Deploys for the week of 2013-06-24

[Maestro Linden]

Hi Willow, you'll only see a 'roll back' condition if something went wrong at shutdown time (such as a crash).

[Imagin Illyar]

Then you have a fly in the ointment there somewhere because I have witnessed issues up to an hour before a restart on many occassions - work I've done on a lot undone, tier payments made but boxes reverted to pre-payment status and I have several tenants who have lost no copy items placed long before they got the 5 minute warning that their sim was about to be restarted. I've learned to work around it by just not doing much of anything until I know the restarts are complete which brings me back to my original point - it would be great if the grid status report page was updated promptly when the restarts start and end.

[Astarte Artaud]

Hi Maestro.

 

Sorry to agree with many of the others here....., but having lost a 1200L$ no copy item this week which was placed several minutes before the region restart notifications.... Yep I should have known, even checked the grid status page bullets whilst viewer was loading (Firestorm),,, well I had forgotten that it was main channel restarts day, My Bad..!!....  Also other furniture I had moved before the restart was back where it started from after the restart. Your notion that the backup of the sim occurs just prior to actual restart is wrong, or your restart queue structure isn't operating as you suspect. Ok my first actual loss in 4 years so It must be an LL acceptable event, even though it shouldn't be allowed to be acceptable.

[Norton Burns]

I think there may be some confusion between the terms 'backup' & 'roll back'

The region will only be rolled back if there is an error, as Maestro says.

However it will be backed up any time up to an hour before the deploy. That state is what will be restored. Anything rezzed/altered between that time & the deploy, that change will be lost.

As no-one knows, other than the 5 minute warning, when a specific region will restart, it is unwise to make any changes after 5am Tues/Weds.

Even if an incremental backup is performed prior to the deploy, you don't know precisely when that will be, & shouldn't it be relied on.

[Ayesha Askham]

Norton

I hate to labour a point but the simple fact is that the process surrounding rolling restarts is not, repeat NOT, being followed.  As a result avatars are losing work that was placed upon sims well in advance of the stated "safe" times.

This is yet another example of the actual occurrences inworld not tallying with the way the LL middle management think it is happening.

Somewhat off topic in one context is the way that the materials project is working.  It causes issues in linksets where one unit of the linkset uses materials properties, essentially doubling the LI of that linkset.  That is useless for builders and surely not as it was intended to work. I should add that the experienced SL builder that discovered this issue is, I understand, raising a JIRA but is not sure what umbrella topic to put it under.

[WolfBaginski Bearsfoot]

Unfortunately, the "in progress" announcement is roughly two hours after the pre-announced start time, so still about an hour after the first actual restart.

 

It still looks careless.

[Imagin Illyar]

Honestly, I could live with it as is as long as the Grid Status Report was updated promptly when they start and finish so I know when to avoid doing any work.

[Levio Serenity]

Some people here aren't getting the point. If a sim has a controlled restart (rolling or otherwise), it should never lose any data, period. It doesn't matter how long any AVs present were given notice. It doesn't matter what they were doing up until the very last second they were on. Absolutely, no matter what, there should be zero loss of data or duplication of no copy objects.  The sim is free to take as long as it needs after AVs have been kicked off to save its state and restart.  Players have been desensitized to errors of this nature and have these ingrained behaviors of "never build on Tuesday mornings." which is sort of sad.

[Perrie Juran]

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Norton Burns wrote:

 

However it will be backed up any time up to an hour before the deploy. That state is what will be restored. Anything rezzed/altered between that time & the deploy, that change will be lost.

As no-one knows, other than the 5 minute warning, when a specific region will restart, it is unwise to make any changes after 5am Tues/Weds.

Even if an incremental backup is performed prior to the deploy, you don't know precisely when that will be, & shouldn't it be relied on.

---

Who, what, when, where, how, what, what, what?

I thought the way we were told the system (supposedly) works is that.

A.  The SIM is taken off line.

B.  A back up is created.

C.  Any changes are applied.

D.  The SIM gets restarted and put back on line.

Am I mis-informed about point B ???????????????

Or are many of us simply confused about the purpose of this back up.  That we are thinking it will save any changes we made before the re-start and that they will remain in place when the restart is completed?

That at least is what I have been expecting though we've been warned content can be lost in the restarts.

Again, have many of us been operating under the wrong impression?

 

[Sayrah Parx]

Has anyone else had their HUDs and avatar attachments detached when logging in this week? Sometimes they just load slower, especially in the last few weeks, but today I logged in and everything was actually detached after about 30 seconds after my avatar loaded normally.

[Qie Niangao]

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Ayesha Askham wrote:

Somewhat off topic in one context is the way that the materials project is working.  It causes issues in linksets where one unit of the linkset uses materials properties, essentially doubling the LI of that linkset.  That is useless for builders and surely not as it was intended to work. I should add that the experienced SL builder that discovered this issue is, I understand, raising a JIRA but is not sure what umbrella topic to put it under.

---

Ayesha, I too am not sure where this is best discussed, but it is indeed intended behaviour. I have a single prim that scores over 1000 LI with materials applied, so a mere doubling is getting off easy. The effect is to force the new "Mesh" physics accounting on all prims in a linkset in which the Materials feature is applied. In practice, you can usually get back to a reasonably sane LI by some combination of, first, setting physics type to None or Convex Hull, and second, segregating prims into separate linksets based on desired physics type.  It's a pain, and no doubt actually adds to simulator load, but it "fixes" LI's worst excursions from sanity.

There are still, however, some fairly glaring bugs in LI calculation for standard prims, some of which were demonstrated at a Server User Group maybe two weeks ago. One gets the impression that the LI-calculations are so fragile that making any change, even a correction, risks a ton of content returned from parcels.

[Levio Serenity]

RE: Point B. I agree with you Perrie. I specifically asked at weekly office hours to confirm this with the Lindens there. It is supposed to make a brand new shiny backup immediately before shutting down and NOT just use whatever the last hourly backup happened to be.