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You're right of course that all of this is based on opinion. There's no rule that says humanoid avatars need to resemble actual humans. Nonetheless, when I see a guy wearing Mini-Me's head on Arnold Schwarzenegger's body I tend to assume he's not too clever. I mean, how could you not notice that?

In fact I don't think too many of the respondents here were stating that their opinion was the rule. I've seen that elsewhere; I didn't see it here. Just a lot of opinions, and that to me is what makes a forum like this so much fun.

But really, the only reason I'm replying is to tell you I think your name is absolutely fabulous.

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Limonella Sorbet wrote:

I don't care what size anyone else thinks my avatar should be. My avatar is not realistic any more than Barbie is. My avatar looks great in her Barbie clothes and that is all I care about. If someone else does not like it they don't have to look.

We all know what real people look like! We all know they come in all shapes sizes heights & weights. If people want to ignore real measurements whether it's long arms long legs short arms short legs wide hips whatever that is their perogative. 

People need to know their opinion is just THEIR opinion & is not worth as much to others as they think!

NOBODY is suggesting otherwise.  Big boobs or big butts aren't really the issue here.  It's avatar height and camera placement. The defaults cause people to make their avatars bigger than average humans and buildings, furniture, and whatnot bigger than real life.

There are those who wish to have wildly out of proportion body parts.  Nothing wrong with that.

There are those who wish to have proportional body parts.  Nothing wrong with that either.

What's being proposed is that people understand their proportions in relation to real life.  Default avatar height and camera position has caused weird proportions in SL to be the norm.  Some would like realistic proportions to be the norm.  I see nothing wrong with that.

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Pussycat Catnap wrote:

 

Heights might be seen as normal if that were the case, but proportions would still be
disgustingly incorrect


That's not exactly "live and let live."

out-of-scale-1.jpg

Yay!  Freedom!  We need no scale, nor proportions. This should please anybody's artistic eyes.  Get used to it!  :matte-motes-big-grin:  :smileytongue:

 (Snapshot taken August 2009)

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Coby Foden wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:

 

But it's not very good to correlate units in 2 different worlds when nothing of the 2 worlds ever meet. The reason why it would have been better to invent a unit for SL is because it would have avoided the frequent RL size / SL size discussions and arguments. The size of things in one world is completely irrelevant to the size fo things in another world, when nothing of the one world is ever in the other world, and vice versa.


(1)
But they do meet.  We have humans in RL, we have human avatars in SL.  And other stuff too what we see in RL, they are in SL too. 
(2)
I don't get the idea why virtual world would need some arbitrary measuring system having no correlation to anything at all.

1. No they don't meet. Nothing from the RL world ever gets into the SL world or vice versa. There are humans in RL but there are only avatars in SL - no humans.

2. Because it is a totally different world and the two never meet. So there is no reason at all to equate the  measurements in the two worlds.

I had a thought earlier. If the SL world's meter is seen as the RL world's yard, SL avatars would be much closer to RL humans. There's no need to do that, of course, because there is no general need to even even try to equate the two worlds.

 

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Pussycat Catnap wrote:

16 wrote:

i had a look back and had a remember

the deletions started from the comment/suggestion that you and Penny are invalid to chat about realism bc of your anthro avatars. every post that was replied to off that got deleted as well. is fair ok for that post to get deleted and some of the responses to it. include my own

is just a pity about all the good posts underneath that had nothing to with that. that got chucked in the bin as well

oh! well 

I completely missed that discussion...

Had no idea anyone ever even said that, let alone who or why. 

It was along the lines of, "It's a bit rich that the two people who complain about avatar height not matching RL human heights have [a couple of animals] avatars." Something like that. I thought it was funny but someone else thought it was rude.

Whatever the reason for the mass deletion, it was a stupid thing to do.

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Pussycat Catnap wrote:

Heights might be seen as normal if that were the case, but proportions would still be
disgustingly incorrect
.

  

That's not exactly "live and let live."

