demo is offered. If you still are interested ask the person selling it to show it to you inworld.

...

^^This, more than anything else. Other methods need some judgement and experience, but the lack of a demo is a simple, obvious flaw. I'm reluctant to spend L$100 on something I haven't seen demo'd, let alone L$13,000.

If it's mesh, there should be a demo. If it's a building or landscaping, there should be a copy rezzed in-world to walk around. A L$13,000 item with nothing more than an image as evidence? That should sound an alarm so loud the dead reach for earplugs.

@OP: Sorry to read you got ripped off like this. Many of us have learned the same lesson, usually for a smaller outlay. The vast majority or merchants out there are genuine and trustworthy, so with luck and a little forethought you won't get caught out again.

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Kelli May wrote:


Syo Emerald wrote:

...

- If its expensive, but no demo available, don't buy it there probably is a reason why no demo is offered. If you still are interested ask the person selling it to show it to you inworld.

...

^^This, more than anything else. Other methods need some judgement and experience, but the lack of a demo is a simple, obvious flaw. I'm reluctant to spend L$100 on something I haven't seen demo'd, let alone L$13,000.

If it's mesh, there should be a demo. If it's a building or landscaping, there should be a copy rezzed in-world to walk around. A L$13,000 item with nothing more than an image as evidence? That should sound an alarm so loud the dead reach for earplugs.

@OP: Sorry to read you got ripped off like this. Many of us have learned the same lesson, usually for a smaller outlay. The vast majority or merchants out there are genuine and trustworthy, so with luck and a little forethought you won't get caught out again.

I was going to single out this very passage and say something quite similar to what you said... now I don't have to go through the trouble... so, thanks! :matte-motes-big-grin-wink:

...Dres (In other words, +1.)

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I bought quite a few things from you with trust? Shouldn't I have? I didn't go to your showroom/site. I bought your items from the SL market, that's where I found you. Being helpful is great but putting me down isn't. I feel daft enough, thanks.

The reason i thought I could trust the sl market is because it is linked to Linden...It's second life, why wouldn't anyone feel they could trust it?

 

I made this thread for other people like me who buy impulsively or aren't so savvy, hopefully I won't do it again!

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That is not even remotely a SL image. There is no way that snapshot came from inworld, that should have been clue number one. From the other thread talking about this you bought an Elvira av. Her image and likeness are trademarked. So you wanted to buy illegal goods. This is akin to buying a bag of pot and getting pencil shavings. Would you really go to the cops after?

Am I sorry you got scammed, sort of. If it was a legit product like a house or horse bundle then yes. Consider this a learning experience.

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Did you not read any of my other posts? Ok, here goes...

1) It wasn't obvious to me, I am not a forum reader...I only signed in to make this thread.

2) I am an impulsive buyer who buys from the sl marketplace. I have done it many times.

3) There were 3 different avatars, only one left now, so someone else has been fooled

4) I haven't said anything about being refunded by sl marketplace.

5) I have no clue as to why people are quoting laws and threatning me that I could be in trouble for purchasing it...That really made me laugh, I have nothing to show that could incriminate, but not just that...seriously? why even say that!!!  

6) I made this thread for peoples opinions, not point out the obvious or make me feel more sillier than I do already.

7) I made this thread for people like me so the advisors and community people could help new users to be more savvy.

And lastly, if Linden are promoting the SL Marketplace under things to do then in my opinion they should be monotoring it or at least Interested in it. The people who own/run SL Marketplace are not doing their job right, people should be abe to buy safely.   

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lottytotty wrote:

Did you not read any of my other posts? Ok, here goes...

1) It wasn't obvious to me, I am not a forum reader...I only signed in to make this thread.

What wasn't? That it was not a SL image? Perhaps you should spend more time in world with the things you have bought.

2) I am an impulsive buyer who buys from the sl marketplace. I have done it many times.

As are most of us. Still should have heard warning bells.

3) There were 3 different avatars, only one left now, so someone else has been fooled

Hopefully they wont't starts a thread about it too. There are dozens already. The other option is someon saw the item and flagged it, like I flagged the elf.