Facts are facts. Opinions are not facts. Science is not opinion. Anatomy and Proportion are what they are - like it or not.

The problem:

 

halfheightsplitprims.jpg

ArmWingspan.jpg 

Wingspan -must- equal body height from base of foot to top of forehead in anyone without a birth defect or tragic accident or malnutrition (diets low in protein in former generations in some regions led to stunted leg growth, this is now dramatically illustrated in the last two decades, especially in Korea; where the youth are often a foot or more taller than their parents, and have the healthy divide where middle of height is at the crotch - a direct result of becomming a first world advanced nation).

But notice that to achieve it on this short avatar shape in the images, I needed to set arm length to 100.

On my newer shape, which no longer uses prim hands, I had to go up to 100. That leaves NO ROOM on the dial for people taller than me... not much space. Penny has found ways to game it so she can get a female avatar into the middle 6 foot something range... possibly by making the chest wider... but this then breaks the proportions for females where the shoulders should be equal or thinner than the hips...

- The dials are just messed up.

 

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Phil Deakins wrote:


Coby Foden wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:

 

But it's not very good to correlate units in 2 different worlds when nothing of the 2 worlds ever meet. The reason why it would have been better to invent a unit for SL is because it would have avoided the frequent RL size / SL size discussions and arguments.


(1)
But they do meet.  We have humans in RL, we have human avatars in SL.  And other stuff too what we see in RL, they are in SL too. 
(2)
I don't get the idea why virtual world would need some arbitrary measuring system having no correlation to anything at all.

1. No they don't meet. Nothing from the RL world ever gets into the SL world or vice versa. There are humans in RL but there are only avatars in SL - no humans.

2. Because it is a totally different world and the two never meet. So there is no reason at all to equate the  measurements in the two worlds.

 

Blue Mars uses meters, Cloud Party uses meters, Second Life uses meters.  Lots of other virtual worlds, games and simulators use meters as a unit for content creation and measurement.  Why is that?  Has it been done so out of 'better knowledge' how virtual worlds work?  Or would there indeed be a good reason to do so, to select an existing widely used familiar measurement unit?  I think there is very good reason.

Let's imagine that in Second Life the length unit would be [blurp].  Let's say that a region would be 350 x 350 blurps in size.  Now what would the default avatar height possibly be suitable for this world?  1 blurp, 2 blurps, 2.5 blurps, 3 blurps, perhaps 10 blurps or what?  We would have no reference anywhere how to relate the avatar size to the region size. Thus no idea at all what that suitable avatar height would be.  Linden Lab would have had to invent some height.

Let's say that they, after some heated discussions in the Lab :smileytongue:, finally agreed that the default avatar height would be 2.95 blurps.  Ok, then how to decide what would be the right size for houses, furniture, vehicles, animals, trees, etc.?  Again, there would be no reference at all to real world.  All would have to be found out by experimenting, building different sizes , eyeballing the results and come into agreement which looks good and workable.  How plenty of wasted time and effort just because the arbitrary [blurp] unit was invented!

And the blurp would not have solved the problem of the scale issue in Second Life.  Some people would have been ok with avatar sizes close to the 2.95 blurps.  But then there are those guys who want to be taller than the next guy.  In no time at all the grid would have been teeming with avatars reaching 4.2 blurps or even more.  It's possible that after some time the builders would make their builds suitable for avatars who were 3.6 blurps tall, instead of making them suitable for the 2.95 blurps tall default avatars.  Questioning the builders "Why do you make your builds oversized?", they would reply "Ah well, that's how the Second Life has evolved, avatars have grown gradually bigger".  And we would then have  discussion: "Why did Linden Lab made this bad decision and invented the blurp?  We don't understand it, it has no reference to anything.  Why didn't they use some sensible unit what is already used all over!"

As I said already earlier, if there was an arbitrary measurement unit like [blurp] it would just complicate things when creating mesh content for Second Life.  Being totally arbitrary no design program would have blurp in their dimension selection.  Mostly they have metric and imperial units.  A conversion factor between the [blurp] and meters and/or feet or inches would be needed to be able to build proper sized content.

So Phil, I still don't get it why you think that it would have been better if we didn't have any relation to real world measurements.  As I see it, it is very good decision that virtual worlds do use the same measurements what we use in real world.  Then we have something what we understand, a frame of reference when creating content.

 

[ADDED info]

I found that in Cloud Party the default female avatar is about 1.68 meters tall (if I did the measurement correctly in Maya).  She does not look like a midget there, she appears to have very correct size in relation to the environment.

Meter appears to be a very good unit for virtual worlds too. No need to invent some random [blurps].

:matte-motes-big-grin:

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Coby Foden wrote:

out-of-scale-1.jpg

Yay!  Freedom
!
  We need no scale, nor proportions. This
should please anybody's artistic eyes.  Get used to it!
 
:matte-motes-big-grin:  :smileytongue:

 (Snapshot taken August 2009)

i would like totally banhammer that short guy. he is like totally a griefer. can tell just by looking at him. and i bet he smells as well

and he just makes himself that little so he can perv that ladies breasts and like pretend he is not. can see he doing it now. is guarantee that if keep watching him then he be perving up her skirt next. what a totally total pervert !!! the sqwiddy little creeper !!! banhammer him !!! 

q; (:

 

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Pussycat Catnap wrote:

Facts are facts. Opinions are not facts. Science is not opinion. Anatomy and Proportion are what they are - like it or not.

 

And disgust is not science.

So you choose to misconstrue one single word from the sum of all of my posts and images on this and take it as if it was my entire point in order to not have to pay attention to the facts and science behind proportion.

It is very unwise, and highly illogical, to let your judgement be clouded by anger.

You don't have to like me. But I am correct. Look up any article on anatomy or proportion. The facts simply ARE.

 

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I never said you were wrong about proportions. I work with clothing and costume design in the real world and your concepts of proportions are basically correct, though not always as cut-and-dried as you make them seem. But that doesn't mean that it's "disgusting" for someone in an imaginary virtual world to make an avatar that doesn't correspond to real-world proportions, and that word "disgusting" didn't fall onto your keyboard from a word tree, you typed it there.

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Giving away free the tools I used to make my proportion screenshots. See my sig below or feed to figure out where to go to find it since they're all up in arms about links in posts these days...

ProportionProp.jpg
A proportion tester. Just take a copy and stretch it to match your height. The colors should change at the bottom of the crotch. Top and bottom of it should reach head top and feet base. You can take a copy of my pose stand too.

(Need to right click these and copy. They're not for sale, but copy).

 

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Coby Foden wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:


Coby Foden wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:

 

But it's not very good to correlate units in 2 different worlds when nothing of the 2 worlds ever meet. The reason why it would have been better to invent a unit for SL is because it would have avoided the frequent RL size / SL size discussions and arguments.


(1)
But they do meet.  We have humans in RL, we have human avatars in SL.  And other stuff too what we see in RL, they are in SL too. 
(2)
I don't get the idea why virtual world would need some arbitrary measuring system having no correlation to anything at all.

1. No they don't meet. Nothing from the RL world ever gets into the SL world or vice versa. There are humans in RL but there are only avatars in SL - no humans.

2. Because it is a totally different world and the two never meet. So there is no reason at all to equate the  measurements in the two worlds.

 

Blue Mars uses meters, Cloud Party uses meters, Second Life uses meters.  Lots of other virtual worlds, games and simulators use meters as a unit for content creation and measurement.  Why is that?  Has it been done so out of 'better knowledge' how virtual worlds work?  Or would there indeed be a good reason to do so, to select an existing widely used familiar measurement unit?  I think there is very good reason.

I don't know any of those games but that doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what othe 3D environments use for measurement. The only thing that matters here is what SL uses.