4) I haven't said anything about being refunded by sl marketplace.

And yiou won't be.

5) I have no clue as to why people are quoting laws and threatening me that I could be in trouble for purchasing it...That really made me laugh, I have nothing to show that could incriminate, but not just that...seriously? why even say that!!!  

Would you have been more upset when the item vanished from your inventory in a few weeks from a properly filed DMCA from Elviras team of lawyers and you logged in one day to find nothing in that folder with no explanation from LL?

6) I made this thread for peoples opinions, not point out the obvious or make me feel more sillier than I do already.

Apparently you just wanted us to pat you on the back and say "there there, it will be ok."

7) I made this thread for people like me so the advisers and community people could help new users to be more savvy.

We know about it, LL knows about it, we go to the MP at flag things when we come across them. I'm not going to sift through 3 million items, are you?

And lastly, if Linden are promoting the SL Marketplace under things to do then in my opinion they should be monotoring it or at least Interested in it. The people who own/run SL Marketplace are not doing their job right, people should be abe to buy safely.
You can buy safely, common sense does help. If it's too good to be true... You have been here since October, in all that time have you EVER seen an av that looked that good?

 

 

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I know we would all love for LL to do a better job of 'policing' the Market Place.

It would be great if LL was able to put in place some type of dispute resolution panel.

But I also see what an insurmountable task that could be in SL's micro economy.

Obviously here we have a blatant ripoff, and an expensive one too.

For all purposes it appears that the sellers account is gone.  Whether they cancelled their account or if LL banned them we don't know.  And how that folder came to be empty is another question.  Perhaps a Merchant can answer this, can a listing be created without uploading an object?  I don't know enough about how the system works not using it myself.  If the listing can't be created without uploading an object, etc, then what happened to it?  A DMCA take down?  We've no real way of knowing, just possibly an educated guess.

Sassy mentioned credit card companies having "legal obligations."  I'm not sure about this.  While I know there are laws that govern stolen credit cards I'm not aware of any that govern 'dispute resolution.'  My take on this is that dispute resolution is something the credit card companies provide to garner consumer confidence.  But a little secret here is that they do not give it away for free.

As a Real Life Merchant, if you file a claim against me with a CC company I have the right to protest that charge back.  At that point the CC company contacts you and says the charge back has been denied.  You can then escalate your claim and ask for it to go to dispute resolution.  And you know who pays for it?  The Merchant.  Even if I win I still get charged a fee.  The credit card companies don't give this service away.

This is why I said it's an insurmountable problem for LL.  Among other things, who is going to pay for it?  At what dollar amount do they say we'll handle dispute resolution? Look at how many people raise hell over $10L purchases. What about clueless people who claim the product was not as described when the reality was they didn't understand how it works.  The whole thing is fraught with a lot of problems.

I know that this puts us in a difficult position as Consumers in SL.  We are left with little to no recourse.  I'll agree it's a crappy situation for us.  But there are many sides to this that need to be taken into consideration.

 ETA:  Posted in both Threads

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I feel sorry for you. 13'000 is so much to lose, but I have never seen an avatar that cost that much! 3.3k I think is the most I have ever seen for an avatar (without clothes etc of course) so you should have thought that was pretty fishy, my friend! Still, I think everyone calling you stupid etc is being way too harsh - It's not necessarily your fault, and I think it's wrong that linden labs can't help with things like marketplace scams. I hope you have better luck in the future.

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Neoraptor wrote:

I feel sorry for you. 13'000 is so much to lose, but I have never seen an avatar that cost that much! 3.3k I think is the most I have ever seen for an avatar (without clothes etc of course) so you should have thought that was pretty fishy, my friend! Still, I think everyone calling you stupid etc is being way too harsh - It's not necessarily your fault, and I think it's wrong that linden labs can't help with things like marketplace scams. I hope you have better luck in the future.

The only people to ue the word stupid are you and the OP..

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Neoraptor wrote:

They implied it. Heavily.

How would you categorize it?  Foolish?  Momentary lapse of reason?  Brain Fart?  Blonde Moment?

One of the biggest problems in SL is people throwing out all their RL good sense when they get here.

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