Let's imagine that in Second Life the length unit would be [
blurp
].  Let's say that a region would be 350 x 350 blurps in size.  Now what would the default avatar height possibly be suitable for this world?  1 blurp, 2 blurps, 2.5 blurps, 3 blurps, perhaps 10 blurps or what?  We would have no reference anywhere how to relate the avatar size to the region size. Thus no idea at all what that suitable avatar height would be.  Linden Lab would have had to invent some height.

First, the sim size would be decided upon. Then, if they next did the avatar, its size would be decided on in relation to the sim, together with the camera position. After that, everything falls into place. Perfect
:)

Let's say that they, after some heated discussions in the Lab :smileytongue:, finally agreed that the default avatar height would be 2.95 blurps.  Ok, then how to decide what would be the right size for houses, furniture, vehicles, animals, trees, etc.?  Again, there would be no reference at all to real world.  All would have to be found out by experimenting, building different sizes , eyeballing the results and come into agreement which looks good and workable.  How plenty of wasted time and effort just because the arbitrary [
blurp
] unit was invented!

See above
:P

And the blurp would not have solved the problem of the scale issue in Second Life.  Some people would have been ok with avatar sizes close to the 2.95 blurps.  But then there are those guys who want to be taller than the next guy.  In no time at all the grid would have been teeming with avatars reaching 4.2 blurps or even more.  It's possible that after some time the builders would make their builds suitable for avatars who were 3.6 blurps tall, instead of making them suitable for the 2.95 blurps tall default avatars.  Questioning the builders "
Why do you make your builds oversized?
", they would reply "
Ah well, that's how the Second Life has evolved, avatars have grown gradually bigger
".  And we would then have  discussion: "
Why did Linden Lab made this bad decision and invented the blurp?  We don't understand it, it has no reference to anything.  Why didn't they use some sensible unit what is already used all over!
"

As I said already earlier, if there was an arbitrary measurement unit like [
blurp
] it would just complicate things when creating mesh content for Second Life.  Being totally arbitrary no design program would have blurp in their dimension selection.  Mostly they have metric and imperial units.  A conversion factor between the [
blurp
] and meters and/or feet or inches would be needed to be able to build proper sized content.

So Phil, I still don't get it why you think that it would have been better if we didn't have any relation to real world measurements.  As I see it, it is very good decision that virtual worlds do use the same measurements what we use in real world.  Then we have something what we understand, a frame of reference when creating content.

The reason why I think it would be better not to have an RL unit of measurement is because a few people want to have RL realistic sizes of things like houses and they just don't work. Most people are content with the way that sizes have evolved in SL, but a few people sometimes kick up a bit of a fuss. For most people it doesn't matter at all. It's just a few people who want to create homes in SL according to RL-realistic sizes, so it's better not to have the same unit of measurement (the meter) and the few people won't have anything to make a fuss about.

 

[ADDED info]

I found that in Cloud Party the default female avatar is about 1.68 meters tall (if I did the measurement correctly in Maya).  She does not look like a midget there, she appears to have very correct size in relation to the environment.

Meter appears to be a very good unit for virtual worlds too. No need to invent some random [blurps].

:matte-motes-big-grin:

I'm sorry that I can't get really into your post but I'm away from home and posting is inconvenient. I hadn't treally expected to post anything at all.

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Phil Deakins wrote:

 

I'm sorry that I can't get really into your post but I'm away from home and posting is inconvenient. I hadn't treally expected to post anything at all.

Aw, what a pity!  Unfortunately I cannot give any credibility to your post now as you just state that, creating a random unrelated to anything dimension system and world using it is easy, easy, easy - no problem at all -  perfect!

shrug-1.gif

Anyway, I wish you nice stay where ever you are.

Hope to see you back soon.  :matte-motes-smile:

 

But perhaps we shouldn't continue our discussion because we both have our firm ideas. :smileywink:

blurps th_Fight01.gifmeters        blurps th_Fight01.gifmeters         blurps th_Fight01.gifmeters

 

                                                       desismileys_2082.gif

 

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Phil Deakins wrote:

The Berlin sim was mentioned a number of times and I went there during the old thread, but all I found were large spaces - no typical RL-sized rooms. I think that was because I had to be in a group or renting or something. Even so, I have yet to see a typical RL-sized room that works acceptably well within the SL world. I'm thinking of a furnished 12' x 12' x 8' room.

Did you visit the right Berlin? ;)

Most public spaces, like the station and city hall are indeed spacious and yes, the apartments where people live are generally off limits to strangers, although if you ask, some will welcome you and gladly show you around.

Beyond that, there is lots of RL scale stuff or semi-RL scale buildings to observe.

We did make some concessions (doors are a little bigger, etc) but we do have rooms that are smaller then 12 by 12 and with much lower ceilings, even by giving people a little more space then you'd often have in RL, most apartments don't have ceilings higher then 4 meter.

A hotel room in our cheap hotel barely fits a bed and a small table and chair.

My avatar has beem RL scale as soon as I figured out the scale of the prims I was building with.

And also because I wanted my avatar to be as much like RL me as possible.

 

Anyway, as all of the apartments in Berlin are pretty much rented all of the time, I can't really invite you in to go have a walk around them, we did have an Open Door day recently where people opened their houses to visitors but it will be a while before we have another one.

 

This is my room, not small, but still a lot smaller then many others.

Me asleep in my room.

 

And here is another room, I made it for a public display at the SL's birthday exhibit, so the ceiling is a little higher to allow people in.

But scale wise, it is smaller then my livingroom in RL.

7378213820_7445d79e24_c.jpg

 

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SL is not RL and people should be free to make their avatars in any proportions they want if that's what they like regardless of how you feel about it. just as you are free to be a neko despite many people finding that weird or even disgusting to the point of banning them for some venues, which I am totally against btw,

Secondly, not everyone in RL fits your perfect proportions.  I don't.  In RL my shoulders are a bit wider than my hips as a result of years of hard core competitive and endurance swimming starting as a very young child and continuing through my 20's. I also have a long torso, and my legs are also quite a bit longer than your perfect proportions suggest they should be.  To say this came about due only to " a birth defect or tragic accident or malnutrition" is absurd. A long torso is common enough that they even make bathing suits to fit them widely available.  My long legs run in the genes of my family.  I have a niece that has much more proportionally longer legs than I and no one calls her a freak;  quite the contrary, most people find her gorgeous.

The fact is that eliminating birth defects, tragic accidents and malnutrition, the human body still comes in a variety of proportions.  Yes, there are 'ideal' proportions that are taught in art schools etc. that a lot of people fit into ,more or less. In the several figure drawing classes I took in art school we were cautioned to use it as a guide only and that we should draw what we actually saw in reality.  If someone doesn't measure up to the guide that doesn't make them 'disgusting' in RL or SL or the victim of an unfortunate circumstance. In RL that's pretty prejudicial thinking IMO and in SL absurd.

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well, indeed 1sl m = 1rl m. and indeed, we need a unit related to rl. But its only a relative unit. 

Coby, except if you have the huge luck to have a screen that is 1m rl large, the meter you see in sl is not a real rl meter, but a relative one. And it even depend on what distance you are caming. So thats said, yes, indeed, sl meters, even if they are different in absolute with rl one, they are supposed to be same in relativity as rl ones. But here the prob it's that it is not what is happening really. I mean. ok,  relative sl meters are equivalent as rl meters. But yesterday, i just noticed that in my store building (what is not a big one), i could put 2 times my avatar till the ceilar. My avatar is bigger than me in rl (i tryed to made the more close but im already 1,80 and look really short compare to others, while im 1,65 m in rl and i m in the average size, i dont feel short at all) and still i can put 2 me verticaly till my sl ceilar. So i took a look at my rl ceilar. No way i could put 2 me in totality in the vertical way.

So relative size are obviously not the same for everything in sl. Proportions are not respecting rl units. Why ? Because of the cam restrictions and above all bec SL is seen thru a screen, with 4 sides : a frame. You cant make the same in non framed environement than in a framed environnement. Its a fact. Old movies directors have already studied this well, you can have great example with Orson Wells movies and see how he used (for one of the first times in Hollywood studios) the ceilars to give deepness to his scenes. Althought on the movies the ceilars look real, i can tell you for sure that in the studios they didnt had the same look than the usual ones.. and its not for nothing, that before him, noone there used ceilars, bec when they where looked thru a screen they didnt looked the same, and it took a lot of time and genius from Orson Wells to find out how do the ceilar had to be settle for looking same as real ones, but obviously they needed to be settled in a different way than the real one and upper.

All is the about the framed view limitation. 

you can indeed use the same relative unit, and as you said its indeed the greatest way to do bec then you can export till another software, and as you said, anyway, we need a unit, and since we know already one in rl, it would be stupid to not use this one. But SL view cant be the same as RL view bec there are limits that doesnt exist in RL :  the frame in particulary.

So i guess that what Phil is saying, is or we accept these limits and ok, we know some things wont never look same as RL and well... is it really a problem ?.... or, .....we still argue about the things are not looking real, stalk pp for they make their avi shorter and stalk any builders for making builds smaller (what with the frame and cam restriction will give big problems to everyone).

The other solution would be that we find a same skilled person as Orson Wells who find a way to make things looking real on screens. Shamely, we havent seen a lot as him since he died. :smileywink:

ETA : i hope my english has been good enough for making my explanation clear. if it doesnt i apologize

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I think people are reading into Pussycat's post wrong.  She can correct me if I'm wrong.  I think shes talking about the fact that you cannot make a proportional avi correctly if youre over a certain (average?) height.  I don't think she is railing against people that honestly want to make the avi they way they do, with intentionally different proportions.

 

I think there needs to be tools to make an avi RL proprtional.  Seems like maybe the tools arent made for that, and as a result, SL has ended up with standard that looks way off.  I've noticed lots of avis that somehow just dont look right to me.  It's not something I could ever put my finger on.  I do know things have gotten better over the years.  Used to be that hardly any skirts would fit me, because I had a butt.  Now, things are different, I see more females with hips, butts and actual legs rather than toothpicks.  So, hopefully we are getting out of the era of poor body shapes due to ignorance and bad tools.

I will have to pick up that body checker that Pussycat has out, as I want to tune my shape more, as there is something not quite right about it.

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Trinity Yazimoto wrote:

well, indeed 1sl m = 1rl m. and indeed, we need a unit related to rl. But its only a relative unit.

ETA : i hope my english has been good enough for making my explanation clear. if it doesnt i apologize

I totally agree to that.  RL meter is physical dimension, SL meter is not a physical dimension, its size varies on our physical diplays depending on how close or far we have zoomed on things what we look at.  In RL our field of vision is very wide compared to what we see of 3D virtual world rended on 2D display.  We perceive 3D world differently on the flat screen compared to how we perceive real world.  That's true.

 

Anyway, it is good that in virtual world we have a unit to what we are used to in RL.  It helps us in determining the correct sizes of content in virtual world in reference to the avatar size.  In RL we know what are the correct object sizes suitable for humans.  When we have that same unit in SL it is easy to make stuff what has the same relative size to avatar size as stuff has in RL to human size.

 

For example if we were to design a mesh spoon to SL.  We can go to our RL kitchen, measure the spoon, design it in 3D software exactly to those dimensions, import the spoon into SL, give it to avatar, and voila – a happy avatar with exactly the right size of spoon in the hand.  No guess work was needed about the right size.  With some random invented SL unit we would be have been quite lost in this respect.  Sure stuff can be resized in SL – but that just leads to non uniform scaling of things.  (I'm always surprised when I see comments like: ”SL is not RL, scale of content does not matter here at all – we just scale things as we wish”).  If all agreed that uniform consistent scaling indeed does matter, then we would have more consistent virtual world to enjoy.  (I'm not saying that making a giant avatar is wrong, if somebody likes giant, that's their choice.)

 

If i have understood correctly, Phil's reasoning goes like:  The default camera is too high (which it sure is – way too high), thus people tend to make avatars bigger to not look so small.  This and the fact that avatars need more room than humans do, makes it necessary to make the houses much bigger than in RL (from 1.5 to 2 times bigger, depending on the designer).  Then the RL sized furniture would look like toys, so the furniture must be made bigger – to fill the empty space.  Again because the furniture is bigger, bigger avatars are neccessary.

 

Bigger, bigger, bigger... until some mystical sweet spot is reached?  Well, I don't believe in that.  If people adreed that the normal average human sizes are good also for SL avatars, then RL sized furniture, vehicles, even spoons and other stuff would be perfect in SL.  And now because the avatars, in general, would not be giants, the houses would not need to be 1.5 or 2 times bigger than in RL.  A smaller upscaling for houses would be enough.  The RL sized furniture would look great in them.  Avatars would have ample room to live in them.  So the solution is not some random dimension system in SL.  The solution is that people become avare of the importance of right scale of things.

And the meter is the perfect measurement in estimating the scale and building to scale. :smileyhappy:

 

PS

Trinity, your English was clear and understandable. :matte-motes-smile:

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The most invested people in this debate have arguments that can be boiled down in to generalizations that can be applied to most policy arguments:

Phil represents:

THIS IS HOW THINGS ALWAYS HAVE BEEN

Yes, much of the SL world is built at larger-than-RL scale, and yes, the camera angle probably has a large role it it. BUT: It's certainly possible to change the default camera angle, even world-wide. Even if code changes are required, much larger changes to the viewers/servers are done all the time.

Penny, Pussycat and Coby represent:

THIS IS HOW THINGS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE

Yes, if everything was built to a scale that matched a SL meter to a RL meter it would simplify things and make them more "accurate." BUT: The rest of SL isn't built to this scale so things built to "correct" scale will look out-of-place with everything else the way things are now. And if you want to rebuild the entirety of SL the 1:1 ratio is arbitrary in a virtual world. Once you build an object scaling it up and down is trivial. It's perfectly true that SL built to a 1:1 scale would allow significantly more things to be built on a standard lot if you only take into account their size. It's also perfectly true that if everything was built to Yabusaka Petite scale you could get about NINE TIMES the number of objects on a lot.

In the end, tnings are going to be done the way people want to do them. As far as blaming the default avatars, I've taken a look at Ruth and she's really not freakish. Her overall height is about 6'-4", making her tall but not a giant by any means. Her face is not her fortune but she's really pretty proportional - her arms are probably a bit short but the shapes that skinmakers give out are generally both taller and less proportional than she is BECAUSE SOMEONE MADE THEM THAT WAY.

I live in a house that's based on a lighthouse. It's got four levels and a domed roof over the whole thing. It's larger than RL scale - I'd hit the front doorknob with my nose and the ceilings are quite high. My neighbor built a "log cabin" that basically runs from lotline to lotline on a lot twice as wide as mine. It's 2 stories with a gable roof and towers over my lighthouse. I met him when he moved in and tactfully noted that it was a bit largish and he said happily, "Yep! I like things big." You know what? He's a pretty nice guy. He's paying for his "land" just like I'm paying for mine - twice as much, in fact. If he wants a big house? He can have a big house.

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Coby Foden wrote:


Theresa Tennyson wrote:


Pussycat Catnap wrote:

 

Heights might be seen as normal if that were the case, but proportions would still be
disgustingly incorrect


That's not exactly "live and let live."

out-of-scale-1.jpg

Yay!  Freedom
!
  We need no scale, nor proportions. This
should please anybody's artistic eyes.  Get used to it!
 
:matte-motes-big-grin:  :smileytongue:

 (Snapshot taken August 2009)

Can i have the one in the silks? pretty please?

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